prettymansson said:

i really don't like music elitists.

And Im sure most them couldn't give a damn !

sammij said:

Bishop31 said:

* clicks this guy's myspace music page .... observes all of the irony ... keeps snarky comments to self *

I do like his style but he ain't no Prince.

Don't think there ever will be!

prettymansson said:

Thanx! I always try to keep it Fly while I do my thing on stage!

prettymansson said:

What trips my shit is that in a prior thread about "why music sucks today" you're ranting on about people who don't know shit about playing instruments, writing songs, etc. And you list all a bunch of (black) bands who were on top of their shit back in the day. I don't see how you could shit on Van so hard in today's musical climate. If a person doesn't like an artist's music, I don't think that makes that person a "hater". But I can't stand the self-righteous comments about lack of musicianship and performing, especially among current black artists, and people like Van get called "mediocre" when he brings it without pre-recorded DAT tracks for his stage show. I'd think you'd be a little more supportive of folks like Van despite your dislike of his style.

BTW, Van is actually 38 or 39.

bsk3601 said:

I'm with U on Artist development. And if by clicking on my Myspace page U felt a sense of Irony...then that's another thing. I'm not by any means saying the man isn't talented. He's better than most of the garbage thats on the Radio/TV. But my beef is the many people who compare him to Prince(who in my opinion is a Total different type of Artist). I agree that U say Prince wasn't kicking ass his first few CD's. But, would U by any means say Van Hunt has the Raw Talent Prince had when he was only say...22 years old?

This is all of course opinion..which is cool. Nobody is right or wrong here. I was just saying I don't get the comparisons.

Bishop31 said:

I get what you're saying. But if you cut through all of the B.S. of media hype then you know that any black man who plays an instrument, especially a guitar is going to get compared to Prince like it or not. With Van, of course the influence is there. But don't let the guitar fool you, Van is much closer to Sly than Prince... even though the purple influence shines through. I believe those who are keeping their ears open will hear everyone from Prince to Sly to Curtis Mayfield to Cameo. I've kept my eyes on Van since Dionne Farris' "Hopeless"... So yes I would say that he definitely has the "Raw Talent" Prince had at 22 years old. Just because it's 11 years later and Van is knocking on 40 years old, does that mean the music isn't any good? Does is make him any less deserving of accolades? Good music is good music and I think the folks who are shitting on Van in this thread are doing so for the wrong reason: just because his name and Prince's name get mentioned in the same sentence.

The sea of crap dumped in our laps doesn't make Van genius, decent, or worth our support.

This has NOTHING to do with people being Prince stans. Prince is in a league seperate from nearly every artist. Only Stevie and the like can be put in the same sentence. It's a shame that there are assorted execs and tools that throw his name around in their little marketing babble, but people aren't studying that.

If pop was normal, people like Van would sink to the bottom.

No one would be giving him a second thought, but some people are desperate to hold onto something modern, quality, and mainstream so they'll take anything. Labels know this, so they find trash like Van Hunt and try to paint him as some kind of second coming.

If people want to roll with this twisted logic then I guess every single existing band deserves support simply because they pick up instruments.

I want to see great bands return, but co-signing SHIT like Van Hunt isn't the way to do that.

Like someone said, there was a time when companies looked for raw talent and groomed it, or allowed it to mature.

Van Hunt isn't an example of that sort of talent.

There are plenty of Vans running around in and outside the industry, and there are 10yr old boys that can knock his shit over.

From what I've heard of Popular, Van has started his career with 3 great albums. That puts him in pretty rarefied air.

Dance said:

I'm the one who made the comment about artist development. I also said that consumers as well as record companies are guilty of not allowing that to happen. Van's label didn't do shit to promote him as the second coming. Van's label did nothing to let the public know that he even had albums out. What little buzz surrounding him has come from word of mouth. I haven't seen one concrete example of what makes Van Hunt so "trashy" or "mediocre". Some of yall are actin' like Van is the equivalent of Tay Zonday.

