Well I've been thinking, do people really give the credit to Marving Gaye that he deserves? Two recent hits are direct rip-offs of his works, & I really don't think that people are giving him his do. Do any of you think that if Marvin Gaye was still alive that he'd be making music still, & on what level would it be?

Obviously a clone of:

& we have:

of course inspired by:

Robin has stated several times tat Marvin is an influence. Plus, people ain't deaf: they know Got To Give It Up when they hear it.

However, many many artists don't get the respect they're due. James Brown and George Clinton are the heaviest sampled people out there and young people are walking around thinking this stuff is original.

Marvin would have died from addiction or suicide if his father didn't shoot him. Very tragic life. I definetly feel like he gets the credit he deserves. He's still one of the most played "old school" artists on the radio and I think if we were to dig around long enough we'd find that many of these artists influenced by him have cited him

Stymie said:

Robin has stated several times tat Marvin is an influence. Plus, people ain't deaf: they know Got To Give It Up when they hear it. However, many many artists don't get the respect they're due. James Brown and George Clinton are the heaviest sampled people out there and young people are walking around thinking this stuff is original.

I'm not really referring to the artist themselves, I'm referring to the listeners. @ work, I was talking with a few co-workers who love both songs. But, when I told them both of those songs are rip-offs of Marvin Gaye classics, they thought I was crazy.... Do people [young &/or casual listeners] not realize that this stuff is rehash? I really like both of these songs myself, but I know their sources, a LOT of people don't seem to put two & two together.....

Some of these people didn't even know who Marvin Gaye was......

Tittypants said:

Don't you dare let them stay ignorant.

Stymie said:

Tittypants said:

I'm not really referring to the artist themselves, I'm referring to the listeners. @ work, I was talking with a few co-workers who love both songs. But, when I told them both of those songs are rip-offs of Marvin Gaye classics, they thought I was crazy.... Do people [young &/or casual listeners] not realize that this stuff is rehash? I really like both of these songs myself, but I know their sources, a LOT of people don't seem to put two & two together.....

Some of these people didn't even know who Marvin Gaye was......

Don't you dare let them stay ignorant.

I tried to put them on to some stuff. Even found a Damn greatest hits album [which I absolutely hate ] for them to buy, if ever they truly need to understand a little bit.

Tittypants said:

Some of these people didn't even know who Marvin Gaye was......

That's not really anything unusual. People generally don't follow their parents and especially not their grandparents music. In the 1980's, the average young person wasn't checking for Perry Como or Dean Martin or Little Richard.

MickyDolenz said:

Tittypants said:

Some of these people didn't even know who Marvin Gaye was......

That's not really anything unusual. People generally don't follow their parents and especially not their grandparents music. In the 1980's, the average young person wasn't checking for Perry Como or Dean Martin or Little Richard.

I guess it was just the household I grew up in, because I knew a lot of older artist as a kid. Imo, it's one thing not to know [I can understand that], but it's another thing to actually challenge something, just because you don't know [which is what they did to me ]. But you're absolutely right. It's sad to me in some ways, that with all of this access to stuff we have online, people are only a little adventuress [outside of searching for porn ] with using it [lots may not know where to start either]. But that's how it is.

MickyDolenz said:

my oldest is 25 and he found that music on his own. He can spot a sample in a heartbeat.

Stymie said:

MickyDolenz said:

That's not really anything unusual. People generally don't follow their parents and especially not their grandparents music. In the 1980's, the average young person wasn't checking for Perry Como or Dean Martin or Little Richard.

my oldest is 25 and he found that music on his own. He can spot a sample in a heartbeat.

I did the SAME thing in my younger age too [I'm sure you know how old I am ]! As a kid, I used to do that a lot! Still can til this day. That's awesome!

Tittypants said:

hes 25 and thinks today's music sucks. I am so proud.

Stymie said:

Tittypants said:

I did the SAME thing in my younger age too [I'm sure you know how old I am ]! As a kid, I used to do that a lot! Still can til this day. That's awesome!

hes 25 and thinks today's music sucks. I am so proud.

Hey, in many ways, I feel the same way.

Tittypants said:

MickyDolenz said:

That's not really anything unusual. People generally don't follow their parents and especially not their grandparents music. In the 1980's, the average young person wasn't checking for Perry Como or Dean Martin or Little Richard.

I guess it was just the household I grew up in, because I knew a lot of older artist as a kid. Imo, it's one thing not to know [I can understand that], but it's another thing to actually challenge something, just because you don't know [which is what they did to me ]. But you're absolutely right. It's sad to me in some ways, that with all of this access to stuff we have online, people are only a little adventuress [outside of searching for porn ] with using it [lots may not know where to start either]. But that's how it is.

