doctamario said:

No Fuck you! Pac had good to say. What people don't realize is you have to look past the thug persona. Look at the words look and what they are rapping about. Strip away that media made persona and you got a real person with something real to say.

PS you should never be glad someone is dead...someday someone might think that about you and that is a shitty thing to think about someone no matter who or what they are.

I could agree more. Unfortunately, black people who speak out on the moral banruptcy of the hip hop culture and music are villianized (ie Bill Cosby). Someone has to stand for what was good in the black community.

Gangsta rap does absolutely nothing good for the African American community or for the hispanic community either.it further criminalizes the black male by constanly referring to him as a "thug" or "gangsta" and this artform is responsible for setting the civil rights movement 1000 years back, by bringing the scorn and disdain once associated with the word "nigger" back into popular culture. the word is now glorifed in hip- hop and rap. rap protaganists argue that by changing the spelling to "nigga" it's now okay.that is complete bullshit!! the spelling of the word does nothing to change the pain & suffering the use of that word has caused many generations.
The image of black women is now also corrupted thanks to this lovely artform. women are constantly refferrd to as "Bitches" & "hoes" and shows black women in videos who do nothing but shake their "bootys" and dance solaciously in night clubs with cold hardened criminals. the issue of female rapppers standing up for women and respect for women holds absolutely no merit when u have female rappers such as "Lil Kim", "Foxxy Brown" ,"Missy Elliot" & "Rah Digga" who themselves refer to other women in their records as 'Bitches & Hoes' and sometimes evem refer to themselves in such ways.
The gangsta rapper of today is many things; a criminal, an auto car collector , a specialist at naming the finest drinks & Desingers , a specialist at saying how much money they make and most inportantly a PIMP now, more than ever, the image of a pimp glorified to such a large extent that songs are even dedicated to it; such bedtime classics as "P.I.M.P" , "Im A PimP" , "Bitch Please" and who could forget nelly's "Pimp Juice". rappers don't even realize it but they influenece many ppl with actions. young black boys who listen to their records hear of a glamaorous lifestyle with luxury cars, plenty bitches & weed, the finest drinks and clothes and aspirie to be like them. could u imagine the fate of many young boys with people like "50 cent" & "Snoop Dog" for role models ??? i shudder to think.
all in all the "rap game" does nothing productive except sell records, while corrupting the view of the african american people either as a "ghetto ho" or a "Gangsta" even hip hop stars like destiny's child continue to corrupt peoples' minds with thier song "soldier" .it's lyrics elude that all black women want are
those street husslin-alcohol drinkin- drug sellin- thugs that hang around the corner-that dropped out o school- lookin like they gonna snacth ur jewellery when u pass- men and that initself is hjust ridiculos. the social and economic reppercutions of these actions are felt as ripple effects throuht the enitire african american community and do nothing good to raise the morale or help the black man or woman in any way if anything they set them back 1000 steps

All I can see is that the pervasive, mainstream music culture of today is about letting the coons keep cooning. And since they are willing participants in the cooning, no one can say a white executive has a gun to their head. I think back to seeing Damon Dash and Camron on the O'Reilly Factor. These creeps dodged every inclination that their music is poisonous to the listener. Instead they touted how their entrepeneurship is inspirational to our youth. Once again, no matter the cost at which the wealth is gained, having a bank account that rivals a successful white man's is all that matters. Camron tried to deflect accountability and put it on parents. AS IF he doesn't know the record company's research has guaranteed him profitability, being that he is marketed to youngsters who crave a hero, coming from single parent homes and overcrowded public schools with little to no attention given. That bastard is counting on it. As an African American, I am sickened by how this trash has conditioned our people and turned them into sullen, foul-mouthed, belligerent people. This music is a free pass to be the absolute worst you can be. There were people of color craving empowerment in the 60s too, but did Berry Gordy stoop to this? And for the person who wonders why there aren't complaints about rock, gee, is rock turning masses of people into blithering minstrel shows? White America wouldn't have it.

damosbeautifulgrlndaworld said:

Yeah, look past the persona, the rape charges, the violence in the streets, the arrests, the jail time, and the all round ignorant behavior and I guess Tupac was not just "a nigga that got shot" to quote Chris Rock.

newpower4ever said:

To understand his persona, you have to understand how he grew up and where he came from. And if you think about his behavior ain't no different than most other artists regardless the genre. Rock n roll artists do crazy shit ALL THE TIME and its gets swept under the rug whenever analyzing a rapper's actions.