I think Van's a great producer. My evidence? Rahsaan Patterson's "Sure Boy", Dionne Farris' "Hopeless". I think he's a great songwriter. My evidence? Check "Bits and Pieces" from his latest, "Character" from On the Jungle Floor, and "The Best" by Rahsaan Patterson. Is he a virtuoso on any of the instruments he plays? Maybe not. But the man is well above average when it comes to a song and a groove.

Van as well as other underground folks who are or have been signed to major labels are not afforded the luxury of releasing an album every year in this day and age. So it's going to be a little harder for some artist to grow unless they develop some sort of devout following. Unless you are affiliated with an indie, record labels don't give a shit about "raw talent".... they want product that will serve as a cash cow. Hell, Van had to lie about his age just to get his first deal with Capitol.

But, I'm straying from my point. For those of you who think he's so mundane and mediocre, please explain why. I'd really like to have an intelligent discussion about this.

bsk3601 said:

I agree with U. The age thing is always a factor. Hell, I'm 26 & I feel too old to get a record deal. So, I feel what your saying about the age thing. If he is what U say he is then he deserves the accolades he gets, regardless of his age. But, I think this Prince comparison perhaps rubs the Prince fans the wrong way because we know just how great Prince is. Van has yet to truly prove himself to most people. But, as a Black man who plays Guitar & deals with stereotypes I'm not gonna hate...we need more like him anyway.

sammij said:

AlexdeParis said:

SirPsycho said:

why hello there...

Sorry u were so offended..
I could list my credits as a musician..but I prefer to be somewhat anonymous on public forums such as this..Yes i do respect that he "plays" an instrument..but when you do that yourself..and you see someone that cant compare to the standards that you are accustomed to..then, It doesn't really menn all that much..and YES if someone has the NERVE to put the words "Van Hunt" in a sentance with "PRINCE" then I will be forced to be a bit harsh..
MEDIOCRE is what I think he is..
(not compared to the fools that dont even deserve to be making records..but SURELY compared to greats like Prince..Stevie...Marvin..Curtis...Sly..."
IE: the levels he's striving for, and being marketed as...
Im also not a D'angelo fan..but its clear as the light of day when i hear him that is Very musically Gifted..I worked with him on his voodoo album and we did some gigs together around that time...As a player..singer..."Real Passionate Artist"..and someone that Can really "BRING IT"
IE: like the old school greats..
he gets my vote..(if we are talking about fairly new cats doing soulful modern music that have the ability to be mentioned among the greats..)

Van hunt aint even in the ballpark of Great..
The proof is in the pudding..and for all those people that think Prince wasn't Turning the industry out after his 3rd album..you dont have a clue !

Prince was being compared to people like Michael Jackson..and had a HUGE following of freeks that were packing his shows wherever he went by the time his 3rd album came out...I remember being a child and actually having "strong" feelings of Dislike for Prince because I was a Michael fan and Prince was like "his Nasty, Sex Fiend, evil,nemesis..or something.."
I bet you if you ask 100 school aged kids..in any city ..In any country..If they know who Van Hunt is..or what kind of Music he plays..or to sing/hum any of his tunes..
you will get virtually No feedback..
Because nobody CARES or will Care.. !

Im standing behind my feelings..
Thank You !


PS..
People need to relax also with all this "Musical elitists" Bullshit..
Everybody has a right to like what they like ! and NOT like what they dont like ! I have all of vans albums and they all make me feel the same way..
*like things that i dont need to hear again..
This is an OPEN Forum..RELAX !
my day today was spent cleaning my house and listening to..

T.rex/marc bolan,
Bill withers,
Jimi Hendrix,
Minnie ripperton,
todd rundgren,
Savage Rose,
Vanity 6,
and a few Break mix cds..
followed by watching a Sly Stone documentary during dinner..

Im a "Musical elitist"?!?!

bsk3601 said:

[Edited 1/7/08 0:00am]

sexxydancer said:

Aaaahhh, since you still check this forum it must mean there IS non-Prince music you Do enoy!!!!
BUSTED!!!

