dearmother said:

Where?

dearmother said:

WHERE?????

makeupshark.blogspot.com

thats what we've been talking about nonstop in the mj 11 thread

i mean audio tapes/phone calls oops sorry, no porn!
[Edited 8/21/09 12:29pm]

dearmother said:

Superstition said:

I am not saying that this is the case... however, the settlement could have had strings attached to it. Like non disclosure... and if the recipients would even acknowledge tht there was even a non disclosure clause the settlement could become null and void and money returned.

How would anyone KNOW that this clause does not exist if it is in the interest of the 2 parties (MJ and boy's family) to keep the agreement secret.

So, yes the boy could have cooperated with police legally but would have blown his settlement if he did, so therefore he doesn't.

I can't understand why this possibility is never considered.


I believe that is why the LA district attorney's office made a new law that prevented this from ever happening again... that people could not use settlements with non disclosure cluase to prevent a legal crimnal investigation... that the victim would be COMPELLED to cooperate in the case of child abuse etc.

I thought they nicknamed this law the Michael Jackson rule/law. I remember thinking when MJ was finally charged... that the LA DA finally got MJ after all that effort...even changing legal rules of engagement,.

unique said:

gosh I hope not

Michael Jackson - Don't Touch Little Boy's, Song

prodigalfan said:

So now we are to believe he was a chubby chaser ????? A bear hunter?????

prodigalfan said:

Even if MJ were gay I doubt he would go for someone that overweight. And by reading the story the guy doesn't really say if anything really sexual ever happened.

The problem with stories about MJ is that there is hardly ever any consistency about them. You get the so-called author Ian Halperine saying he liked young, handsome fit men in their late teens or early 20s. And then you have chubby cheeks saying something completely different. You have Mark Lester saying he was asexual and couldn't bear to be in a relationship with anyone and then you have Lisa Marie Presley saying that they did indeed have a sexual relationship, that's why I take a lot of stories about MJ sexuality with a pinch of salt.

OldTeenager said:

What the house-keeper is saying isn't new. She testified for the prosecution at the 2005 trial. Probably if she quit her job or went to the police with her story in the first place, instead of getting sack for stealing probably her evidence would have held up better in court and MJ may have been convicted.

whatsgoingon said:

I know... that is the thing about trust... not saying that what the housekeeper said was not true... but because she blew her trust stealing... you just can't be sure.
I tell my daughter that trust is a very valuable thing... and when you lose it, it is hard to regain.

I guarantee you if Jackson had been accused of shoplifting a loaf of bread from a grocery store, there'd be a line of ex-employees wrapped around the block to tell their story about how he was a klepto who fed his urge by shoplifting from stores.

I think that because fans are such big fans,if there favorite music artist or athlete gets in trouble they will look for any and every excuse in the book.

1. Jordy Chandler - His father was greedy so that means the son was automatically lying. There are many parents in this world who would have taken the 20 million and many 13 year olds who probably wouldn't want to get in front of a jury and talk about the stuff a grown man did to them.

2. Maids Son from 1993 - The excuse is because she accepted money from Hard Copy for her story then that means her son was automatically lying. He's now a pastor and testified at the 2005 trial. Keep in mind she barely spoke english in 1993 and wasn't making much money. Many low income latinos would have accepted 20,000 from Hard Copy. Doesn't mean there sons were lying about being molested. Question? Why Testify in 2005 and why would he lie? For What!

3. Security Guard from 1993 - He accepted money from Hard Copy so that means he was automaically lying. Please stop with the if it was true u would go right to the cops and not accept money. YEA RIGHT....20,000. Doesn't mean he made it up cause many ppl would have accepted that.

4. Housekeeper in this footage - Another excuse


If MJ was caught on tape die hard fans would say it was a guy dressed as MJ

It wasn't fans who found him not guilty. Wasn't the jury upscale whites from Santa Barbara?

BabyBeMine said:

How are any of those "looking" for a reason? "Looking" for a reason would be saying he's a nice guy so he couldn't have done it. He loves kids and wouldn't hurt them. Those are stretching.

Tons of ex-employees and people accepting handouts, or people who are proven liars and manipulators of the system is cold evidence.

Lumping everyone who thinks he's innocent into the "rabid fans" category is not right. I'm sure there are people who would believe anything, but look at how many non-fans just go by what they see on the news and surmise that he was guilty.