And before you go accusing him of rape, you need to look into the situation. 2pac wasnt convicted of rape; he convicted of sexual abuse - and thats just merely touching her on the ass. He shouldnt have have even been convicted of that because:

1) the the very first time he met the girl was at a club - she willingfully suck his dick there at the club just because he was a star.

2) The other two guys that Pac was with that night called her up to the hotel behind his back. Pac did't want her to come. Pac was asleep in one room, while they were in another until she started screaming "rape!" Pac got blamed because he was the "famous one". The other two guys who actually commited the sexual assualt on her, corporated with the police and had their trial seperated from Pac's and got off with much lighter sentences. Now think about that: it was the same crime and a seperated trials. Its obvious the police already had a vendatta against Pac and wanted him in jail. And it was revealed that one of those guys was acutally a police informant.

And 3) when the so-called victim was interviewed by VIBE magazine, she contradicted herself ALOT in it.

And to help paint the whole picture.....

- One of those two guys (whom I mentioned earlier) was part of an gang that funded Bad Boy Records with dirty money at the time. Because these two guys were acually police informants, 2Pac made a small negative remark about one of the two other guys in a magazine. They got mad at that remark and that would lead to Pac being set up in the lobby of a studio and shot five times...and the rest is history.

So given that situation, if you were in Pac's shoes, wouldn't that really piss you the fuck off?

I still dont believe Biggie or Puff had anything to do with either shooting.

by bringing the scorn and disdain once associated with the word "nigger" back into popular culture. the word is now glorifed in hip- hop and rap. rap protaganists argue that by changing the spelling to "nigga" it's now okay.that is complete bullshit!!

There have always been negative images and stereotypes but they did not dominate everything like they do today. Not only has hip hop taken over the music scene but it also is movies, sitcoms, and television commercials. The ones making real money of this mess are white men in business suits. They have made these thug idiots their clowns and they are laughing their asses all the way to the bank.

I used to wonder why white people were not offended by it because some of it has a lot of anger towards white people. When you really think about it, a white racist would love this anger and would be happy that they are angry. They also love to see black people calling each other "nigger" and as far as changing the spelling to "nigga", they love this even more because it's supposed to make the word "acceptable". White racists are also loving these thug images and crime glamorized. And as far as the fools "keeping it real", the white racists are really loving that. They see it as "the niggers staying in their place" in a crime infested ghetto and not daring to venture out of it into their world.

There are black men in business suits that cannot catch a cab. What do you think these thug images are doing for that? It is setting progress back.

These idiots need to wake up because they are the white racists' "clown" and they are being made fools of, being conned and ripped off, and are basically a fucking joke. This reminds me of the old days of "black face" entertainment. It's rediculous.

newpower4ever said:

To understand his persona, you have to understand how he grew up and where he came from. And if you think about his behavior ain't no different than most other artists regardless the genre. Rock n roll artists do crazy shit ALL THE TIME and its gets swept under the rug whenever analyzing a rapper's actions.

And before you go accusing him of rape, you need to look into the situation. 2pac wasnt convicted of rape; he convicted of sexual abuse - and thats just merely touching her on the ass. He shouldnt have have even been convicted of that because:

1) the the very first time he met the girl was at a club - she willingfully suck his dick there at the club just because he was a star.

2) The other two guys that Pac was with that night called her up to the hotel behind his back. Pac did't want her to come. Pac was asleep in one room, while they were in another until she started screaming "rape!" Pac got blamed because he was the "famous one". The other two guys who actually commited the sexual assualt on her, corporated with the police and had their trial seperated from Pac's and got off with much lighter sentences. Now think about that: it was the same crime and a seperated trials. Its obvious the police already had a vendatta against Pac and wanted him in jail. And it was revealed that one of those guys was acutally a police informant.

And 3) when the so-called victim was interviewed by VIBE magazine, she contradicted herself ALOT in it.

