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PrintableSherryJackson said: MOL said: That's exactly why I once called him an idiot. He was too nice to too many people. Arrrgggghhhhh!!! MJ was an incredibly good person but that has drawbacks as well (he let himself be leeched). Again, he had a pure heart and I love him. I love his sweet nature, his kind heart, his full-of-love-to-give persona. I just think he shouldn't have been so nice to some people (The Arvizos, for example). [Edited 5/27/10 4:11am] Being nice to people doesn't make you an idiot. When you see someone like MJ being exploited for his kindness, it's because he sadly didn't see the harm in bringing people too close to him (like the Arvisos and the Chandlers). That's someone who lacks a second eye in which to analyse people and analyse situations, which makes him/her vulnerable. I would say that Michael Jackson didn't fully understand how his kindness and generosity could be misconstrued by the public (i.e opening Neverland to the public, allowing children to sleep over and use the facilities, etc). He comes from a generation when things like this were permissable and not considered to be unnatural or eccentric. I, personally, wouldn't go as far as to call him an idiot. Just saying my opinion and I mean no disrespect. However, I understand where you're coming from with your statment. I agree. | |
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SherryJackson said: MOL said: That's exactly why I once called him an idiot. He was too nice to too many people. Arrrgggghhhhh!!! MJ was an incredibly good person but that has drawbacks as well (he let himself be leeched). Again, he had a pure heart and I love him. I love his sweet nature, his kind heart, his full-of-love-to-give persona. I just think he shouldn't have been so nice to some people (The Arvizos, for example). [Edited 5/27/10 4:11am] Being nice to people doesn't make you an idiot. When you see someone like MJ being exploited for his kindness, it's because he sadly didn't see the harm in bringing people too close to him (like the Arvisos and the Chandlers). That's someone who lacks a second eye in which to analyse people and analyse situations, which makes him/her vulnerable. I would say that Michael Jackson didn't fully understand how his kindness and generosity could be misconstrued by the public (i.e opening Neverland to the public, allowing children to sleep over and use the facilities, etc). He comes from a generation when things like this were permissable and not considered to be unnatural or eccentric. I, personally, wouldn't go as far as to call him an idiot. Just saying my opinion and I mean no disrespect. However, I understand where you're coming from with your statment. I don't think it was ever a "natural thing" for a grown man to allow kids to sleep over his home unless he himself had kids for them to play with. Michael himself was doing all the playing. That was pathological and has been for a great many years. As a matter of fact the word pedophile does not necessarily always connotate being of a "sexual" nature like we use it today, but it comes from the meaning of the adult having "an un-natural or pathological love for kids". Playing grounds are never level when adults play with kids, unless the adult is consciously playing the role of the teacher. Michael needed someone to stand up to him and tell him to cut that shit out. I remember even Smokey Robinson supporting Michael Jackson during the last sex trial and saying, I wish that he would not put himself in this predicament by playing around with little boys. I recall Janet and crazy sounding Latoya giving interviews after the first child sex scandal basically saying the same thing. Michael was going to do what he wanted with kids regardless of what anyone told him. Now I'm not saying that things went sexual at least I truly hope that they did'nt, but it was definitly pathological for an 40 year old man to be playing around with little boys. Even going so far as to mention that he wanted to be burried with children. Thanks Joe Jackson! [Edited 5/27/10 12:20pm] Although I'm your biggest fan...I'm also your biggest critic. Can you deal with that? | |
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Reel said: SherryJackson said: Being nice to people doesn't make you an idiot. When you see someone like MJ being exploited for his kindness, it's because he sadly didn't see the harm in bringing people too close to him (like the Arvisos and the Chandlers). That's someone who lacks a second eye in which to analyse people and analyse situations, which makes him/her vulnerable. I would say that Michael Jackson didn't fully understand how his kindness and generosity could be misconstrued by the public (i.e opening Neverland to the public, allowing children to sleep over and use the facilities, etc). He comes from a generation when things like this were permissable and not considered to be unnatural or eccentric. I, personally, wouldn't go as far as to call him an idiot. Just saying my opinion and I mean no disrespect. However, I understand where you're coming from with your statment. I don't think it was ever a "natural thing" for a grown man to allow kids to sleep over his home unless he himself had kids for them to play with. Michael himself was doing all the playing. That was pathological and has been for a great many years. As a matter of fact the word pedophile does not necessarily always connotate being of a "sexual" nature like we use it today, but it comes from the meaning of the adult having "an un-natural or pathological love for kids". Playing grounds are never level when adults play with kids, unless the adult is consciously playing the role of the teacher. Michael needed someone to stand up to him and tell him to cut that shit out. I remember even Smokey Robinson supporting Michael Jackson during the last sex trial and saying, I wish that he would not put himself in this predicament by playing around with little boys. I recall Janet and crazy sounding Latoya giving interviews after the first child sex scandal basically saying the same thing. Michael was going to do what he wanted with kids regardless of what anyone told him. Now I'm not saying that things went sexual at least I truly hope that they did'nt, but it was definitly pathological for an 40 year old man to be playing around with little boys. Even going so far as to mention that he wanted to be burried with children. Thanks Joe Jackson! [Edited 5/27/10 12:20pm] I wholeheartedly agree. | |
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From KOP board.
