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Thread started 10/21/04 12:29pm

dealodelandron

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The MIS-Education of Lenny Kravitz (Prince mentioned frequently)

http://www.soul-patrol.co...04/news17/

EDITORIAL: The MIS-Education of Lenny Kravitz

This is my reply to certain statements made by Mr. Lenny Kravitz during a recent interview. The coments of Mr Kravitz are italicized and in red.

Kravitz wishes others also would ease up. Ever since he made his debut with the album "Let Love Rule" in 1989 with it's mix of R&B, funk, and psychedelic rock, Kravitz has been labeled a recycler - someone who borrows the styles of others. Even though Kravitz arguably has now developed his own sound, critics still charge he sounds like some other act - Prince, the Rolling Stones, Jimi Hendrix, etc.

Own sound or not, the real question in my mind is...
"When is Lenny Kravitz ever going to produce an album that measures up to the RECORD COMPANY HYPE and MILLIONS OF MARKETING DOLLARS that accompanies his every move"


The subject brings out a rare display of emotion from the typically low-key musician.

Lenny please stop whining and just put out a good album (If that is indeed possible???)


So why does he think he's been criticized? "I'm a black man in rock-and-roll, first of all, and the only one right now

SURELY HE DOES NOT TRULY BELIEVE THIS????
Personally I think this is an insult to every other Black rock n' roll artist out there plying their trade. I'll check with the Black Rock Coilition and find out if they have any actual statistical data on this, however I feel quite safe in saying that Lenny needs to wash his mouth out with soap.

(go and check your numbers Lenny)


"If I was white, we wouldn't even be having this conversation about these critics. I'd be sliced bread..."

Psssst...
Lenny, lets be honest for just a moment.
(And then you can return to your fantasy world)

Think back to the night of 3/15/2004 while you were sitting FRONT ROW AND CENTER at the 2004 Rock n' Roll Hall of Fame Induction Ceremonies. Remember the look of sheer horror on your face as someone named PRINCE delivered one of the greatest Rock n' Roll performances of ALL TIME, just a few feet away from you.

Maybe you have conveniently forgotten about all of this, but I haven't. I was there just a few feet away from your table. Don't cha remember???
You were sitting there with a whole bunch of rich and wealthy music industry executives.
I guess they were friends of yours?
Don't just take my word for it. Ask one of them if you don't want to believe me...

Ask them to recall, how on that night PRINCE looked like he had just invented Rock n' Roll, just moments before getting his statue forever enshrining him as one of the "GREATEST OF THE GREATS"?????

Last time I looked, ISN'T PRINCE A BLACK MAN?

Or maybe he shouldn't count since he wasn't SITTING FRONT ROW AND CENTER, schmoozing with rich and wealthy multinational corporate executives while the MIGHTY DELLS WERE SEATED RIGHT NEXT TO THE KITCHEN DOOR???

Was that a consideration for you Lenny?
Did you even notice these two events?
I know that you noticed the performance of Prince, because I could see how glazed over your eyes were (like a deer in headlights kinda look) and how you looked like you wanted to run away and hide, because you KNEW that you (and everyone else there that night) were witnessing ROCK AND ROLL HISTORY RIGHT IN FRONT OF THEM BEING CREATED BY A BLACK MAN. (and knowing that you have proven beyond a shadow of a doubt over the PAST 10 YEARS that YOU ARE INCAPABLE OF PRODUCING MUSIC AT A SIMILAR LEVEL????)

But all of that aside for the moment Lenny, did ya notice the Dells?
* Did you notice that they were REAL VICTIMS OF RACISM DURING THAT SAME MOMENT?
* Did you walk over and acknowledge their presence, like Prince did?
* Did you ask your rich buddies at your table why YOU weren't seated next to the kitchen door, so that the people who were actually being honored that evening could sit "FRONT ROW AND
CENTER"???

On second thought, maybe you are correct Lenny??
Maybe if you were white we wouldn't even be having this conversation???

(Ok, now lets return to Lenny's fantasy world)

"They lie, they do things, they follow you around," he rants. "I'm not looking for the attention. If you catch me coming out of a restaurant or out of a house and shoot my photo, there's nothing I can do about it."

As my man from the old TV show "Good Times" might say...
"LENNAAYY, LENNAAYY, LENNAAYY, JUST IMAGINE HOW MUCH ALL OF THOSE STAGED PHOTOS WILL BE WORTH WHEN (and if) YOU EVER PRODUCE A GOOD ALBUM...."

While he still may be looking for love, he's no longer searching for happiness - he's managed to find peace within himself.

(no comment)

Perhaps it would be a useful exercise for Lenny Kravitz to read more about someone like Sammy Davis Jr. and his struggles, before he is so damn quick to portray himself as some kind of a victim???

Sammy really was THE ONLY ONE and he was able to get by some of the obstacles that he was faced with, because he was a GREAT entertainer. Perhaps Lenny will discover that the key to becoming a great star isn't by whining and trying to somehow use the fact that he is Black as some kind of an excuse as to why he isn't a "big star"???

Maybe if Lenny were to actually take the time to read up on some Black History, he would discover that the people from our community who became "big stars", didn't achieve that based on dressing the part, making the gossip columns, or WHINING to the press. These people like Sammy Davis Jr. achieved GREATNESS because they were GREAT ENTERTAINERS, who WORKED HARD to achieve their goals.

