I only want a 100% natural born man with a 100% natural born dick.

i am gay but like prince let woman be a woman and man be a man i dont believe in sex changes and all that jazz. i am a man and i dont like girly type men if i want girly id be with a real girl.i think people overdoing it these days with all this liberated stuff just going 2 the extremes

Wow some extreme approaches to the subject so far.

So be it that you come home with someone whom indeed have gone through the process fully, and told you later that they used to be another gender; would you run away?

cbarnes3121 said:

i am gay but like prince let woman be a woman and man be a man i dont believe in sex changes and all that jazz. i am a man and i dont like girly type men if i want girly id be with a real girl.i think people overdoing it these days with all this liberated stuff just going 2 the extremes

You don't believe in them? They exsist!

You know a lot of folk say the same "overdoing and liberated" shit about us.

I happen to be a dick man, so that would be my only thing. Unfortunately they've not come as far as creating really great dicks for trans f2m yet. If I was a top I totally would not care.

We were in a lesbian club with Jersey and PunkM and Ron found himself so conflicted with the total hots for this chick that looked like a pretty young twink.

vainandy said:

I only want a 100% natural born man with a 100% natural born dick.

johnart said:

I happen to be a dick man, so that would be my only thing. Unfortunately they've not come as far as creating really great dicks for trans f2m yet. If I was a top I totally would not care.

We were in a lesbian club with Jersey and PunkM and Ron found himself so conflicted with the total hots for this chick that looked like a pretty young twink.

I guess that is part of a reason why I dont care about it...plus not oral active too much.

I have yet to see what these transitions look like however.

Yes I knwo what you mean, this dude was short, kind of thick, facial hair with the chin strap and short cut military hairstyle...hot. I was conflicted.

cbarnes3121 said:

i am gay but like prince let woman be a woman and man be a man i dont believe in sex changes and all that jazz. i am a man and i dont like girly type men if i want girly id be with a real girl.i think people overdoing it these days with all this liberated stuff just going 2 the extremes

Especially when they have the operations and then regret it and want to change back. Seems to me more emphasis needs to be on addressing the mental issue rather than surgically changing the body. I saw a special on transexuals (there have been quite a few) but the one I saw either aired on PBS or Lifetime (can't remember). Anyway, this guy changed himself like 3 times. He finally settled on being a man but he had non-functioning genitals or something; basically only a hole to let the urine out. He claimed he hadn't received the right kind of psychiatric treatment and that doctors were too quick to grant him the surgery and hormones. They had a woman who transitioned to a man and she too regretted it but only because she later wanted to experience pregancy but had her reproductive organs removed. It was just terribly sad as both people seemed to be living rather reclusive lives.

paisleypark4 said:

johnart said:

I happen to be a dick man, so that would be my only thing. Unfortunately they've not come as far as creating really great dicks for trans f2m yet. If I was a top I totally would not care.

We were in a lesbian club with Jersey and PunkM and Ron found himself so conflicted with the total hots for this chick that looked like a pretty young twink.

I guess that is part of a reason why I dont care about it...plus not oral active too much.

I have yet to see what these transitions look like however.

Yes I knwo what you mean, this dude was short, kind of thick, facial hair with the chin strap and short cut military hairstyle...hot. I was conflicted.

In the end if all that's necessary to get you both off is there and stuff adds up...hot is hot, who cares about the details and labels?

[Edited 6/10/11 11:27am]

HotGritz said:

cbarnes3121 said:

i am gay but like prince let woman be a woman and man be a man i dont believe in sex changes and all that jazz. i am a man and i dont like girly type men if i want girly id be with a real girl.i think people overdoing it these days with all this liberated stuff just going 2 the extremes

Especially when they have the operations and then regret it and want to change back. Seems to me more emphasis needs to be on addressing the mental issue rather than surgically changing the body. I saw a special on transexuals (there have been quite a few) but the one I saw either aired on PBS or Lifetime (can't remember). Anyway, this guy changed himself like 3 times. He finally settled on being a man but he had non-functioning genitals or something; basically only a hole to let the urine out. He claimed he hadn't received the right kind of psychiatric treatment and that doctors were too quick to grant him the surgery and hormones. They had a woman who transitioned to a man and she too regretted it but only because she later wanted to experience pregancy but had her reproductive organs removed. It was just terribly sad as both people seemed to be living rather reclusive lives.

