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Prince and Tony, Toni, Tone I just want to know what was behind the conflict ( if any ) between Prince and the core members of Tony, Toni, Tone ( Raphael Wiggins - at the time - , Dwayne Wiggins, Timothy Christian ) way back in 87.
First, were they the group that Sheila E worked with during her tours ? Second, Did P ask them to become part of his group, and why did they turn him down? Thank you. Jeux Sans Frontiers | |
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Supposedly at one point in the 80's (before Shelia hit it big), T.T.T used to be her backup band at some gigs. Rapheal Saddiq said that Prince used to go see them play quite often and made mention that he wanted to work with them. I may be wrong, but I think he wanted the band (or certain members)to back him up in 1987. Prince was also going to "reshape" them as his "new band". Rapheal said at 1st they were excited about it, but they saw how Prince does business and they declined. They made mention of it in one of their tunes. | |
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From their first album Who , there is a song " Born Not To Know " that briefly mentions that they " ain't wearnig paisley " . I just want to know what's the story behind that quote. Jeux Sans Frontiers | |
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prince most likely wanted someone who's funk ideas he could steal/borrow. being that andre had left and most of the time tired of his crap. luckly ttt quickly saw what it took some, years to face up to.
[Edited 7/8/05 12:58pm] [Edited 7/8/05 13:18pm] [Edited 7/8/05 13:19pm] [Edited 7/8/05 14:31pm] | |
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UncleGrandpa said: From their first album Who , there is a song " Born Not To Know " that briefly mentions that they " ain't wearnig paisley " . I just want to know what's the story behind that quote.
Ah! So THAT'S what that meant! Good shit homey! "But what of black women? . . . I most sincerely doubt if any other race of women could have brought its fineness up through so devilish a fire." -- W.E.B. Du Bois -- | |
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jbell said: prince most likely wanted someone who's funk ideals he steal/borrow. being that andre left and most of the time tried of his crap.
[Edited 7/8/05 12:58pm] ----- Funny you should say steal. "Born Not To Know" is rip off of DMSR. | |
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jbell said: prince most likely wanted someone who's funk ideals he steal/borrow. being that andre left and most of the time tried of his crap.
[Edited 7/8/05 12:58pm] How can he steal his own INVENTION? = THE TIME. And if Dre was so tight where was his solo career after he left P? "But what of black women? . . . I most sincerely doubt if any other race of women could have brought its fineness up through so devilish a fire." -- W.E.B. Du Bois -- | |
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Think about how Prince has dressed his bandmates and side projects. They can look real dumb. Mazarati was comical. My friend I always used to joke about Miko getting the worst styles 'cause he could cut up the guitar. | |
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TheCrucialExperience said: jbell said: prince most likely wanted someone who's funk ideals he steal/borrow. being that andre left and most of the time tried of his crap.
[Edited 7/8/05 12:58pm] How can he steal his own INVENTION? = THE TIME. And if Dre was so tight where was his solo career after he left P? you cant steal your own invention. however you can steal ideas FROM your so called invention. maybe dre's uses and takes credit for JUST his own ideas! [Edited 7/8/05 13:25pm] [Edited 7/8/05 14:27pm] [Edited 7/8/05 14:33pm] | |
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laurarichardson said: jbell said: prince most likely wanted someone who's funk ideals he steal/borrow. being that andre left and most of the time tried of his crap.
[Edited 7/8/05 12:58pm] ----- Funny you should say steal. "Born Not To Know" is rip off of DMSR. How do you know that "Born Not To Know" is a rip off of "DMSR" and not the other way around. I't prince that has the reputation. for stealing ideas not ttt! [Edited 7/8/05 13:37pm] [Edited 7/8/05 14:33pm] | |
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jbell said: TheCrucialExperience said: How can he steal his own INVENTION? = THE TIME. And if Dre was so tight where was his solo career after he left P? you cant steal your own invention. however you can steal ideal FROM your so called invention maybe dre's uses and takes credit for JUST his own ideals! [Edited 7/8/05 13:25pm] Again, if The Time was Prince's invention, his alter ego, how can he steal from himself? If he wrote the music and lyrics and did the arrangements, how can he steal from something HE came up with? And I have no idea what you Dre comment means.   "But what of black women? . . . I most sincerely doubt if any other race of women could have brought its fineness up through so devilish a fire." -- W.E.B. Du Bois -- | |
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jbell said: laurarichardson said: ----- Funny you should say steal. "Born Not To Know" is rip off of DMSR. How do you know that "Born Not To Know" is a rip off of "DMSR" and not the other way around. I't prince that has the reputation. for stealing ideals not ttt! [Edited 7/8/05 13:37pm] ? Sounds like you're just hatin' for no other reason than to hate. "But what of black women? . . . I most sincerely doubt if any other race of women could have brought its fineness up through so devilish a fire." -- W.E.B. Du Bois -- | |
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TheCrucialExperience said: jbell said: you cant steal your own invention. however you can steal ideal FROM your so called invention maybe dre's uses and takes credit for JUST his own ideals! [Edited 7/8/05 13:25pm] Again, if The Time was Prince's invention, his alter ego, how can he steal from himself? If he wrote the music and lyrics and did the arrangements, how can he steal from something HE came up with? And I have no idea what you Dre comment means. ideas not ideals, sorry | |
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DSMR came long before TTT so it is no way any song they had could have been "riped off" by Prince.