They were not proven liars.

1. Jordy Chandler - It was not proven he lied. The GQ article isnt the bible to the truth of what happened. And just because his dad was greedy doesnt mean his son was lying. There are mothers and fathers who go to clubs all night and be gone for the whole weekend and leave 10 year olds at home.. Just because they accepted 20 million does not mean Jordy lied and there is no proof. MJ paid the 20 million not to necessarily prevent the case from going to trial but to prevent the boy and family of releasing the details. Years later they came out anyway but MJ thought it was never get to the public. He knew would he was being accused of and the details in those accusations and wanted that to be locked and sealed.

2. Maids Son - When was it proven he lied? Just cause his mother accepted 20,000. Barely speaks english and probably making minimum wage

3 Security Guard who said he witnessed MJ and Jordy


Accepted 20,000 for your story does not mean your lying. Be Realistic here your a maid who is making like minimum wage and you get offered 20,000. Of course your going to take it.

Your a maid making minimum wage, barely speak english struggling to make ends meet. Accepting 20,000 from Hard Copy to tell yor story doesnt make you a liar.

Her son (Now a Pastor) testified at the 2005 trial. Where is the proof that he lied? Where

BabyBeMine said:

I was speaking of the 2005 accusers when I said proven liars.

The rest... has anyone ever had a solid case who hasn't accepted cash? Anyone who wasn't fired? Anyone who was employed and left?

Bottom line, no.. I don't know for a fact, but based on everything I've seen, I've made up my mind he was innocent. Stop lumping everyone who thinks he's innocent into the deluded fan category. I sat on the fence for a long time about whether he was guilty or innocent, but have come to believe he was innocent in recent years. Nothing makes sense to me, nothing adds up., People call him stupid, regressed... yet at the same time we're supposed to believe he was this mastermind criminal who groomed his victims. Every one of these stories has played out the same to me... ex-employees, a kid with greedy parents...

Either these people are liars or they are sick individuals themselves for not coming forward until money was dangled.

Question? Do you honestly think behind closed doors MJ is this sweet, innocent person all the time. How do we know what the maid said was not true when she said MJ told me if i tell anyone he would have someone take care of me.

Sometimes he nicest ppl are the most evil

BabyBeMine said:

I don't know what MJ is like behind closed doors.

Maybe a tabloid or a gossip show can write one of his disgruntled employees a check to tell us.

BabyBeMine said:

Well the Housekeeper who said she saw him molest many children wasn't a foreigner who couldn't speak English. This is a woman who said she actually SAW him molest many children. I am sure she could have easily conveyed her story to the police and social services without needing a translator. But what does she do instead? she says nothing and worse of all she continues to work for someone who she claimed was a pedo until he sacked her for stealing and then sells her story to the media. And this was basically the problem with All his employees evidence and why none of their testimony stood up in court. I am sure if at least one of those employees quit working for him because of his "actions" instead of being sacked and went to the police with their story before selling it to the tabloids, probably a conviction could have been secured.

What we have to understand is that during the 2005 trial there was NO physical evidence, all the prosecution had was circumstantial evidence which was largely based on the fact that MJ admitted that he allowed children to sleep in his bed, ableit "not in a sexual way", therefore the prosecution really needed credible witnesses to corrobate the children story, to get a conviction and yet all they could come up with were a list of disgruntle employees who had been sacked and went to the media to sell their stories, and people are surprised that he was found NOT GUILTY!!
[Edited 8/22/09 20:56pm]

Frankly, I was NEVER EVER EVER an MJ fan. He was some old guy as far as I was concerned. Yeah, I liked a few of his songs, but those could be counted on one hand--with a few fingers left over.

I barely followed him after Thriller, and couldn't name an album he released after Bad. He seriousl fell off of my radar, and started to look weird.

However, I DON'T think he molested a soul.

So the excuse that those who disagree are rabid fans is insane.

I don't care how much of a fan you are, I don't know of anyone who would excuse a pedophile. Even your hardened criminals who've killed their own family members have a special kind of hatred for them.

Accept that some people-like myself--read the transcripts and evidence with AN OPEN MIND because we aren't fans--and came to the conclusion that he was innocent.