- Mark Lester:
‘We’d go out for dinner or a coffee and he would notice women walking past and say, ‘She’s so cute, she’s got a nice tush,’ but then he would be very apologetic. - A Bodyguard for Michael Jackson in Berlin 1988 (rough translation): When we were riding around in a car in Berlin, Michael would look at the women in miniskirts and high heels …”Look at her hips!” and “Look at her @ss!” Michael would say. However, when we passed the girl in question he realized she was a 50 year old woman. It is needless to say that Michael and I had a good laugh about that. It goes without saying that Michael is pro @ss? - Tatiana on shooting TWYMMF with Michael: By our fourth take, the heel of my boot was caught in the cars upholstery and Michael put his hand on my leg to help pull it out. It blew my mind that he had actually touched my leg, which I pulled away and began to tumble out of the car falling on my butt and hard too! Michael started laughing hysterically as Joe Pytka yelled, “Get up, keep it going, keep it going, and don’t stop.” As I did, Michael got out of the car and started wiping my butt off. - Tatiana on the kiss: As I stepped up to him and put my arms around his collar, he looked deep into my eyes, almost as though he was challenging me. Then he did this sexy little thing where he bit his bottom lip. I placed my arm around his waist, and I landed a kiss right on his smacker! Never for a moment did I feel this was one-sided, as he at this point, put his left hand on my rear. - Michael Lovesmith, former fellow Motown recording artist: “Don’t believe the nonsense about Michael being gay and stuff. When there were girls around he’d talk about them to the guys and run around pinching their @sses and then run away. He was a real funky street dude, know what I mean?” - Aaron Carter: However, Carter insisted that he thought Jackson liked women. “He’ll see a girl and comment on her,” Carter said, “or want to touch her [bottom]. He likes girls.” - Becky Barksdale, lead guitarist for Michael during the Dangerous World Tour: Barksdale recalled a concert, in a town she can’t remember, where she got an unexpected surprise from the Man in the Mirror. It was during Jackson’s mega-hit Beat It, as she ripped through the Eddie Van Halen riffs made famous on MTV. Concentrating on the song, Barksdale was paying attention to little else. “I came out front with him and we were dancing around and playing guitar, and he was right next to me,” she said, encouraging fans to visit her website to look for photos of the two together. “We never really had any contact with each other. We’re doing the show, night after night after night. One night, I think we were in Buenes Aires, or Chile, I can’t remember which … I had my eyes shut and I’m playing guitar, doing a guitar solo. All of a sudden I feel something on my butt. I was like, ‘Oh my God, some crazed fan had somehow gotten past security and was on stage. But he was just having fun with me. I turned around and I saw that it was him, and my jaw dropped. And the drummer, I think he skipped a beat because he was laughing so hard,” said Barksdale, who beat out hundreds of other guitarists in a closed audition to win the right to stand on stage with Jackson during the tour. Kai Chase, his personal chef during the last months: Interviwer: Did he ever flirt with you? Kai: Oh yeah, he would flirt you know, in his own charming way. I remember Prince coming into the kitchen, “daddy wants to know when dinner’s going to be ready?” I said, “It’s going to be ready at 6:30.” “Okay, well when it’s ready can you come and set it on th table.” So I’m in the dining room and I’m putting the dishes down and the food and whatnot and he walks in. I have menus on the table for the kids to see. So I’m leaving the area and I have on my chef’s uniform, the chef’s jacket and on the back there’s a little openning at the back of the apron. So I have my white jeans on and I remember as I’m walking out, I turn around just to see and all of a sudden “psshht” his head turned and it was right on my tush. I was like okaaaay. Interviewer: Fair to say that in that moment the King of Pop was reading more than one menu at the same time. Kai: (laughing) I think so. - Myspace post from someone who knew him: I’ll never forget the first thing he asked me was about my aunt. He had a thing for my Aunt J in the 80′s. She was ten years older than him and about 100 pounds heavier than him. She had always been pretty big and curvacious, most of her weight settling towards her lower body. It cracked me up that after all that time he was still checking for her. My mother had always told me that she thought Michael was some kind of undercover freak. He tried to be a shy boy in his younger days but he often got caught stealing some peeks. As she says, she thinks Michael was an “@ss man.” - Carry, a friend of Diana Ross’ in the 80s: I have caught him staring at Diana, not just her butt(which he did at times) but just her and he would have this smile on his face.  "When Michael Jackson is just singing and dancing, you just think this is an astonishing talent. And he has had this astounding talent all his life, but we want him to be floored as well. We really don´t like the idea that he could have it all." | |
