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Prince's religion - a compassionate take on it. We all know that Prince has been spiritual all his life and has always talked about god... he has become quite devout lately though and has abandoned his old free-thinking style.
On average, religiosity increases with age, as people begin to truly ponder their own mortality. Teenagers and young adults usually walk around with a feeling of invincibility and do not contemplate the inevitability of death with the depth of a person of advancing age. Prince is certainly getting older and he has recently seen the deaths of multiple family members. I think that there is a very real correlation between the pain associated with the loss of loved ones and his own struggle with the inevitability of his mortality and his much more rigid religious stance. His rejection of the notion of hell can be seen as a rejection of the notion of being punished for past transgressions and as a compassionate stance of wishing hell on no man, woman or child. Larry Graham probably has less to do with Prince's new-found religion than Prince's own internal needs and search for a cure for the pain of his losses and his fears of the unknown. Prince's choices are his own and I believe that he makes them in truth to his heart and not out of brainwashing by Larry Graham. I have decided to respect his views and his opinions although I do not agree with them. The man is in pain and is searching for answers, as we all are. This is coming from a man who is not religious and does not believe in god, heaven, hell or devils. CAVEAT: This does not mean that I will avoid discussion of religious issues, this is simply stating my opinion of Prince's situation and my respect for his decision. I will remain caustic at most times, but I had a moment of weakness here... *sniff* SUPERJOINT RITUAL - http://www.superjointritual.com
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*reads post*
...*reads signature*  | |
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Nep2nes said: *reads post*
...*reads signature* The signature is a quote from "Blue Velvet" by David Lynch. SUPERJOINT RITUAL - http://www.superjointritual.com
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Very good, IceNine. I couldn't have said it better myself.  -------
A census taker once tried to test me. I ate his liver with some fava beans and a nice chianti... "I've just had an apostrophe!" "I think you mean an epiphany..." | |
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I agree.i feel that way sometimes.trying to find a meaning for it all.Scared that you'll run out of time to do so. | |
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Cool post Icenine, and well observed, I agree with your comments on the correlation between religion and age. | |
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I agree with the sentiment, but I simply wouldn't speculate too much on the ifs and whys of his spirituality. I never had any problem with Prince being religious, save at the time the TRC lyrics were released. But as a fan, my first wish has always been that he does something he really cares about, so if it was going to be God and JW doctrine, so be it. As long as the music was interesting... I would draw the line at clear, vociferous intolerance.
The fact is, most people I know believe in God, I've got a dear friend who is mother superior of a convent, and Prince is just exercising his right to interpret this world and life itself. Each of us has come to our own conclusions on what it all means, and I think the complexity and depth of the question warrants that we respect each other's beliefs. [This message was edited Sat Aug 17 17:54:40 PDT 2002 by Aerogram] | |
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IceNine said: We all know that Prince has been spiritual all his life and has always talked about god... he has become quite devout lately though and has abandoned his old free-thinking style.
On average, religiosity increases with age, as people begin to truly ponder their own mortality. Teenagers and young adults usually walk around with a feeling of invincibility and do not contemplate the inevitability of death with the depth of a person of advancing age. Prince is certainly getting older and he has recently seen the deaths of multiple family members. I think that there is a very real correlation between the pain associated with the loss of loved ones and his own struggle with the inevitability of his mortality and his much more rigid religious stance. His rejection of the notion of hell can be seen as a rejection of the notion of being punished for past transgressions and as a compassionate stance of wishing hell on no man, woman or child. Larry Graham probably has less to do with Prince's new-found religion than Prince's own internal needs and search for a cure for the pain of his losses and his fears of the unknown. Prince's choices are his own and I believe that he makes them in truth to his heart and not out of brainwashing by Larry Graham. I have decided to respect his views and his opinions although I do not agree with them. The man is in pain and is searching for answers, as we all are. This is coming from a man who is not religious and does not believe in god, heaven, hell or devils. CAVEAT: This does not mean that I will avoid discussion of religious issues, this is simply stating my opinion of Prince's situation and my respect for his decision. I will remain caustic at most times, but I had a moment of weakness here... *sniff* I wish everyone thought this way. thank U Icenine! U are tres cool! BY THE POWER INVESTED IN ME BY GOD ALL NEGATIVITY BOWS | |
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I find your perspective to be quite interesting and refreshing IceNine.
We may never know/understand Prince's reaons for his change in his spiritual views. While I respect Prince's right to his own spiritual beliefs, I am also saddened by how drastically he has changed his convictions. I love Prince's music. I respect him as a spiritual person. I don't have to agree with everything he does.  | |
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well said icenine When I read about the evils of drinking, I gave up reading. | |
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..icenine has always been the bomb... | |
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Oh i see now... there r fams for ice nine..
 | |
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right Cashmere??? Damn, i thought this was a site 4 Prince... 
