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Printablepaisleypark4 said: nowikno1 said: Ok, now I try not to provide criticism when it comes to songwritting and producing. Because as "artists & "producers" we all choose to express ourselves in different ways. That is what makes us "unique" At one point Jimmy and Terry led the pack. Now it's seems that they're now following suit. I've studied a lot of their material and I'm sorry a lot of their "HITS" came from ONE SONG....."Im only human" by the human league. Heres a list:
Tender Love-Force MD's If you were here with me-2night Alexander Oneal Tell me if you still Care-SOS Band Can U stand the rain-New Edition Sensitivity-Ralph Tresvant Money cant' buy U love- Ralph Tresvant "Mo money Soudtrack" Giving my all to you-Johnny Gill On Bended knee-Boyz 2 Men Come back to me-Janet Jackson and probably a few others I forgot. what bothers me is that when people cant come up with anything ORIGINAL. They go to the Last resort of sampling a classic. WHY????? Her 1st 3 joints (releases) with Jimmy and Terry will always be my Favs. I will say this, The Industry is need of a wake up call and there's a revolution going on right now(musically speaking that is) in every basement, in every home studio accross the GLOBE!. And everything that is underground will reach above ground(mainstream) without compromise. Remeber.....The EXOUDUS has begun. The Best thing Janet could do for her career is to leave JD out of the production side(Damita Jo is a good example) Lawd, u need to study MUCH MUCH more. Jimmy jam And Terry Lewis been producing song since 1981 
http://www.prince.org/msg/8/129361 Im guessing u never was around for my Jimmy Jam & Terry Lewis Essential post.... Especially the part when u said "Tell me If U Still Care" uuuh.. 1983 DUH
[Edited 5/2/06 10:42am] | |
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paisleypark4 said: nowikno1 said: The Best thing Janet could do for her career is to leave JD out of the production side(Damita Jo is a good example)
Last but not lease, JD had nothing to do with Damita Jo. Exactly. | |
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nowikno1 said: paisleypark4 said: Lawd, u need to study MUCH MUCH more. Jimmy jam And Terry Lewis been producing song since 1981
http://www.prince.org/msg/8/129361 Im guessing u never was around for my Jimmy Jam & Terry Lewis Essential post.... Especially the part when u said "Tell me If U Still Care" uuuh.. 1983 DUH
[Edited 5/2/06 10:42am] U missed the whole point.....the point was that all of those particular songs and more.....are the SAME SONG!!!!! The same Chord Structure, the SAME CHORD PROGRESSION!!!!! It doesn't take a music major to figure that out. AND OH YES, I do know jam and lewis have been producing since 81. I've followed them since thier days with the time. I also know that when they were fired from prince's camp, before the success of the SOS band.....They were charging $1500.00 a trak. | |
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nowikno1 said: nowikno1 said: U missed the whole point.....the point was that all of those particular songs and more.....are the SAME SONG!!!!! The same Chord Structure, the SAME CHORD PROGRESSION!!!!! It doesn't take a music major to figure that out. AND OH YES, I do know jam and lewis have been producing since 81. I've followed them since thier days with the time. I also know that when they were fired from prince's camp, before the success of the SOS band.....They were charging $1500.00 a trak. You think Money Can't Buy You Love is the SAME song as Come Back To Me?  | |
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nowikno1 said: nowikno1 said: U missed the whole point.....the point was that all of those particular songs and more.....are the SAME SONG!!!!! The same Chord Structure, the SAME CHORD PROGRESSION!!!!! It doesn't take a music major to figure that out. AND OH YES, I do know jam and lewis have been producing since 81. I've followed them since thier days with the time. I also know that when they were fired from prince's camp, before the success of the SOS band.....They were charging $1500.00 a trak. Well yeah they even used some of the same instruments but.....sooo I didnt understand. Does that make it any less or better of a song? Id say Human and Come Back 2 Me and Sunshine (alexander oneal) can all be fused together and make a hott mix. Because they are all three made by the same producers. U can mix Prince songs easily together because they are from Prince. U can mix the Neptunes songs together because they are the same producers. Not every single production is going to sound like something different. Im just mad that someone said that J&T arent creative and they sound the same Just makes me angry.