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MOL said: Reel said: I don't think it was ever a "natural thing" for a grown man to allow kids to sleep over his home unless he himself had kids for them to play with. Michael himself was doing all the playing. That was pathological and has been for a great many years. As a matter of fact the word pedophile does not necessarily always connotate being of a "sexual" nature like we use it today, but it comes from the meaning of the adult having "an un-natural or pathological love for kids". Playing grounds are never level when adults play with kids, unless the adult is consciously playing the role of the teacher. Michael needed someone to stand up to him and tell him to cut that shit out. I remember even Smokey Robinson supporting Michael Jackson during the last sex trial and saying, I wish that he would not put himself in this predicament by playing around with little boys. I recall Janet and crazy sounding Latoya giving interviews after the first child sex scandal basically saying the same thing. Michael was going to do what he wanted with kids regardless of what anyone told him. Now I'm not saying that things went sexual at least I truly hope that they did'nt, but it was definitly pathological for an 40 year old man to be playing around with little boys. Even going so far as to mention that he wanted to be burried with children. Thanks Joe Jackson! [Edited 5/27/10 12:20pm] I wholeheartedly agree. Ohhh...and I never called MJ an idiot as Bboy said. I called him dumb. | |
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MOL said: MOL said: I wholeheartedly agree. Ohhh...and I never called MJ an idiot as Bboy said. I called him dumb. What´s the difference? "When Michael Jackson is just singing and dancing, you just think this is an astonishing talent. And he has had this astounding talent all his life, but we want him to be floored as well. We really don´t like the idea that he could have it all." | |
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luv4ever said: Reel said: I went to that TMZ site and saw the pictures. It is absolutely sickening. However....Michael Jackson's biological parents hardly need permission from some lawyer executor of his estate to exploit their dead son, and hock goods with false signatures of his kids. Damn shame yes.....illegal, I doubt it. Yall leave Michael Jackson's elderly parents alone! Those kids should be with their mother not a 79 and 80 year old grandparents. It's Michael Jackson fault that those kids are there, so give it a rest!!![b] [b][Edited 5/27/10 11:27am] Oh really? So he ordered Conrad Murray to give him 40 times more Propofol than he should, to make him sleep? Interesting point. | |
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dag said: MOL said: Ohhh...and I never called MJ an idiot as Bboy said. I called him dumb. What´s the difference? "Idiot" is a word heavily related with ineptitude. It's more pejorative than "dumb". | |
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MOL said: dag said: What´s the difference? "Idiot" is a word heavily related with ineptitude. It's more pejorative than "dumb". Yeah, I know. In czech, it´s very similar, but in the end, the meaning remains the same. "When Michael Jackson is just singing and dancing, you just think this is an astonishing talent. And he has had this astounding talent all his life, but we want him to be floored as well. We really don´t like the idea that he could have it all." | |
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Reel said: kibbles said: people can say that mol throws shade at joe, but here's why:
http://www.tmz.com/2010/0...te-belted/ Michael Jackson Estate -- MJ Belts Are Bogus! Originally posted May 27th 2010 1:00 AM PDT by TMZ Staff An extremely fancy belt commemorating Michael Jackson -- and allegedly "sanctioned" by Joe Jackson and Katherine Jackson -- can be yours for the bargain basement price of $1,500 -- problem is ... the whole thing may be illegal. *snip* So of course we called MJ estate lawyer Howard Weitzman, who said the belts were news to him and that the executors never authorized the sale. Weitzman says, "The Trustees of the Estate of Michael Jackson did not authorize the making or the sale of the Michael Jackson Tribute Belts." Weitzman continues, "We would never condone the use of Michael's children's signatures to promote the sale of merchandise." ***** and there's a picture at the site of joe and katherine signing the belts. i want someone, anyone, dare to defend this. these people are unconscienable (sp?) this is the same reason katherine and joe are sitting there with a multi-million dollar judgment against them now, and why her stipend from the estate has been attached. sick, sick, sick. [Edited 5/27/10 4:02am] I went to that TMZ site and saw the pictures. It is absolutely sickening. However....Michael Jackson's biological parents hardly need permission from some lawyer executor of his estate to exploit their dead son, and hock goods with false signatures of his kids. Damn shame yes.....illegal, I doubt it. it's absolutely illegal. one, once you reach the age of majority, your parents don't 'own' anything about you. when mj was alive, they couldn't just put his name on anything - lord knows they tried. secondly, mj has set up a will and trust, and has authorized his executors to 'exploit' him - promote his image, set up merchanding, etc. did you not notice what weitzman was saying? they absolutely have the control over mj's image. if this continues, what do you want to bet branca and mcclain shut it down? | |