Hey don't feel down. I'm not even old enough to drink legally and I grew up listening to top 40 radio. All the old music I listen to I discovered all on my own. My dad even goes to me sometimes when he wants to figure out who sang an old song

Tittypants said:

MickyDolenz said:

That's not really anything unusual. People generally don't follow their parents and especially not their grandparents music. In the 1980's, the average young person wasn't checking for Perry Como or Dean Martin or Little Richard.

I guess it was just the household I grew up in, because I knew a lot of older artist as a kid. Imo, it's one thing not to know [I can understand that], but it's another thing to actually challenge something, just because you don't know [which is what they did to me ]. But you're absolutely right. It's sad to me in some ways, that with all of this access to stuff we have online, people are only a little adventuress [outside of searching for porn ] with using it [lots may not know where to start either]. But that's how it is.

If someone hasn't heard a particular song or act, how would they know it's sampled or influenced by someone else's style? One day a DeBarge song came on the radio, and I had a younger cousin tell me that whoever this was copied Biggie Smalls.

.

Many people don't know that Aretha Franklin's Respect was a remake. Some of Whitney Houston's songs were remakes of little known or forgotten songs, so people think she put them out first. In the same way, some acts sample songs from obscure records and not hits or popular songs.

MickyDolenz said:

Tittypants said:

I guess it was just the household I grew up in, because I knew a lot of older artist as a kid. Imo, it's one thing not to know [I can understand that], but it's another thing to actually challenge something, just because you don't know [which is what they did to me ]. But you're absolutely right. It's sad to me in some ways, that with all of this access to stuff we have online, people are only a little adventuress [outside of searching for porn ] with using it [lots may not know where to start either]. But that's how it is.

If someone hasn't heard a particular song or act, how would they know it's sampled or influenced by someone else's style? One day a DeBarge song came on the radio, and I had a younger cousin tell me that whoever this was copied Biggie Smalls.

.

Many people don't know that Aretha Franklin's Respect was a remake. Some of Whitney Houston's songs were remakes of little known or forgotten songs, so people think she put them out first. In the same way, some acts sample songs from obscure records and not hits or popular songs.

Other example: JLo using the lambada melody (A brazilian common melody) in her hit "On The Floor", people thought it was her or the producers she worked with who created that sound. And many of Kanye West samples..

MickyDolenz said:

Tittypants said:

I guess it was just the household I grew up in, because I knew a lot of older artist as a kid. Imo, it's one thing not to know [I can understand that], but it's another thing to actually challenge something, just because you don't know [which is what they did to me ]. But you're absolutely right. It's sad to me in some ways, that with all of this access to stuff we have online, people are only a little adventuress [outside of searching for porn ] with using it [lots may not know where to start either]. But that's how it is.

If someone hasn't heard a particular song or act, how would they know it's sampled or influenced by someone else's style? One day a DeBarge song came on the radio, and I had a younger cousin tell me that whoever this was copied Biggie Smalls.

.

Many people don't know that Aretha Franklin's Respect was a remake. Some of Whitney Houston's songs were remakes of little known or forgotten songs, so people think she put them out first. In the same way, some acts sample songs from obscure records and not hits or popular songs.

I, personally, used to read album credits. That's how I would find out samples. Too bad people really don't buy albums anymore.

Tittypants said:

I, personally, used to read album credits. That's how I would find out samples. Too bad people really don't buy albums anymore.

Even in the record days, not everyone read the credits. They just bought the album or 45 to listen to. 8 track tapes and often cassettes and reel to reel tapes didn't have credits at all. With cassettes, if they had credits or lyrics, the print was usually too tiny to read. Many record albums didn't have credits either, other than the songwriters names on the label. Pre 1970's, it wasn't common to list the musicians or background singers on the record sleeve. At most there was some kind of writeup about the act or the songs on the album on the back cover.

MickyDolenz said:

Tittypants said:

I, personally, used to read album credits. That's how I would find out samples. Too bad people really don't buy albums anymore.

Even in the record days, not everyone read the credits. They just bought the album or 45 to listen to. 8 track tapes and often cassettes and reel to reel tapes didn't have credits at all. With cassettes, if they had credits or lyrics, the print was usually too tiny to read. Many record albums didn't have credits either, other than the songwriters names on the label. Pre 1970's, it wasn't common to list the musicians or background singers on the record sleeve. At most there was some kind of writeup about the act or the songs on the album on the back cover.

I grew up in the cassette/CD era. So, the music I was listenig to all had credits. But, hey, I guess we all didn't experience that.

Tittypants said:

I grew up in the cassette/CD era. So, the music I was listenig to all had credits. But, hey, I guess we all didn't experience that.