(remember ya'll:it ain't ova!!!)  GOD, i luv THAT MAN  &  | |
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Prince has always been in search of a strong male father/role model figure - someone to put him in touch with a black male identity that has been elusive to him all his life. The first half of his career was molded by white men - Chris Moon, Cavallo/Fargnoli/Ruffalo (that's their names?), even early-on bandmates like Matt Fink and Bobby Z., and his trusted bodyguard Chick Huntsberry (please tell me if I'm messing up the spelling of these names left and right)...
Then when these men left him and/or passed away, and around the time of Diamonds and Pearls/the symbol album, he started to fall in with a hip-hop/party crowd, where he could be treated like a super-studly pimp-daddy faux-gangsta, complete with his cane and his tootsie pop and his doo-rag...ultimately that scene didn't work out, and in steps Larry Graham, a confident, strong, secure, spiritual older black man with a strong history in funk and R&B...someone with whom Prince can relate...and someone who invites him into the fold...and around this time, Prince's own father passes away. This might be a little deep, it might even be a little intrusive, but it seems that part of Prince's journey over the past decade has been that of identifying the masculine side of himself...finding the missing pieces of his identity that his father wasn't around to help him find...and when a good ol' boy thug network didn't do the trick, he took a higher road and let Larry and his JW philosophies be the template. Will this be The Truth that he's been looking for? Who knows. We all know how fickle the little guy is, and how impatient and fidgety he is, and how his head can be turned at the drop of a dove feather. I personally think he'll never quit searching, if indeed this is the void he's trying to fill. Just some VERY hyper-analytical thoughts... | |
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who are any of us to decide whose religious and spiritual beliefs are right or wrong? Perhaps every religion is a piece of the puzzle...perhaps not. atheists shouldn't care one way or the other since they don't believe in a God to begin with. People of other religions shouldn't be concerned with the beliefs of others either as they need to worry about their own afterlife. after all Jesus did say "there are many mansions in my father's kingdom".
peace and love! | |
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IceNine said: Nep2nes said: *reads post*
...*reads signature* The signature is a quote from "Blue Velvet" by David Lynch. Love that movie. I mean, like, where is the sun? | |
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Psychoanalysis is best left up 2 the xperts that actually have face 2 face interaction with said subject. | |
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IceNine said: We all know that Prince has been spiritual all his life and has always talked about god... he has become quite devout lately though and has abandoned his old free-thinking style.
On average, religiosity increases with age, as people begin to truly ponder their own mortality. Teenagers and young adults usually walk around with a feeling of invincibility and do not contemplate the inevitability of death with the depth of a person of advancing age. Prince is certainly getting older and he has recently seen the deaths of multiple family members. I think that there is a very real correlation between the pain associated with the loss of loved ones and his own struggle with the inevitability of his mortality and his much more rigid religious stance. His rejection of the notion of hell can be seen as a rejection of the notion of being punished for past transgressions and as a compassionate stance of wishing hell on no man, woman or child. Larry Graham probably has less to do with Prince's new-found religion than Prince's own internal needs and search for a cure for the pain of his losses and his fears of the unknown. Prince's choices are his own and I believe that he makes them in truth to his heart and not out of brainwashing by Larry Graham. I have decided to respect his views and his opinions although I do not agree with them. The man is in pain and is searching for answers, as we all are. This is coming from a man who is not religious and does not believe in god, heaven, hell or devils. CAVEAT: This does not mean that I will avoid discussion of religious issues, this is simply stating my opinion of Prince's situation and my respect for his decision. I will remain caustic at most times, but I had a moment of weakness here... *sniff* --- This is a great post. I never understood why non-belivers worried about some else religion. I never belived that Larry Graham brainwashed Prince. A lot of people in the black community are raised in the church. I know that religion was not something foreign to Prince and someday as he got older he was going to slow down the pace of his life a make a decision. I think he his in a lot of pain because of the deaths of his parents and child. I think he probaly has a host of mental and emotional issues to deal with. As much as people hate to admit it religion can be a great comfort to somepeople when they are dealing with a mountain of problems. | |
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Right on IceNine! Well said, love your post!
I think Prince has the right to his own choices in his own life, although I haven't been involved in the org for very long, did people post threads about his decision making in the past. If everyone wanted to question Prince in the past, they could have questioned his sexuality, his love life, eating habits, taste in fashion, etc etc. The list could go on! He has always been spiritual - nobody really questioned his change on spirituality during the Lovesexy era, I really don't think that this is something that Prince has jumped into quickly. he has the brains to study things before actaully doing them and his choice in religion for him is bes t for himself now and/or in the future. We have no control over it so we can either try and understand where he is coming from, and/or accept it and him for who and what he is. I love him regardless and his music still is the best. He could have gone down many different raods in the past but we still have a genius who looks good, takes care of himself and really respects life. Hell, lets thank that he hasn't squandered his life with booze and drugs and is not 6 feet under like many other artists/musicians. PRINCE is here to stay, so let's make him feel good as he does us! | |
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ADORA said: Psychoanalysis is best left up 2 the xperts that actually have face 2 face interaction with said subject.
And the written word is best left to writers who don't type in Princebonics...but do what you need to do to feel sufficiantly Fammy. | |
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IceNine says:
On average, religiosity increases with age, as people begin to truly ponder their own mortality. Teenagers and young adults usually walk around with a feeling of invincibility and do not contemplate the inevitability of death with the depth of a person of advancing age. Prince is certainly getting older and he has recently seen the deaths of multiple family members. I think that there is a very real correlation between the pain associated with the loss of loved ones and his own struggle with the inevitability of his mortality and his much more rigid religious stance. His rejection of the notion of hell can be seen as a rejection of the notion of being punished for past transgressions and as a compassionate stance of wishing hell on no man, woman or child. IceNine, I believe Prince has been searching all his life for the answers to our existence here on earth. He has written much of his music with spiritual overtones. The true meaning of the word, spiritualize, is to deprive oneself of materiality or worldliness, which some religions are more of an advocate of than others. You can certainly see where his views are on certain issues. I think as we walk our personal walk with God we learn, and the spirit guides us. I don't believe one has to be a certain religion to get to heaven. Any religion that teaches they are the only way, and hatred of others, is surely not the way. I don't believe in a God that would threaten in a distructive way. As we grow older, we certainly do learn more and more we are not invincible. This is a lesson that should be taught sooner, rather than latter. Life is short, and precious, we often learn too late to appreciate others, and to not take things for granted. I agree, that getting older surely contributes to seeking more answers, and finding some spiritual refuge, and therefore finding strength. IceNine says: This is coming from a man who is not religious and does not believe in god, heaven, hell or devils. IceNine, I've asked you this before. Since you do not believe in God, heaven, hell or devils. Do you believe in EVIL and GOOD, because they both exist, and who than is responsible for the two? [This message was edited Sun Aug 18 9:05:41 PDT 2002 by EchoOfMySoul] | |
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EchoOfMySoul said: IceNine says:
On average, religiosity increases with age, as people begin to truly ponder their own mortality. Teenagers and young adults usually walk around with a feeling of invincibility and do not contemplate the inevitability of death with the depth of a person of advancing age. Prince is certainly getting older and he has recently seen the deaths of multiple family members. I think that there is a very real correlation between the pain associated with the loss of loved ones and his own struggle with the inevitability of his mortality and his much more rigid religious stance. His rejection of the notion of hell can be seen as a rejection of the notion of being punished for past transgressions and as a compassionate stance of wishing hell on no man, woman or child. IceNine, I believe Prince has been searching all his life for the answers to our existence here on earth. He has written much of his music with spiritual overtones. The true meaning of the word, spiritualize, is to deprive oneself of materiality or worldliness, which some religions are more of an advocate of than others. You can certainly see where his views are on certain issues. I think as we walk our personal walk with God we learn, and the spirit guides us. I don't believe one has to be a certain religion to get to heaven. Any religion that teaches they are the only way, and hatred of others, is surely not the way. I don't believe in a God that would threaten in a distructive way. As we grow older, we certainly do learn more and more we are not invincible. This is a lesson that should be taught sooner, rather than latter. Life is short, and precious, we often learn too late to appreciate others, and to not take things for granted. I agree, that getting older surely contributes to seeking more answers, and finding some spiritual refuge, and therefore finding strength. IceNine says: This is coming from a man who is not religious and does not believe in god, heaven, hell or devils. IceNine, I've asked you this before. Since you do not believe in God, heaven, hell or devils. Do you believe in EVIL and GOOD, because they both exist, and who than is responsible for the two? [This message was edited Sun Aug 18 9:05:41 PDT 2002 by EchoOfMySoul] Watch out IceNine - a preacher is on their way...  | |
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EchoOfMySoul said: Do you believe in EVIL and GOOD, because they both exist, and who than is responsible for the two?
man... icenine keep it up, just from the responce im now able to find out which thread/posts i should avoid... | |
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Anxiety said: Prince has always been in search of a strong male father/role model figure - someone to put him in touch with a black male identity that has been elusive to him all his life. The first half of his career was molded by white men - Chris Moon, Cavallo/Fargnoli/Ruffalo (that's their names?), even early-on bandmates like Matt Fink and Bobby Z., and his trusted bodyguard Chick Huntsberry (please tell me if I'm messing up the spelling of these names left and right)...
Then when these men left him and/or passed away, and around the time of Diamonds and Pearls/the symbol album, he started to fall in with a hip-hop/party crowd, where he could be treated like a super-studly pimp-daddy faux-gangsta, complete with his cane and his tootsie pop and his doo-rag...ultimately that scene didn't work out, and in steps Larry Graham, a confident, strong, secure, spiritual older black man with a strong history in funk and R&B...someone with whom Prince can relate...and someone who invites him into the fold...and around this time, Prince's own father passes away. This might be a little deep, it might even be a little intrusive, but it seems that part of Prince's journey over the past decade has been that of identifying the masculine side of himself...finding the missing pieces of his identity that his father wasn't around to help him find...and when a good ol' boy thug network didn't do the trick, he took a higher road and let Larry and his JW philosophies be the template. Will this be The Truth that he's been looking for? Who knows. We all know how fickle the little guy is, and how impatient and fidgety he is, and how his head can be turned at the drop of a dove feather. I personally think he'll never quit searching, if indeed this is the void he's trying to fill. Just some VERY hyper-analytical thoughts... --- You are making some good points. There is a hugh problem in the black community concerning the lack of black role models for young men. Perhaps having Larry around is a way to make up for that father figure that has been missing in his life. | |
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EchoOfMySoul said: IceNine, I've asked you this before. Since you do not believe in God, heaven, hell or devils. Do you believe in EVIL and GOOD, because they both exist, and who than is responsible for the two?
There is no such thing as good and evil, there are only subjective opinions and good and evil are value judgments. Implying that good and evil actually exist is to pre-suppose a universal metaphysical morality. I do not subscribe to metaphysics and believe that all human actions are judged subjectively based on societal norms and concensus opinion; this does not make these concepts a universal metaphysic because they are subjective opinions. ... [This message was edited Sun Aug 18 10:41:43 PDT 2002 by IceNine] SUPERJOINT RITUAL - http://www.superjointritual.com
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ADORA said: Psychoanalysis is best left up 2 the xperts that actually have face 2 face interaction with said subject.
Preach. | |
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Question?When a lion rips apart a deer or other animal for food it does it in the most cruel way possible(being eaten alive).What did the deer do to deserve this??And why is it considered nature???Why does something have to die for something to live???The average human couldn't even stomach real nature(so are we being removed from GOD??)I am very spiritual and i do believe in GOD(higher being).It's just one of life"s questions i have wondered about since i was a child. | |
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theC said: Question?When a lion rips apart a deer or other animal for food it does it in the most cruel way possible(being eaten alive).What did the deer do to deserve this??And why is it considered nature???Why does something have to die for something to live???The average human couldn't even stomach real nature(so are we being removed from GOD??)I am very spiritual and i do believe in GOD(higher being).It's just one of life"s questions i have wondered about since i was a child.
Deep pondering (analytical) questioning "theC".  I often (daily) ponder the same qwest for understandment to the continuous... neverending... occurences of "life". That's the true beauty of "life" and it's underlying mysteries... it keeps us yearning for "answers" that will best suite our way of life. We are continuously looking for our personal "connections" and how we will relate to it when it arrives within our daily paths. As for your question relating to the ways of nature (among animals)... that has long been a question of mine as well... and all we truly can go on is theory... inter-connected within our own personal beliefs. But the questions will forever continue... and in many ways... I am at peace with that alone. Optimism is purely my personal "chosen" way..., believing that everything has somekind of reason and a valuable lesson to gain in return, even if it's grossly difficult to comprehend.
Beautiful Day... and best wishes... | |
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Ice Nine, I valued/appreciated reading the "compassionate take" you mentioned above. Your words were chosen very nicely. 
Beautiful Day! | |
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Freespirit said: [color=blue:3892cb748f:322f92c144]Ice Nine, I valued/appreciated reading the "compassionate take" you mentioned above. Your words were chosen very nicely.
Beautiful Day! Thank you very much. I don't think that everyone understands that I am usually kidding and making jokes on here... this post was honest. SUPERJOINT RITUAL - http://www.superjointritual.com
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