A name gets you through the door but hustle helps you BUST that door wide open. It's easy to see WHY Janet succeeded when most of the other siblings failed.

Timmy84 said:

A name gets you through the door but hustle helps you BUST that door wide open. It's easy to see WHY Janet succeeded when most of the other siblings failed.

so right u r

Being a Jackson always played a role in her popularity it's just something that was and will forever be unavoidable. But to act like it's the sole reason for her success is a little extreme. Why didn't the other siblings ever mirror the same type of fame or recognition?

She was young, she was attractive, she could carry a good enough tune, she could move, she hooked up with the right people...she was therefore the most marketable after Michael. On the surface, Jermaine is probably more talented but more could be done with Janet. Rebbie was already in her mid-30s in 1986. She was too old to be a hot "happening" popstar. Latoya is just garbage. You could give her all the tools in the world and it still wouldn't work.

Janet had everything work in her favor. Being a sister to the biggest star ever undoubtedly helped but there were other factors as well.

I agree with SEANman and Timmy, she is her own person. And at least we know it, even if people don't always acknowledge it. And though I'm a big fan of both janet and michael (though michael more), sometimes when janet doesn't get props or starts getting compared to michael, I get very irritated

alphastreet said:

I agree with SEANman and Timmy, she is her own person. And at least we know it, even if people don't always acknowledge it. And though I'm a big fan of both janet and michael (though michael more), sometimes when janet doesn't get props or starts getting compared to michael, I get very irritated

Because the media wasn't no help at all. As far as they're concerned, she will always be in his shadow. Sometimes, she would have to put them in their place because everytime they interview her, they ask about Michael.

Maybe it's just me, but she herself looks irritated till this day or starts behaving funny if an interviewer mentions his name. I used to get mad and think maybe she resents him sometimes and that's common with siblings (don't you pull up that rumor VIBE started in 97' LOL), but I really don`t blame her for constantly being compared. It`s like being compared to your popular mom or something all the time when you`re a kid and nothig like her.....

alphastreet said:

Maybe it's just me, but she herself looks irritated till this day or starts behaving funny if an interviewer mentions his name. I used to get mad and think maybe she resents him sometimes and that's common with siblings (don't you pull up that rumor VIBE started in 97' LOL), but I really don`t blame her for constantly being compared. It`s like being compared to your popular mom or something all the time when you`re a kid and nothig like her.....

vibe rumor?

formallypickles said:

I live for Janet but Beyonce hands down. Single ladies was an epidemic.

Janet had Three Peaks in her career: Control era , Rhythm Nation era, and the time frame Between Janet era and Velve Rope era. All never reaching the height of single ladies

Much of Janet's success was from the coattails of her brother. Don't sit here and act like it's not true.

Now Janet's Longevity is another story, Janet wins hand down in this category.

[Edited 9/24/11 16:29pm]

That's The Way Love Goes, All For You and the Rhythm Nation singles were all bigger than Single Ladies. No, they didn't have a viral video or related knock-offs, but they were defining singles that were *everywhere*. And the Rhythm Nation video in particular had a much bigger influence and impact than SL.

And LOL @ Janet riding on the coattails of her brother's success. What she DID was create a name for herself and a real body of work that were massively successful and completely independent of MJ. Do you see Rebbie or Latoya or Jermaine or Tito having huge careers? No.

[Edited 9/24/11 19:46pm]

VIBE started a rumor about a song on Velvet Rope (You) being about Michael in an interview, but they took it back and apologized and Janet confirmed the song is not about him, but about herself though if you listen to the lyrics, I can see why people think so. Just saying...

The difference between the songs are that Rhythm Nation was influential and iconic, Single Ladies was entertaining and became a dance phenomena.

Timmy84 said:

A name gets you through the door but hustle helps you BUST that door wide open. It's easy to see WHY Janet succeeded when most of the other siblings failed.

Exactly. That "on the coattails" song is so old and tired.

alphastreet said:

Maybe it's just me, but she herself looks irritated till this day or starts behaving funny if an interviewer mentions his name. I used to get mad and think maybe she resents him sometimes and that's common with siblings (don't you pull up that rumor VIBE started in 97' LOL), but I really don`t blame her for constantly being compared. It`s like being compared to your popular mom or something all the time when you`re a kid and nothig like her.....

Yeah, I can imagine that it's downright irritating.

