A perfect parody of a slow jam. Beck manages to turn the classic Adore, among many other R & B ballads, on its head. With a killer bass line to boot.

I said, Lady! . . . Step into my Hyundai!!!

just the fact that it all takes place in a JC Penney's store is cool enough!

namepeace said:

Yes I love me some Beck...I have all his albums...yes the old acoustic ones too...he is the current musical chameleon in the same way Prince and Bowie were.

I'm going to go see him live here in Sydney on March 22nd! It will be the 2nd time I've seen him.

Debrah is a masterful pastiche of slow jams, particularly Prince slow jams.

I need to apologize to beck pulicly..when this one came out ( Midnite Vultures) came out folks were saying he was funky etc and I scoffed big time and loudly..I must admit I had not heard the material of Midnite Vultures and thought he was not worthy of saying he was of Prince related funk etc..but when I finally heard Debra many months later I was floored. Love this song and I am sorry for being wrong about Beck back then on amp.

Beck suffers from the same malady that afflicted Bowie- he's too often style over substance. I think 'Debra' is a prime case in point. It's clearly a Prince pastiche, and it's so affected and contrived that it only comes off as lame imitation. That whole album ('Midnite Vultures') is a victim of its own self-conscious parody- everything is so far up its own arse that the music is neglected. I think it's great that he's finally dropped that whole postmodern stance on his latest album. He's found one of the most important ingredients of great art: emotional honesty.
[This message was edited Sat Feb 22 18:21:16 PST 2003 by fairmoan]

i dig this song... and i LOVE Beck's music... each album is completely different

fairmoan said:

I pretty much agree, although while midnite vultures DID suffer from the sort of self-consciousness you describe...parts of the album are brilliant and not stuck up at all ie, "Broken Train", "Beautiful Way".

It is not my favourite of his...that's still goes to the genius that is "Odelay"...although I have played that album too many times to listen to it these days.

Mutations is UTTERLY genius, too. I know that word can get used for the wrong people, but Beck is not one of them. Actually Mutations is equal to Odelay for me...they're both brilliant for vastly different reasons.

Sea Change is very good, but the subject matter is quite depressing (all the album is about a breakup)...and as for his other albums...I love the early fucked up shit...that stuff is hilarious and very original.
[This message was edited Sat Feb 22 18:51:17 PST 2003 by mrdespues]

"Debra" is a very cool song and 'Midnite Vultures' is kicka**.

I love Beck and think he's a lyrical master. I've really been enjoying "Sea Change".

I hope someday I get to see him in concert.

fairmoan said:

I think other people take the Midnight Vultures album more seriously than Beck did. It was meant to be a tongue in cheek, fun, party album with satire, and old school (and Prince's) influence throughout. That's why some of the lyrics are such gobbledegook.

Although I wouldn't call it a "great" album, it is to me a very good album.
[This message was edited Sat Feb 22 21:06:13 PST 2003 by Supernova]

love Debra. Peaches & Cream is also good. those are the only 2 i remember.

Supernova said:

Absolutely. I just think the music as a whole suffers from this incessant cross-referencing and self-consciousness. If I want to listen to Prince, I'll take out a Prince album. And it will be infinitely better. Sometimes I think Beck is just too clever for his own good. I honestly couldn't care whose influence he's copped or who he's sampled if the music isn't any good. And too often it isn't.
[This message was edited Sat Feb 22 21:46:29 PST 2003 by fairmoan]

fairmoan said:

Nice!

Man, I was absolutely startled by the use of state-of-the art "pro-tools production" techniques on Midnite Vultures when I first heard it. In this case (Beck's first foray into essentially an electronic sounding album) new technology is put to great use. He referenced modern r&b and hip hop and still kept his own style. Sure, some of it IS laboured and is a little more style than substance, but that is the POINT...he is making a statement about the current state of music...dissing it in parts and yet appreciating it in others. None of it is ever bad...Beck hasn't made a bad album yet, unlike a certain star beginning with P (don't flame, I'm not saying Beck is better, he just knows how to edit himself).

Don't diss Beck, he's fucking great and he loves Prince, too! He wasn't making a Prince comedy album he was making a funk album which frequently referenced P. Midnite Vultures doesn't rank with the best of P's music, but it is a nice homage in parts...it is a great advertisement about Prince to a younger generation, too.

And by the way, "Peaches and Cream" is another one of the greatest Prince songs Prince didn't write (although it is the weakest track on MV in my opinion).