I can't rattle off specific percentages but from my experience with the trans community and anything I've read and seen, I don't believe this is the majority of cases. There's always gonna be regret and misjudgments and miscalls in anything. For every regretful transition, I wonder how many suicides might be out there from folk who are trapped in the wrong body but have neither the means nor the support system to transition.

It wasn't until recently that we gays got take off the medical books as a "mental issue".

I just recently watched Becoming Chaz... Anyone else see it? I thought it was very good.. I was a bit saddened tho that testosterone has changed how she acts, If you were with someone from the very beginning and had to go thru these changes it would be pretty hard I think...

Otherwise, if I saw someone I thought was hot, but found out it was a woman, I dont think I would have a problem since I was initially attracted to the whole of that person, not just whats between their legs...

tinaz said:

I just recently watched Becoming Chaz... Anyone else see it? I thought it was very good.. I was a bit saddened tho that testosterone has changed how she acts, If you were with someone from the very beginning and had to go thru these changes it would be pretty hard I think...

Otherwise, if I saw someone I thought was hot, but found out it was a woman, I dont think I would have a problem since I was initially attracted to the whole of that person, not just whats between their legs...

Damn u. This is what make yall better than us menfolk.

johnart said:

tinaz said:

I just recently watched Becoming Chaz... Anyone else see it? I thought it was very good.. I was a bit saddened tho that testosterone has changed how she acts, If you were with someone from the very beginning and had to go thru these changes it would be pretty hard I think...

Otherwise, if I saw someone I thought was hot, but found out it was a woman, I dont think I would have a problem since I was initially attracted to the whole of that person, not just whats between their legs...

Damn u. This is what make yall better than us menfolk.

You should have a talk with your penis, I think he is just being selfish and stubborn...

See, a vagina has feelings... It understands things... Plus lesbian sex is hot... soooooo

tinaz said:

johnart said:

Damn u. This is what make yall better than us menfolk.

You should have a talk with your penis, I think he is just being selfish and stubborn...

See, a vagina has feelings... It understands things... Plus lesbian sex is hot... soooooo

The penis has feelings too. Mine likes the feeling other other peni.

[Edited 6/10/11 11:50am]

johnart said:

paisleypark4 said:

I guess that is part of a reason why I dont care about it...plus not oral active too much.

I have yet to see what these transitions look like however.

Yes I knwo what you mean, this dude was short, kind of thick, facial hair with the chin strap and short cut military hairstyle...hot. I was conflicted.

In the end if all that's necessary to get you both off is there and stuff adds up...hot is hot, who cares about the details and labels?

[Edited 6/10/11 11:27am]

Right on. But if they had not gone all the way through, Im guessing u would have some issues about that right?

johnart said:

tinaz said:

You should have a talk with your penis, I think he is just being selfish and stubborn...

See, a vagina has feelings... It understands things... Plus lesbian sex is hot... soooooo

The penis has feelings too. Mine likes the feeling other other peni.

[Edited 6/10/11 11:50am]

paisleypark4 said:

johnart said:

In the end if all that's necessary to get you both off is there and stuff adds up...hot is hot, who cares about the details and labels?

[Edited 6/10/11 11:27am]

Right on. But if they had not gone all the way through, Im guessing u would have some issues about that right?

I actually wouldn't cause I think there's so many gray areas in sexuality. Seriously, my only concern (and it would be just for the long-term) would be that I quite enjoy to suck a dick.

If I went to a party and met a dude who happen to have a vagina but everything else about him turned me on, I'd totally still get it on with him to the extent that any physical mis-matches would allow.

johnart said:

paisleypark4 said:

Right on. But if they had not gone all the way through, Im guessing u would have some issues about that right?

I actually wouldn't cause I think there's so many gray areas in sexuality. Seriously, my only concern (and it would be just for the long-term) would be that I quite enjoy to suck a dick.

If I went to a party and met a dude who happen to have a vagina but everything else about him turned me on, I'd totally still get it on with him to the extent that any physical mis-matches would allow.

