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Thread started 05/15/03 2:39pm

themuse

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How did all the money from Purple Rain disappear down the Purple Drain?

A breakdown of Prince’s millions which is due to go out on BBC3 this Sunday at 8pm I think. If you don’t wanna know – don’t read!

When I first heard that the Beeb were going to make a ‘documentary’ about Prince I was excited. It had been over ten years since the Omnibus documentary about Prince was made. When I found out it was about his millions – I was intrigued. . When I found out it was going to air on BBC3, I was a bit miffed. Not BBC2?? (Alarm bells start ringing). I should say that I work at the BBC and obviously got hold of the tape prior transmission!

It starts off well. A montage of Prince’s early days – voice over about selling 60,000 albums world wide, live shows are legendary, lives to make music. First interview is with Bob Cavello, Prince’s ex manager. Same old thing said – Prince was fantastic, produced himself etc. Purple Rain and the earlier albums earned him a cool £40million. Charles Prince’s cousin, who was a drummer in his old band, takes the crew to house where Prince grew up and tells them stories of his childhood. They even go to Andre’s house where Prince ran away to and lived in the basement. Charles comes across a bit bitter as Prince got rid off him, because WB told him he needed more white people in the band than black to be successful.

Next stop – Paisley Park. It is as this point I realise that the BBC have just reused footage from the old Omnibus documentary!! They have new shots of PP outside but they obviously weren’t allowed in. Next person to be interviewed – DR FINK! Fink basically said all about the crazy hours rehearsing and how he couldn’t keep up with Prince physically. As Paisley Park didn’t having constant business bringing in revenue. Cash was going down the drain. Cavello had a meeting with Prince and made a graph showing spending was going up and up and revenue was going down – Prince turned off the projector and walked out!!! flip u

They then interview an ex PA who goes through a typical day with Prince. She had to look check on new printers, check licence for limousine, get a pool table with red felt for his dad, get the piano overhauled and painted, get a 1985 GMC, interview his house keeper, check on Mazarti rehearsal schedules, check office supplies at his house, get a new phone at the new security gate, check with Susannah about a washing machine . . . and it goes on. The funniest part is the wardrobe department had Prince voodoo dolls made for staff that left including the pins! They show photos of parties that Prince threw featuring some ghastly decorations. . :pop:This you have to see to believe – unbelievably tacky!! ill! Anyway, through all this money they knock off £6million (this includes ex protégé artists failed careers too like Jill Jones etc) Total so far £34million.

They also interview Alan Leeds, Vice President of PP and Howard Bloom, ex PR person. Howard says that he has been in bed with chronic fatigue syndrome since leaving Prince. Gayle Chapman takes us to the old house Prince lived in with the band. Apparently the whole house was filled with coins on the floor. He would just empty his pockets on the floor. She also talks about her rehearsal and how she was only hired because she was white, blonde, had blue eyes and played funky keyboards! (Those were Prince’s words).

Next, the films Purple Rain, UCM and GB. Nothing amazing to report here. Usual stuff about WB not wanting to make Purple Rain – it was a smash and the rest were flops. Altogether they give him £3million in profit – Total £37 million.

WB ex Jeff Gold complained Prince left him nothing to do! Prince would walk in saying here’s my new album, new single and the music video to go with it. He made a video production company go bust, as he didn’t pay them $600, 000 for six months. First production with this company was Gett Off. Budget was $200,000 and 5 days later it was $1million as he would hire the film crews and they would just wait for him – but he doesn’t want to shoot that video. $90,000 was spent on ‘7’ before it was even shot.

The live shows – Lovesexy was the most expensive. £1.5 million for set design alone. They speak to his UK publicist Chris Poole who said he was dating Diamond and Pearl. They interview Pearl who said she wasn’t having a relationship with Prince but they were encouraged to be vague. They talk about the ONA tour and how he is making more cash from that now, as his entourage is so small. He has made £37million from tours alone – Total £74million.

They also talk to the guy that custom builds Prince’s guitars. He has never met Prince in person. He has spent £600,000 on guitars (Not £13million as originally reported).

