Reason i started this thread is because i was listening one version of Purple Rain from recent Jazz festival

and while my intention was to hear if Prince kicked ass as he did on W2A performances

but my started noticing Andy's Allo rhythm guitar playing on the song Purple Rain.

It was dreadfull ,every chord played without any feeling,any change of rhytmic accent.

She even didn't play the susspend chord from the song,the one that gives song a certan flavour.

Is Prince lost his mind?

I s this the same guy who punished Brown Mark because his

string broke on bass during the performance

and made Mark miss the tour bus leaving for the next city?

It's not fair to the other band members like John who is great ,Ida also to make them

play with unproffesional amateur.

Andy's guitar is in the mix and it hurts the bands sound.

Also setlists are incredably lame.He adds a song or two here or there

but he still plays the same show like he did since 1997

but now it's much worse.

Now he have a ver annoying Shelby ruinning every classic shouting and acting like anybody cares for she do .

But at least she can sing so i won't talk bad about her.

Prince can do another type of greatest hits setlist along with a fan classic.

for example:

Soft and Wet

I Wanna be your Lover (full)

I Fell for U (full)

Let's Go Crazy full version like he did in 1984,1985

The Beautiful Ones

When Doves Cry

It's Gonna Be Lonely

Lady Cab Driver

Do Me Baby

Automatic

Extra Lovable

I Would Die 4 U

It's Gonna be a Beautiful Night

Prince on acoustic guitar

When Doves Cry(again

Dinner with Delores

Until We Dance Close and Slow(Prince strumming the acoustic with strings on keyboards playing along.

Purple Rain(acoustic)

Encore: Why U Wanna Treat me so Bad

Private Joy

The Most Beatiful Girl

he can rehearse a setlist like this in a few days but he is lazy,he don't cares anymore.

This is the darkest era of Prince as a live performer,nothing exciting happens.

Prince become even that lazy he didn't bother to rehearse

killer fusion setlist for the recent jazz festival performances like those he

did in 2007 and 2001.

And he says he have the funkiest band on the planet ,somehow i find Duran Duran to be much more tight and funkier live act ,even if they are not known for Funk

[Edited 7/18/11 17:39pm]

No, this is not the same guy. Prince is dead.

I agree. I watched the North Sea Jazz festival and I actually fell asleep for the first time ever. I don't buy the age argument cuz I've seen him pull out all the stops in the last year. I think sometimes he's just coasting on his reputation and for all those people who label those of us 'haters' just for criticising a below-par performance, he chooses to be in the entertainment industry where people are subject to scrutiny. If you want the fame and fortune, you also have to take the criticism when you don't deliver, much as sportspeople do.

What I worry about is when age does really start to negatively affect his performances and he simply is unable to deliver. He'll still be posing and mugging for the audience as though he was the badass of old when instead he might have become an embarrassment. I just hope he still tries to kick ass while he can because the clock is ticking! I want him to go out on a high and then quit while he's ahead- not disappear into irrelevance in a painful-to-watch kind of way.

WTF!?

He totally smashed Hop Farm so I'm happy.

Oh, and to answer why Andy Allo doesn't get the same treatment as Brown Mark when she fucks up: I assume it has something to do with P Control. Mark simply didn't have that.

I fell for you? Untill we dance close and slow?

scuze me while I kiss this guy! Get those bananas out of your ears please.

Your list would have been nice 30 years ago. NSJ was great; setlist and performance. Too bad about P not attending soundcheck on thursday (no Andy either...) so the sound was LOUD on friday, but he apologised so get over it.

Please no more Andy "playing guitar" or "singing"! Your girl is lovely Prince, but please keep private matters private.

I love that he has Andy draw terrible little murals while songs are happening. And by that I mean I hate it.

I don't think Prince has become too relaxed. Even though the setlist looked tame, the Hop farm show was bloody brilliant.

What he has done though, is lose his marbles over a pretty girl. Andy is super pretty, but a shite guitar player and the quicker he gets enough of her, the quicker she will be out of the band, which will be good for everyone!

bigbrother said:

I agree. I watched the North Sea Jazz festival and I actually fell asleep for the first time ever. I don't buy the age argument cuz I've seen him pull out all the stops in the last year. I think sometimes he's just coasting on his reputation and for all those people who label those of us 'haters' just for criticising a below-par performance, he chooses to be in the entertainment industry where people are subject to scrutiny. If you want the fame and fortune, you also have to take the criticism when you don't deliver, much as sportspeople do.