Van Hunt is great and only 30 YEARS OLD (Born Mar 8, 1977 in Dayton, OH
), so please relax and enjoy guys... The sheer fact that he is no (and will be no) Prince does not mean you should not appreciate his great music. he is a very talented composer, not as strong as a musician but still OK. I love him

Wise words...!

DrD said:

[Edited 1/7/08 7:22am]

..

DrD said:

...not to mention a prettty good lyricist

I agree with Prettymanson and Dance. For me, how many instruments he plays or what he represents is irrelevant. He's a bland figure and he doesn't know how to write a catchy tune. Why would I give a fuck?
[Edited 1/15/08 12:40pm]

Glad I finally checked out these vids. I don't have time for hate and debates. If I don't like somebody I just keep it moving.
[Edited 1/7/08 9:49am]

some of ya'll veiws may change....i didn't see anything distinctive or interesting about him at first either...

...


I was kinda lukewarm on Van Hunt's first two releases, though I certainly heard the potential. But now I've had a chance to check out the new album and IMO, it's an impressive leap forward. You definitely hear the growth. It's not as "commercial" as the last two though, and I'm sad to hear that Blue Note won't release it. I do hope it gets released eventually--it won't be for every taste, but this is the certainly the one that won me over....





...

paligap said:

prettymansson said:

You don't want to be too anonymous if you've got to preface your post with that info.

Once again, I can respect your opinion. I just don't think it's logical. It's the media machine that has subjected Van to the Prince, Sly and Stevie comparisons. Once again, when you've got a cat like Van who makes the music he does as opposed to mainstream R&B, it's a clichéd comparison. Black man who plays funk/rhythm guitar licks with some rock edge? Who do you think the first comparison is going to be? How likely are you to read a review that compares a black guitar player to Shuggie Otis or George Johnson? Speaking of Shuggie, you could ask 100 or so school children about him and I'm willing to be my ass that they'd give the same response you said that would've given about Van. Is it popularity among the masses that distinguishes mediocrity from potential greatness? Is Van Hunt's musicianship on par with Prince's or Stevie's? I would give an emphatic, "Hell Naw". I'm sure Van would give the same answer.

I would just think that if you are a professional/session musician, then you'd be a little more supportive of Van despite your dislike of his style, like D'Angelo. In a climate of so many folks as you so eloquently put it, "don't deserve to be making records", I just think he deserves a little more credit than your giving him. You damn near come across as bitter about the dude.

Personally, I think that this 3rd lp proves that he's on his way to great things musically, no matter how old he is. Everyone is entitled to their opinion on the guy, I'm still not seeing why it's got to be mediocre.
[Edited 1/7/08 16:31pm]

paligap said:

OTOH, while I think it's up to his usual standard of excellence, Popular doesn't top On the Jungle Floor for me. That one was easily my second favorite R&B record of the 2000s (after Voodoo).

well well ! you see this is why Threads like these create problems ,when VAN has been nothing but a supporter of Prince ! last show at BB Kings the music playing prior was all Prince.How cool to be able to bump a fellow artist msuic whom you appreciate and still know you can hold your own. AND HE CAN !


Well if it was attention that this thread was seeking it got back to VAN in a not so good way while he was on the internet with his own child .


so this is what VAN has to say. Via his myspace page


it’s none of your business what other people say about you...
Category: Blogging

but, I have read my own press. Not all of it. Just enough to not be able to turn back. it's gone to my head.
I can remember once going on okayplayer-trying for the 15th time to find some new info on D'angelo's still nascent record-and "stumbled" across a thread about the Prince comparisons that have been made about ME... some of the comments on there were downright destructive. I never even imagined that you could mix the words "p**ssy" and "musician" while stating an opinion:) Some were supportive. Even fewer were constructive or managed to put forth what I would deem accurate analysis. It all made me sick. Because I knew that NOBODY really knew what the f*ck they were talking about. I am neither as perfect as the best that has been said about me nor as mediocre as the worst that's been said.