Thats why i love the org. [Edited 5/2/06 11:54am] Straight Jacket Funk Affair
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VoicesCarry said: nowikno1 said: U missed the whole point.....the point was that all of those particular songs and more.....are the SAME SONG!!!!! The same Chord Structure, the SAME CHORD PROGRESSION!!!!! It doesn't take a music major to figure that out. AND OH YES, I do know jam and lewis have been producing since 81. I've followed them since thier days with the time. I also know that when they were fired from prince's camp, before the success of the SOS band.....They were charging $1500.00 a trak. You think Money Can't Buy You Love is the SAME song as Come Back To Me? Yes it is. The only diference is....its sped up. If we were sitting at a piano I would play it for you. Hell, soon as I heard it, I went to the piano and played it with very little effort. And If I was playing a live gig...I could incorporate all of those songs n 2 1 song for about 7 minutes before I took a break. Hell, Dirty Mind, Controversy and 1999 are very similar. They all have a straight beat or 4 on the floor goove, with a one note bass line that repeats its self whereas the guitar and synth carries the trak.Dont take my word for it, listen for yourself  | |
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nowikno1 said: VoicesCarry said: You think Money Can't Buy You Love is the SAME song as Come Back To Me? Yes it is. The only diference is....its sped up. If we were sitting at a piano I would play it for you. Hell, soon as I heard it, I went to the piano and played it with very little effort. And If I was playing a live gig...I could incorporate all of those songs n 2 1 song for about 7 minutes before I took a break. Hell, Dirty Mind, Controversy and 1999 are very similar. They all have a straight beat or 4 on the floor goove, with a one note bass line that repeats its self whereas the guitar and synth carries the trak.Dont take my word for it, listen for yourself Yes, they are, and I understand what you're saying. But no, they are not the SAME song. Now "Ice Ice Baby" and "Under Pressure" - SAME damn song. | |
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paisleypark4 said: nowikno1 said: U missed the whole point.....the point was that all of those particular songs and more.....are the SAME SONG!!!!! The same Chord Structure, the SAME CHORD PROGRESSION!!!!! It doesn't take a music major to figure that out. AND OH YES, I do know jam and lewis have been producing since 81. I've followed them since thier days with the time. I also know that when they were fired from prince's camp, before the success of the SOS band.....They were charging $1500.00 a trak. Well yeah they even used some of the same instruments but.....sooo I didnt understand. Does that make it any less or better of a song? Id say Human and Come Back 2 Me and Sunshine (alexander oneal) can all be fused together and make a hott mix. Because they are all three made by the same producers. U can mix Prince songs easily together because they are from Prince. U can mix the Neptunes songs together because they are the same producers. Not every single production is going to sound like something different. Im just mad that someone said that J&T arent creative and they sound the same Just makes me angry.
Thats why i love the org. [Edited 5/2/06 11:54am] I never said that j&t weren't creative. Because even if you are going to re-use the same chords in a song that ALSO invloves a certain amount of creativity. and to a certain extent I agree with every single production isn't going to sound different depending on the artists and producers invloved. The catch is 2 not be THAT obvious. | |
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VoicesCarry said: nowikno1 said: Yes it is. The only diference is....its sped up. If we were sitting at a piano I would play it for you. Hell, soon as I heard it, I went to the piano and played it with very little effort. And If I was playing a live gig...I could incorporate all of those songs n 2 1 song for about 7 minutes before I took a break. Hell, Dirty Mind, Controversy and 1999 are very similar. They all have a straight beat or 4 on the floor goove, with a one note bass line that repeats its self whereas the guitar and synth carries the trak.Dont take my word for it, listen for yourself Yes, they are, and I understand what you're saying. But no, they are not the SAME song. Now "Ice Ice Baby" and "Under Pressure" - SAME damn song. well of course.....because its a SAMPLE  | |
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nowikno1 said: VoicesCarry said: Yes, they are, and I understand what you're saying. But no, they are not the SAME song. Now "Ice Ice Baby" and "Under Pressure" - SAME damn song. well of course.....because its a SAMPLE Um, except it WASN'T when released. Remember Ice on some damn TV show...."Theirs goes DA DA DA DA DA DA DA and mine goes DA DA DA DA DA DA DA DA DA" C'mon - one of the all-time great music moments on TV! | |
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VoicesCarry said: nowikno1 said: well of course.....because its a SAMPLE Um, except it WASN'T when released. Remember Ice on some damn TV show...."Theirs goes DA DA DA DA DA DA DA and mine goes DA DA DA DA DA DA DA DA DA" C'mon - one of the all-time great music moments on TV! That was a classic moment. | |
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Graycap23 said: VoicesCarry said: Um, except it WASN'T when released. Remember Ice on some damn TV show...."Theirs goes DA DA DA DA DA DA DA and mine goes DA DA DA DA DA DA DA DA DA" C'mon - one of the all-time great music moments on TV! That was a classic moment. Wether it be a sample or cover, note for note THAT SONG was COPIED entirely. What is being overlooked is that j&t actually WROTE hits note for note. Most of them that I previously listed sounded very similar because of the CHORD stucture and movement. But it wasn't an OBVIOUS duplicate of a prior hit because they were at least CREATIVE enough to swich chords around. Ex. Sensitivity-Ralph Tresvant Someday is 2night-Janet Jackson Dont take my word for it. Listen for yourself | |