In fact, I retured to the thread to continue reading the Vanit Fair articles that were written from the vantage point of someone convinced of his guilt. I'd read a few then had to run errands.

I read looking for something to convince me of his guilt but found nothing but some one-sided garbage that stretched and reached. I do believe the quotes about his family being ignorant, uneducated, unable to accept their time has past, Michael being eccentric and lacking social skills...BUT the legal case against him left MUCH to be desired.

In fact, which page was the Vanity Fair link on? I searched but can't remember the page number.

I just can't believe this shit keeps on coming up and up all the time. He was found innocent not once but twice of these charges and he was emotionally immature, yes he was a very strange cookie, but he was not a kiddie fiddler. As far as I am concerned, Hard Copy, Vanity Fair, The Globe, The Enquirer, The Sun etc and all that tabloid garbage have blood on their hands, and its all shit.
Michael Jackson did not

1. Molest little boys
2. Become a homosexual
3. Shut Jordy up with money
4. Have a shrine to Elizabeth Taylor
5. Bleach his skin (He had viltigo and its been proved)
6. Do cruel things to kids
7. Force them to drink Jesus juice
8. Eat his own faeces
9. Spend $500,000 on perfume for the studio when he made Invincible.
10. Moonwalk through neverland 8 days after he died.

He may have
1. Become addicted to pills
2. Gone off the rails with messy bedrooms and slumber parties
3. Been father to Blanket (Its highly likely).

The man is dead just leave him in peace.

dearmother said:

Ahaha, this is great.

MJ didn't want to be Diana. He wanted to be IN Diana, maybe.

As far as the settlement compelling Jordy not to speak....

NOT!!!!

Law enforcement knows that they could have subpoenaed him, and that would not have gone against the terms of the settlement.

They knew they didn't have a case, which is why they did not move forward with a subpoena.

Jordy could've still testified in a criminal case.

whatsgoingon said:

Aahahahahahaah! Adrian McManus testified during the 2005 trial! Eeheheh! When Mesereau asked her why hadn't she gone to the police instead of reporting this "story" to the tabloids, she answered that "no one would believe" her. Mesereau then asked why did she sell the "story" to the tabloids if no one would believe her. She didn't reply. When the lawyer asked her if she had ever seen Jackson acting in a strange way towards her son or other kids, she answered: "I saw Mr. Jackson tickeling Jason. I wanted money and I took it.". Mesereau then said: "Just that?". Adrian replied "yes".


Adrian McManus is less credible than Janet Arvizo! Ohhh BTW, did you know that Janet Arvizo wanted to escape Neverland in a hot air baloon? Didn't she realise that she could just open Neverland's gates and get out? Hummmmm!!!!
[Edited 8/23/09 8:06am]

Karen71 said:

Tom Mesereau said, on Jay Leno, that Vanity Fair's articles were extremely biased. He also talked about Court TV being biased and twisting everything (smells like Didi)!!!

Im not saying MJ is 100% guilty but you sure cant say he's 100% innocent either. It could be either or.

Any grown man who has been accused of molestation 3 times, Jordy Chander, Maids son, Gavin and sleeps in bed with 13 year old boys not his own could potentially be a child molestor.

Honestly when you look at it most boys 13 who are basically teenagers don't sleep in the same bed as there own parents. Especially boys. When you watch that MJ and Gavin interview where Gavin says Gavin if you sleep with me then you love me. To me that tells me Gavin was hesitant but MJ insisted.

Notice how MJ had that nervous look on his face and quickly said i slept on the floor. Lyin his ass off. Why Lie?

Karen71 said:

Why believe the family is ignorant, uneducated and unable to accept their time has past? The Jacksons are not the only group who wants to get back together and the lead singer does not.

Why not believe what Rebbie said in 1992? That she had not even seen her brother Michael in 3 years. I think he treated them all like that and maybe what Jermaine said in his uncussessful song WORD TO BAD was accurate. I think he felt like that because majority of the family was probably wondering why Michael never comes around. Rebbie had not seen him in 3 years

Thats why i think the nice, shy image he displays is BS. He treats his family like crap. They supported him during the trial when they didn't have to and when they show up at his crib he has security prevent them from coming in.

MJ's family in 2005 could have been like you know you rarely even come around so handle it yourself buddy. There is a reason why Rebbie never came to the trial.
[Edited 8/23/09 18:38pm]