I fully realize that taking the time to find out what others did to make themselves great (and trying to emulate some of their behaviors) may not be as exciting as hanging out with record company executives, making stylish video's for eMpTVy or being photographed with Hollyweird actresses.

However my feeling is that if a person wants to be recognized as "great", regardless of their field or profession, taking the lessons learned by others who have already "walked where you want to go", might just be a good way to get started down that path.

One of the great things about taking that approach is that usually those who have already "walked where you want to go", usually leave some "footprints" for you to follow. In my experience once a person learns this, all they need to do next is to do the HARD WORK required to grow into that person's footsteps...

My advice to Lenny is to find the footsteps that Sammy left for him (and others) to follow and try to follow that path. He could do (and has already done) far worse...

(Just trying to be constructive...)

--Bob Davis
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Reply #1 posted 10/21/04 1:21pm

FunkMistress

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This is an "editorial"? Reads like someone's overcaffeinated blog entry.
CHICKENS ARE NOT SUPPOSED TO DO COCAINE, SILKY HEN.
The Normal Whores Club
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Reply #2 posted 10/21/04 2:01pm

GooeyTheHamste
r

FunkMistress said:

This is an "editorial"? Reads like someone's overcaffeinated blog entry.


We call this INAPPROPRIATE THREADING from now on...
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Reply #3 posted 10/21/04 2:55pm

Anxiety

FunkMistress said:

This is an "editorial"? Reads like someone's overcaffeinated blog entry.


you know, on one level, i would agree with you. the editor in me is cringing, because this reads like a particularly spirited internet rant moreso than the skillfully scathing indictment the author may have intended it to be. this is a piece of writing desperately in need of serious triage and grooming.

on another level, as a music fan, i completely agree with what the guy had to say and, as much as i would love to this day to be a big fan of lenny's - i ADORED 'let love rule' and even got a kick out of 'are you gonna go my way' - his work gets more and more bland and predictable with each album. he's become a product. his creativity seems to be bleached and/or fading - not that it was exactly vibrant to begin with, but at least he started out seeming to have some kind of texture that was refreshing among all the disposable crappy pop music coming out at the time he came on the scene...and now he seems to be in that same cesspool of crap.

i didn't know the bit about prince chatting with the dells at the RNRHOF. that's class. it's also the kind of thing a true music fan would do. nice one, P.
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Reply #4 posted 10/21/04 5:27pm

Snap

i'm confused confuse who's saying what and to whom? and why like this? tho i think i get the gist
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Reply #5 posted 10/21/04 6:58pm

laurarichardso
n

Snap said:

i'm confused confuse who's saying what and to whom? and why like this? tho i think i get the gist

-----
This was written by Bob Davis the guy who runs Soul Patrol. He is just putting in his comments concerning an interview that Lenny did a few months ago.

Bob was at the RnRHOF and had reported on his website the glazed look Lenny had on his face that night. I really think Lenny's comments about being the only black in Rock n Roll really pissed Bob off.


I must say I agree with everything Bob is saying.
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Reply #6 posted 10/21/04 7:59pm

Bull

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I'm a Lenny fan, But I have 2 agree with the writer on this 1.It's not about color, its about music and ur craft.
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Reply #7 posted 10/21/04 10:35pm

ufoclub

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this is a good read. I like emootional insider bickering. Kudos for Prince to acknowledge The Dells.
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Reply #8 posted 10/22/04 12:44am

DavidEye

Yeah,I read this article on the Soul Patrol website.It's very interesting.
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Reply #9 posted 10/22/04 2:20am

Hotlegs

Eventhough my man Lenny has become an coporate rock star, I still think that the Soul Patrol writer is being a little harsh on him.In Lenny's music catalouge of songs, he has written some good tunes in the past. However over the last couple years, he has become a slave to the rhythm (record company proto-type). I don't think that Lenny has shown any spite towards P b/c he idolized P (hair doo and all). Given some time, he will become enlighten about record companies like P did and find himself.
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Reply #10 posted 10/22/04 5:38am

dealodelandron

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yeah, i'm kinda thinking this is a bit harsh. but if kravitz really does feel that way, i think he is overstating his importance to music.

i dug let love rule, really liked mama said + are you gonna go my way. circus has a few interesting moments, and 5 was kinda cool. after that...he practically fell off the cliff rather than just a gradual downgrade in quality.
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Reply #11 posted 10/22/04 6:17am

papabeat

ufoclub said:

this is a good read. I like emootional insider bickering. Kudos for Prince to acknowledge The Dells.

Interesting insight in that article, but it trips in trying to congratulate Prince. I don't read the part where Prince then invited the Dells over to his better table.
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Reply #12 posted 10/22/04 8:14am

OdysseyMiles

Anxiety said:

i didn't know the bit about prince chatting with the dells at the RNRHOF. that's class. it's also the kind of thing a true music fan would do. nice one, P.