TTT had 2 albums. Prince is a RRHOF member, had the #1 album,#1 pop song ,#1 R&B song ,& #1 album at the same time .Prince had a top 10 song for 10 years straight. Prince was the first Black singer to have a video on MTV.Prince was ..... TTT will be telling their grandkids that Prince wanted them to play in his band. |
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muleFunk said: DSMR came long before TTT so it is no way any song they had could have been "riped off" by Prince.
TTT had 2 albums. Prince is a RRHOF member, had the #1 album,#1 pop song ,#1 R&B song ,& #1 album at the same time .Prince had a top 10 song for 10 years straight. Prince was the first Black singer to have a video on MTV.Prince was ..... TTT will be telling their grandkids that Prince wanted them to play in his band. The Tonies had 4 albums and MJ was the first Black artist to have a vid on MTV. "But what of black women? . . . I most sincerely doubt if any other race of women could have brought its fineness up through so devilish a fire." -- W.E.B. Du Bois -- | |
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muleFunk said: DSMR came long before TTT so it is no way any song they had could have been "riped off" by Prince.
TTT had 2 albums. Prince is a RRHOF member, had the #1 album,#1 pop song ,#1 R&B song ,& #1 album at the same time .Prince had a top 10 song for 10 years straight. Prince was the first Black singer to have a video on MTV.Prince was ..... TTT will be telling their grandkids that Prince wanted them to play in his band. Respect, But I guess you really don't no that much about TTT...Raphael get's a lot of props in the industry as a writer/producer (too much to name...google it...) That guy is very underrated...His shit with TTT is good, but his solo shit is better than anything Prince has put out in the last 15 years....That said, Prince is still on the Mount Rushmore of music royalty...But that doesn't diminish TTT's talents... [Edited 7/8/05 17:13pm] [Edited 7/8/05 17:35pm] | |
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This was never meant to diss TTT, they were obviously successful on their own even with out officially working with P, all of their albums were good. And no doubt Raphael Saadiq ( now ) is a well credited song writer, unfortunately his solo records have not sold well at all. The group as a whole could easily hold their own with P, they were just as good as NPG from 91 - 94 when Rosie left. Could you imagine what Prince's music would have sounded like with TTT as his touring band?
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oh please, if TTT would have backed up Prince, they would have left eventually for sure because it would have been way to many egos in the room. Look at Raphael Saadiq now, he is solo because he couldn't get along with members of his groups (TTT, Lucypearl). I will forever love and miss you...my sweet Prince. | |
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SPYZFAN1 said: Supposedly at one point in the 80's (before Shelia hit it big), T.T.T used to be her backup band at some gigs. Rapheal Saddiq said that Prince used to go see them play quite often and made mention that he wanted to work with them. I may be wrong, but I think he wanted the band (or certain members)to back him up in 1987. Prince was also going to "reshape" them as his "new band". Rapheal said at 1st they were excited about it, but they saw how Prince does business and they declined. They made mention of it in one of their tunes.