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nowikno1 said: Graycap23 said: That was a classic moment. Wether it be a sample or cover, note for note THAT SONG was COPIED entirely. What is being overlooked is that j&t actually WROTE hits note for note. Most of them that I previously listed sounded very similar because of the CHORD stucture and movement. But it wasn't an OBVIOUS duplicate of a prior hit because they were at least CREATIVE enough to swich chords around. Ex. Sensitivity-Ralph Tresvant Someday is 2night-Janet Jackson Dont take my word for it. Listen for yourself Sorry, considering songs with similar chord stuctures the SAME song isn't how most people evaluate plagiarism  . But you go ahead and do it....your way. | |
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VoicesCarry said: nowikno1 said: Wether it be a sample or cover, note for note THAT SONG was COPIED entirely. What is being overlooked is that j&t actually WROTE hits note for note. Most of them that I previously listed sounded very similar because of the CHORD stucture and movement. But it wasn't an OBVIOUS duplicate of a prior hit because they were at least CREATIVE enough to swich chords around. Ex. Sensitivity-Ralph Tresvant Someday is 2night-Janet Jackson Dont take my word for it. Listen for yourself Sorry, considering songs with similar chord stuctures the SAME song isn't how most people evaluate plagiarism . But you go ahead and do it....your way.No, what I ORIGINALLY said was that most of j&t hits came(derived)from the same song and that even though they sounded similar it wasnt a OBVIOUS duplicate | |
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nowikno1 said: VoicesCarry said: Sorry, considering songs with similar chord stuctures the SAME song isn't how most people evaluate plagiarism . But you go ahead and do it....your way.No, what I ORIGINALLY said was that most of j&t hits came(derived)from the same song and that even though they sounded similar it wasnt a OBVIOUS duplicate And then you said: "all of those particular songs and more.....are the SAME SONG!!!!!" | |
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nowikno1 said: VoicesCarry said: Sorry, considering songs with similar chord stuctures the SAME song isn't how most people evaluate plagiarism . But you go ahead and do it....your way.No, what I ORIGINALLY said was that most of j&t hits came(derived)from the same song and that even though they sounded similar it wasnt a OBVIOUS duplicate And the last I checked, This was not an attempt on how to establish plagerism. I was distinguishing the similarities between certain songs. | |
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nowikno1 said: nowikno1 said: No, what I ORIGINALLY said was that most of j&t hits came(derived)from the same song and that even though they sounded similar it wasnt a OBVIOUS duplicate And the last I checked, This was not an attempt on how to establish plagerism. I was distinguishing the similarities between certain songs. See my above post. I read what you said | |
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VoicesCarry said: nowikno1 said: No, what I ORIGINALLY said was that most of j&t hits came(derived)from the same song and that even though they sounded similar it wasnt a OBVIOUS duplicate And then you said: "all of those particular songs and more.....are the SAME SONG!!!!!" Well....they are all realted in some instance or another. I've played them in a medley once....and they are pretty much the same song.Maybe with one or 2 chords changed. At least. Even not being at my piano right now, I can tell you that most of them start out in c# or F. | |
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nowikno1 said: VoicesCarry said: And then you said: "all of those particular songs and more.....are the SAME SONG!!!!!" Well....they are all realted in some instance or another. I've played them in a medley once....and they are pretty much the same song.Maybe with one or 2 chords changed. At least. Even not being at my piano right now, I can tell you that most of them start out in c# or F. uh.. i pretty much know the difference between those 2 songs..just because they have the same keyboard background sounds really doesnt make "I Just Cant Get Enough" by Depeche Mode sound like "Black velveteen" by lenny Kravitz. Quit hatin on them. Straight Jacket Funk Affair
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nowikno1 said: Ok, now I try not to provide criticism when it comes to songwritting and producing. Because as "artists & "producers" we all choose to express ourselves in different ways. That is what makes us "unique" At one point Jimmy and Terry led the pack. Now it's seems that they're now following suit. I've studied a lot of their material and I'm sorry a lot of their "HITS" came from ONE SONG....."Im only human" by the human league. Heres a list:
Tender Love-Force MD's If you were here with me-2night Alexander Oneal Tell me if you still Care-SOS Band Can U stand the rain-New Edition Sensitivity-Ralph Tresvant Money cant' buy U love- Ralph Tresvant "Mo money Soudtrack" Giving my all to you-Johnny Gill On Bended knee-Boyz 2 Men Come back to me-Janet Jackson and probably a few others I forgot. what bothers me is that when people cant come up with anything ORIGINAL. They go to the Last resort of sampling a classic. WHY????? Her 1st 3 joints (releases) with Jimmy and Terry will always be my Favs. I will say this, The Industry is need of a wake up call and there's a revolution going on right now(musically speaking that is) in every basement, in every home studio accross the GLOBE!. And everything that is underground will reach above ground(mainstream) without compromise. Remeber.....The EXOUDUS has begun. The Best thing Janet could do for her career is to leave JD out of the production side(Damita Jo is a good example) Jam and Lewis used to be GREAT producers.The stuff they produced in the first half of the 80s was excellent (Cherelle's "I Didn't Mean To Turn You On",Gladys Knight and The Pips' "You're Number One (In My Book)",The SOS Band's "Just Be Good To Me"),but they have completely run out of ideas.Nowadays,their music is stale and uninspired and unfortunately,filled with samples.I recall buying Chante Moore third CD in 1999 which was mostly produced by Jam and Lewis.I ended up selling it.It was a total snoozefest.I don't know what happened,but Jam and Lewis lost something. | |
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