What I worry about is when age does really start to negatively affect his performances and he simply is unable to deliver. He'll still be posing and mugging for the audience as though he was the badass of old when instead he might have become an embarrassment. I just hope he still tries to kick ass while he can because the clock is ticking! I want him to go out on a high and then quit while he's ahead- not disappear into irrelevance in a painful-to-watch kind of way.

At a Prince concert?????

Damn!

You actually fell asleep...at a PRINCE concert?

PRINCE!

You know the skinny motherfucker with the high voice, usually has a guitar with him, sometimes sits at a piano, might even kick it on some drums if the feeling moves him...and would party all night...THAT PRINCE?

Isn't that a sign of the Apocalypse?

.

how the hell can you fall asleep at a concert period?

I share a growing concern for te live show these last couple of years. Prince is simply leaning entirely too much on SHelby and now this fake guitarist chick. Giving huge segments of the show to Shelby KILLS the concert. It is not so much a knock on her - NO ONE would be a welcome diversion for Prince in a Prince concert. You want to see and hear Prince - not 15 minutes of his backup. It has reached ridiculous levels now and it does make some people think he is lazy. I know that is not the case. I think he is getting old and needs the help quite frankly.

While I accepted the fact that we will never see the Prince who jumped off 20ft high amp stacks, did James Brown splits better than James Brown, and swung down a fireman pole, I did think that his legendary longevity would remain since he hasnt abused himself with drug and drink like other rock stars. Even if his voice came to a point that he could not get the falsetto like it used to be, he has so many other talents to fall back on - hell, we would pay to just see him stand in one spot and strap on a guitar or sit down to the piano and just play.

But this filling of major chunks of the show with other people who just arent as good as him is not fair to fans or his legacy. The wonderful thing about Prince that made me a fan in 1978 was the fact that he, more than anyone else, didnt need anyone. He could - and did - do it all. He did his songs. He sang all the leads. And he played at least guitar and piano in nearly every show. No one else could do it. THat is what made him PRINCE for me. I was amazed one little man could do all of that and do it better than everyone else.

I know time changes everyone. Prince certainly has earned the right to rest on his laurels - his career has spanned 5 decades. Artists have come and gone in that time. Prince survived every trend: disco, new wave, hip hop - and still rules. I just dont like to think he is coasting or slowing down. I suppose it is bound to happen eventually. He is only human. I just want to see him remain that fiercely independent maverick who does it all himself - because he is the best.

[Edited 7/19/11 6:00am]

bigbrother said:

I agree. I watched the North Sea Jazz festival and I actually fell asleep for the first time ever. I don't buy the age argument cuz I've seen him pull out all the stops in the last year. I think sometimes he's just coasting on his reputation and for all those people who label those of us 'haters' just for criticising a below-par performance, he chooses to be in the entertainment industry where people are subject to scrutiny. If you want the fame and fortune, you also have to take the criticism when you don't deliver, much as sportspeople do.

What I worry about is when age does really start to negatively affect his performances and he simply is unable to deliver. He'll still be posing and mugging for the audience as though he was the badass of old when instead he might have become an embarrassment. I just hope he still tries to kick ass while he can because the clock is ticking! I want him to go out on a high and then quit while he's ahead- not disappear into irrelevance in a painful-to-watch kind of way.

I noticed that you didn't mention the incompetent sound and light staff at North Sea Jazz festival. Was that a factor?

Totally agree with you about the setlist these days ( I´m tired of all those cover songs and same old hits but would love to see a show like he did the second and third night in Rotterdam at the NSJF).

Andy may not be a good enough musician to be in his band, especially at this stage in his career, but she seems to put a big smile on his face and I like that. Too bad she doesn´t seem to be really familiar with his back catalogue the way Manuella was because I think we´d get to hear more interesting songs then ( remember those Paisley Park celebrations and interesting setlists from 2001 to 2004 were probably partly influenced by Mani, who was a hardcore fan).