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kibbles said: Reel said: I went to that TMZ site and saw the pictures. It is absolutely sickening. However....Michael Jackson's biological parents hardly need permission from some lawyer executor of his estate to exploit their dead son, and hock goods with false signatures of his kids. Damn shame yes.....illegal, I doubt it. it's absolutely illegal. one, once you reach the age of majority, your parents don't 'own' anything about you. when mj was alive, they couldn't just put his name on anything - lord knows they tried. secondly, mj has set up a will and trust, and has authorized his executors to 'exploit' him - promote his image, set up merchanding, etc. did you not notice what weitzman was saying? they absolutely have the control over mj's image. if this continues, what do you want to bet branca and mcclain shut it down? If I were a betting person, I'd bet that absolutely nothing will happen to Joseph and Katherine. No "Cease and Desist" order will be given any merrit in a court of law. The woman is his biological mother and has custody of his kids. Now...if there was a picture showing Paris and the rest of his kids working feverishly sweat dripping off of them as they are signing thousands and thousands of belts, perhaps child welfare could step in, and lots of stuff could happen. Folks get too tied up with the legal "mambo jambo" and yes while anyone can be "taken to court"...it's wiser to look at the actual court outcomes. Nothin is gonna happen to them. Damn shame...yes! Criminal no. Although I'm your biggest fan...I'm also your biggest critic. Can you deal with that? | |
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kibbles said: Reel said: I went to that TMZ site and saw the pictures. It is absolutely sickening. However....Michael Jackson's biological parents hardly need permission from some lawyer executor of his estate to exploit their dead son, and hock goods with false signatures of his kids. Damn shame yes.....illegal, I doubt it. it's absolutely illegal. one, once you reach the age of majority, your parents don't 'own' anything about you. when mj was alive, they couldn't just put his name on anything - lord knows they tried. secondly, mj has set up a will and trust, and has authorized his executors to 'exploit' him - promote his image, set up merchanding, etc. did you not notice what weitzman was saying? they absolutely have the control over mj's image. if this continues, what do you want to bet branca and mcclain shut it down? That expression caught my attention. Joe, Randy and Jermaine did that ALL THE TIME! | |
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Reel said: kibbles said: it's absolutely illegal. one, once you reach the age of majority, your parents don't 'own' anything about you. when mj was alive, they couldn't just put his name on anything - lord knows they tried. secondly, mj has set up a will and trust, and has authorized his executors to 'exploit' him - promote his image, set up merchanding, etc. did you not notice what weitzman was saying? they absolutely have the control over mj's image. if this continues, what do you want to bet branca and mcclain shut it down? If I were a betting person, I'd bet that absolutely nothing will happen to Joseph and Katherine. No "Cease and Desist" order will be given any merrit in a court of law. The woman is his biological mother and has custody of his kids. Now...if there was a picture showing Paris and the rest of his kids working feverishly sweat dripping off of them as they are signing thousands and thousands of belts, perhaps child welfare could step in, and lots of stuff could happen. Folks get too tied up with the legal "mambo jambo" and yes while anyone can be "taken to court"...it's wiser to look at the actual court outcomes. Nothin is gonna happen to them. Damn shame...yes! Criminal no. i didn't say it was criminal, but they or others can be held civilly liable not just by the estate but the company that the estate has given exclusive rights to to produce mj merchandise. bravado has paid for the rights to market mj's image, and you can believe they don't give a damn about these being mj's parents. *they* have paid money. you are categorically wrong about a 'cease and desist' order not being given any merit. it happens all the time. just b/c mj didn't go after his parents for their dirty dealing, doesn't mean this company won't defend their rights. it's done all the time; shit gets shut down ALL THE TIME. | |
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Reel said: Ok I know that this won't be a popular opinion, but Katherine was also a victim of all of Joe's antics also. I mean she had / has polio extreme low self esteem. As a woman with like 6-8 kids where was she going to go? How would she have gotten by without "Joe's leadership" trust me, she was thinking that in her mind. That's what all dependent women do. Joe was such a force to be reconned with even Michael as an adult had phobias about Joseph. He said he became nauseaus at the Jacksons 25th anniversary reunion show or some show like that.