VoicesCarry said:

formallypickles said:

I live for Janet but Beyonce hands down. Single ladies was an epidemic.

Janet had Three Peaks in her career: Control era , Rhythm Nation era, and the time frame Between Janet era and Velve Rope era. All never reaching the height of single ladies

Much of Janet's success was from the coattails of her brother. Don't sit here and act like it's not true.

Now Janet's Longevity is another story, Janet wins hand down in this category.

[Edited 9/24/11 16:29pm]

That's The Way Love Goes, All For You and the Rhythm Nation singles were all bigger than Single Ladies. No, they didn't have a viral video or related knock-offs, but they were defining singles that were *everywhere*. And the Rhythm Nation video in particular had a much bigger influence and impact than SL.

And LOL @ Janet riding on the coattails of her brother's success. What she DID was create a name for herself and a real body of work that were massively successful and completely independent of MJ. Do you see Rebbie or Latoya or Jermaine or Tito having huge careers? No.

[Edited 9/24/11 19:46pm]

This.

alphastreet said:

VIBE started a rumor about a song on Velvet Rope (You) being about Michael in an interview, but they took it back and apologized and Janet confirmed the song is not about him, but about herself though if you listen to the lyrics, I can see why people think so. Just saying...

The difference between the songs are that Rhythm Nation was influential and iconic, Single Ladies was entertaining and became a dance phenomena.

I always looked at the song as about self therapy. Mainly because that's what it was. She pretty much confirmed it when you hear her spell the word "conscience" BACKWARDS!

E-c-n-e-i-c-s-n-o-c... just listen to that part carefully.

alphastreet said:

mrsnet said:

Wow Cinnamon, what do you base this on? I know this is a janet vs Bey thread, but I really wish you would come in and further explain. Because Dangerous was a huge success in the 90s. remember MJ's awesome MITM Grammy performance? The Huge Oprah interview's massive viewership - biggest in US history (at that time). Then the superbowl - largest SB audience in history, right?

Janet could not have pulled in such numbers.

Remember the premier of Black or White on main TV? MJ was the only artist that was honored so.

Now I remember Janet was given the biggest contract ever to a popstar (something like that) but a month or so later MJ topped it.

It was in the 90s that the Vanguard Award was named the MJ award. Also BET or Soultrain (forget which) named an award in MJ's honor.

History was also a huge seller. Did any of Janet's albums outsell MJ's in the 90's or 00's? Now I'll admit the media catered to her. But she was NEVER more popular. In fact, despite the slaughter by the media, after Thriller, no star was ever as big as MJ (not even in the US) imo. Cause Mike continued to pull in huge numbers. In 2001, the 30th anniversary viewership in the US was 27million! who else but MJ could do that? I remember janet's HBO concert special was something like 8 million. And madonna had one that was only 3 million.

Now in 00's AFY was a hit, but did it sell more than Invincible in the US? I'm asking cause I really don't know. But MJ was STILL aforded the premiere of YRMW on main TV. Janet or no one else was granted that honor.

And even during his trial and troubles during 2005 and beyond, MJ's back catalog still outsold his peers (madonna, Prince, Whitney) 3 to 1 in the US. And FAR surpassed Janet's. SO Just explain to me why do you think Janet was more popular than MJ? I really want to know how you determined that since I know you're a big fan of MJ and of Janet's. And whoever else could shed some light on this notion I'd appreciate it.

As far as Janet vs. Beyonce, Janet is/was bigger at her peak (RN) in US, but clearly Bey is HUGE outside of the US. Janet was never as big as Bey internationally - not even during RN.

[Edited 9/23/11 21:15pm]

I know it was for cinammon and I'm also a huge fan of the two, but I also agree that MJ was way bigger than Janet in the early 90's and even during HIStory from what I remember. I knew more people that appreciated him than Janet though when the Janet eras were happening, people were feeling her,during janet. mostly among all ages, and Velvet Rope for those a little older than me at the time. I think she was appreciated for singles the most when they were on the radio, but I loved her for who she was and felt she was so underrated. It was media who would call her the normal Jackson and all that, when in reality, michael was still outselling her internationally. HIStory even outsold Velvet Rope. All For You outsold Invincible though(in the US, not worldwide), although pulling 2 million considering the lack of promo and Sony refusing to ship more copies is great. Janet pulled 1.5 or so with one single and started approaching 2 million with STCML, so just imagine if he kept putting out more....I was totally looking forward to the competition!!!!