I didn't know about that either. That was total class. It doesn't surprise me though. P has always seemed to have a deep respect for his musical elders (Miles, Ray, Stevie, Mavis, Carlos, Joni..). thumbs up!
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Reply #13 posted 10/22/04 8:52am

raveon2tnek

now a wanna be suddenly wants to be prince!!
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Reply #14 posted 10/22/04 8:59am

ufoclub

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Did prince even have a table.. did they show him at the table? I only saw the performances parts, and a few bits.

papabeat said:

ufoclub said:

this is a good read. I like emootional insider bickering. Kudos for Prince to acknowledge The Dells.

Interesting insight in that article, but it trips in trying to congratulate Prince. I don't read the part where Prince then invited the Dells over to his better table.
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Reply #15 posted 10/22/04 1:37pm

prettymansson

let love rule and mama said were the BOMB !! after that ??? i think the models and the fashion...and the fake "starworld" stole the mans focus on making quality personal music....how do you write about positivity when u are a shallow asshole ?
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Reply #16 posted 10/22/04 1:40pm

prettymansson

"shallow asshole"
hmmmm...maybe i shouldnt judge...our man prince has been thought of in the same way by most of the people that he worked with from 1978-1995 too....
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Reply #17 posted 10/22/04 2:45pm

Kellie

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I love Lenny....I don't care who thinks he is "corporate" or whatever they want to think, that's their opinion...I think he's great & puts on a hell of a show too.....I just want to say I don't understand though why would someone say he said "if I was a white man" or whatever???? He IS a 1/2 white Jewish ...AND 1/2 black man...I can't stand when people start throwing the "black thing" or the "white thing" big freaking whoop deee doo.....we are all PEOPLE regardless of our color. rolleyes He was giving an interview on tv actually a few weeks ago & he is the most down to earth & nice people, and he isn't sitting there wityh a head to huge to fit through the door.....Besides his first couple of albums were during his angry period when he & his wife were splitting.....he even stated that himself.....I still love my Lenny no matter what anyone says . horny
"Let me take you away from here.........forever"
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Reply #18 posted 10/22/04 4:47pm

Thunderbird

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I think that article has a lot of valid points, but he arguments are awful. I think that "I'm a black man in rock-and-roll, first of all, and the only one right now" quote is pretty old, before Prince's comeback this year. Besides, he's right if he means at his level of stardom and popularity. I don't see any other black rock and roll guys doing Target commercials and selling songs to Microsoft.

And as far as Lenny getting a better seat than the Dells? Please. Lenny probably sat with the executives because he's the one still making the money. And for goodness sake, they were the ones getting inducted, the hell does it matter where they sit? I don't think their table had anything to do with racism. Maybe it did, but I don't think that's obvious. Hey, maybe Lenny isn't a big Dells fan. Is he obligated to go over and say hi? Prince did because he's old and remembers when they were still popular. Were all the short people obligated to greet Prince?

He's right about Sammy. Sammy was always very, very appreciative of his fame. As much as Lenny thinks people hate him, he doesn't have to deal with the racism Sammy was shown. Frank had to fight just to get him hotel rooms where they were performing. When you look at old marquees of the Sands hotel, Sammy's name is in a different color. That's bad. Lenny has it easy. At least when he's attacked by the press, his manservant can defend him.

OK, so Sammy would have had Frank's mafia buddies. It's not a perfect analogy, I know. biggrin But I do think that Lenny has worked hard to get to the level of fame and stardom he's at. Lenny does take a ton of criticism; it's understandable that he'd let his annoyance slip now and then, especially because every interviewer brings it up.
When the sunlight strikes raindrops in the air, they act as a prism and form a rainbow. The rainbow is a division of white light into many beautiful colors. Regardless of the day, I'm glad you were born.
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Reply #19 posted 10/22/04 4:59pm

Hotlegs

Thunderbird said:



But I do think that Lenny has worked hard to get to the level of fame and stardom he's at. Lenny does take a ton of criticism; it's understandable that he'd let his annoyance slip now and then, especially because every interviewer brings it up.


nod Exactly.
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Reply #20 posted 10/23/04 1:26am

sataninas

pout
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Reply #21 posted 10/23/04 9:42am

SynthiaRose

Thunderbird said:

I think that article has a lot of valid points, but he arguments are awful. I think that "I'm a black man in rock-and-roll, first of all, and the only one right now" quote is pretty old, before Prince's comeback this year. Besides, he's right if he means at his level of stardom and popularity. I don't see any other black rock and roll guys doing Target commercials and selling songs to Microsoft.

And as far as Lenny getting a better seat than the Dells? Please. Lenny probably sat with the executives because he's the one still making the money. And for goodness sake, they were the ones getting inducted, the hell does it matter where they sit? I don't think their table had anything to do with racism. Maybe it did, but I don't think that's obvious. Hey, maybe Lenny isn't a big Dells fan. Is he obligated to go over and say hi? Prince did because he's old and remembers when they were still popular. Were all the short people obligated to greet Prince?

He's right about Sammy. Sammy was always very, very appreciative of his fame. As much as Lenny thinks people hate him, he doesn't have to deal with the racism Sammy was shown. Frank had to fight just to get him hotel rooms where they were performing. When you look at old marquees of the Sands hotel, Sammy's name is in a different color. That's bad. Lenny has it easy. At least when he's attacked by the press, his manservant can defend him.