Folks must rememember the mindset and the time that these women were coming up. She herself allowed herself to be victimized by Joe's affairs and reported kids out of wedlock. She had the self esteem of a rock, a sunken rock with an anchor tied to it in murkey marshy water. Her esteem was worst than Tina Turner. People like Joe Jackson know how to pick their victims and Katherine was the perfect victim to keep barefoot and pregnant while he explored his own fantasies of musical stardom. Joe Jackson is trying to use "senescence" as a defense of "not remembering ever hitting Michael". He's just plan Dirty, and I'm surprised that all of the kids dont hate his guts. Remember Jermaine in an interview saying "Michael left my mother money, and if my mother has money, my father has money". She's still a damned victim. She probably feels that since he was the motivating force behind the group he still deserves his due. Damned shame but thats the nature of dependants. Theres a part of me that want's to quote New Jack City and say "Joe Jackson, your soul is required in hell". But that wouldn't be right, and I have no heaven nor hell to put Joe Jackson in so I won't. co-sign "We may deify or demonize them but not ignore them. And we call them genius, because they are the people who change the world." | |
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MOL said: MOL said: I wholeheartedly agree. Ohhh...and I never called MJ an idiot as Bboy said. I called him dumb. No you called him an idiot or agreed with him being one when talking with sleepyg it was about this same issue [Edited 5/27/10 15:38pm] "We may deify or demonize them but not ignore them. And we call them genius, because they are the people who change the world." | |
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"We may deify or demonize them but not ignore them. And we call them genius, because they are the people who change the world." | |
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kibbles said: Reel said: If I were a betting person, I'd bet that absolutely nothing will happen to Joseph and Katherine. No "Cease and Desist" order will be given any merrit in a court of law. The woman is his biological mother and has custody of his kids. Now...if there was a picture showing Paris and the rest of his kids working feverishly sweat dripping off of them as they are signing thousands and thousands of belts, perhaps child welfare could step in, and lots of stuff could happen. Folks get too tied up with the legal "mambo jambo" and yes while anyone can be "taken to court"...it's wiser to look at the actual court outcomes. Nothin is gonna happen to them. Damn shame...yes! Criminal no. i didn't say it was criminal, but they or others can be held civilly liable not just by the estate but the company that the estate has given exclusive rights to to produce mj merchandise. bravado has paid for the rights to market mj's image, and you can believe they don't give a damn about these being mj's parents. *they* have paid money. you are categorically wrong about a 'cease and desist' order not being given any merit. it happens all the time. just b/c mj didn't go after his parents for their dirty dealing, doesn't mean this company won't defend their rights. it's done all the time; shit gets shut down ALL THE TIME. Kibbles well I guess we'll just have to wait and see...won't we? Although I'm your biggest fan...I'm also your biggest critic. Can you deal with that? | |
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Michael with Rebbie and her daughter (I think Yashi) "We may deify or demonize them but not ignore them. And we call them genius, because they are the people who change the world." | |
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MOL said: Reel said: I don't think it was ever a "natural thing" for a grown man to allow kids to sleep over his home unless he himself had kids for them to play with. Michael himself was doing all the playing. That was pathological and has been for a great many years. As a matter of fact the word pedophile does not necessarily always connotate being of a "sexual" nature like we use it today, but it comes from the meaning of the adult having "an un-natural or pathological love for kids". Playing grounds are never level when adults play with kids, unless the adult is consciously playing the role of the teacher. Michael needed someone to stand up to him and tell him to cut that shit out. I wholeheartedly agree. Really?!? First off, I don't think anyone here is qualified to define what is natural for Michael Jackson. Maybe it isn't natural for people like yourselves to be friends with kids, but Michael Jackson's life is so different that it is hard for anyone to relate to, or even to begin to have any genuine understanding of, his actual life experience. The legend holds that Michael Jackson was alienated from people his entire life, and it seems apparent that the humans he most comfortable relating to were often children and/or former child stars. Just like it would be impossible to define what is "natural" for Prince Charles, it is impossible to define/relate to what is "natural" for Michael Jackson. It is outrageous for people to pretend as if they understand what is natural for others, especially when judging the character of performance artists, based on their own understanding of what is "natural," as even the most regular/normal world is arguably unnatural due to the fact that very little about dominant organized society can be characterized as "natural". Kids often have the potential to be the most "natural" of all humans, as they are honest and unconditioned by society. Michael Jackson, the artistic genius, sought inspiration from the great minds of children, and considered them his peers. I find it strange when people assert taht Michael was wrong for playing with kids he