Janet. actualy sold more than Dangerous and though I know it was a very popular era(in the US, not worldwide), I didn't know any songs from it until 95' (it's possible I could have heard them and not known) though I sometimes heard her name during the era though I didn't know a thing about her yet aside from Poetic Justice and being related to MJ. I didn't know everything MJ put out during Dangerous when happening, but I stayed up for the Black or White premiere and Will You Be There was very popular late summer. The Oprah interview was talked about too from what I remember, my mom borrowed a tape with it from my aunt when it aired, and I'm just like "no way a man singing like that sounds like THAT" though I just remember it in flashes from that time, back then I had no regard for watching people talk on tv no matter who they were, I just wanted music and video games But I'm glad I eventually listened to it again a few years later

Oh and the grammy performance was from the 80's and so was the video vanguard award renaming, I think they dropped it in the 90's. The first BET awards aired in 2002, so maybe it was named then, can't recall.....I'm glad it was renamed though, better than than never.

One time I was trying to get rid of Janet tickets for a show cause I scored a better deal last minute, and a few people said to me, and this is before his death, if it was Michael they would have snapped them up. Sure it meant they were unaware of her work, but that supports what you are saying about his continued success in sales despite controversy.

[Edited 9/24/11 0:16am]

Alphastreet, Thanks for the response. Now I learned something - that the album 'Janet'' outsold Dangerous in the US. I surely would not have guessed that, wow. Because worldwide Dangerous is in the top 25 biggest albums.

Still, since Thriller until the present MJ was /is the most popular/famous artist ever. No competition.

And I think Beyonce is the only black female artist to generate some of the frenzy similar to Michael. Not on his level but closer than anyone else. Haven't there been Beyonce dolls? Correct me if Im wrong, but Im sure Ive seen them. Other than Mike, I've not seen any other 'black' celebrity dolls. And Bey's been on every magazine cover there is. Far more than Janet. Never saw Janet as huge internationally. As for Beyonce's peak, I don't know what era that was. Cause she goes on and on to the point I've wanted her to just go away for awhile. Glad for the baby so I won't have to see her for awhile.

angel345 said:

mrsnet said:

Now I remember Janet was given the biggest contract ever to a popstar (something like that) but a month or so later MJ topped it.

What contract was this as far as Janet is concerned? I had no idea. I remembered MJ's estate has like an $200 million contract with Sony, and back in the day he had another maybe $200 million plus contract with them.

In the 90s I believe. I vaguely remember this. I recall people talking about her being offered this huge record deal. I do remember it was before Mike's '93 scandal.

mrsnet said:

alphastreet said:

I know it was for cinammon and I'm also a huge fan of the two, but I also agree that MJ was way bigger than Janet in the early 90's and even during HIStory from what I remember. I knew more people that appreciated him than Janet though when the Janet eras were happening, people were feeling her,during janet. mostly among all ages, and Velvet Rope for those a little older than me at the time. I think she was appreciated for singles the most when they were on the radio, but I loved her for who she was and felt she was so underrated. It was media who would call her the normal Jackson and all that, when in reality, michael was still outselling her internationally. HIStory even outsold Velvet Rope. All For You outsold Invincible though(in the US, not worldwide), although pulling 2 million considering the lack of promo and Sony refusing to ship more copies is great. Janet pulled 1.5 or so with one single and started approaching 2 million with STCML, so just imagine if he kept putting out more....I was totally looking forward to the competition!!!!

Janet. actualy sold more than Dangerous and though I know it was a very popular era(in the US, not worldwide), I didn't know any songs from it until 95' (it's possible I could have heard them and not known) though I sometimes heard her name during the era though I didn't know a thing about her yet aside from Poetic Justice and being related to MJ. I didn't know everything MJ put out during Dangerous when happening, but I stayed up for the Black or White premiere and Will You Be There was very popular late summer. The Oprah interview was talked about too from what I remember, my mom borrowed a tape with it from my aunt when it aired, and I'm just like "no way a man singing like that sounds like THAT" though I just remember it in flashes from that time, back then I had no regard for watching people talk on tv no matter who they were, I just wanted music and video games But I'm glad I eventually listened to it again a few years later

Oh and the grammy performance was from the 80's and so was the video vanguard award renaming, I think they dropped it in the 90's. The first BET awards aired in 2002, so maybe it was named then, can't recall.....I'm glad it was renamed though, better than than never.