This is the most confusing part of the documentary. I don’t know if anyone knows about this but some woman called Sandra St Victor claims she wrote Soul Sanctuary. She sings her version – which sounds nothing like his version – then sings what the version we know on Emancipation. She says she was surprised when it turned up on Emancipation. But I can’t figure out if she is saying the first version is what she wrote or the second version. . Someone else can clarify that for me. But she called his lawyer and he sent her a card with a cheque for a very small amount!

Another big interview surprise – Alex Hahn!! He just rambles on the legal side of things. Prince has made £30million from his song writing – Total £103million. They also mention his property in Minni, Spain, Toronto, Paris and LA. They have a look at the LA mansion – but it obviously looks nothing like when Prince lived in there. They add another £20 million for properties – Total £123 million!

The feud with WB saga and the name change business is also mentioned. A financial journalist says Prince came close to bankruptcy in the mid nineties and WB gave him a final $10million and then he split from them. They then talk about his love life. They start with Mayte (they call her Mai Tai) and show what must be an old interview where Mayte is saying she loves Prince and the NPG. They also go to the church where they got married.

They also talk about law suites and how Prince tried to sue UPTOWN and lost. (No mention of the org!) They reckon legal battles have cost him £15 million, which brings his total down to £108 million.

The briefly mention Glam Slam and the NPG stores – knock off £1.5 million for failed business. Total now is £107 million.

Then cut to today. He is JW, married to 25 year old Manuella and DOW spending are over. He has released 7 albums in the last five years and is selling them via the internet. (SEVEN ALBUMS VIA THE INTERNET! WHERE??). Here is the bit the UK fans have been waiting for. . The Purple Rave Party!! Sorry guys, its only small shots and no interviews. Alex Hahn labels his hard-core group of fans at only a 100,000 people!! – Is that it? Surely that is wrong. They go on to say the attraction of having complete control over his music and the way he releases means more than the number of units he sells.

So the total is £107 million. But then they say that the failed protégé’s, studios and women have cost him so much they drop his value to £40 million based on his assets alone!! Which is stupid as I thought they were taking all that off his cash as the programme went on!!

They end it by saying if he sells as much as he did then he will be the richest as he gets a bigger cut now. But he must be the happiest artist as he has complete control over his work.

So I hope I haven’t bored anyone too much and is nice for our American friends to read, as they can’t see the programme yet. My personal feelings on the show are that it is a lot of what is in DMSR and the old Omnibus Documentary. They poke a lot of fun at Prince about his fashion, heels etc but there’s nothing there that we haven’t heard before.

Anyways I’m tired of typing so someone else say something now!!
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Reply #1 posted 05/15/03 2:45pm

VelvetSplash

This is the most confusing part of the documentary. I don’t know if anyone knows about this but some woman called Sandra St Victor claims she wrote Soul Sanctuary. She sings her version – which sounds nothing like his version – then sings what the version we know on Emancipation. She says she was surprised when it turned up on Emancipation. But I can’t figure out if she is saying the first version is what she wrote or the second version. . Someone else can clarify that for me. But she called his lawyer and he sent her a card with a cheque for a very small amount!

Sandra St. Victor formerly of The Family Stand - they co-wrote several songs together, but there was a mis-understanding - she thought they would collaborate in the studio, where as we all know Prince doesn't do that he sends tapes back and forth, so communication broke down.

He took the songs they wrote, and released them without crediting her.
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Reply #2 posted 05/15/03 2:54pm

deMatthijs

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The big majority of orgers will not be able to watch the documentary for
at least the coming period, so this is quite some good work!

woot!

But it is somewhat all outside assessments, then?
And I missed the part where he went from 100 million till 'bankruptcy
in the middle nineties'.
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Reply #3 posted 05/15/03 2:58pm

PhilG

Yeah thanks for typing this.Very interesting. hmmm
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Reply #4 posted 05/15/03 3:02pm

Supernova

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VelvetSplash said:

This is the most confusing part of the documentary. I don’t know if anyone knows about this but some woman called Sandra St Victor claims she wrote Soul Sanctuary. She sings her version – which sounds nothing like his version – then sings what the version we know on Emancipation. She says she was surprised when it turned up on Emancipation. But I can’t figure out if she is saying the first version is what she wrote or the second version. . Someone else can clarify that for me. But she called his lawyer and he sent her a card with a cheque for a very small amount!