In the end, it´s Prince who´s calling the shots and it´s his prerogative to decide who can play in his band. And like I said, it´s a nice change to see him a bit more relaxed, smiling and happy these days.

I really enjoyed the show I saw last summer in Berlin but my expectations for the Cologne show are very low, so I won´t end up disappointed. The last time I saw him in Cologne was not that spectacular either but with Prince , it´s a bit of a gamble these days. One night he might give you a great show like he did in Rotterdam and at HOP, and then he gives you a mediocre, mainstream oriented show like he did in Luxembourg. I think it also depends a bit on the crowd.

Co-sign about Shelby.....that lady can sing, but is really becoming waaaaaay to dominant in Prince´s show. I can´t stand her hypeman action on stage, the constant screaming and oversinging. She´s cool, I wish her the best in her future endeavours and with her own career, but I´m not too fond of background singers being in the spotlight.

I also wasn´t too fond of Rosie Gaines, Tony M. etc. etc.

When I go to a Prince show, it´s Prince I want to hear, not someone else.

I really like Bonie Boyer though...may she rest in peace...she was great and never was too dominant. Balance is key.

I wonder whether Prince can´t really hear or understand the difference.

thebanishedone said:

Reason i started this thread is because i was listening one version of Purple Rain from recent Jazz festival

and while my intention was to hear if Prince kicked ass as he did on W2A performances

but my started noticing Andy's Allo rhythm guitar playing on the song Purple Rain.

It was dreadfull ,every chord played without any feeling,any change of rhytmic accent.

She even didn't play the susspend chord from the song,the one that gives song a certan flavour.

Is Prince lost his mind?

I s this the same guy who punished Brown Mark because his

string broke on bass during the performance

and made Mark miss the tour bus leaving for the next city?

It's not fair to the other band members like John who is great ,Ida also to make them

play with unproffesional amateur.

Andy's guitar is in the mix and it hurts the bands sound.

Also setlists are incredably lame.He adds a song or two here or there

but he still plays the same show like he did since 1997

but now it's much worse.

Now he have a ver annoying Shelby ruinning every classic shouting and acting like anybody cares for she do .

But at least she can sing so i won't talk bad about her.

Prince can do another type of greatest hits setlist along with a fan classic.

for example:

Soft and Wet

I Wanna be your Lover (full)

I Fell for U (full)

Let's Go Crazy full version like he did in 1984,1985

The Beautiful Ones

When Doves Cry

It's Gonna Be Lonely

Lady Cab Driver

Do Me Baby

Automatic

Extra Lovable

I Would Die 4 U

It's Gonna be a Beautiful Night

Prince on acoustic guitar

When Doves Cry(again

Dinner with Delores

Until We Dance Close and Slow(Prince strumming the acoustic with strings on keyboards playing along.

Purple Rain(acoustic)

Encore: Why U Wanna Treat me so Bad

Private Joy

The Most Beatiful Girl

he can rehearse a setlist like this in a few days but he is lazy,he don't cares anymore.

This is the darkest era of Prince as a live performer,nothing exciting happens.

Prince become even that lazy he didn't bother to rehearse

killer fusion setlist for the recent jazz festival performances like those he

did in 2007 and 2001.

And he says he have the funkiest band on the planet ,somehow i find Duran Duran to be much more tight and funkier live act ,even if they are not known for Funk

[Edited 7/18/11 17:39pm]

Okay Alex, I'll take 'Fans Who Are Still Stuck In The 80's' for $200.

runawayslave said:

I share a growing concern for te live show these last couple of years. Prince is simply leaning entirely too much on SHelby and now this fake guitarist chick. Giving huge segments of the show to Shelby KILLS the concert. It is not so much a knock on her - NO ONE would be a welcome diversion for Prince in a Prince concert. You want to see and hear Prince - not 15 minutes of his backup. It has reached ridiculous levels now and it does make some people think he is lazy. I know that is not the case. I think he is getting old and needs the help quite frankly.

While I accepted the fact that we will never see the Prince who jumped off 20ft high amp stacks, did James Brown splits better than James Brown, and swung down a fireman pole, I did think that his legendary longevity would remain since he hasnt abused himself with drug and drink like other rock stars. Even if his voice came to a point that he could not get the falsetto like it used to be, he has so many other talents to fall back on - hell, we would pay to just see him stand in one spot and strap on a guitar or sit down to the piano and just play.