One time I was trying to get rid of Janet tickets for a show cause I scored a better deal last minute, and a few people said to me, and this is before his death, if it was Michael they would have snapped them up. Sure it meant they were unaware of her work, but that supports what you are saying about his continued success in sales despite controversy.

[Edited 9/24/11 0:16am]

Alphastreet, Thanks for the response. Now I learned something - that the album 'Janet'' outsold Dangerous in the US. I surely would not have guessed that, wow. Because worldwide Dangerous is in the top 25 biggest albums.

Still, since Thriller until the present MJ was /is the most popular/famous artist ever. No competition.

And I think Beyonce is the only black female artist to generate some of the frenzy similar to Michael. Not on his level but closer than anyone else. Haven't there been Beyonce dolls? Correct me if Im wrong, but Im sure Ive seen them. Other than Mike, I've not seen any other 'black' celebrity dolls. And Bey's been on every magazine cover there is. Far more than Janet. Never saw Janet as huge internationally. As for Beyonce's peak, I don't know what era that was. Cause she goes on and on to the point I've wanted her to just go away for awhile. Glad for the baby so I won't have to see her for awhile.

Janet American Idol Specialty Barbie Doll

Janet magazine covers collage (and this ain't even all of 'em...by the way, how many times has Bey covered Rolling Stone?)<--honest question... Janet has been covering magazines since the '70s.

and for good measure...

Janet comic book (does Beyonce have one?)

Nevermind the fact that the cover of the janet. album has been copied, parodied etc., ad-nauseum

Have Beyonce's album covers ever been mimicked?

Janet has fan clubs everywhere from Asia to the Netherlands. She is a global star.

[Edited 9/24/11 20:39pm]

I can't believe there was no Rhythm Nation Barbie when I tried asking years ago, that alone told me something. I think maybe Whitney Houston matched MJ's international success too before Beyonce came along. India also copied the Janet pose in 93, I remember seeing it in an Indian magazine, but wasn't aware of where it was from yet.

Anyone know of a Canadian Janet fanclub? That's what I thought :*(

Wow that Janet doll is beautiful. I know many stars with specialty dolls. But I was refering to dolls on store shelves like TARGET Stores, TOY RUS, etc. like Mike dolls during Thriller Era. Haven't I seen Beyonce dolls in stores too? I'm sure I have.

I know Janet is a global star but she's not as famous/popular as Beyonce internationally. Doesn't/never has caused the kind of madness internationally that beyonce does.

janet has been a huge star on the African American magazine covers while beyonce has crossed over moreso and been on EVERY magazine cover for the past ten years. Frankly, I'm tired of seeing her lol. I was just saying so couple days ago with yet another Beyonce cover. I really think they make too much over her. But I love her as an entertainer as I love Janet. they're both great.

Janet has graced black media AND mainstream covers. The reason she became so successful is because she aimed to appeal to black audiences with Control and had crossover success since. I do know Beyonce was the first black female or female alone to be on sports illustrated and got press for that, but Janet did Rolling Stone 3 times. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think any black females were on there yet, heck MJ couldn't get one aside from his j5 days until Thriller.

I kinda believe Janet was big the way someone like Mary J. Blige was, more than mainstream worldwide.

alphastreet said:

Janet has graced black media AND mainstream covers. The reason she became so successful is because she aimed to appeal to black audiences with Control and had crossover success since. I do know Beyonce was the first black female or female alone to be on sports illustrated and got press for that, but Janet did Rolling Stone 3 times. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think any black females were on there yet, heck MJ couldn't get one aside from his j5 days until Thriller.

I kinda believe Janet was big the way someone like Mary J. Blige was, more than mainstream worldwide.

Beyonce's been on Rolling Stone as well.

how many times? I'm not really sure, I have all 3 of janet's issues

Whitney's done it as well.

I think this is around the same time as Janet.

Oh wait I think this woman might have them all beat.

mjscarousal said:

Cinnamon234 said:

That's not even true. Beyonce is big in other countries outside of the U.S.

Janet if anything is more of a U.S. star. She's a huge star in America, but definitely not as big outside of the U.S.

Of course she's had some success in other countries, but she's mainly a U.S. act.

Beyonce is big all over. Europe, South America, Africa,etc. All you need to do is watch her performances from her last tour when she toured overseas to see how popular she really is.

She is bigger worldwide than you think.