considered his peers, as many people find it fun to be with kids. Sleepovers, if you will all recall, are quite fun and in my experience did not involve sex with peers. Michael Jackson is truly the MAN IN THE MIRROR, as his image allows people to react in a fashion that projects their own lives and their understanding of hte world upon him. The great arrogance of those who assert that Jackson was behaving inappropriately by spending time with children serves to define the immaturity of their own over-sexed minds. The obsessive insistence that it is inappropriate for older people to be friends with kids only serves to project the sick and twisted nature sex-obsessed minds of those who criticize. Sick minds like these, while lost in their own self service, question why anyone would be friends without trying to get something for themselves, failing to understand the real love that goes far beyond sex. I am embarrassed for Smokey Robinson, as he spoke without realizing how silly he was. In the legendary world of Jesus, people could've complained of how unnatural/unconventional Jesus' appreciation for children was. However, according to the story, Jesus is of God, and therefore superior to man. Perhaps Jackson was doing nothing more than acting out an episode from the Jesus story, not out of narcissism but out of admiration. Closer attention ought to be paid to the notion that Jackson publicly lived life on stage. You really never know. I can't tell if people here actually believe gossip/entertainment news is real or if they're trying to pretend the characters are real as if they're watching a fictional soap opera. People often forget the Jacksons, and most other famous people (including politicians) are PERFORMANCE ARTISTS. The Jacksons can be seen as actors in an avant garde synergetic fashion throughout their public careers. The masses ought to more often consider that there is a poetic aspect to everything publicly offered by the Jacksons, just as there is with PRINCE. Those who write as if they understand the Jackson family really know little about what they do. Rather, we only know what can be interpreted from teh story they present. The mythologized understanding of the Jackson family is largely based on the story told in the television biopic AMERICAN DREAM, a work created to enhance the legend around the famous family's story (just as Purple Rain did for PRINCE). While there may be some true aspects to the tale, there is really nothing to go on but the word of performance artists (who, for all we know, may be performing all along in an ongoing act of storytelling). I don't know if anyone has bothered to follow up on the acts that Joe Jackson was allegedly shamelessly promoting from his label at the BET awards last year in the wake of Michael's passing, but I can tell you that I personally had never heard of them and haven't since. For all we know, his acts were made up (never intended to sell records) and Joe is playing his lifelong role of the bad guy in the story, and by playing this role he keeps people interested and keeps the story going. The same with Jermaine, as he continues to be obnoxious despite the fact that such is obvious to all. I am curious, does anyone know when the story about Joe's abuse was first made public? I am too young to know when this started. Who was the first to say Joe was abusive, and when did they first say it? We really have no idea what is real for THE JACKSONS, and the never-ending story they perform suspicioiusly never ceases to be entertaining. They are super-genius artists, and we should not discount the possibility that they know exactly what they're doing, and have known all along. MOL said: alphastreet said: this family makes me sick, I've decided to stop listening to their crap and go about respecting michael, janet, the kids and katherine(despite MOL's opinions on her)
How is it possible to respect a woman who lets her 5 years old son be exploited to the core, be abused verbally, emotionally and physically by her husband? This is a woman who let her husband go after/hunt/hound mercilessly her most famous son until the day of his death. A woman who lets her jobless, sex addict, lazy, penniless, deadbeat, exploitative and abusive kids and husband live off of her most famous son. This is a woman who manipulated/pressured Michael for Joe's and the siblings' benefit. A woman who let her sex addict husband fuck every hot woman he saw and, yet, refused to let her child Michael have any exposure to the "full of sin" world. A woman who took part in Joe's games. Katherine loved Michael. But she loved Joe more. Again, I don't know if you're actually serious, but you really have no idea. Information presented in media stories and movies does not provide sufficient understanding for passing judgment on anyone. I hope this family doesn't actually make you sick. For all we know, any of the following possibilities could be true -Joe is pretending to be bad to keep the story alive, and his label acts are fake; Joh'Vonnie is fake -Katherine was abused/dominated by Joe just as the kids were, and did her best to do what she thought was right (religion); she had no control over Joe's behavior, and was subject to his manipulation. -Janet's mother is actually Rebbie (who married quite young), and was merely marketed as a sibling to the Jackson 5. To my knowledge, there are no public photos of Katherine pregnant with Janet, nor any form of public proof that she is actually Janet's mother and not her grandmother. -Who we see as Michael's formerly "masked" kids are actors who represent his actual kids, just like the kids in MOONWALKER; I don't think it is asking to much for one to realize that Michael was always performing - especially in paparazzi photography. For someone who sought to be the greatest actor of all time, it ought to be considered that