And to help paint the whole picture.....

- One of those two guys (whom I mentioned earlier) was part of an gang that funded Bad Boy Records with dirty money at the time. Because these two guys were acually police informants, 2Pac made a small negative remark about one of the two other guys in a magazine. They got mad at that remark and that would lead to Pac being set up in the lobby of a studio and shot five times...and the rest is history.

So given that situation, if you were in Pac's shoes, wouldn't that really piss you the fuck off?

Although I understand your frustration. your knoledge of hip hop, is definately limited, Ja Rule (and the others posted expect for rah digga b/c shes a dope MC) is a pop star not hip hop he just uses rap as his medium. while you post these clowns how about posting some positive faces in hip hop here i'll start:


Common


dead prez


the roots


mos def


Nas


Bahamadia


Pete Rock

oh really and what has mos def or any of the other bands done that ppl like "Ja rule"(who mind u, is not a pop star) "50 cent" haven't undone with their actions already?? as for "Nas" u should listen to some of his earlier work ,just beacuse he suddenly has this new found "knoldege of wealth" doesn't undo all the shit he has helped do over the years(the stupid feud with "Jay-z" , drug arrests etc.)
the consequences of a negative self image can lead to irrepressible damage not only to the individual but to the community as a whole. when rappers refer to themselves as "nigga" & "gangsta" and women as "bitches + hoes" it leads to a devaluing of the black person and only serves to reinforce many of the ignorant steretypes that "white" society already holds in thier minds. record labels like
:"death row" & "muder inc." just serve the same purpose, with names like those, it further creates the impression of black men as "criminals"

Xavier23 said:

Murder inc...is no longer Murder inc.
[Edited 4/3/05 18:18pm]

Supernova said:

Andy, you are one cool cat, indeed.

damosbeautifulgrlndaworld said:

Death Row records... is no longer Death Row Records either but i just used those two as illustrations to my point

oh really and what has mos def or any of the other bands done that ppl like "Ja rule"(who mind u, is not a pop star) "50 cent" haven't undone with their actions already?? as for "Nas" u should listen to some of his earlier work ,just beacuse he suddenly has this new found "knoldege of wealth" doesn't undo all the shit he has helped do over the years(the stupid feud with "Jay-z" , drug arrests etc.)
the consequences of a negative self image can lead to irrepressible damage not only to the individual but to the community as a whole. when rappers refer to themselves as "nigga" & "gangsta" and women as "bitches + hoes" it leads to a devaluing of the black person and only serves to reinforce many of the ignorant steretypes that "white" society already holds in thier minds. record labels like
:"death row" & "muder inc." just serve the same purpose, with names like those, it further creates the impression of black men as "criminals"

Watch this video...one of the best..to bad it came after his death.


You may have to scroll down a bit and give a sec to load.

http://www.myspace.com/in...0403174218
[Edited 4/3/05 17:49pm]

Xavier23 said:

Shoulda made some better choices to illustrate your point then. Cause using comapny names that no longer exist make your points weak,

damosbeautifulgrlndaworld said:

But the point is, not that they've changed those names, but that they had those names in the first place . The fact that they no longer exist isn't relevant, it 's the fact that they did actually exist at one point

jjhunsecker said:

Yes, but using the past to support an argument for a present situation is weak, and makes the argument weak. That is my point.

damosbeautifulgrlndaworld said:

Just the fact that both Murder, Inc. and Death Row are/were brought up on the charges that are pending is "insulting" to the black communities that SUPPORTED their so-called rises to fame. Makes no difference in what they were called before or after, the fact that "Murders" and "Rapes" and "Mayhem" in general were committed by the people of these organizations is revolting in itself. All the dollars(from all communities) that were spent on that so-called "art-form", then used for basically 21st century gangland corruption activity....just gives all the fuel for the redneck haters out their to say "I told you so". Then all the people who really work hard and pay their schoool dues, get lumped together with all that negative stereo-typing.

Nothing personal Damos.....dont be so quick to judge weak, when your defense, is merely support of a meaningless name change...of two urban terroristic organizations.

jjhunsecker said:

Yes, but using the past to support an argument for a present situation is weak, and makes the argument weak. That is my point.