OK, so Sammy would have had Frank's mafia buddies. It's not a perfect analogy, I know. biggrin But I do think that Lenny has worked hard to get to the level of fame and stardom he's at. Lenny does take a ton of criticism; it's understandable that he'd let his annoyance slip now and then, especially because every interviewer brings it up.



Wow, your comments are great!
__
Anyway, here are my thoughts:

I actually saw Lenny make these comments in an interview this summer.

Context is everything. He said "if i were white we wouldn't even be having this conversation" during a discussion of his similarities to other black rockers (prince, hendrix). (and he did mention he was half-white by the way).

He's just tired of people making comparisons.

White people who play guitars don't aways have to defend whether they are copying others. I got his point. He wasn't talking about racism ... as much as people being unable to see beyond Hendrix and Prince to recognize a black rocker trying to stand on his own sound (is his music and playing really that similar to PRince and Jimi... or do people just see black skin and a guitar?)


And I understand what he's saying about attracting critique because he's the only black rocker out there now.He is. It makes him a stand-out for scrutiny.

Of course there are other lesser known individuals, but on the pop culture center stage right now, he's the only one.

To me Prince isn't really marketing himself as rock, but rather funk.

Anyway, I really love Baptism. I went on a trip and took all of Lenny's albums with me. I played Baptism first .. then a greatest hits collection. The older songs (with the exception of Are Gonna Go My Way and maybe Mr. Cab Driver) sounded a little sluggish next to Baptism, which has a LOT of energy and intensity (even in the slow tracks, to me).

I don't think Lenny's making crappy music right now.

He's not a genius, but he has his own style and frankly I'm glad he's offering me an alternative to the music out there now. I don't like funk or hip hop ... and Prince won't rock for me, so I'm glad Lenny is.

And about Lenny being jealous of Prince. I highly doubt that's the case. He reveres him. I'm sure Lenny's eyes weren't 'glazing over' in envy. He respects the man.

This reviewer seems to have deep and personal animosity toward Lenny.
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Reply #22 posted 10/23/04 10:02am

YODAHENDRIX

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SynthiaRose said:

Thunderbird said:

I think that article has a lot of valid points, but he arguments are awful. I think that "I'm a black man in rock-and-roll, first of all, and the only one right now" quote is pretty old, before Prince's comeback this year. Besides, he's right if he means at his level of stardom and popularity. I don't see any other black rock and roll guys doing Target commercials and selling songs to Microsoft.

And as far as Lenny getting a better seat than the Dells? Please. Lenny probably sat with the executives because he's the one still making the money. And for goodness sake, they were the ones getting inducted, the hell does it matter where they sit? I don't think their table had anything to do with racism. Maybe it did, but I don't think that's obvious. Hey, maybe Lenny isn't a big Dells fan. Is he obligated to go over and say hi? Prince did because he's old and remembers when they were still popular. Were all the short people obligated to greet Prince?

He's right about Sammy. Sammy was always very, very appreciative of his fame. As much as Lenny thinks people hate him, he doesn't have to deal with the racism Sammy was shown. Frank had to fight just to get him hotel rooms where they were performing. When you look at old marquees of the Sands hotel, Sammy's name is in a different color. That's bad. Lenny has it easy. At least when he's attacked by the press, his manservant can defend him.

OK, so Sammy would have had Frank's mafia buddies. It's not a perfect analogy, I know. biggrin But I do think that Lenny has worked hard to get to the level of fame and stardom he's at. Lenny does take a ton of criticism; it's understandable that he'd let his annoyance slip now and then, especially because every interviewer brings it up.



Wow, your comments are great!
__
Anyway, here are my thoughts:

I actually saw Lenny make these comments in an interview this summer.

Context is everything. He said "if i were white we wouldn't even be having this conversation" during a discussion of his similarities to other black rockers (prince, hendrix). (and he did mention he was half-white by the way).

He's just tired of people making comparisons.

White people who play guitars don't aways have to defend whether they are copying others. I got his point. He wasn't talking about racism ... as much as people being unable to see beyond Hendrix and Prince to recognize a black rocker trying to stand on his own sound (is his music and playing really that similar to PRince and Jimi... or do people just see black skin and a guitar?)


And I understand what he's saying about attracting critique because he's the only black rocker out there now.He is. It makes him a stand-out for scrutiny.

Of course there are other lesser known individuals, but on the pop culture center stage right now, he's the only one.

To me Prince isn't really marketing himself as rock, but rather funk.

Anyway, I really love Baptism. I went on a trip and took all of Lenny's albums with me. I played Baptism first .. then a greatest hits collection. The older songs (with the exception of Are Gonna Go My Way and maybe Mr. Cab Driver) sounded a little sluggish next to Baptism, which has a LOT of energy and intensity (even in the slow tracks, to me).

I don't think Lenny's making crappy music right now.

He's not a genius, but he has his own style and frankly I'm glad he's offering me an alternative to the music out there now. I don't like funk or hip hop ... and Prince won't rock for me, so I'm glad Lenny is.

And about Lenny being jealous of Prince. I highly doubt that's the case. He reveres him. I'm sure Lenny's eyes weren't 'glazing over' in envy. He respects the man.

This reviewer seems to have deep and personal animosity toward Lenny.



At last an intelligent, well written statement here.

Open ure eyes 2 this ignorant people.
Luminous beings are we...not this crude matter.
Is this 2morrow or just the END of time?
The Funk will always b with u
"I've got a face, not just my race, Bang
Bang I've got you babe!"
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Reply #23 posted 10/23/04 10:13am

laurarichardso
n

Thunderbird said:

I think that article has a lot of valid points, but he arguments are awful. I think that "I'm a black man in rock-and-roll, first of all, and the only one right now" quote is pretty old, before Prince's comeback this year. Besides, he's right if he means at his level of stardom and popularity. I don't see any other black rock and roll guys doing Target commercials and selling songs to Microsoft.

And as far as Lenny getting a better seat than the Dells? Please. Lenny probably sat with the executives because he's the one still making the money. And for goodness sake, they were the ones getting inducted, the hell does it matter where they sit? I don't think their table had anything to do with racism. Maybe it did, but I don't think that's obvious. Hey, maybe Lenny isn't a big Dells fan. Is he obligated to go over and say hi? Prince did because he's old and remembers when they were still popular. Were all the short people obligated to greet Prince?


He's right about Sammy. Sammy was always very, very appreciative of his fame. As much as Lenny thinks people hate him, he doesn't have to deal with the racism Sammy was shown. Frank had to fight just to get him hotel rooms where they were performing. When you look at old marquees of the Sands hotel, Sammy's name is in a different color. That's bad. Lenny has it easy. At least when he's attacked by the press, his manservant can defend him.

OK, so Sammy would have had Frank's mafia buddies. It's not a perfect analogy, I know. biggrin But I do think that Lenny has worked hard to get to the level of fame and stardom he's at. Lenny does take a ton of criticism; it's understandable that he'd let his annoyance slip now and then, especially because every interviewer brings it up.

-----
-----"
"I don't see any other black rock and roll guys doing Target commercials and selling songs to Microsoft."

What artist wants to do a Target Commercial? (LOL)

"And as far as Lenny getting a better seat than the Dells? Please. Lenny probably sat with the executives because he's the one still making the money."
-----
Well let's see the the Dells were the ones being inducted in the RnR Hall of Fame not Lenny and Lenny is not selling a whole lot of records right now.

"I don't think their table had anything to do with racism. Maybe it did, but I don't think that's obvious"

Well you don't know the back story about how hard it was to get the Dells in the Rock n Roll Hall of Fame. Bob Davis worked hard to get them in and he has complained before about the way this organization has treated black artist. A lot of racism is going on behind closed doors.

I am younger them Prince and I know who the Dells are it just a matter of showing respect for the artist that came before you. Something Prince seems to do a lot. It is just about having respect.
[Edited 10/23/04 10:14am]
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Reply #24 posted 10/23/04 11:51am

PurpleCharm

ufoclub said:

Did prince even have a table.. did they show him at the table? I only saw the performances parts, and a few bits.

papabeat said:


Interesting insight in that article, but it trips in trying to congratulate Prince. I don't read the part where Prince then invited the Dells over to his better table.

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Reply #25 posted 10/23/04 1:18pm

DMSR88

Here's my twocents of the deal.

Lenny has indeed recieved a lot of criticism in his 15 years of being in the industry. From when he was first starting out and trying to get a record deal in LA, record execs were always saying that he wasn't black enough, or he wasn't white enough, and refused to sign him because he wouldn't change.

Instead of critisizing Lenny, you have to look at the good he's done. He's been in the business for 15 years already. 15 years! Now how many artists nowadays do you even see staying that long? And, about what I just said, Lenny REFUSED to change his music just to get signed, which is what true class is all about, and what Prince has been preaching if I'm not mistaken.

However, I do see why he is getting bashed many times.

Lenny didn't say he was the ONLY black musician in rock music. Back in 2002-2003 in his DVD of all places, he said that rock & roll was a black artfrom (which is true) and he didn't see why more black people didn't embrace it as a musical style (probably because the media portrays black people as rappers and thugs and nothing more, but when a black guy picks up a gitar, it's weird). He said he was the only MAIN one out there right now (which is true, on his level of experience and commercial success). There are other black rockers out there, like Ben Harper and etc., but mainly, Lenny is the only one you see. Prince may play a guitar, but Prince promotes himself as more funk instead of rock & roll, and besides, this was back in 2002-2003 when he said this. How popular was Prince back then?

He says that he hates paparazzi and doesn't like going out, and that it shouldn't be about his clothes or who he's going out with, but he is constantly seen with his numerous Hollywood girlfriends on Sunset Blvd. I really do think that if you go up to someone on the street, they'd know Lenny from his girlfriends like Nicole Kidman and Lisa Bonet rather than his music.

Yes, he does seem to emulate Prince a lot, but that doesn't mean he's trying to copy him. If you haven't noticed, Lenny does have those feminine qualities that Prince has, which is why he dresses the way he does and talks and does his manerisms the way he does, but that doesn't mean he's copying Prince. People are way too hard on him for this. They judge every move that Lenny or some other artist does and compare it to everything Prince did. Well, hello, Prince didn't invent music, I'm sorry to disappoont you, and even Prince 'stole', as you all call it some samples and has made lyrics too similar to other songs to be coincidence, but you never see him getting flack for it. So, I think people should just listen to the music in a positive way rather than critizising it for having, oh, one little Prince bass line.