THAT's the point I was after...ok. I wanted to know how important that area would be to u in the heat of the moment.

So other than the one night stand, does anyone think you could have a long term relationship with some one who was trans gender if they havemnt had the complete surgery?

Do you think you would always go back to what your sexual preference was from the begining?

tinaz said:

So other than the one night stand, does anyone think you could have a long term relationship with some one who was trans gender if they havemnt had the complete surgery?

Do you think you would always go back to what your sexual preference was from the begining?

If the trans husband enjoyed watching me work a paynus then I think we could have a very long relationship.

As a top dude (if you don't care for dick), then you still have a boy and his holes.

As a str8 dude with a m2f, I would think if the attraction is strong enough and you are not repulsed by what's between her legs, you also still have a girl and at least 2 holes.

Oh yes, and love conquers all, said the unicorn.

johnart said:

HotGritz said:

Especially when they have the operations and then regret it and want to change back. Seems to me more emphasis needs to be on addressing the mental issue rather than surgically changing the body. I saw a special on transexuals (there have been quite a few) but the one I saw either aired on PBS or Lifetime (can't remember). Anyway, this guy changed himself like 3 times. He finally settled on being a man but he had non-functioning genitals or something; basically only a hole to let the urine out. He claimed he hadn't received the right kind of psychiatric treatment and that doctors were too quick to grant him the surgery and hormones. They had a woman who transitioned to a man and she too regretted it but only because she later wanted to experience pregancy but had her reproductive organs removed. It was just terribly sad as both people seemed to be living rather reclusive lives.

I can't rattle off specific percentages but from my experience with the trans community and anything I've read and seen, I don't believe this is the majority of cases. There's always gonna be regret and misjudgments and miscalls in anything. For every regretful transition, I wonder how many suicides might be out there from folk who are trapped in the wrong body but have neither the means nor the support system to transition.

It wasn't until recently that we gays got take off the medical books as a "mental issue".

I don't think the number of people who express regret over their surgery or those that switch back and forth is common either but I also don't believe that the number of people who go through with operation and treatment are ultimately happy in their choice. Seems to me from what I've seen and read that most people are content with taking hormones and dressing like the sex they prefer to be- its as if they are content living in the middle so to speak. One could argue that finances are a factor but from what I've read and heard, sexual reassignment is a lot cheaper than it used to be. In any case, if someone waivers heavily on such a serious and life-altering decision then it probably isn't the right decision to make. Even if one person makes the wrong choice then that's one person too many.

To your last sentence, did they remove homosexuality as a disorder altogether or did they recategorize it from disorder to disturbance? I'm talking about the DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders). That's the latest published version right?

If that's what you're attracted to, try it out.

We always make a big deal about preference. Love is universal and should be seen that way. Everybody needs love.

Timmy84 said:

If that's what you're attracted to, try it out.

We always make a big deal about preference. Love is universal and should be seen that way. Everybody needs love.

Thinking of the Beatles ALL YOU NEED IS LOVE...DA DA DA DA DA

HotGritz said:

Timmy84 said:

If that's what you're attracted to, try it out.

We always make a big deal about preference. Love is universal and should be seen that way. Everybody needs love.

Thinking of the Beatles ALL YOU NEED IS LOVE...DA DA DA DA DA

Well you can put it like that too.

HotGritz said:

johnart said:

I can't rattle off specific percentages but from my experience with the trans community and anything I've read and seen, I don't believe this is the majority of cases. There's always gonna be regret and misjudgments and miscalls in anything. For every regretful transition, I wonder how many suicides might be out there from folk who are trapped in the wrong body but have neither the means nor the support system to transition.

It wasn't until recently that we gays got take off the medical books as a "mental issue".

I don't think the number of people who express regret over their surgery or those that switch back and forth is common either but I also don't believe that the number of people who go through with operation and treatment are ultimately happy in their choice. Seems to me from what I've seen and read that most people are content with taking hormones and dressing like the sex they prefer to be- its as if they are content living in the middle so to speak. One could argue that finances are a factor but from what I've read and heard, sexual reassignment is a lot cheaper than it used to be. In any case, if someone waivers heavily on such a serious and life-altering decision then it probably isn't the right decision to make. Even if one person makes the wrong choice then that's one person too many.