I went to high school with the TTT, worked with them on they're second album, and remain good friends and keep in contact with Ray(Rapheal) and Dewayne. If you have the 12in. version of it feels good, I am the guy that does the P-funk inspired speaking part after the rap. My youngest son, and Dewayne's three children attend the same school. I say all of this so that you guys will know that I know what I am talking about, not just spreading speculation. Two of the tonies were in Sheila's band. Rapheal and Tim. The third member was not a primary menber TTT. that person was carl wheeler keyboardist for Sheila's band, and TTT. He's the one that wore the priests' collar.These fellows were in Shiela's touring band for the album "Shiela E" in 86' and early 87'. This group opened for P&the Revolution in Japan. P asked them to join his band when he dissolved the Revolution. He wanted Sheila's whole group to be his new band. Everyone accepted but the guys who would eventually become TTT. They were flatterd, but they wanted more creative control over their music. Not to mention,m ore cash than P was willing to pay at that time. The three got with RAy's brother Dewayne,and their cousin elijah baker, and friend Antron Halle, and 3T was born. The other members of Sheila's band hooked up with what was left of the revolution and became the sign/lovesexy band. That's how it really went down. THIS IS NOT MUSIC, THIS IS A TRIP! | |
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mkdagrizzley said: SPYZFAN1 said: Supposedly at one point in the 80's (before Shelia hit it big), T.T.T used to be her backup band at some gigs. Rapheal Saddiq said that Prince used to go see them play quite often and made mention that he wanted to work with them. I may be wrong, but I think he wanted the band (or certain members)to back him up in 1987. Prince was also going to "reshape" them as his "new band". Rapheal said at 1st they were excited about it, but they saw how Prince does business and they declined. They made mention of it in one of their tunes.
I went to high school with the TTT, worked with them on they're second album, and remain good friends and keep in contact with Ray(Rapheal) and Dewayne. If you have the 12in. version of it feels good, I am the guy that does the P-funk inspired speaking part after the rap. My youngest son, and Dewayne's three children attend the same school. I say all of this so that you guys will know that I know what I am talking about, not just spreading speculation. Two of the tonies were in Sheila's band. Rapheal and Tim. The third member was not a primary menber TTT. that person was carl wheeler keyboardist for Sheila's band, and TTT. He's the one that wore the priests' collar.These fellows were in Shiela's touring band for the album "Shiela E" in 86' and early 87'. This group opened for P&the Revolution in Japan. P asked them to join his band when he dissolved the Revolution. He wanted Sheila's whole group to be his new band. Everyone accepted but the guys who would eventually become TTT. They were flatterd, but they wanted more creative control over their music. Not to mention,m ore cash than P was willing to pay at that time. The three got with RAy's brother Dewayne,and their cousin elijah baker, and friend Antron Halle, and 3T was born. The other members of Sheila's band hooked up with what was left of the revolution and became the sign/lovesexy band. That's how it really went down. interesting  I will forever love and miss you...my sweet Prince. | |
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mkdagrizzley said: SPYZFAN1 said: Supposedly at one point in the 80's (before Shelia hit it big), T.T.T used to be her backup band at some gigs. Rapheal Saddiq said that Prince used to go see them play quite often and made mention that he wanted to work with them. I may be wrong, but I think he wanted the band (or certain members)to back him up in 1987. Prince was also going to "reshape" them as his "new band". Rapheal said at 1st they were excited about it, but they saw how Prince does business and they declined. They made mention of it in one of their tunes.
I went to high school with the TTT, worked with them on they're second album, and remain good friends and keep in contact with Ray(Rapheal) and Dewayne. If you have the 12in. version of it feels good, I am the guy that does the P-funk inspired speaking part after the rap. My youngest son, and Dewayne's three children attend the same school. I say all of this so that you guys will know that I know what I am talking about, not just spreading speculation. Two of the tonies were in Sheila's band. Rapheal and Tim. The third member was not a primary menber TTT. that person was carl wheeler keyboardist for Sheila's band, and TTT. He's the one that wore the priests' collar.These fellows were in Shiela's touring band for the album "Shiela E" in 86' and early 87'. This group opened for P&the Revolution in Japan. P asked them to join his band when he dissolved the Revolution. He wanted Sheila's whole group to be his new band. Everyone accepted but the guys who would eventually become TTT. They were flatterd, but they wanted more creative control over their music. Not to mention,m ore cash than P was willing to pay at that time. The three got with RAy's brother Dewayne,and their cousin elijah baker, and friend Antron Halle, and 3T was born. The other members of Sheila's band hooked up with what was left of the revolution and became the sign/lovesexy band. That's how it really went down. Thank you very much for answering my question, that solves everything I wanted to know. It must have been-nice to be a part of such a successful band as TTT, thanks for sharing you experience. Jeux Sans Frontiers | |
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Look, I have 3 TTT albums and like their music ,however who will be remembered by the non-fan ...Prince or the TTT ?