Now Janet was at her peak internationally I believe during the "Janet" album and "Together Again" was a big international hit for her, but generally speaking, she is not a huge megastar outside of the U.S.

Thats not true

Your not listening to what I am saying.

The question is asking who was bigger during the height of their popularity. During Janets peak during HER PEAK and during the height of her popularity she was a big star internationally and even at times during the 90's gave Michael a run for his money with endorsements and chart postions...

Beyonce is an internatonal star I never denied that but you are making it seem like she is this global huge star outside of the United States in all the other countries respectively and that is not true. She might be that way in America but dont be fooled and think she is like that in every country in the world like c'mon.. there is only one artist and second artist comes close second in that category to give her that high regard just because she is the it girl now in the US is way to much.

I agree Janet is not that big now but during her peak??? she was huge and just because she wasnt able to maintain her international appeal doesnt mean her popularity during her peak should be underestimated. I wasnt old enough to tie my shoes and know Janet was the shit back then, still is as far as Im concern

[Edited 9/20/11 22:08pm]

Who?

alphastreet said:

how many times? I'm not really sure, I have all 3 of janet's issues

I think twice if you count this.

She's also been on Vogue. I think she's the third or fourth black female to ever grace the cover alongside the likes of Oprah and Michelle Obama.

ThePopLover2 said:

mjscarousal said:

Thats not true

Your not listening to what I am saying.

The question is asking who was bigger during the height of their popularity. During Janets peak during HER PEAK and during the height of her popularity she was a big star internationally and even at times during the 90's gave Michael a run for his money with endorsements and chart postions...

Beyonce is an internatonal star I never denied that but you are making it seem like she is this global huge star outside of the United States in all the other countries respectively and that is not true. She might be that way in America but dont be fooled and think she is like that in every country in the world like c'mon.. there is only one artist and second artist comes close second in that category to give her that high regard just because she is the it girl now in the US is way to much.

I agree Janet is not that big now but during her peak??? she was huge and just because she wasnt able to maintain her international appeal doesnt mean her popularity during her peak should be underestimated. I wasnt old enough to tie my shoes and know Janet was the shit back then, still is as far as Im concern

[Edited 9/20/11 22:08pm]

Who?

Rhianna?

I own about 23 of those covers in the collage, some cut up though for my wall LOL

daPrettyman said:

I would say Janet is/was a bigger star. Mostly because she was able to break out of the shadow of her family and create a career path for herself. As for her peak, I would say it was during the Rhythm Nation era (89 - 91). She was able to accomplish so much during that time while managing to have creative and timeless videos.

As for Beyonce, I would say her career peek was a few years ago with her B'Day project. "Irreplacable" was such a big hit and managed to make her appeal to an audience that she would have never reached. Especially when she did the country version on the AMAs with Sugarland. Is Beyonce bigger than Janet, I wouldn't say she is/was at her peak.

I think you are biased; you must've grown up with Janet Jackson in order to make this assertion.

While I think it is slightly inarguable that without JJ, there probably could not be a Beyonce, if you go back and consider what she did with Destiny's Child up until now and then! add that together with the advent of the internet and technology (Facebook, Myspace, Twitter, iTunes, YouTube, et), Beyonce has had a contemporary exposure that JJ never could dream of during her height, which I agree was the Rhythm Nation era.

It took months for JJ to do what Beyonce does today in a week.

I was typing hella fast and didnt realize the typo I was refering to Michael Jackson. Yall are worse than the media when it comes to Beyonce I think its funny lol

And Beyonce doesnt have a doll made of her... shit even Brandy and Brittany Spears had dolls made of them.

Puh-leeease! Why is this even a topic to be responded to?!

purplethunder3121 said:

Puh-leeease! Why is this even a topic to be responded to?!

Thats the same thing I said... Its like these people never get tired of talking about Beyonce. Most of these topics are not even worth discussing and yes I understand I dont have to respond But GOT DAMN like seriously all these Beyonce threads are ridiculous. And the questions been dumb as shit just to get a rise out of people.

What kind of fuckin comparision is this? Janet and Beyonce ... what the hell?

Next thread will be on Beyonce is greater than the Beatles

Beyonce appears at a Restaurant

Beyonce has more grammys than Prince

Beyonce baby is a chimpmunk

WHO DA FUCK CARESSS .. making all these damn worthless laughable dumb ass threads

[Edited 9/25/11 0:49am]

[Edited 9/25/11 0:51am]