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Musicology...Beyonce...etc
[Edited 8/13/05 9:04am]

in 1977 or 78 (forget which), when he signed a contract with WB.

sitruk7 said:

"Don't go for second best baby
Put your love to the test..."

Sure, just last summer he sold out Staples Center, Xcel Energy Center, Allstate Arena, MAdison Square Garden, etc.


Honestly, what is selling out?? You never saw/see Prince hawking soda pop, I-tunes, or McDonalds. I think the only time I saw him in a commercial not related to his music were the "little red corvette" ads for Chevrolet. You could call being attached to "Batman" selling out, but honestly most bands/artists throw a song on a soundtrack for a quick hit or quick cash-most of the time their song has nothing to do with the movie.

At least with Batman, Prince's music was IN THE MOVIE and it was an honest to goodness case of Prince being inspired by the movie.

Out of the hundreds of thousands of artists out there Prince has the respect of most by doing whatever he wants on his terms-regardless of uf you or I think it it is "Selling out".

Bottom line, if you think Prince has ever "sold out" then I challenge you to find a rock star/ musician who hasn't.
[Edited 8/13/05 9:15am]

In my opinion, most of his concerts are a bit of a sell-out, since he plays mostly "hits" - I don't think that's always what he really wants to play...

skywalker said:

Once Dylan was in an underwear commercial it was over. It's hard to be a star and not sell out though. I think Radiohead coulda sold out, but didn't.

Tony M

i think the only time one ever TRULY sells out is when one compromises their freedom or principles for the love of money. i'm going to have to go with my previous comment - even though he may not have known what it would cost him at the time, in retrospect it seems the only time prince has TRULY sold out was when he signed his name to that warners contract. and if he can be excused for signing it in 78, then let's just say the big sell out was when he agreed to that multi-million dollar contract that allegedly was supposed to make him a vice president at WB and yadda yadda yadda.

Anxiety said:

Preach!

As some have said, it depends on one’s interpretation of "selling out". In my opinion, P sells out when he needs to fill the cash coffers. I believe the first time he "sold out" was with Batman. I like the album but it’s filled with songs that sound like past hits (certainly songs like Trust and Partyman) and has got that big old bat logo on front. As much as I liked the experience that was Batdance, what sold the album, or at least a couple of million copies of it, was that big ol' logo. For those that remember that time, EVERYTHING with a batman logo was selling like hotcakes. P is no dummy. Lovesexy was his first commercial "flop" in 6 years (only going gold) and P. wanted to make some money and get back out there on people's radars. So, voila, the Batman soundtrack.

Second time he sold out was with Diamonds and Pearls. The album is not an artistic one, it was designed to be a hit. He got good expensive videos made, did some press, added a freaking rapper to his band, released non-controversial polished singles and went double platinum, not bad after almost sabotaging his career with Graffiti Bridge. I would call Symbol a sell-out too but I just find it an extension of D and P. He releases a hip-hop song as the first single, instead of releasing the best single, 7, first, includes more rap, etc. Didn't work as well as D and P but still a hit.

The third time he sold out was Rave. Except he messed it up. He filled the song with potential commercial hits with artists who were popular at the time (Eve, Stefani, Crow) and then releases the "Prince-like" "Greatest Romance" as the first single. The single's lack of success, late video, and the poor promotion doomed what was surely a "sell-out" album.

Fourth time was last year. Musicology was a "sell-out". Filled with classic sounding Prince songs, not blazingly original but the best imitation he has done of himself in a long time. Didn't get a lot of airplay because of prince being considered ancient according to Top 40 standards but the "sell-out" concert tour was HUGE. All hits, last time he was going to play them, went down smooth.

None of this is intended as criticism. I like when Prince sells. I like when he charts. I like all the albums I mentioned. But all were design for hits, money, and publicity, not art. All were "Prince-like" but diluted and polished, not raw as his best work tends to be. All did well, except for Rave which should have done better.