But this filling of major chunks of the show with other people who just arent as good as him is not fair to fans or his legacy. The wonderful thing about Prince that made me a fan in 1978 was the fact that he, more than anyone else, didnt need anyone. He could - and did - do it all. He did his songs. He sang all the leads. And he played at least guitar and piano in nearly every show. No one else could do it. THat is what made him PRINCE for me. I was amazed one little man could do all of that and do it better than everyone else.

I know time changes everyone. Prince certainly has earned the right to rest on his laurels - his career has spanned 5 decades. Artists have come and gone in that time. Prince survived every trend: disco, new wave, hip hop - and still rules. I just dont like to think he is coasting or slowing down. I suppose it is bound to happen eventually. He is only human. I just want to see him remain that fiercely independent maverick who does it all himself - because he is the best.

[Edited 7/19/11 6:00am]

"I share a growing concern for te live show these last couple of years. Prince is simply leaning entirely too much on SHelby and now this fake guitarist chick. Giving huge segments of the show to Shelby KILLS the concert. It is not so much a knock on her - NO ONE would be a welcome diversion for Prince in a Prince concert. You want to see and hear Prince - not 15 minutes of his backup. It has reached ridiculous levels now and it does make some people think he is lazy. I know that is not the case. I think he is getting old and needs the help quite frankly."

I do want to comment on that statement above that u made:

I have been to many concerts that the artist are younger than Prince and they let other people shine for about that amount of

time during the concert, Age doesn't matter, it is when they talk for that amount of time on stage during the show is when it is annoying.

[Edited 7/19/11 6:17am]

runawayslave said:

I share a growing concern for te live show these last couple of years. Prince is simply leaning entirely too much on SHelby and now this fake guitarist chick. Give huge segments of the show to Shelby KILLS the concert. It is not so much a knock on her - NO ONE would be a welcome diversion for Prince in a Prince concert. You want to see and hear Prince - not 15 minutes of his backup. It has reached ridiculous levels now and it does make some people thik he is lazy. I know that is not the case. I think he is getting old and needs the help quite frankly.

While I accepted the fact that we will never see the Prince who jumped off 20ft high amp stacks, did James Brown splits better than James Brown, and swung down a fireman pole, I did think that his legendary longevity would remain since he hasnt abused himself with drug and drink like other rock stars. Even if his voice came to a point that he could not get the falsetto liek it used to be, he has so many other talents to fall back on - hell, we would pay to just see him stand in one spot and pstrap on a guitar or sit down to the piano and just play.

But this filling of majoe chunks of the show with other people who just arent as good as him is not fair to fans or his legacy. The wonderful thing about Prince that made me a fan in 1978 was the fact that he, more than anyone else, didnt need anyone. He could - and did - do it all. He did his songs. He sang all the leads. And he played at least guitar and piano in nearly every show. No one else could do it. THat is what made him PRINCE for me. I was amazed one little man could do all of that and do it better than everyone else.

I know time changes everyone. Prince certainly has earned the right to rest on his laurels - his career has spanned 5 decades. Artists have come and gone in that time. Prince survived every trend: disco, new wave, hip hop - and still rules. I just dont like to think he is coasting or slowing down. I suppose it is bound to happen eventually. He is only human. I just want to see him remain that fiercely independent maverick who does it all himself - because he is the best.

Great post. Totally agree with you. Why risk your reputation as the number one showman on the planet by turning your own show into a showcase for other singers and musicians when you could easily do your own, more impressive show simply by planning it thoroughly.

I don´t need to see Prince do the splits or dance around these days, or scream until he´s got a sore throat....just play more piano every now and then, play guitar, sing more obscure and rarely heard songs, less cover versions and don´t give the spotlight to others to a point where it gets on the audience´s nerves.

I think he´s still got the energy and the talent and drive to deliver a spectacular show but he needs to revise the whole concept of his currrent show. It´s not really a matter of length or lack of energy but smart planning.

Instead, we get tons of covers, tons of Shelby time on stage, and less Prince.