Michael had acted out a career-long story much too big/complex to be covered within a feature length film or tv series. Prince, too, has acted out a life-long legend, with many chapters as an extended version of a Hollywood musical about a naturally gifted artistic genius and his struggle against money-seeking profiteers. -Latoya is a comedienne who hillariously plays the role of the crazy perfectly unsuccessful sister, like Janice on THE SOPRANOS. Bottom line: It's all a legend, and it should be viewed as artwork. I don't think it was inappropriate or unnatural for Michael Jackson to have befriended kids. Perhaps he was even trying to reveal something about society by making this publicly knowingly with anticipation of the public response in an unconventional artistic expression, much like the presence of overt misogyny in much of Hitchcock's work - planted with anticipation of viewer reaction to mirror the sincere nature of viewers based on their reaction to such. When Hitchcock said "we don't torture our women enough," he was jokingly commenting on the status we give to women in a society that often regarded them as objects. Michael and the Jacksons are artists, not idiots as so many assume them to be at face value. | |
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vanity2 said: MOL said: How is it possible to respect a woman who lets her 5 years old son be exploited to the core, be abused verbally, emotionally and physically by her husband? This is a woman who let her husband go after/hunt/hound mercilessly her most famous son until the day of his death. A woman who lets her jobless, sex addict, lazy, penniless, deadbeat, exploitative and abusive kids and husband live off of her most famous son. This is a woman who manipulated/pressured Michael for Joe's and the siblings' benefit. A woman who let her sex addict husband fuck every hot woman he saw and, yet, refused to let her child Michael have any exposure to the "full of sin" world. A woman who took part in Joe's games. Katherine loved Michael. But she loved Joe more. Again, I don't know if you're actually serious, but you really have no idea. Information presented in media stories and movies does not provide sufficient understanding for passing judgment on anyone. I hope this family doesn't actually make you sick. For all we know, any of the following possibilities could be true -Joe is pretending to be bad to keep the story alive, and his label acts are fake; Joh'Vonnie is fake -Katherine was abused/dominated by Joe just as the kids were, and did her best to do what she thought was right (religion); she had no control over Joe's behavior, and was subject to his manipulation. -Janet's mother is actually Rebbie (who married quite young), and was merely marketed as a sibling to the Jackson 5. To my knowledge, there are no public photos of Katherine pregnant with Janet, nor any form of public proof that she is actually Janet's mother and not her grandmother. -Who we see as Michael's formerly "masked" kids are actors who represent his actual kids, just like the kids in MOONWALKER; I don't think it is asking to much for one to realize that Michael was always performing - especially in paparazzi photography. For someone who sought to be the greatest actor of all time, it ought to be considered that Michael had acted out a career-long story much too big/complex to be covered within a feature length film or tv series. Prince, too, has acted out a life-long legend, with many chapters as an extended version of a Hollywood musical about a naturally gifted artistic genius and his struggle against money-seeking profiteers. -Latoya is a comedienne who hillariously plays the role of the crazy perfectly unsuccessful sister, like Janice on THE SOPRANOS. Bottom line: It's all a legend, and it should be viewed as artwork. I don't think it was inappropriate or unnatural for Michael Jackson to have befriended kids. Perhaps he was even trying to reveal something about society by making this publicly knowingly with anticipation of the public response in an unconventional artistic expression, much like the presence of overt misogyny in much of Hitchcock's work - planted with anticipation of viewer reaction to mirror the sincere nature of viewers based on their reaction to such. When Hitchcock said "we don't torture our women enough," he was jokingly commenting on the status we give to women in a society that often regarded them as objects. Michael and the Jacksons are artists, not idiots as so many assume them to be at face value. Wowowowow @ that "War and Peace" book that you wrote. I don't have time nor energy to read all that shit. Seriously, and I mean no offense. This sounds like your rational mind has not "kicked in" from the lines that I did skim. You stated in a sentence that "Michael considered the kids his peers".The fact is that the kids WERE NOT HIS PEERS. They were KIDS, they did not have the same life experience and the years that Micheal had on this earth. The field was not leveled. Sounds like there are some unresolved issues somewhere within yourself, and I don't mean any offense because I didn't read the whole Epic that you wrote. Damn @ the length of that shit you wrote. My eyes are fatigued. Although I'm your biggest fan...I'm also your biggest critic. Can you deal with that? | |
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bboy87 said: EmeraldSkies said: Thanks for posting this.  I can't wait to get my copy,and watch it on a bigger screen. He was truely an amazing man,and seeing the crowds he drew togehter still leaves me in awe.I hope we get an American release soon  I hope so to! I will then have 3 different copies of Moonwalker. Music washes away from the soul the dust of everyday life. ~Berthold Auerbach | |
