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PrintableTonyVanDam said: silverchild said: Prince
Curtis Mayfield Rick James Anita Baker Isley Brothers The Roots Common Donny Hathaway Roberta Flack 
 I was about to mention Mr Biggs. I wonder how Ernie really feels about all this Mr Biggs business. Rick James sold out eventually probably cause he was broke and needed a hit. What I hate the most are the covers albums (Babyface has one coming) and the hiphop productions/rapper featurings (Cameo/Bar-kays). The Muthafuckin Time never sold out, Jesse never sold out. | |
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rebelsoldier said: TonyVanDam said:
I was about to mention Mr Biggs. I wonder how Ernie really feels about all this Mr Biggs business. What I hate the most are the covers albums (Babyface has one coming) and the hiphop productions/rapper featurings (Cameo/Bar-kays). The Muthafuckin Time never sold out, Jesse never sold out.   | |
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rebelsoldier said: TonyVanDam said:
I was about to mention Mr Biggs. I wonder how Ernie really feels about all this Mr Biggs business. Rick James sold out eventually probably cause he was broke and needed a hit. What I hate the most are the covers albums (Babyface has one coming) and the hiphop productions/rapper featurings (Cameo/Bar-kays). The Muthafuckin Time never sold out, Jesse never sold out. He probably won't say nothing because it's getting him money but of course once brother Ronnie goes to jail, he'll probably speak out.  | |
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Roger Troutman! Sure "I Wanna Be Your Man" and "Computer Love" crossed over, But Roger never changed his sound to do it. Now some of you may think that he sold out with Dre and Tupac Shakur on the song "California Love" But that song was and still is FONKY!! | |
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since Tina Turner claims she always wanted to be a rock singer does that make her a sell out? You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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ehuffnsd said: since Tina Turner claims she always wanted to be a rock singer does that make her a sell out?
IMO, Tina Turner qualfies as a sell-out when she did a remake of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together" to launch her once-dead career and then a few years later she makes a derogative comment about soul music (in an interview she said "she hated it" and called it "depressing"). THE TRAFFIC JAMMERS, The Org's house band: VAINANDY -- lead singer; NAJEE -- bass; THE AUDIENCE -- guitar; PHUNKDADDY -- rhythm guitar; ALEX de PARIS -- keyboards; Da PRETTYMAN -- keyboards; FUNKENSTEIN -- drums. HOLD ON TO YOUR DRAWERS! | |
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Najee said: ehuffnsd said: since Tina Turner claims she always wanted to be a rock singer does that make her a sell out?
IMO, Tina Turner qualfies as a sell-out when she did a remake of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together" to launch her once-dead career and then a few years later she makes a derogative comment about soul music (in an interview she said "she hated it" and called it "depressing"). because she doesn't like a "black" form of music that makes her a sell out? i can't stand bluegrass does that make me a sell out? You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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ehuffnsd said: because she doesn't like a "black" form of music that makes her a sell out?
i can't stand bluegrass does that make me a sell out? That's not the point. If Tina Turner supposedly hates soul music -- which is debateable, considering her past with The Ike and Tina Turner Revue -- then why make a cover of arguably one of the greatest soul songs ever, as a first single nonetheless? Easy -- at that time, she had no audience so she had to get someone to start buying her songs. But as soon as songs like "What's Love Got to Do with It?," "Private Dancer" and "Better Be Good to Me" made her a huge pop/rock artist, she started developing a fake British accent and saying she "hated" soul music. THE TRAFFIC JAMMERS, The Org's house band: VAINANDY -- lead singer; NAJEE -- bass; THE AUDIENCE -- guitar; PHUNKDADDY -- rhythm guitar; ALEX de PARIS -- keyboards; Da PRETTYMAN -- keyboards; FUNKENSTEIN -- drums. HOLD ON TO YOUR DRAWERS! | |
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TheDance87 said: alphastreet said: I'm sorry to sound ignorant, but maybe some people 'sell out' as you put it because they're tired of doing the same type of music over and over again and being ghettoized. If anything, you should be happy about mainstream accepting black artists at a phenomenal level. A lot of you also realize that it was blacks that created rock and roll, right? Even if they weren't allowed to perform their music back in the 50's. So actually, "selling out" and going pop/rock for mainstream audiences is just a mentality and covering up the fact that doing rock is doing music that blacks were already doing. Some black artists could go for that sound and very well NOT be accepted in mainstream. Another time, an urban sounding song may be well received by mainstream and become a hit, that doesn't mean selling out. And if you ask me, this is the same kind of mentality when people in the schoolyard are called white for not talking in ebonics and wanting to go to a good college...very immature