It's ironic. Just two nights ago an associate called and asked if HE should go on line and address some "false accusations" that were made about HIM. I told him, "hell naw. Don't even give those fools any energy. That's what they live for...to dismantle people and overcompensate for their personal problems...all from behind a computer screen."

And, alas, here I am.

Last night I was on the
computer with my son. He likes to look up biographical information on the 43 presidents. (And to think, at 5 years old, all I wanted to do was the 'robot'). After he'd his fill he asked if I would google "Van Hunt's Son." I pondered his reasoning and the potential for damage that I was ignoring. I was reluctant when I said, ". . .o. . .k..."
I pressed enter. and right there, at the top of the page was a heading, "Van Hunt is Prince's Son." This time it was Prince.org. "Oh, Jesus" I whispered. I had to have it.

Double Click.

I read the first line, "there aint sh*t about Van Hunt that's genius." Or something to that effect. My son reads almost as fast as i do. But, I caught him before he got to the curse words. I said "go play." He started to challenge the order. I put on my transformer face. He found a toy.
I read on.
Of course, everyone on the thread was a Prince fan. But, to my surprise, this time I emerged from the comments without any long-term scarring. Some people didn't know enough about me to form an opinion. Some people knew enough to be enthusiastically supportive and encouraging of my work. Some were, obviously, musically inclined on top of being Prince fans. Some didn't give a damn.
The debate seemed to be fueled by the bodyguarding of Prince's legacy and about the question of whether or not I was a good musician. They mentioned other musicians who would supposedly wipe the floor with me (even 10 year old musicians).

What they don't realize is that I've played guitar with, for and beside most of their heroes. And, I doubt that any of those musicians would say that I couldn't hold my own. What they don't know is that guitar isn't even my first instrument. Piano is. What they don't know is I never set out to make improvisational solo records. I fast forward through Prince's guitar solos. As a matter of fact I would be more likely to listen to Thelonious Monk play one of his tinkly excursions than I would Art Tatum. Charlie Parker could MAKE you hear modal scales in fourths-using major minor 11ths and do it before you notice that Mccoy Tyner or Oscar Peterson didn't even have his hands on the keys. but, i put my money on Johnny Hodges. slow notes by the most beautiful horn tone in the business. Ask me who's the better singer, Sam Cooke or Muddy Waters, and I'll say, obviously, Sam Cooke. But, ask me who I prefer to listen to and, well... Muddy is my man! And, if u listened to Sly's 'there's a riot goin on' you would not walk away from that record claiming that George Benson or Herbie Hancock need be worried about claims on their Godliness. But, it's MY favorite record.

What they don't know is that 'their man', while he is an incredible talent and entertainer, he willed his biggest hits into being. Because he HAD to be a star. He no longer writes great songs because being a great songwriter was never his goal. Being relevant was/is. What they don't know is that Neil Young, Bob Dylan, Duke Ellington...THOSE are great songwriters. They wrote hundreds of them- consistently. Nary a dud in their entire career. What they don't know is that Michelangelo was an artist. Marlon Brando was an artiste (emphasis on the 'iste'). Each more naturally skillful than any of the people I've mentioned. Ayn Rand, Tennessee Williams... craftsmen. Read 'Fountainhead' or watch 'Night of The Iguana'. the work is more fine tuned and sharp and sophisticated than any of the people I've mentioned. They don't know that these are the benchmarks for me. Not their obsolete little argument over who has the best album of the last 20 years that was played on the now invisible and inaudible "black radio."

What they can't comprehend is the lengths I have gone to create what is my highest ideal...for their world to sneer at...and that it is quietly reaching critical immunity because of the dues that i have paid.

So, kiss my a** while you decide if i'm worth your respect. it shouldn't matter to me; and, i am glad to say that it doesn't anymore. and, i will tell my child the same thing the next time he asks me to google Van Hunt's son: it's none of your business what people say about you

details on my future coming tuesday.
V H .
[Edited 1/13/08 10:54am]