They had a lot of courage for stepping out into their forum instead of backing Prince and both (Prince with SOTT band and TTT with their own albums) profited from the eventual situations. To say that TTT is on an even level with Prince in the 91-94 time is truly hyperbole. They dissed Prince in the music. I have not heard Prince even mention them in any medium so why did they call Prince out? Prince was the first with Little Red Corvette. MJ came right after P with Billie Jean. I was there to see the shit. |
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TTT will be remember more by black fans than the POP majority no doubt, I don't believe they ever placed very high on the mainstream Top 30 ( at least not enough for any one to care ). All I was trying to say about TTT and NPG at the time was that they were pretty much even to each other ( with the exception of Levi and Sonny ) . Were you to remove Tony M, Tommy, Kirk and Morris Hayes, the guys from TTT could have easily handled the pressure of being with Prince. I don't think it's wrong to say that that period of the NPG was not his best band.
From what I read from the earlier response from the guy who actually worked with TTT, I can agree with him that the egos of Prince and TTT would have eventually clashed, but since they never really worked together, there's no need to debate who will be remembered more. Jeux Sans Frontiers | |
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mk, did 3T replace Ray with his cousin or a dude that sounds like him? "But what of black women? . . . I most sincerely doubt if any other race of women could have brought its fineness up through so devilish a fire." -- W.E.B. Du Bois -- | |
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TheCrucialExperience said: mk, did 3T replace Ray with his cousin or a dude that sounds like him?
oh my gosh, its funny you ask this because i think right after Raphael Saadiq left TTT, they had some kind of performance I think it was Soul Train or Saturday Night Live, or something and they had this guy jumping around and doing the same moves as Saadiq, yet they avoided showing his face. I will forever love and miss you...my sweet Prince. | |
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missfee said: TheCrucialExperience said: mk, did 3T replace Ray with his cousin or a dude that sounds like him?
oh my gosh, its funny you ask this because i think right after Raphael Saadiq left TTT, they had some kind of performance I think it was Soul Train or Saturday Night Live, or something and they had this guy jumping around and doing the same moves as Saadiq, yet they avoided showing his face. really! LOL! Yeah, a buddy of mine said they replaced him with a dude that was either his cousin but he sounded just like him. "But what of black women? . . . I most sincerely doubt if any other race of women could have brought its fineness up through so devilish a fire." -- W.E.B. Du Bois -- | |
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"Sounds like you're just hatin' for no other reason than to hate." | |
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muleFunk said: DSMR came long before TTT so it is no way any song they had could have been "riped off" by Prince.
TTT had 2 albums. Prince is a RRHOF member, had the #1 album,#1 pop song ,#1 R&B song ,& #1 album at the same time .Prince had a top 10 song for 10 years straight. Prince was the first Black singer to have a video on MTV.Prince was ..... TTT will be telling their grandkids that Prince wanted them to play in his band. ----- Co-Sign. I am not going to waste my time talking a newbie who does not know how old DMSR is. TTT were in JHS when that song came out. I guess they jumped on a private plane a flew to Minn after gym class. (LOL). I come to the this board for the laughs. | |
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murph said: muleFunk said: DSMR came long before TTT so it is no way any song they had could have been "riped off" by Prince.
TTT had 2 albums. Prince is a RRHOF member, had the #1 album,#1 pop song ,#1 R&B song ,& #1 album at the same time .Prince had a top 10 song for 10 years straight. Prince was the first Black singer to have a video on MTV.Prince was ..... TTT will be telling their grandkids that Prince wanted them to play in his band. Respect, But I guess you really don't no that much about TTT...Raphael get's a lot of props in the industry as a writer/producer (too much to name...google it...) That guy is very underrated...His shit with TTT is good, but his solo shit is better than anything Prince has put out in the last 15 years....That said, Prince is still on the Mount Rushmore of music royalty...But that doesn't diminish TTT's talents... [Edited 7/8/05 17:13pm] [Edited 7/8/05 17:35pm] ----- I don't think anyone is dissing TTT but, they were not a pop group and therefore, they don't have the fame that P has. P was the 2nd black man to get on MTV. He is an ICON and I think a lot of people have an issue with giving his dap. That said I don't think Raphael's solo work is on par with anything Prince has done. I do think TTT was an incredible band and if they had went with Prince it would have only been a few years before they rolled out and on to bigger and better things. However, it does not make it okay to rip off DMSR (LOL) | |
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yes p borrowered heavily from his bandmembers and didnt give them credit..
yes the written, arranged and produced by prince monicure is a huge joke... yes prince is a genius that deserves his RRHF awards and grammies and stardom.... yes andre cymone went on to become a hot hot hot producer..... yes morris day wrote a prince song that became his first big hit.. and yes some fans will deny any of this...or they will start to nitpick at reality because they cant accept the fact that prince walked all over people to become famous....which in itself is a talent... and yes i cant wait for laurarichardson to come up with some witty, friendly, insightful responce to my comments.. Space for sale... | |
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