Sandra St. Victor formerly of The Family Stand - they co-wrote several songs together, but there was a mis-understanding - she thought they would collaborate in the studio, where as we all know Prince doesn't do that he sends tapes back and forth, so communication broke down.

He took the songs they wrote, and released them without crediting her.

Then why is she credited as co-writer for the song in the album liners?
This post not for the wimp contingent. All whiny wusses avert your eyes.
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Reply #5 posted 05/15/03 3:04pm

Cloudbuster

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Supernova said:

VelvetSplash said:

This is the most confusing part of the documentary. I don’t know if anyone knows about this but some woman called Sandra St Victor claims she wrote Soul Sanctuary. She sings her version – which sounds nothing like his version – then sings what the version we know on Emancipation. She says she was surprised when it turned up on Emancipation. But I can’t figure out if she is saying the first version is what she wrote or the second version. . Someone else can clarify that for me. But she called his lawyer and he sent her a card with a cheque for a very small amount!

Sandra St. Victor formerly of The Family Stand - they co-wrote several songs together, but there was a mis-understanding - she thought they would collaborate in the studio, where as we all know Prince doesn't do that he sends tapes back and forth, so communication broke down.

He took the songs they wrote, and released them without crediting her.

Then why is she credited as co-writer for the song in the album liners?


I was about to ask that.
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Reply #6 posted 05/15/03 3:31pm

VelvetSplash

The co-wrote several tracks, not just Soul Sanctuary.

I'm going on what I've read, that she has said herself.

Some of you act like when Prince bends over you can see sunlight - Welcome 2 The Dawn.
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Reply #7 posted 05/15/03 3:41pm

Supernova

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VelvetSplash said:

The co-wrote several tracks, not just Soul Sanctuary.

I'm going on what I've read, that she has said herself.

Some of you act like when Prince bends over you can see sunlight - Welcome 2 The Dawn.

No, you're just overreacting about people who are trying to get a fact clarified, which isn't surprising. The quote in question was about the song "Soul Sanctuary", not any other songs.
This post not for the wimp contingent. All whiny wusses avert your eyes.
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Reply #8 posted 05/15/03 3:41pm

Handclapsfinga
snapz

PhilG said:

Yeah thanks for typing this.Very interesting. hmmm

verrry interesting, indeed...hmmm
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Reply #9 posted 05/15/03 3:43pm

langebleu

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moderator

On the 'Emancipation' set, Sandra St. Victor gets a namecheck for the lyrics to 'Soul Sanctuary'. It has been argued that the credit from Prince implies she only contributed minimally on this song, but that could equally be down to an unfair interpretation of the liner notes.

Certainly the story that St. Victor is reported to have given both in Liquid Assets TV programme and also in Alex Hahn's book suggests she was surprised at the turn of events that their 'collaboration' took.

As has previously been highlighted elsewhere, there appears to be no credit whatsoever in the liner notes given to Johnny Kemp for his contribution to this song, despite him officially being registered as a co-author at the Library of Congress.
.
.
[This message was edited Thu May 15 15:45:07 PDT 2003 by langebleu]
ALT+PLS+RTN: Pure as a pane of ice. It's a gift.
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Reply #10 posted 05/15/03 3:44pm

laurarichardso
n

VelvetSplash said:

The co-wrote several tracks, not just Soul Sanctuary.

I'm going on what I've read, that she has said herself.

Some of you act like when Prince bends over you can see sunlight - Welcome 2 The Dawn.