If you're interested in Beck, try MV for sure...but don't forget the album which really made him, "Odelay" and "Mutations" is so ornate and intricate and contains wonderful songwriting and lyrics. Mutations is probably my overall fave if you want technical musicianship. A great band on that one (and on Sea Change).

.
[This message was edited Sat Feb 22 22:21:54 PST 2003 by mrdespues]
[This message was edited Sat Feb 22 22:23:15 PST 2003 by mrdespues]

fairmoan said:

Oh, don't get me wrong, there's at least a third of the album I usually skip. But for me most of the party songs are strong enough to keep me interested.

fairmoan said:

Indeed. However, it should be noted that Beck's Prince pastiche was better than 's Prince pastiche that year, style over substance or no.

AaronUnlimited said:

Sounds like most of you only started listening to Beck around the time of Midnite Vultures and Sea Change...you're missing out as these aren't his best albums, even though they are great, too.

mrdespues said:

I assume that was addressed to me. You might be right there, but I do own Odelay and I can't see anything too special there.

Actually, I disagree on second thought.

It isn't a question of style over substance.

With Beck it is sometimes a case of ART over entertainment.

He is a true artist, his father was a founding member of the Fluxus art movement and Beck himself was a big part of the anti-folk movement before he hit it big with "Loser".

Music isn't always about "soul", "the funk" or even what feels good (although, to me, most of MV and Becks catalogue feels great)...it is also about history and artistic integrity and originality within the musical community.

As Beck once sang, "I ain't got no soul! I ain't go no soul!" While Beck makes his pastiches on the soul music he loves, he knows full well that he isn't up there with the great soul singers...he isn't trying to be...he is great as a musicologist and referencer to ALL of pop music though...much like Zappa, Prince, Bowie, Beefheart, Tom Waits...but most of all like himself. He's an original.

It's it's not always just to entertain, folks...it makes you think...it's art.
[This message was edited Sat Feb 22 22:31:38 PST 2003 by mrdespues]

fairmoan said:

Odelay is great, although I can't listen to it now from playing it tooo many times.

Please try Mutations if you haven't already. Of all his albums it has the broadest appeal.

mrdespues said:

For the record, I thought Odelay was overrated and got rid of it.

Supernova said:

I think you obsessed Prince fans are too elitist sometimes...I admit I don't listen to Odelay anymore...but it is a great and defining album of it's era.

mrdespues said:

And just HOW do you deduce that I'm an "obsessed" Prince fan just because I don't agree on an album you're in love with? Logic is lacking.

Beck...

Supernova said:

humblest apologies, i wasn't just singling you out. i have no evidence that you're an obsessed prince fan...i was talking about a great many of the orgers...they don't listen to anything else except prince and related or just r&b and soul or funk, judging by the stuff i see in the non-prince music forum.

obviously i am just standing up for an artist i have grown up with and love...and who i happen to believe is a great of his time. this is a prince site...of course a lot of you don't get beck, i understand that...but many people out there in the world do and many of them are highly respected musicians (including prince himself, i believe).

i agree that beck's best music is when he is at his most heartfelt and sincere...it's the stuff that lasts...but i think he's great for doing something so different all the time as well.

if you don't make music yourself, I guess it's sometimes hard to understand why some musicians make the music they make, but i DO make music and I get it and along with Prince, Beck is one of my favourite artists.

mrdespues said:

Actually, you have a wider view of their tastes than I do (at least recently), it seems 80% of what's posted over there is about Madonna and Michael Jackson.

I like a wide variety of stuff, I just haven't been in starting thread mode for a long time.

Supernova said:

ok cool.

First time I saw Beck live was when "The New Polution" had
just been released as a single. It was a very good concert
and people were dancing all over the place and lighting
bonfires and stuff [it was an open air concert].

I liked MV for it's cheesyness. It was just a fun party
album with lots of influences which I think, a lot of the
critics and also fans took much more seriously than it was
ever intended.

What I like so much about Beck is that he tries so many
different things and doesn't really get stuck on one
particular style. Mutations was such a difference again
from Odelay and MV.

And Sea Change does sound a bit like Beck of old but it's
darker and more depressing. It's quite brave of him to go
there since it might have turned out horrible. But as
Sea Change proves, heartache and depression can propell
some of the most beautiful songs around.

Beck is great and I love the Midnite Vultures album. While the album is quite tongue-in-cheek, as much of Beck's work is, it is still just a damn good album in its own right. The fact that Debra has such a strong nod to Prince slow jams alters the brilliance of the song not a jot.

That acoustic bass is damn good.