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Reel said: I don't think it was ever a "natural thing" for a grown man to allow kids to sleep over his home unless he himself had kids for them to play with. Michael himself was doing all the playing. That was pathological and has been for a great many years. As a matter of fact the word pedophile does not necessarily always connotate being of a "sexual" nature like we use it today, but it comes from the meaning of the adult having "an un-natural or pathological love for kids". Playing grounds are never level when adults play with kids, unless the adult is consciously playing the role of the teacher. Michael needed someone to stand up to him and tell him to cut that shit out. I remember even Smokey Robinson supporting Michael Jackson during the last sex trial and saying, I wish that he would not put himself in this predicament by playing around with little boys. I recall Janet and crazy sounding Latoya giving interviews after the first child sex scandal basically saying the same thing. Michael was going to do what he wanted with kids regardless of what anyone told him. Now I'm not saying that things went sexual at least I truly hope that they did'nt, but it was definitly pathological for an 40 year old man to be playing around with little boys. Even going so far as to mention that he wanted to be burried with children. Thanks Joe Jackson! [Edited 5/27/10 12:20pm] Out of curiosity, how many of you actually read the court transcripts of the trial? Because I recall Gavin saying he was angry at Michael because he cut him off in 2000 after he was fully treated from cancer. It's not like Micael was trying to keep him around for fun or play time. He was only called back to appear in the Bashir documentary and then again for the rebuttal video. I don't think he was "playing around" with him. I don't follow media stories, but hold judgement until I see evidence. I do recall him playing around with a group of kids during water balloon fights, but it's not him alone with any child. Also, many parents were questioned and they've all said that they gave their kids permission and Michael was nothing more than a big brother or a father figure to them all. Heck, even Gavin said he was upset when Michael stopped talking to him in 2000 because it felt like he was losing a father. I don't think Michael is the only strange one. I think some people's obsession with celebrities and the expectation to continue having them in our lives (especially if they're covering our expenses) is just as pathological. Also, I just want to end off with one more thing... the whole children this and children that is also a huge part of Michael's Peter Pan image. All these assumptions we make are based on data that Michael's presents. In actuality, there are many private reports about Michael just being a regular guy, flirting with girls, reading books, etc. But no, we only see the "pathological" man. [Edited 5/27/10 19:30pm] "If you enter this world knowing you are loved and you leave this world knowing the same, then everything that happens in between can be dealt with" - Michael Jackson | |
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This fan got his foot ran over by a car so he could meet Michael. I won't lie, I'd get hit by a car to meet Michael too.
"If you enter this world knowing you are loved and you leave this world knowing the same, then everything that happens in between can be dealt with" - Michael Jackson | |
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MyLuv229 said: This fan got his foot ran over by a car so he could meet Michael. I won't lie, I'd get hit by a car to meet Michael too.
Guess they don't use crutches in Europe. Maybe he put his foot out there on purpose  Although I'm your biggest fan...I'm also your biggest critic. Can you deal with that? | |
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There needs to be a new Michael Jackson thread posted because this one is so bogged down with pictures and footage that it is actually running pretty slow. Although I'm your biggest fan...I'm also your biggest critic. Can you deal with that? | |
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I just wanted to say...that..it has been almost a year since Michael has passed and I still..still can't exactly wrap my mind around it. It still boggles my mind..& still hurts. | |
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Another mix of Jam leaked today  "We may deify or demonize them but not ignore them. And we call them genius, because they are the people who change the world." | |
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"We may deify or demonize them but not ignore them. And we call them genius, because they are the people who change the world." | |
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that she's out of my life clip is awesome, and sexy!
That was an interesting write up of everything being an act, we never know for sure, but Rebbie being Janet's mom??? That had me in stitches! hahaha stupidest thing I've heard | |
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bboy87 said: Randy seems very sincere. It has got to be hard on them. I'm sure they must think..."If I had only done a little more, if I had only persisted, if I had him committed". I mean all of these thoughts must run through your mind when someone loses a loved one from something soooo preventable. I really believe that Michael's family did all that they possibly could (based on media reports and from Janet herself), I understand that several "interventions" were attempted. But I really wonder if they ever attempted to get him hospitalized under California's 5150. Especially if they knew about the damned anesthesia sleeps. Sad, and I'm definitely not blaming anyone in the family. Although I'm your biggest fan...I'm also your biggest critic. Can you deal with that? | |
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