Credits don't always have the same thing on them. The 1st one is the original maxi single from 1979, which credits the group members and Sylvia Robinson. The 2nd is a remix that came out in 1989 that only credits Chic members Bernard Edwards & Nile Rogers. Neither credits Alan Hawkshaw, who wrote Here Comes That Sound Again, where the little part at the beginning is based on, nor Grandmaster Caz who wrote most of Big Bank Hank's lyrics on Rapper's Delight. Many people think Rapper's Delight is done by a DJ mixing or sampled, but the music is actually replayed by the Sugarhill Records house band. There is also a song by George Michael called Waiting For That Day. On the 1st printings, it's credited to George only and later printings, it's credited to George, Mick Jagger, and Keith Richards.

Tittypants said:

Some of these people didn't even know who Marvin Gaye was......

Hell, I think half the people around here don't know who Marvin Gaye is.

There is nothing wrong wih liking a derivative song but the problem I have is with the denials.

It's been going like this since the beginning of pop music. How many Led Zeppelin fans realize that Whole Lotta Love was based on Muddy Waters' You Need Love?

Here we go again about people not getting credit or proper respect

Gaye was able to make a damn good living making music, he sold a lot of records, he had a fan base. During his time, Gaye got his props... different generation. As far as folks not knowing Gaye is, that's news to me, there's You-Tube folks.

The fight with his father was a form of suicide... Gaye knew how that was going to go down when he fought with his dad. For those of that generation that was always understood if you ever crossed that line... of hitting parent. Who knows what Gaye would've been doing if he had lived; I think he would have had to deal with his substance abuse issues.

Prior to sampling most musicians took pride in developing their own sound.... newsflash that's not the case now. A lot of these artist don't have the talent but also many of them are just lazy... they aren't interested in putting in the time to develop their craft. The only problem I have is when these guys front and try to lead others to believe.... "I wrote this".

Case in point...

Led Zeppelin who did a lot of ripping off and out and out stealing. That's why Rolling Stones magazine kept a foot up their fake asses for decades and called them out often.

=======================================

[Edited 7/11/13 5:44am]

Tittypants said:

I would not call what Robin or what Justin did, "ripoffs". What they did was pay homage to Marvin and Michael,(for that matter) by using a similar sound. Now, what certain rappers have been doing with the music of, James, and Issac Hayes, I would consider to be, more of a ripoff. For they lifed the entire song and basically branded it as their own. That's a ripoff...

Stymie said:

Robin has stated several times tat Marvin is an influence. Plus, people ain't deaf: they know Got To Give It Up when they hear it. However, many many artists don't get the respect they're due. James Brown and George Clinton are the heaviest sampled people out there and young people are walking around thinking this stuff is original.

OUCH!!! say that!!

TD3 said:

Led Zeppelin who did a lot of ripping off and out and out stealing.

It's interesting that Robert Plant sampled Led Zeppelin's Black Dog on his solo song Tall Cool One in the 1980's.

MickyDolenz said:

TD3 said:

Led Zeppelin who did a lot of ripping off and out and out stealing.

It's interesting that Robert Plant sampled Led Zeppelin's Black Dog on his solo song Tall Cool One in the 1980's.

Old habits die hard or never die at all.

shorttrini said:

Tittypants said:

I'm not really referring to the artist themselves, I'm referring to the listeners. @ work, I was talking with a few co-workers who love both songs. But, when I told them both of those songs are rip-offs of Marvin Gaye classics, they thought I was crazy.... Do people [young &/or casual listeners] not realize that this stuff is rehash? I really like both of these songs myself, but I know their sources, a LOT of people don't seem to put two & two together.....

Some of these people didn't even know who Marvin Gaye was......

I would not call what Robin or what Justin did, "ripoffs". What they did was pay homage to Marvin and Michael,(for that matter) by using a similar sound. Now, what certain rappers have been doing with the music of, James, and Issac Hayes, I would consider to be, more of a ripoff. For they lifed the entire song and basically branded it as their own. That's a ripoff...

Who has done that recently? (as in the past few years) Samples have to be cleared. People have to be paid. Anyone sampling in this day and age is probably doing more of a homage to the original artist since 1. The song can be identified, therefore must be cleared as a sample and 2. the original artist (well, the publishing rights holder) gets a check and the work can usually be found on sites like whosampled so that people can trace the original song back.

This paying homage line sounds like the looting vs. finding thing during Katrina. People choose their words according to whom they are speaking about.

[Edited 7/11/13 10:23am]

BlaqueKnight said:

Okay, maybe I should have used the term,"legal ripoff". Even though they are crediting the original artist of the song,the process known as sampling has become more of an "easy go to",(nowadays) than the art form that it used to be. To me, this is not paying homage. It's lazy and more importantly lacks of originality.

BlaqueKnight said:

Tittypants said:

Some of these people didn't even know who Marvin Gaye was......

Hell, I think half the people around here don't know who Marvin Gaye is.

There is nothing wrong wih liking a derivative song but the problem I have is with the denials.

It's kinda what made me make this thread in the first place.

Another example of this:

OBVIOUSLY from :




& there is no sample clearance, or interpolation in the credits.......