This question is mainly for orgers in the legal field or music industry, but still open to anyone else...I'm in the development stages of opening a club/lounge cartering to all types of local artists (poets, singers, bands, painters, dancers, etc). I want the name to pay a subtle homage to an artistic and experimental era of P's career. My question is, how can I do this without crossing that line of copyright infringement and/or false representation? Meaning, I know better than to call it something that has Prince written all over it like Glam Slam or Erotic City or The Purple Rain Room. I don't want to make it seem like it is in anyway associated with Paisley Park Ent or Prince supported. Would I be in the safe zone if it was called something like Same December or Strays Of The World? What about something more obscure like 17 Mountains or Butterscotch Clouds? Like I said, I want to pay respects but make it very subtle. Any assistance would be appreciated.

7souls said:

How is "Same December" or "Strays Of The World" at all subtle when those are direct song titles?

It's impossible to copyright a song title exclusively. With a title like "Purple Rain" you are of course pushing it a bit, but "Strays Of The World" really should be no problem.

They may not be subtle to you but if you ask a non P fan about these songs, there's a good chance they're not going to know anything about them or who sings them. How many times have you heard either of these songs on the radio or seen the videos played on VH1 and MTV?

7souls said:

In terms of copyright, if you author something original in tangible form, then you hold copyright over it.

Copyright to the song, "Starfish and Coffee" vested in Prince when he recorded it. That doesn't mean that he has exclusive rights over the words "Starfish" or "Coffee" or necessarily "Starfish and Coffee" if you were considering competing with 'Starbucks' and selling marine life to accompany a skinny latte. But it could be challenged (not necessarily on grounds of copyright) - and he probably has more financial muscle than you. (Just a guess)

You should be careful that you are clearly not trying to pass your business off as in any way being linked with Prince and his businesses, and I suspect he wouldn't wish to be connected with eating our aquatic associates.

I wouldn't in any way advertsie implicitly or explicitly the image or work of Prince as connected with your business. And, as you've spotted, if Prince has in any way registered a mark (e.g. a trading name you should avoid that altogether).

So I would play safer and take one step further back than you are suggesting currently. Combine 'purple' ideas never combined by Prince in his work, and never registered by Prince. Or take one thought and twist it in your own direction. You want something which is a gentle homage rather an opportunity for someone to accuse you of something else.

So calling your club "Purple " is well off limits - but naming your lounge 'The Mellow Experience" and calling one of a range of a non-alcoholic cocktails, "The Strawberry Invasion" is unlikely to get you into deeper water.

Or are those now copyrighted to me?

Use them and I'll make you pay.


[Edited 5/5/06 14:13pm]

pay homage to Prince by doing something original

Universaluv said:

Something original?!? First of all you didn't answer the question that was asked so why waste time replying? Second there are no clubs around this town that spotlight all types of local artists. So explain to me, since you're obviously so intelligent and know all, what is unoriginal about opening a place for the starving artist that wants to read their heart felt poetry to others, or having a place for a painter that can't get their stuff put on display anywhere else or letting a local band play for hours that's 100 times better than anyone currently getting millions just because they slept with the right person to get a record deal?
And if your well thought out and educated reply was supposed to address me asking about relating the name to something P, did you happen to read the part about...development stages? That means I'm tossing around ideas. For all I know, I may come up with a pathetic name like Universaluv. What was the harm in asking someone that knew the legal side of things, since I don't, and luckily getting someone to reply like langebleu that answered all the questions I had???
This has got to be one of the dumbest replies I have ever seen on this site. My goal is to give something back to my community and give the muted voice an open mic, and this is the best that you can think of to write????
[Edited 5/5/06 16:59pm]

Universaluv said:

p.s. Nova and Lang, thanks.
[Edited 5/5/06 16:48pm]

hmmm...i would never take legal advice in a place like this...

That said...I don't think the word "Copyright" is appropriate for what you're talking about. Last I looked, Copyright does not cover song titles. I think what you're talking about is "trademark". Probably something like "Glam Slam" was trademarked for that club of his...but then again, I believe that goes state by state...