as for dangerous and invincible, a lot of people my age bought the CD back then and were very much into r&b, hip hop, rap, reggae and pop, some alternative/rock as well. I can think of at least 20 people that I know have it from what I've heard, songs like butterflies, break of dawn and heaven can wait were heavily played on r&b/urban radio and could have easily become hits had mj chosen to release those and capitalize on the audience that was feeling him the most, but he was so out of it during that time period [Edited 8/9/07 8:21am] [Edited 8/9/07 8:22am] *shakes head* Yes 2 me, Mike ain't no sell out. He's always done the music, HIS way. As much as I love Prince, Michael is still an incredible artist. U can't hate on a brotha 4 loving some MJ. I don't know where y'all get this idea of Mike's Bad Album being his "White" album. Lord have mercy. Yeah I know there are times where homeboy is weird but he's an true innovator. Like our homeboy, Prince. I also think MJ is an incredible artist, and I love all of his albums (excluding songs such as "Privacy," "You Are My Life," etc)! I should not have called Bad his "White Album." Like alphastreet said, many, including myself, tend to label rock and roll as white music when it really originated within the black community. Sadly, I have to constantly remind myself not to "box" people into genres due to their race and gender. I hope not to streotype people musically just based on race again. | |
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Najee said: ehuffnsd said: because she doesn't like a "black" form of music that makes her a sell out?
i can't stand bluegrass does that make me a sell out? That's not the point. If Tina Turner supposedly hates soul music -- which is debateable, considering her past with The Ike and Tina Turner Revue -- then why make a cover of arguably one of the greatest soul songs ever, as a first single nonetheless? Easy -- at that time, she had no audience so she had to get someone to start buying her songs. But as soon as songs like "What's Love Got to Do with It?," "Private Dancer" and "Better Be Good to Me" made her a huge pop/rock artist, she started developing a fake British accent and saying she "hated" soul music. let's see she recorded soul music and was beaten up at the same time. Can't understand why she might equate the two. You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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I see Shitney Houston as the absolute definition of a black artist selling out. They should put her picture in the dictionary next to the word.
I do not see a black person making rock music as selling out by no means. I see a black person, or any other person for that matter, selling out by purposely making music (of any genre) and weakening it so it will appeal to both the R&B and pop/rock crowd. If a black person makes strong rock, that's cool. If a black person makes weak rock, hoping that the R&B audience will like it, that's selling out. The same goes on the R&B side. If a black artist makes R&B but weakens it for the pop/rock audience that's selling out. It's cool to have both rock and funk on the same album as long as each track is strong in the genre it is. Now, if Shitney wanted to make adult contemporary, then it should have been played on adult contemporary stations only and not R&B stations.....especially when funk was the dominating thing on those stations at the time. I see it as blatant racism that her weak shit was played on black stations simply because she's black. Her music did not belong on those stations at the time. Of course, little goodie ass two shoes knew they would play her on those stations AND the pop/rock stations. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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ehuffnsd said: let's see she recorded soul music and was beaten up at the same time. Can't understand why she might equate the two.
The problem is that Tina Turner jump-started her career by choosing to make a cover of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together" -- years after leaving Ike Turner. She teamed up in 1982 with British Electric Foundation for a remake of The Temptations' "Ball of Confusion" and recorded a remake of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together." Your attempt to connect the two don't make sense here. I have no problem with Turner making rock-oriented or rock/pop-type songs. What I have a problem is when she chooses to make covers of soul songs to get her career started and then after she gets massive crossover acceptance she disses the soul genre and comes up with ways purposely to distance herself from the genre and audience (c'mon, a British accent from a black woman from the South?). [Edited 8/9/07 19:53pm] THE TRAFFIC JAMMERS, The Org's house band: VAINANDY -- lead singer; NAJEE -- bass; THE AUDIENCE -- guitar; PHUNKDADDY -- rhythm guitar; ALEX de PARIS -- keyboards; Da PRETTYMAN -- keyboards; FUNKENSTEIN -- drums. HOLD ON TO YOUR DRAWERS! | |
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ehuffnsd said: Najee said: That's not the point. If Tina Turner supposedly hates soul music -- which is debateable, considering her past with The Ike and Tina Turner Revue -- then why make a cover of arguably one of the greatest soul songs ever, as a first single nonetheless? Easy -- at that time, she had no audience so she had to get someone to start buying her songs. But as soon as songs like "What's Love Got to Do with It?," "Private Dancer" and "Better Be Good to Me" made her a huge pop/rock artist, she started developing a fake British accent and saying she "hated" soul music. let's see she recorded soul music and was beaten up at the same time. Can't understand why she might equate the two. Please tell me you are not trying to take it there.  | |
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As for black artists that have never sold out, the only ones I know of are the funk groups that never purposely tried to get a crossover hit....but only the ones that have stayed retired since the 1980s and have not tried to make an album in the 1990s or today.