Reminds me a bit of those years when Larry would run half of the show.

Too bad those other artists then get the flack for the decisions Prince makes . He´s probably got the best intentions ( supporting Shelby and Larry and sharing the stage with them) but honestly, I don´t pay that much money to see other people taking over from him.

I´d much prefer a more relaxed, physically less demanding show if the songs are Prince songs and if he played more piano or whatever instead of leaving the stage for Shelby or others.

Gohi said:

I love that he has Andy draw terrible little murals while songs are happening. And by that I mean I hate it.

Agreed! What is that?

Cons:

A. It's been done - a lot - so it's not original

B. She's not good at it - my 8 year old draws better

C. It detracts from what is going on

Pros:

A. She can't play guitar while drawing, so that's a good thing

B. It basically takes her off the stage for a while

I'm waiting for her to ask for it back when the song is over - alongside Prince asking for his guitar back that he just gave to someone in the audience.

Actually, I think it would be great if the next person in the audience to get one of these would ball it up and throw it back up on stage!

[Edited 7/19/11 6:10am]

I actually agree with some of the less flattering stuff posted on here, as Prince line ups go, this is one of the weakest he has ever been on tour with apart from JB & Maceo...However, I think this enhances Prince´s performances because he has to carry the band.

When I first watched the Le Journal show, I was shocked and thought it was a weak performance, this made me abit nervous about going to the Hopfarm, especially with my GF who is not a fan. I managed to download it and watched it again and realised P is carrying the band, which definitely ups his level of performance. This is one of the reasons why I think the Hopfarm concert is the best I have ever seen or been at. The footage that is floating about from the Paris show, confirms this in my opinion.

It sort of reminds me of the way Maradona took a not so great Argentina team to two world cup finals, winning one of them, through individual moments of brilliance or Zidane dragging France to the final in 2006, his individual performance against Brazil in 2006 rates with one of the best I have ever seen.

I know I have topic wandered a bit, but I think they are good examples of what I am trying to explain.

vman4639 said:

Gohi said:

I love that he has Andy draw terrible little murals while songs are happening. And by that I mean I hate it.

Agreed! What is that?

Cons:

A. It's been done - a lot - so it's not original

B. She's not good at it - my 8 year old draws better

C. It detracts from what is going on

Pros:

A. She can't play guitar while drawing, so that's a good thing

B. It basically takes her off the stage for a while

I'm waiting for her to ask for it back when the song is over - alongside Prince asking for his guitar back that he just gave to someone in the audience.

Actually, I think it would be great if the next person in the audience to get one of these would ball it up and throw it back up on stage!

[Edited 7/19/11 6:10am]

Actually, I think that would be a very disrespectful and fucked up thing to do that would surely lead to Prince being upset. You don´t want him to abruptly end the show, or do you?

KoolEaze said:

vman4639 said:

Agreed! What is that?

Cons:

A. It's been done - a lot - so it's not original

B. She's not good at it - my 8 year old draws better

C. It detracts from what is going on

Pros:

A. She can't play guitar while drawing, so that's a good thing

B. It basically takes her off the stage for a while

I'm waiting for her to ask for it back when the song is over - alongside Prince asking for his guitar back that he just gave to someone in the audience.

Actually, I think it would be great if the next person in the audience to get one of these would ball it up and throw it back up on stage!

[Edited 7/19/11 6:10am]

Actually, I think that would be a very disrespectful and fucked up thing to do that would surely lead to Prince being upset. You don´t want him to abruptly end the show, or do you?

Well - sometimes the truth hurts - and I get the sense that maybe 'constructive criticism' is not welcomed in Prince's world. I agree this is rude - but it would certainly make a point!

I am more in the camp of, "let Prince do whatever he wants - it usually works and I'll gladly take a few missteps as long as he's still trying" - but, I still think some reality every once in a while is a good thing ;->

vman4639 said:

Gohi said:

I love that he has Andy draw terrible little murals while songs are happening. And by that I mean I hate it.

Agreed! What is that?

Cons:

A. It's been done - a lot - so it's not original

B. She's not good at it - my 8 year old draws better

C. It detracts from what is going on

Pros:

A. She can't play guitar while drawing, so that's a good thing

B. It basically takes her off the stage for a while

I'm waiting for her to ask for it back when the song is over - alongside Prince asking for his guitar back that he just gave to someone in the audience.