To your last sentence, did they remove homosexuality as a disorder altogether or did they recategorize it from disorder to disturbance? I'm talking about the DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders). That's the latest published version right?

I guess by "means" I didn't mean strictly fincancial (should've been clearer) but just all the factors sorrounding the decision. But yes, it is a lot less expensive than it used to be.

I've known quite a few ladies who have lived happily as women, without reassigning what's between their legs. Some feel stronger about it than others. But I wonder if the "hatred" for what's between their legs would be less (more would be fine with themselves as women with breasts/penis) if society (always society ) didn't label them as freaks for this. I think there is the possibility that ultimately the desire is to be a "full" woman (vagina) stems from idiotic labels and destructive notions and pressures more than it being a mental disorder.

I hope that made sense. It did in my head.

I can't remember ,have to check. If we've just been re-categorized Imma be pissed all over again. Lawd.

HotGritz said:

johnart said:

I can't rattle off specific percentages but from my experience with the trans community and anything I've read and seen, I don't believe this is the majority of cases. There's always gonna be regret and misjudgments and miscalls in anything. For every regretful transition, I wonder how many suicides might be out there from folk who are trapped in the wrong body but have neither the means nor the support system to transition.

It wasn't until recently that we gays got take off the medical books as a "mental issue".

I don't think the number of people who express regret over their surgery or those that switch back and forth is common either but I also don't believe that the number of people who go through with operation and treatment are ultimately happy in their choice. Seems to me from what I've seen and read that most people are content with taking hormones and dressing like the sex they prefer to be- its as if they are content living in the middle so to speak. One could argue that finances are a factor but from what I've read and heard, sexual reassignment is a lot cheaper than it used to be. In any case, if someone waivers heavily on such a serious and life-altering decision then it probably isn't the right decision to make. Even if one person makes the wrong choice then that's one person too many.

To your last sentence, did they remove homosexuality as a disorder altogether or did they recategorize it from disorder to disturbance? I'm talking about the DSM (Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders). That's the latest published version right?

Homosexuality was taken off altogether. I don't recall that it was re-categorized at all.

@Hotgriz

PS. I do agree with your "even one person is too many" sentiment. Unfortunately I think it's like with everything else in life. There are always casualties. Sad, and I don't mean to make light of that, but true. There are so many variables at play when it comes to this (especially being that these cases are not in the majoroty). Even their doctors/pshychologists/counselors have to be considered I think. Are these people that slipped through and the doctor gave the ok when clearly there was more to be considered about the patient? I mean, some docs will approve anything.

Complicated, for sure.

http://en.wikipedia.org/w..._Disorders

Multi-axial system

The DSM-IV organizes each psychiatric diagnosis into five dimensions (axes) relating to different aspects of disorder or disability:

• Axis I: Clinical disorders, including major mental disorders, and learning disorders
• Axis II: Personality disorders and intellectual disabilities (although developmental disorders, such as Autism, were coded on Axis II in the previous edition, these disorders are now included on Axis I)
• Axis III: Acute medical conditions and physical disorders
• Axis IV: Psychosocial and environmental factors contributing to the disorder
• Axis V: Global Assessment of Functioning or Children's Global Assessment Scale for children and teens under the age of 18

Common Axis I disorders include depression, anxiety disorders, bipolar disorder, ADHD, autism spectrum disorders, anorexia nervosa, bulimia nervosa, and schizophrenia.

Common Axis II disorders include personality disorders: paranoid personality disorder, schizoid personality disorder, schizotypal personality disorder, borderline personality disorder, antisocial personality disorder, narcissistic personality disorder, histrionic personality disorder, avoidant personality disorder, dependent personality disorder, obsessive-compulsive personality disorder, and intellectual disabilities.

Common Axis III disorders include brain injuries and other medical/physical disorders which may aggravate existing diseases or present symptoms similar to other disorders.

paisleypark4 said:

Wow some extreme approaches to the subject so far.

So be it that you come home with someone whom indeed have gone through the process fully, and told you later that they used to be another gender; would you run away?

I know I wouldn't.