Selling out is also weakening your music for mass appeal. Therefore, a former funk group or artist that does away with their funky instruments and uses shit hop sounding equipment to make their music is also a form of selling out. The only artist I can think of that still makes music and hasn't done that completely is Prince.....however, Prince has sold out on individual tracks like "Mr. Goodnight" and "Incense and Candles". Andy is a four letter word. | |
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black woman records soul music and is beaten up by her soul artist husband = the reason the black woman supposedly doesn't like soul music
wtf?? [Edited 8/9/07 19:54pm] | |
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Najee said: ehuffnsd said: let's see she recorded soul music and was beaten up at the same time. Can't understand why she might equate the two.
The problem is that Tina Turner jump-started her career by choosing to make a cover of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together" -- years after leaving Ike Turner. She teamed up in 1982 with British Electric Foundation for a remake of the Temptations' "Ball of Confusion" and recording a remake of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together." Your attempt to connect the two don't make sense here. I have no problem with Turner making rock-oriented or rock/pop-type songs. What I have a problem is when she chooses to make covers of soul songs to get her career started and then after she gets massive crossover acceptance she disses the soul genre. [Edited 8/9/07 19:49pm] I have almost no knowledge of Tina Turner's life and music, so please correct me if I am wrong. But, from reading both your and effunsd's posts, couldn't it be that she felt more "safe" starting with covers of well-known and respected soul musicians? That she did not have the courage yet to venture out into fields which she really wanted to do, especially if she had just separated from her abusive partner? | |
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FuNkeNsteiN said: silverchild said: Prince
Curtis Mayfield Rick James Anita Baker Isley Brothers The Roots Common Donny Hathaway Roberta Flack Uhm... Wonderful... the hip hop stuff of Urban Rhapsody... the contemporary R&B sound of Deeper Still My biggest gripe about "Urban Rapsody" is that it didn't have any funk on it. It had some shit hop on it but it did have a nice slow or three. "Deeper Still" is another story. The whole entire album is a hot sellout mess. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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PurpleCharm said: ehuffnsd said: let's see she recorded soul music and was beaten up at the same time. Can't understand why she might equate the two. Please tell me you are not trying to take it there. sometimes people equate certain things whether right or wrong. You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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Rodya24 said:
Whenever I see that clip of Whitney being booed, I feel sorry for her as well. I never saw the clip but every time I read about it, I damn near have an orgasm. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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Rodya24 said: Najee said: The problem is that Tina Turner jump-started her career by choosing to make a cover of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together" -- years after leaving Ike Turner. She teamed up in 1982 with British Electric Foundation for a remake of the Temptations' "Ball of Confusion" and recording a remake of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together." Your attempt to connect the two don't make sense here. I have no problem with Turner making rock-oriented or rock/pop-type songs. What I have a problem is when she chooses to make covers of soul songs to get her career started and then after she gets massive crossover acceptance she disses the soul genre. [Edited 8/9/07 19:49pm] I have almost no knowledge of Tina Turner's life and music, so please correct me if I am wrong. But, from reading both your and effunsd's posts, couldn't it be that she felt more "safe" starting with covers of well-known and respected soul musicians? That she did not have the courage yet to venture out into fields which she really wanted to do, especially if she had just separated from her abusive partner? interesting thought You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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ehuffnsd said: PurpleCharm said: Please tell me you are not trying to take it there. sometimes people equate certain things whether right or wrong. Did Tina tell you that was the reason? | |
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PurpleCharm said: Dear Jesus,
Please do not allow this thread to turn into a Michael Jackson thread. TIA, PurpleCharm Honey, Michael Jackson is Malcolm X compared to some other artists I can think of. Andy is a four letter word. | |
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Najee said: ehuffnsd said: let's see she recorded soul music and was beaten up at the same time. Can't understand why she might equate the two.