A lot of what Lenny says doesn't seem to match up with his actions, which does get me frustrated sometimes.

He says it's about the music and staying true to the music, but is constantly selling the rights of his songs to people like Target, Gap, Microsoft. And, I agree with whoever said it, Lenny has joined the pool of fake pop celebrities in recent years, but that doesn't mean he can't booey himself out.

Yes, his music has become a bit more predictable, more simple, and more pop, but in every album there aree quite a few gems. I mean, besides writing the simple pop tunes like "Where Are We Runnin'?", the man has written some of the most gorgeous songs, like "Heaven Help", "It Ain't Over 'Til It's Over", and almost every song off of Let Love Rule. If you look at him in the early years, he had great, and I mean, absolutely GREAT lyrics and the rhythm and soul of the music down, and I wish he would go back to that. But nowadays, he seems to have lost the soul and rhythm and continues to regurgitate crap because his melodies and lyrics are very simple, in a sense of structure like "Who, shoe, blue". But then again, here's a paradox: As simple as his music may have become, and as many of you like me wish he would go back to real music instead of this easy-make me rich music he's doing now, you have to admit back in '98 when "Fly Away" came out, you all enjoyed it. I know I did.

And that about raps up my twocents. But, I do agree with whoever said it, regarding Lenny not going over to the Dells table or getting a better seat, maybe Lenny wasn't a fan of the Dells. Just because someone is older than you and has paid more dues doesn't mean you have to meet them and mingle with them. Lenny does share a lot of respect for elder artists, like Prince, Jimi, James, George Clinton, Stevie, Ray, so don't think he's just someone so caught up on their ego not to respect anyone. He probably just wasn't a fan of them, or, if he was like me, never even heard of them.

And Lenny was probably sitting front row with record execs because they probably wanted to treat him to something, or because, yes, whoever said it, is the current one making the money.

That's my twocents
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Reply #26 posted 10/23/04 1:34pm

Hotlegs

DMSR88 said:

Here's my twocents of the deal.

Lenny has indeed recieved a lot of criticism in his 15 years of being in the industry. From when he was first starting out and trying to get a record deal in LA, record execs were always saying that he wasn't black enough, or he wasn't white enough, and refused to sign him because he wouldn't change.

Instead of critisizing Lenny, you have to look at the good he's done. He's been in the business for 15 years already. 15 years! Now how many artists nowadays do you even see staying that long? And, about what I just said, Lenny REFUSED to change his music just to get signed, which is what true class is all about, and what Prince has been preaching if I'm not mistaken.

However, I do see why he is getting bashed many times.

Lenny didn't say he was the ONLY black musician in rock music. Back in 2002-2003 in his DVD of all places, he said that rock & roll was a black artfrom (which is true) and he didn't see why more black people didn't embrace it as a musical style (probably because the media portrays black people as rappers and thugs and nothing more, but when a black guy picks up a gitar, it's weird). He said he was the only MAIN one out there right now (which is true, on his level of experience and commercial success). There are other black rockers out there, like Ben Harper and etc., but mainly, Lenny is the only one you see. Prince may play a guitar, but Prince promotes himself as more funk instead of rock & roll, and besides, this was back in 2002-2003 when he said this. How popular was Prince back then?

He says that he hates paparazzi and doesn't like going out, and that it shouldn't be about his clothes or who he's going out with, but he is constantly seen with his numerous Hollywood girlfriends on Sunset Blvd. I really do think that if you go up to someone on the street, they'd know Lenny from his girlfriends like Nicole Kidman and Lisa Bonet rather than his music.

Yes, he does seem to emulate Prince a lot, but that doesn't mean he's trying to copy him. If you haven't noticed, Lenny does have those feminine qualities that Prince has, which is why he dresses the way he does and talks and does his manerisms the way he does, but that doesn't mean he's copying Prince. People are way too hard on him for this. They judge every move that Lenny or some other artist does and compare it to everything Prince did. Well, hello, Prince didn't invent music, I'm sorry to disappoont you, and even Prince 'stole', as you all call it some samples and has made lyrics too similar to other songs to be coincidence, but you never see him getting flack for it. So, I think people should just listen to the music in a positive way rather than critizising it for having, oh, one little Prince bass line.

A lot of what Lenny says doesn't seem to match up with his actions, which does get me frustrated sometimes.

He says it's about the music and staying true to the music, but is constantly selling the rights of his songs to people like Target, Gap, Microsoft. And, I agree with whoever said it, Lenny has joined the pool of fake pop celebrities in recent years, but that doesn't mean he can't booey himself out.

Yes, his music has become a bit more predictable, more simple, and more pop, but in every album there aree quite a few gems. I mean, besides writing the simple pop tunes like "Where Are We Runnin'?", the man has written some of the most gorgeous songs, like "Heaven Help", "It Ain't Over 'Til It's Over", and almost every song off of Let Love Rule. If you look at him in the early years, he had great, and I mean, absolutely GREAT lyrics and the rhythm and soul of the music down, and I wish he would go back to that. But nowadays, he seems to have lost the soul and rhythm and continues to regurgitate crap because his melodies and lyrics are very simple, in a sense of structure like "Who, shoe, blue". But then again, here's a paradox: As simple as his music may have become, and as many of you like me wish he would go back to real music instead of this easy-make me rich music he's doing now, you have to admit back in '98 when "Fly Away" came out, you all enjoyed it. I know I did.

And that about raps up my twocents. But, I do agree with whoever said it, regarding Lenny not going over to the Dells table or getting a better seat, maybe Lenny wasn't a fan of the Dells. Just because someone is older than you and has paid more dues doesn't mean you have to meet them and mingle with them. Lenny does share a lot of respect for elder artists, like Prince, Jimi, James, George Clinton, Stevie, Ray, so don't think he's just someone so caught up on their ego not to respect anyone. He probably just wasn't a fan of them, or, if he was like me, never even heard of them.

And Lenny was probably sitting front row with record execs because they probably wanted to treat him to something, or because, yes, whoever said it, is the current one making the money.

That's my twocents



clapping Well Said indeed.
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Reply #27 posted 10/25/04 8:16am

Thunderbird

avatar

I love this thread!

Remember, no matter how much Lenny "sells out" or stays in the mainstream, he's still the one writing, producing and performing his songs. Even the drums, people! He stands in the mainstream with a ton of other artists who have people writing their songs, hire studio lyricsts, or at least hire people to produce their work. Where most others take a team of fifty, Lenny does it mostly himself. I'd say that's pretty impressive. biggrin
When the sunlight strikes raindrops in the air, they act as a prism and form a rainbow. The rainbow is a division of white light into many beautiful colors. Regardless of the day, I'm glad you were born.
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Reply #28 posted 10/25/04 8:50am

laurarichardso
n

DMSR88 said:

Here's my twocents of the deal.

Lenny has indeed recieved a lot of criticism in his 15 years of being in the industry. From when he was first starting out and trying to get a record deal in LA, record execs were always saying that he wasn't black enough, or he wasn't white enough, and refused to sign him because he wouldn't change.

Instead of critisizing Lenny, you have to look at the good he's done. He's been in the business for 15 years already. 15 years! Now how many artists nowadays do you even see staying that long? And, about what I just said, Lenny REFUSED to change his music just to get signed, which is what true class is all about, and what Prince has been preaching if I'm not mistaken.

However, I do see why he is getting bashed many times.

Lenny didn't say he was the ONLY black musician in rock music. Back in 2002-2003 in his DVD of all places, he said that rock & roll was a black artfrom (which is true) and he didn't see why more black people didn't embrace it as a musical style (probably because the media portrays black people as rappers and thugs and nothing more, but when a black guy picks up a gitar, it's weird). He said he was the only MAIN one out there right now (which is true, on his level of experience and commercial success). There are other black rockers out there, like Ben Harper and etc., but mainly, Lenny is the only one you see. Prince may play a guitar, but Prince promotes himself as more funk instead of rock & roll, and besides, this was back in 2002-2003 when he said this. How popular was Prince back then?

He says that he hates paparazzi and doesn't like going out, and that it shouldn't be about his clothes or who he's going out with, but he is constantly seen with his numerous Hollywood girlfriends on Sunset Blvd. I really do think that if you go up to someone on the street, they'd know Lenny from his girlfriends like Nicole Kidman and Lisa Bonet rather than his music.

Yes, he does seem to emulate Prince a lot, but that doesn't mean he's trying to copy him. If you haven't noticed, Lenny does have those feminine qualities that Prince has, which is why he dresses the way he does and talks and does his manerisms the way he does, but that doesn't mean he's copying Prince. People are way too hard on him for this. They judge every move that Lenny or some other artist does and compare it to everything Prince did. Well, hello, Prince didn't invent music, I'm sorry to disappoont you, and even Prince 'stole', as you all call it some samples and has made lyrics too similar to other songs to be coincidence, but you never see him getting flack for it. So, I think people should just listen to the music in a positive way rather than critizising it for having, oh, one little Prince bass line.

A lot of what Lenny says doesn't seem to match up with his actions, which does get me frustrated sometimes.

He says it's about the music and staying true to the music, but is constantly selling the rights of his songs to people like Target, Gap, Microsoft. And, I agree with whoever said it, Lenny has joined the pool of fake pop celebrities in recent years, but that doesn't mean he can't booey himself out.

Yes, his music has become a bit more predictable, more simple, and more pop, but in every album there aree quite a few gems. I mean, besides writing the simple pop tunes like "Where Are We Runnin'?", the man has written some of the most gorgeous songs, like "Heaven Help", "It Ain't Over 'Til It's Over", and almost every song off of Let Love Rule. If you look at him in the early years, he had great, and I mean, absolutely GREAT lyrics and the rhythm and soul of the music down, and I wish he would go back to that. But nowadays, he seems to have lost the soul and rhythm and continues to regurgitate crap because his melodies and lyrics are very simple, in a sense of structure like "Who, shoe, blue". But then again, here's a paradox: As simple as his music may have become, and as many of you like me wish he would go back to real music instead of this easy-make me rich music he's doing now, you have to admit back in '98 when "Fly Away" came out, you all enjoyed it. I know I did.

And that about raps up my twocents. But, I do agree with whoever said it, regarding Lenny not going over to the Dells table or getting a better seat, maybe Lenny wasn't a fan of the Dells. Just because someone is older than you and has paid more dues doesn't mean you have to meet them and mingle with them. Lenny does share a lot of respect for elder artists, like Prince, Jimi, James, George Clinton, Stevie, Ray, so don't think he's just someone so caught up on their ego not to respect anyone. He probably just wasn't a fan of them, or, if he was like me, never even heard of them.

And Lenny was probably sitting front row with record execs because they probably wanted to treat him to something, or because, yes, whoever said it, is the current one making the money.

That's my twocents

-----
Sorry going over and saying hello to the only other black group in the room is not stroking an ego. Called respect but maybe that is a black thing. Again no one is buying Lenny current CD he is not making any money for anyone right now.
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Reply #29 posted 10/25/04 9:06am

sataninas

DMSR88 said:

Here's my twocents of the deal.

Lenny has indeed recieved a lot of criticism in his 15 years of being in the industry. From when he was first starting out and trying to get a record deal in LA, record execs were always saying that he wasn't black enough, or he wasn't white enough, and refused to sign him because he wouldn't change.

Instead of critisizing Lenny, you have to look at the good he's done. He's been in the business for 15 years already. 15 years! Now how many artists nowadays do you even see staying that long? And, about what I just said, Lenny REFUSED to change his music just to get signed, which is what true class is all about, and what Prince has been preaching if I'm not mistaken.

However, I do see why he is getting bashed many times.

Lenny didn't say he was the ONLY black musician in rock music. Back in 2002-2003 in his DVD of all places, he said that rock & roll was a black artfrom (which is true) and he didn't see why more black people didn't embrace it as a musical style (probably because the media portrays black people as rappers and thugs and nothing more, but when a black guy picks up a gitar, it's weird). He said he was the only MAIN one out there right now (which is true, on his level of experience and commercial success). There are other black rockers out there, like Ben Harper and etc., but mainly, Lenny is the only one you see. Prince may play a guitar, but Prince promotes himself as more funk instead of rock & roll, and besides, this was back in 2002-2003 when he said this. How popular was Prince back then?

He says that he hates paparazzi and doesn't like going out, and that it shouldn't be about his clothes or who he's going out with, but he is constantly seen with his numerous Hollywood girlfriends on Sunset Blvd. I really do think that if you go up to someone on the street, they'd know Lenny from his girlfriends like Nicole Kidman and Lisa Bonet rather than his music.

Yes, he does seem to emulate Prince a lot, but that doesn't mean he's trying to copy him. If you haven't noticed, Lenny does have those feminine qualities that Prince has, which is why he dresses the way he does and talks and does his manerisms the way he does, but that doesn't mean he's copying Prince. People are way too hard on him for this. They judge every move that Lenny or some other artist does and compare it to everything Prince did. Well, hello, Prince didn't invent music, I'm sorry to disappoont you, and even Prince 'stole', as you all call it some samples and has made lyrics too similar to other songs to be coincidence, but you never see him getting flack for it. So, I think people should just listen to the music in a positive way rather than critizising it for having, oh, one little Prince bass line.

A lot of what Lenny says doesn't seem to match up with his actions, which does get me frustrated sometimes.

He says it's about the music and staying true to the music, but is constantly selling the rights of his songs to people like Target, Gap, Microsoft. And, I agree with whoever said it, Lenny has joined the pool of fake pop celebrities in recent years, but that doesn't mean he can't booey himself out.

Yes, his music has become a bit more predictable, more simple, and more pop, but in every album there aree quite a few gems. I mean, besides writing the simple pop tunes like "Where Are We Runnin'?", the man has written some of the most gorgeous songs, like "Heaven Help", "It Ain't Over 'Til It's Over", and almost every song off of Let Love Rule. If you look at him in the early years, he had great, and I mean, absolutely GREAT lyrics and the rhythm and soul of the music down, and I wish he would go back to that. But nowadays, he seems to have lost the soul and rhythm and continues to regurgitate crap because his melodies and lyrics are very simple, in a sense of structure like "Who, shoe, blue". But then again, here's a paradox: As simple as his music may have become, and as many of you like me wish he would go back to real music instead of this easy-make me rich music he's doing now, you have to admit back in '98 when "Fly Away" came out, you all enjoyed it. I know I did.

And that about raps up my twocents. But, I do agree with whoever said it, regarding Lenny not going over to the Dells table or getting a better seat, maybe Lenny wasn't a fan of the Dells. Just because someone is older than you and has paid more dues doesn't mean you have to meet them and mingle with them. Lenny does share a lot of respect for elder artists, like Prince, Jimi, James, George Clinton, Stevie, Ray, so don't think he's just someone so caught up on their ego not to respect anyone. He probably just wasn't a fan of them, or, if he was like me, never even heard of them.

And Lenny was probably sitting front row with record execs because they probably wanted to treat him to something, or because, yes, whoever said it, is the current one making the money.

That's my twocents


Awww! Isn't he sweet?! ... fro yes
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