You just want to name your place after a prince song?...I think you'd be fine picking pretty much any name...as long as you're not in a state that Prince (or anyone else) has a club that already has that name trademarked or is in use and known.

Like I said, don't take legal advice in here and for goodness sakes don't take this as legal advice...But before you do research it some more or ask someone who has intellectual property experience...Don't limit yourself to lesser known song titles. "17 Days" may be perfectly alright for all you know (and I'm guessing it would be...). Check to see what names have been trademarked in your state. Copyright is not applicable to song titles.

Again, don't take this as legal advice.

JeanGenie said:

Why can't I take this as solid legal advice? So when P's atty comes knockin on my door, my defense can be...but they said I could on Prince.org. You'll need to contact my atty JeanGenie and Associates. I know better, just looking for other orgers constructive advice/opinions. Anyway, I appreciate this. I keep getting the trademark/copyright thing mixed. Like I said, I wanted it to be subtle so in reality there's little to no chance I would actually name something I personally funded and built from scratch after a title someone else came up with. That would be a cop out. My idea came from a friend that plays guitar in a local band. Long time ago, somehow he got to meet Santana. He was given a guitar pick. To this day, every gig he plays he wears that pick on a necklace. It's his way of showing respect for a major inspiration in his life without having to do something so obvious like wearing a shirt with Santana's face pasted all over it. So I thought, if I could inspire at least one kid to come in my club and express him or herself like they never could anywhere else, then I could feel like I did something with the inspiration SOTT, Billy's Glasses, Joy In Repetiton, etc gave me.

actually, she is correct. I am not a lawyer, but a paralegal in the intellectual property field. the lyrics and the musical compisition are a copyright...but what you are seeking is a trademark.

the legalese:

Copyright: Copyright protection under the copyright code (title 17, section 102, U.S. Code) extends only to “original works of authorship.” The statute states clearly that ideas and concepts cannot be protected by copyright. To be protected by copyright, a work must contain at least a certain minimum amount of authorship in the form of original literary, musical, pictorial, or graphic expression. Names, titles, and other short phrases do not meet these requirements.

Trademarks: A trademark is a word, phrase, symbol or design, or a combination of words, phrases, symbols or designs, that identifies and distinguishes the source of the goods of one party from those of others.

Protection under Trademark or Unfair Competition Laws: Some brand names, trade names, slogans, and phrases may be entitled to protection under the general rules of law relating to unfair competition, or they may be entitled to protection and registration under the provisions of state or federal trademark laws. The federal trademark statute covers trademarks and service marks—those words, phrases, symbols, or designs that identify the source of the goods or services of one party and distinguish them from those of others. The Copyright Office has no role in these matters.


In plain english: copyright protects artistical works; trademark protects a phrase or name; a patent protects an invention.

i would suggest searching the trademark office for any registered trademark on the name you decide on. you can search trademarks by going here: http://tess2.uspto.gov/bi...sil3jm.1.1


If you find no registered trademark, I would say go for it, If, for some reason, Prince has a problem with it, like claiming unfair competition, you get a cease and desist letter first. That is a legal requirement. They have to give you a chance to remedy the infringment before they can file suit. If that day should ever come (which I don't think it will if you simply name the place after some obscure Prince song that people outside the community dont even know exist) then you can simply change the name if you dont feel like fighting that battle.

Why not just call it 'Space' - after the Prince song.

7souls said:

And I love you too (thus the pathetic name!).

Just offered my unsolicited opinion on your idea. In this little marketplace of ideas, you're not always gonna get the answers you want from everyone. Take it, leave it, call me an ass. Whatever, hope it works out for ya.

i wonder how this place got round it.

http://www.purplerainbar.com/

kinda nsfw

muirdo said:

Whoa.

Do Something TOTALLY original

nowikno1 said:

what an ironic post

please must we go there again

Justin1972UK said:

Great idea. Perfect name for an art venue, and it references Prince without being obvious.

padawan said:

there is a big Nightclub franchise that goes of the name Space.

There's a coffeeshop in The Netherlands with the name Purple Rain in the same lettering as the Prince album even. I'm surprised there's never been a lawsuit.

Oh and a coffeeshop is not a place to buy coffee if you know what I mean.