GottaLetitgo said:

Oh really? How can you be so sure of that?

RealMusician said:

i don't think batman was selling out at all. there was some great stuff on there, and tim burton had issues with some of the music prince offered for the soundtrack, as much as he's said he loved all the music he was offered. i think prince genuinely was excited to work on this project...and i think it shows in the music.

diamonds and pearls, i can kinda see...though i have a hard time viewing "gett off" as a sell-out single.

I dont think Prince would have made a soundtrack to any other movie than Batman, that was some of the first music he learned as a kid, and he did have to be talked in to it

RealMusician said:

Yeah, The Gold Experience tour was a BIG hit. It pissed lots of non-hardcore fans off big time.

Would it not be nice if he could build a bridge between both new and old music? These days his releases seem to be just a reason to go out on tour. None of his recent releases seemes to spark an all new song tour like Sign The Times was back in the day.

sosgemini said:

True. Prince following trends instead of setting them surely was a sign.

Getting Junior Vasquez to do remixes for him was a big mistake. God they sucked so freakin' bad.

BananaCologne said:

I kinda like the Thieves In The Temple Dub.

HamsterHuey said:

What do you want, a medal?

Well, to some extent I would say he kinda sold out when he started to incorporate more Hip-Hop into his music in the early 90's. At the time I thought it was cool for him to get the "Gay Boyz" to dance and rap for him. But nwo that I look back on it, I'd say it was a terrible move. I saw that as Prince trying to stay relevant to what was happening in music then. Hip-Hop and Club/Dance music pretty much dominated the pop charts and I guess Prince wanted to stay hip to the scene. Big mistake. Why? Because now that we look back on that era, it just looks fucking corny. What was Prince trying to do anyway, beat MC Hammer to his own game? Didn't he know that MC Hammer was just pop music and that he would suck about 5-10 years later? Prince should've just kept it real and remain an alternative to the rest of the garbage that was out there. So that was where I thought he sold out.

Prince attempted a major sellout with Rave, imo, but his attempt didn't work.

Anxiety said:[quote]

RealMusician said:

Can we all agree that Arms of orion wasn't done for art's sake?

When folks were saying he wasn't black, and he didn't bother correcting them.

with Batman (he changed direction for that project)
then starting with Diamonds & Pearls and forward a few years
including all the NPG albums, associated artists, etc.
you might also say Rave but really a large majority of Rave
is classic Prince -- the ballads, studio effects, guitar work, piano, vocals

jbell said:

people define color differently
when wasn't Prince Black?
even so-called "white" albums like ATWIAD & Parade
are full of funky moments
and don't forget...
Prince's roots are in MPLS
how black is that?
we're all mostly a product of our influences
no need to correct the fools who'd say such things
the music has always spoken for itself
and if we're gonna be proud of anything
let it be because of what we do
and not because of our physical hue
[Edited 8/13/05 14:04pm]

I'm not speaking in reference to his music. I'm talking about a black man letting a record comany try to pass him off as not a black man. Early in his career folks were saying he was not black.

Tony M
New Power Soul
Rave
The performance with Beyonce.

jbell said:

P never denied he was black. He played with the idea in the song Controversy to spark just that... controversy.

jbell said:

Think about that. If there's any room for question then perhaps it's not a simple matter of black or white. I think the world is moving beyond the one drop theory. Catch up.

I wouldn't say Prince ever sold out. There are times he felt he had to compromise. That's one of the things life's about. Perhaps to reach a wider audience he incorporated rap and enlisted guest artists. Then again it's possible he started to appreciate rap and wanted to work with these people. I don't buy that but who know's what's in his heart.
[Edited 8/13/05 16:40pm]

whodknee said:

I know that there is nobody pure black, pure white etc...bla bla bla., however my mother is black, my father is black, and if someone ask me what race am I and if I choose to answer, I state that I'm black.