Actually, I think it would be great if the next person in the audience to get one of these would ball it up and throw it back up on stage!

????

i was 2 days in ghent

i was at nsj

i did not see or here any lame setlist and i don't go to a prince show to see only prince perform

and yes he seems very relaxed but it doesn't effect his live performance .

if you fall asleep at a prince concert than there is something wrong with you .

i do miss the pissed off prince but the happy & relaxed prince is alright for me .

and i can enjoy a full concert with only shelby j or any other band member .

the sound at nsj was not that great(and to loud) but that was not only at the prince concert i seen and here a lot of great live acts at the festival but never here a good sound .

Ok, I love Andy, because whatever her skills are, after having listened to some of the recent European shows, she is having a great effect on Prince. He is playing with energy, the setlists are more interesting. Have you guys heard NSJ night 3. Prince goes crazy and nasty on When I lay my Hands on you. He pulled out Girl for heavens sake. He's never played that song before and he and Andy sounded great on it.

Clearly Andy is not good enough on guitar to be in the NPG , but I do think her vocals are worthy and as long as she's inspiring Prince I love it. Maybe she's the one who will finally help him break the evil grip of Larry Graham.

drclay i'm not so happy with the jhw prince...but you have to respect his choise and larry was a good friend for him in bad times so he's not that evil ....

i agree with you about andy she's ok on guitar her vocals are good (not great) but she does have a good affect on prince and gives him his little funky dirty mind again and we all love that part

To OP and those who agree with him:

What do you base your opinion on? Here are some alternatives to choose from.

1. Being present (and awake) at several of the recent concerts
2. Being present (and awake) at at least one of the recent concerts
3. Having seen several quality videos of entire concert from current tour
4. Having seen at least one quality video of entire concert from current tour
5. Having heard several audio bootlegs from current tour
6. Having heard at least one concert bootleg from current tour
7. Having seen snippets one youtube or similar, with good sound and clear image
8. Having seen snippets one youtube or similar, filmed from 500 meters or more, with bad zoom and heavily distorted sound
9. Reading setlist on Prince.org
10. Noticing that some people complain about setlist on Prince.org

I’m just wondering..

runawayslave said:

I share a growing concern for te live show these last couple of years. Prince is simply leaning entirely too much on SHelby and now this fake guitarist chick. Giving huge segments of the show to Shelby KILLS the concert. It is not so much a knock on her - NO ONE would be a welcome diversion for Prince in a Prince concert. You want to see and hear Prince - not 15 minutes of his backup. It has reached ridiculous levels now and it does make some people think he is lazy. I know that is not the case. I think he is getting old and needs the help quite frankly.

While I accepted the fact that we will never see the Prince who jumped off 20ft high amp stacks, did James Brown splits better than James Brown, and swung down a fireman pole, I did think that his legendary longevity would remain since he hasnt abused himself with drug and drink like other rock stars. Even if his voice came to a point that he could not get the falsetto like it used to be, he has so many other talents to fall back on - hell, we would pay to just see him stand in one spot and strap on a guitar or sit down to the piano and just play.

But this filling of major chunks of the show with other people who just arent as good as him is not fair to fans or his legacy. The wonderful thing about Prince that made me a fan in 1978 was the fact that he, more than anyone else, didnt need anyone. He could - and did - do it all. He did his songs. He sang all the leads. And he played at least guitar and piano in nearly every show. No one else could do it. THat is what made him PRINCE for me. I was amazed one little man could do all of that and do it better than everyone else.

I know time changes everyone. Prince certainly has earned the right to rest on his laurels - his career has spanned 5 decades. Artists have come and gone in that time. Prince survived every trend: disco, new wave, hip hop - and still rules. I just dont like to think he is coasting or slowing down. I suppose it is bound to happen eventually. He is only human. I just want to see him remain that fiercely independent maverick who does it all himself - because he is the best.

[Edited 7/19/11 6:00am]

Prince did not survive hiphop, and he's been coasting for the last 15 years.

Hes giving Shelby way 2 much stage time so yes.......2 bloody relaxed ....

paulludvig said: