You know, I was sitting here thinking. These newbie Prince fans just don't realize and appreciate bootleg collecting!! Nowadays, all you have to do is go to a site, click a couple of things, and you have your video or audio boot (with artwork) in a few minutes. The ONLY work involved is finding what site to go to. And if the product or quality is shit, it's pretty easy to press Delete, and you're really no worse for wear.

Back in the day, we had to hunt around and scavenge for any little Prince goodie we could find. We had to find trader circles, and make VHS or audio taped copies of stuff to get it. And of course with each time it was taped (generation) the quality degraded just a bit. You had to make connections, often via "snail mail" or mailing lists. And, if you just started out or didn't have much of anything to trade, you were coming out of pocket. But you know what, that shit was worth it!!!! Seeing stuff like NYE 1987 show with Miles or the 1988 Dortmund Lovesexy show or the Birthday Parade show was all certainly worth it. Small Club and The Black Album absolutely blew my mind, and I was glad to fork over some cash for it, though usually people taped it for you or gave it to you out of the kindness of their heart or for a return solid down the line.

And then don't forget the pressed discs from Moonraker/Thunderball and Sabotage and Superhero Records and others! City Lights was like the Holy Grail, IMO!!! I just had to have that, gold sleeve and all!

We truly had to put in some work to be hardcore Prince fans, and if you bothered doing all of that, you definitely had the right to say you were a "hardcore". These days, you can get entire catalogs in one swoop, with no work at all. Yes, I'm glad a lot of the guess work and hard work has given way to easier methods of collecting, but there was a thriving, hard-working underground Prince community that I will never forget. And the new fans will never know what it's like to be a part of it or understand just how easy they've got it.

Walk down Memory Lane over...

I don't think there's any anger in the OP. Just nostalgia and a sense that us old school fans have a level of appreciation for boot collecting that newbie's will never experience.

I feel much the same way but would never want to go back to paying $25-$35 per disc for boots. Nor would I want to go back to waiting a whole year before live shows worked their way into my neck of the woods. In fact, with fewer mom & pop shops and fewer Prince fans in my area, I'd probably never see new boots with the old system.

That doesn't stop me from feeling the same nostalgia or feeling the same sense of paying my dues back in the day as the OP... I just prefer getting stuff fast & free with the interwebs.

djThunderfunk said:

I like the web better....

Agreed!

I live at the end of the world, so interweb has made a huge difference to my life.
I love the ease at which I can find stuff, and share.

But I still get a thrill when I find a package in my mailbox from a fellow fan, nothing can beat that feeling.

I remember these days. Collecting music and boots could be challenging... and xpensive.

I'm happy I can download entire catalogues in a click now, the internet has opened so many musical doors to me, so much great stuff I couldn't have found or afforded before (& I ain't especially talking bootlegs).

I'm really glad I've known the "records" era, it's full of great memories, but Lawd how I dig this digital age!

mostbeautifulboy said:

I totally get what the OP is saying, going to the record fairs and hunting through hundreds of stuff just to find that little bit of treasure, collecting the vinyl boots and the tapes and eventually cd's. There did seem to be more of a sense of community about it all back then.

Hell I even remember being able to buy bootlegs from some of the smaller record shops where I lived, it really was "pssst, I have this for you," really under the counter stuff...hehe.

However, I do feel that now that we have the internet for such a task, I would not want to go back to that. I still go to record fairs, just not to buy bootlegs anymore.

I think that there can still be a certain excitement involved in tracking down and obtaining some of the rarer or more obscure boots online these days, or some amazing new release, and to be able to download them with a couple of clicks and for free. It still can be a thrill

I guess what i'm trying to say is, I loved the old days and that method of collecting, and the work involved. Now though, having adjusted myself to the 21st century way of collecting, i'm glad to be using this method now.

[Edited 8/28/11 1:42am]

Can totally relate to this thread,

Back in the day, trading/copying tapes, audio and VHS was like a second job.

Made it all worthwile when a new batch arrived in the mail and you spent the next few days getting a fix.

It truely was a different experience I think. I used to get a list sent to me in the mail, then spend days deciding which ones to get...now one click and you got it.

[Edited 8/28/11 1:42am]

alexnvrmnd777 said:

You know, I was sitting here thinking. These newbie Prince fans just don't realize and appreciate bootleg collecting!! Nowadays, all you have to do is go to a site, click a couple of things, and you have your video or audio boot (with artwork) in a few minutes. The ONLY work involved is finding what site to go to. And if the product or quality is shit, it's pretty easy to press Delete, and you're really no worse for wear.

Back in the day, we had to hunt around and scavenge for any little Prince goodie we could find. We had to find trader circles, and make VHS or audio taped copies of stuff to get it. And of course with each time it was taped (generation) the quality degraded just a bit. You had to make connections, often via "snail mail" or mailing lists. And, if you just started out or didn't have much of anything to trade, you were coming out of pocket. But you know what, that shit was worth it!!!! Seeing stuff like NYE 1987 show with Miles or the 1988 Dortmund Lovesexy show or the Birthday Parade show was all certainly worth it. Small Club and The Black Album absolutely blew my mind, and I was glad to fork over some cash for it, though usually people taped it for you or gave it to you out of the kindness of their heart or for a return solid down the line.

And then don't forget the pressed discs from Moonraker/Thunderball and Sabotage and Superhero Records and others! City Lights was like the Holy Grail, IMO!!! I just had to have that, gold sleeve and all!

We truly had to put in some work to be hardcore Prince fans, and if you bothered doing all of that, you definitely had the right to say you were a "hardcore". These days, you can get entire catalogs in one swoop, with no work at all. Yes, I'm glad a lot of the guess work and hard work has given way to easier methods of collecting, but there was a thriving, hard-working underground Prince community that I will never forget. And the new fans will never know what it's like to be a part of it or understand just how easy they've got it.

Walk down Memory Lane over...

I know what you mean. You did have to put in the work, and when you found something new, it was like finding treasure. I still remember finding the Black Album on CD in 1991 and my hands SHAKING when i paid for it!

One thing I don't miss though is the cost. £14 for a single CD £15 for a double. A guy on a local market stall used to find something new for me to buy every sing week. I spent a fortune for years.

so yes, I miss the buzz, but I don't miss the payment.

And collecting online has allowed me to make contacts and friendships that CD purchasing never did. I wouldn't change that for anything

At a record fair, I spent £100 on a LRC 12" just so I could listen to Horny Toad.

It was the only way to listen to the B-Sides back then.

I thought it was an investment and be worth a lot of money one day!

Why should you get all nostalgic about giving money to people who don't deserve it?

Meanwhile, nowadays 'the internet children' -who never knew those feelings- just grew used to taking things for granted, to not do any work further than a couple of mouse clicks because 'someone is doing it for me', to ask and ask and ask for more stuff without saying 'please' or, even less, 'thanks', to criticise lots of things because they might not reach 'their' quality standards, etc...

And the worst of it all is that we have those 'I can't stand audience recordings or high generation copies of outtakes' when in the end all they do is turn the lossless stuff to mp3 to listen to in those fucking portable players.

I'm glad that we have the web today so that we don't have to go thru all we went thru in the past (and that it's all for free!), but I really hate the 'spoiled children' thing.

The most surprising thing is that while most of us underline the great advantage of getting everything for free, there are still those who like to purchase pressed boots from Sabotage or Eye that mainly contain stuff that was put out by the fans FIRST AND FOR FREE or, even worse, they pay good money for CDr copies of freely circulating stuff to that French rat nicknamed Lovesigne or to a myriad of eBay scalplers (who in many cases are the same French rat with different nicks).

802 said:

Why should you get all nostalgic about giving money to people who don't deserve it?

Why should you talk about things you don't know because you didn't live them? It's so easy to talk when you have no fucking clue what you're talking about...

Back in the day, it was 'worthwhile' to pay money for a crappy boot because there was so little stuff in circulation, so the few people who actually bothered putting those gems in our hungry hands, in a way, 'deserved' that money.

Currently, there's a growing tendency to still buy boots (either pressed or on CDr) when you have 1001 possibilities to get that stuff for free. That is what I don't understand.

[Edited 8/28/11 4:08am]

[Edited 8/28/11 4:09am]

vitriol said:

802 said:

Why should you get all nostalgic about giving money to people who don't deserve it?

Why should you talk about things you don't know because you didn't live them? It's so easy to talk when you have no fucking clue what you're talking about...

Back in the day, it was 'worthwhile' to pay money for a crappy boot because there was so little stuff in circulation, so the few people who actually bothered putting those gems in our hungry hands, in a way, 'deserved' that money.

Currently, there's a growing tendency to still buy boots (either pressed or on CDr) when you have 1001 possibilities to get that stuff for free. That is what I don't understand.

[Edited 8/28/11 4:08am]

[Edited 8/28/11 4:09am]

It's never worthwhile to give money to bootleggers. If you pay for music, the money should go to the artists. And while I didn't live this, I have seen actual pressed bootlegs at record stores. Many times.

vitriol said:

And the worst of it all is that we have those 'I can't stand audience recordings or high generation copies of outtakes' when in the end all they do is turn the lossless stuff to mp3 to listen to in those fucking portable players.

Audience recordings suck, I don't want to hear someone talking or singing out of tune and so on. And no, I don't use mp3 players (because I'm weird like that )

I prefer having an audience recording of something that's not circulating as SB than having nothing at all.

I have all the circulating dates Prince played since March 1980 to Aug 2011. If I were only interested in SB recordings I'd just have a few dates.

And there are VERY GOOD audience recordings. Just listen to some ONA Tour ones.

I had my guy too!

itsjustaroundthecorner said:

I love this post! I remember trolling around Revolver Records, Bleeker Bobs and Rebel Rebel in NYC hoping to find something new. I remember the Jewel Box blew my mind. And the live stuff just was so addictive. Prince can say what he wants about the boots. But they made me a true Prince junkie. Songs like Desire, Sex of it, all day all night were too good to be ignored. Plus, it was fun knowing you were part of this 'purple underground'

Yes!

I live in NJ, so they would be "day trips" with my friend.

802 said:

It's never worthwhile to give money to bootleggers. If you pay for music, the money should go to the artists. And while I didn't live this, I have seen actual pressed bootlegs at record stores. Many times.

Nowadays, I'd agree with you because you can get hold of it free. But back then, if you wanted unreleased tracks & live recordings, you HAD to pay bootleggers to get this stuff.

But don't you see, the act of doing that, meeting up with mates, sharing your findings and swapping recordings in order to keep the prices down is why things are free now.

Unbeknowingly, thanks to their elevated prices, bootleggers probably actually helped create the free music sharing community as we know it today.

Don't try to school these know-it-all youngsters with history lessons.

You'd be ruining their favourite pastime: talking without knowing.

back in the late 80's and early 90's i used to wander nyc looking for boots .. there was julius the boot guy who sold tapes on the corner .. bleeker bobs .. but the big one for me was second coming records .. i was really into janes addiction bootlegs back then but my prince fandom still existed .. i remember drooling over a stack of prince bootleg vinyl .. chocolate box (the old version) caught my eye in particular .. but alas .. it was all about janes addiction and black flag and dead kennedys for me back then .. even so .. i managed to get a copy of the black album and a few prince tapes along the way .. i never minded paying for bootlegs .. seemed like the right thing to do .. i know its prince music but people put work into pressing and artwork and taping and trading .. it was a rarity back then .. something to be cherished and the hunt was part of the fun .. if you find EVERYTHING all at once, you lose that mystery and excitement .. the mass amount that is available now is way too much overkill .. the trading process weeded out the mediocrity and repetition somewhat and the mystery of what may be on the show kept you looking for more .. now with setlists and websites and every show out there, sure its free, but there is just too much .. its all a blur .. great show where's the next one, must have all 3,000 shows .. when it was mp3s there was just no point .. mp3s suck ass .. now with flacs becoming more available .. i do appreciate the upgrade on my favorite shows, but with the upgrades come the guilt .. this high quality stuff is music prince should release and get paid for .. i don't mind having it for free out of spite that prince does not release it himself .. but if he ever did .. i would pay him money for sure .. particularly the dirty mind thru lovesexy era .. some of those soundboards are phenomenal .. i guess the internet makes me feel cheap .. like trying to eat mcdonalds food or something .. its just too much and kinda sleazy .. too easy and kinda spoils the fans .. but still if not for boots i probably would not be a prince fan anymore since his records have been stinkers for so long now .. the only reason i buy new records is because i am still curious due to exploring his outtakes and boots .. still curious and still disappointed .. there is nothing quite like taping your own show tho .. being the ONLY person with a document of a historical moment .. until you share it .. but we all know there are some gems that don't get shared even now .. makes it all the more exciting

I read a lot of posts of late about people not bothering with audience recordings, which in a lot of cases people immediately discount before they even listen to a note. It's a shame because a lot of these newer generation audience recordings are fantastic quality and do not contain any audience chatter or likewise.

Anyway, I was thinking about back when we had to purchase bootlegs, if you wanted more than official releases, paying for the boots was the only way to obtain them unless you did swaps with people who were like minded, and thinking about it, it does not really seem like that long ago.

It took me a long time to get into computers as a means of obtaining unofficial recordings, the first few times I looked into it I never thought I would be able to work out how to do it, but through trial and error, and a lot of help from some very kind people, I got there.

Back in the earlier days of boot collecting there indeed was a sense of community, but there are still small pockets of people of the internet generation who are willing to help, and willing to share some of the amazing material that they have, it's just a different kind of community when things are done online. It is to those people of the modern way of collecting that I will probably be eternally grateful to, because since I started to collect this music online I have obtained music that I never would have imagined having in my wildest dreams, and I believe that that has only been possible through the internet.

Maybe that same music might have been available in the physical world, but i'm damn sure a lot of it would not be available at all or so quickly as it is thanks to the internet.

I have "met" some great people online through my interest in collecting this music, and all I can say is, long may the friendships and the music, continue.

I been collecting them since 1984?Tapes back then---there was a lady that had ever show.I mean ever show.I wish I bought more from her-she new someone in the band-most of them were soundboard.Then cds came around-that made it much better-art work-something that looked real.There were 2 stores Here that sold them-Tom Tracks and IN YOUR Ear---both r closed.They would get orders in from around the world-I would alway get first picks.Now I still get them from around the world but direct.I don't know what sites to go to---I still buy lots boots every year.I love boots--I listen to boots more then anyother music!I love New Morring right now!What a show--it was epic---I wish I was there.

The "current way" of boot collecting seems to me a reflection of the current dominant culture, with all its advantages... and disadvantages.