The problem is that Tina Turner jump-started her career by choosing to make a cover of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together" -- years after leaving Ike Turner. She teamed up in 1982 with British Electric Foundation for a remake of The Temptations' "Ball of Confusion" and recorded a remake of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together." Your attempt to connect the two don't make sense here. I have no problem with Turner making rock-oriented or rock/pop-type songs. What I have a problem is when she chooses to make covers of soul songs to get her career started and then after she gets massive crossover acceptance she disses the soul genre and comes up with ways purposely to distance herself from the genre and audience (c'mon, a British accent from a black woman from the South?). [Edited 8/9/07 19:53pm] my ex a native of california. moves to the Boston area. comes back with a Boston accent. it happens. how do we not know that isn't how she felt all the time, but couldn't say otherwise because that's what she was recording with said abusive partner? You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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ehuffnsd said: PurpleCharm said: Please tell me you are not trying to take it there. sometimes people equate certain things whether right or wrong. i'm trying to come up with reason on why she may have said something i know no more than Najee. and i don't like this thread it equates appealing to larger audiences or white people as a let down, and a bit racial. You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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Rodya24 said: I have almost no knowledge of Tina Turner's life and music, so please correct me if I am wrong. But, from reading both your and effunsd's posts, couldn't it be that she felt more "safe" starting with covers of well-known and respected soul musicians? That she did not have the courage yet to venture out into fields which she really wanted to do, especially if she had just separated from her abusive partner?
It's difficult to have a discussion with the other person has no knowledge of the subject at hand. It's not like Tina Turner is an obscure artist, so I would read up on her to get some context of her career. Turner always did other genres of music -- rock, soul/R&B, etc. -- throughout her career with the Ike and Tina Turner Revue and a solo act, so that's not a problem. The problem is that she makes a statement that "she hates" soul music when it was a soul song that launched her solo career. It was never an issue of some emotional tie to her ex-husband because she chose to record a cover of Al Green's "Let's Stay Together" years after leaving him. The fact is if it wasn't for "Let's Stay Together" she would not have had a platform to become the huge rock/pop star she became. Once she solidified herself as rock/pop artist, she started using and saying measures that purposely alienated her from what remnants of a soul following she had. Like I said, Turner chose to make a cover of "Let's Stay Together" in order to gain foothold with a U.S. audience to get her career (which was considered poison) started. [Edited 8/9/07 20:14pm] THE TRAFFIC JAMMERS, The Org's house band: VAINANDY -- lead singer; NAJEE -- bass; THE AUDIENCE -- guitar; PHUNKDADDY -- rhythm guitar; ALEX de PARIS -- keyboards; Da PRETTYMAN -- keyboards; FUNKENSTEIN -- drums. HOLD ON TO YOUR DRAWERS! | |
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ehuffnsd said: my ex a native of california. moves to the Boston area. comes back with a Boston accent. it happens.
It doesn't happen when you're in your mid-40s and your speech patterns are fully established. THE TRAFFIC JAMMERS, The Org's house band: VAINANDY -- lead singer; NAJEE -- bass; THE AUDIENCE -- guitar; PHUNKDADDY -- rhythm guitar; ALEX de PARIS -- keyboards; Da PRETTYMAN -- keyboards; FUNKENSTEIN -- drums. HOLD ON TO YOUR DRAWERS! | |
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Najee said: ehuffnsd said: my ex a native of california. moves to the Boston area. comes back with a Boston accent. it happens.
It doesn't happen when you're in your mid-40s and your speech patterns are fully established. he was 34 when he moved away, and after 8 years of living in CA my family notices a diffence in how i talk when i go back to visit in Missouri. I was 18 when I moved away. [Edited 8/9/07 20:08pm] You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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ehuffnsd said: he was 34 when he moved away.
It would fair to say your ex-husband was emulating how people in the Boston area talked. Such regionalized speech patterns are developed at younger ages and over a period of years. Developing a Boston or British accent is not like catching the cold. THE TRAFFIC JAMMERS, The Org's house band: VAINANDY -- lead singer; NAJEE -- bass; THE AUDIENCE -- guitar; PHUNKDADDY -- rhythm guitar; ALEX de PARIS -- keyboards; Da PRETTYMAN -- keyboards; FUNKENSTEIN -- drums. HOLD ON TO YOUR DRAWERS! | |
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Najee said: ehuffnsd said: he was 34 when he moved away.
It would fair to say your ex-husband was emulating how people in the Boston area talked. Such regionalized speech patterns are developed at younger ages and over a period of years. Developing a Boston or British accent is not like catching the cold. thanks for calling him my husband, though only in MA could we get married. it happens, some people tend to do it, he had no idea he was doing it. my mom is the same way and she came back from a trip to our Motherland, Ireland, she was speaking with a brough. You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
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