---
No we do not think that!!! She does get credit for one song and she could certainly sue him if she did not get credit for the rest of the songs. However, she did say she accepted a check from him and that puts a hole in her story.
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Reply #11 posted 05/15/03 3:46pm

langebleu

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laurarichardson said:

... and she could certainly sue him if she did not get credit for the rest of the songs. However, she did say she accepted a check from him and that puts a hole in her story.
Not really ... she has gone on record explaining why she decided not to pursue the issue further.
ALT+PLS+RTN: Pure as a pane of ice. It's a gift.
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Reply #12 posted 05/15/03 3:54pm

themuse

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I've just re read what I wrote and I guess I should apologise for all the spelling mistakes etc! I just really haven't got the energy to edit!

I also wondered about the £100 million - bankrupt. The programme has a very tabloid feel to it. Nothing like the pure class of Omnibus.
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Reply #13 posted 05/15/03 3:59pm

LaMont

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laurarichardson said:

VelvetSplash said:

The co-wrote several tracks, not just Soul Sanctuary.

I'm going on what I've read, that she has said herself.

Some of you act like when Prince bends over you can see sunlight - Welcome 2 The Dawn.

---
No we do not think that!!! She does get credit for one song and she could certainly sue him if she did not get credit for the rest of the songs. However, she did say she accepted a check from him and that puts a hole in her story.


Precisely..Prince is too big to steal songs and have it swept under the rug. Any attorney would take a case against a big money music legend like Prince if it was winable - its not, and that is why it doesnt happen.
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Reply #14 posted 05/15/03 4:28pm

langebleu

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LaMont said:

laurarichardson said:

VelvetSplash said:

The co-wrote several tracks, not just Soul Sanctuary.

I'm going on what I've read, that she has said herself.

Some of you act like when Prince bends over you can see sunlight - Welcome 2 The Dawn.

---
No we do not think that!!! She does get credit for one song and she could certainly sue him if she did not get credit for the rest of the songs. However, she did say she accepted a check from him and that puts a hole in her story.


Precisely..Prince is too big to steal songs and have it swept under the rug. Any attorney would take a case against a big money music legend like Prince if it was winable - its not, and that is why it doesnt happen.
Any attorney who is asked.

Firstly, Eric Leeds (amongst others) is also on record as disputing the sole authorship of a song claimed by Prince on 'Emancipation'. But some people choose not to take the legal route, irrespective of their attorney's eagerness.

Secondly, I don't know of any instance where anyone has claimed that Prince has actually stolen a song from someone else (there have been well-documented comments by Morris and Andre about some of the earlier work). In some instances, people have felt aggrieved because their contribution on a song or the recording of that song has not been credited in any way.

Some people have suggested that the constant jamming and rehearsals gave rise to riffs and chord sequences and melodies, which Prince would lay claim to in his subsequent writing. The right to assert a song writing credit in such instances is difficult to prove, and some have said that the stamp Prince placed on the subsequent recordings makes it difficult to claim much beyond an idea, inspiration, or a few bars.

Equally, it is difficult to understand why all of the writers on 'Soul Sanctuary' are not credited.
[This message was edited Thu May 15 16:31:27 PDT 2003 by langebleu]
ALT+PLS+RTN: Pure as a pane of ice. It's a gift.
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Reply #15 posted 05/16/03 4:33am

BoySimon

A thought: perhaps the $100m to zero(!) comes from the fact that Prince likes to have Paisley Park up and running 24-7 just in case the muse strikes him? The cost of running this studio for his whim must surely put a hole in someone's bank balance?

Also, when Emancipation came out, didn't EMI pay for the paintjob as he hadn't the money to do it himself?
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Reply #16 posted 05/16/03 4:56am

DavidEye

langebleu said:



As has previously been highlighted elsewhere, there appears to be no credit whatsoever in the liner notes given to Johnny Kemp for his contribution to this song, despite him officially being registered as a co-author at the Library of Congress.



Johhny Kemp?! Is he the same Johnny Kemp who sang that huge 1988 hit "Just Got Paid"? How did he get involved with co-writing "Soul Sanctuary"?
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Reply #17 posted 05/17/03 4:45pm

themuse

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BoySimon said:

A thought: perhaps the $100m to zero(!) comes from the fact that Prince likes to have Paisley Park up and running 24-7 just in case the muse strikes him? The cost of running this studio for his whim must surely put a hole in someone's bank balance?

Also, when Emancipation came out, didn't EMI pay for the paintjob as he hadn't the money to do it himself?


Yes, they did mention this fact in the prog. They say he lost/loses a lot of cash for simply having so many people waiting around for him.I mean gawd - £40 million . . I think you can afford to do that!
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Reply #18 posted 05/17/03 4:50pm

Marrk

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themuse said:

BoySimon said:

A thought: perhaps the $100m to zero(!) comes from the fact that Prince likes to have Paisley Park up and running 24-7 just in case the muse strikes him? The cost of running this studio for his whim must surely put a hole in someone's bank balance?

Also, when Emancipation came out, didn't EMI pay for the paintjob as he hadn't the money to do it himself?


Yes, they did mention this fact in the prog. They say he lost/loses a lot of cash for simply having so many people waiting around for him.I mean gawd - £40 million . . I think you can afford to do that!


Though £40 mil is not to be sniffed at, It doesn't strike me as a figure Prince should be happy with though.Sheena Easton has a similar amount, i remember reading awhile back.

It isn't a shock to me though.
Yeah, we'll, we'll try to imagine what silence looks like.
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Reply #19 posted 05/18/03 7:58am

calldapplwonde
ry83

I don't think that people not directly into Prince's financial situation can really estimate what he's got.
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Reply #20 posted 05/18/03 8:46am

NME

themuse said:

I've just re read what I wrote and I guess I should apologise for all the spelling mistakes etc! I just really haven't got the energy to edit!

I also wondered about the £100 million - bankrupt. The programme has a very tabloid feel to it. Nothing like the pure class of Omnibus.


It isn't meant to be an in depth programme about artistry. it's supposed to be a look at the grand lifestyles that rock stars live. i'm not flaming you, but as many Orgers won't know the programme i think you might be giving the wrong impression. For all those who haven't seem it it's far more like MTV Cribs. it's about wealth and what the artist does (good / bad) with it. it's supposed to be fun.
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Reply #21 posted 05/18/03 9:45am

themuse

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Fair comment NME but I didn't think I was doing that. All I said was it wasn't like Omnibus but more like a tabloid.
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Reply #22 posted 05/18/03 10:43am

themuse

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Just thought actually NME. The reason why I may come across like that is because the last I heard of the 'programme' was the what was said about the documentary here.


http://www.prince.org/msg...msg_390303

I'm not flaming you either but I was dissapointed that it wasn't om par with Millions and they should have told everyone that when they were filming! Liars!
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Reply #23 posted 05/18/03 12:02pm

NME

themuse said:

Just thought actually NME. The reason why I may come across like that is because the last I heard of the 'programme' was the what was said about the documentary here.


http://www.prince.org/msg...msg_390303

I'm not flaming you either but I was dissapointed that it wasn't om par with Millions and they should have told everyone that when they were filming! Liars!


i hadn't seen that. i see where you are coming from.

i suspect that BBC may be doing a proper documentary in the near future. I know that there are a few important people who have been recently interviewed and aren't included in the 'Prince's Millions' programme. It's not unlike the BBC to do this especially with all the new channels they've got to fill.
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Reply #24 posted 05/18/03 1:02pm

themuse

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I hope you're right NME. Actually does anyone remember the name of the person that came on here asking us to email her with reagrds to the programme they were making on Prince?
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Reply #25 posted 05/19/03 12:34am

freakyfeet

themuse said:

I hope you're right NME. Actually does anyone remember the name of the person that came on here asking us to email her with reagrds to the programme they were making on Prince?


The researcher for the program's name was Sophie Everest

She can be reached at sophie.everest@bbc.co.uk if anyone wants to make comments smile
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Reply #26 posted 05/19/03 2:00am

BartVanHemelen

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Supernova said:

He took the songs they wrote, and released them without crediting her.

Then why is she credited as co-writer for the song in the album liners?


SongSSS. He took several of her songs and altered them and released them without asking her anything, and often with incorrect credits. See also: Never B Another Fool by Chaka, for instance.
[This message was edited Mon May 19 2:08:53 PDT 2003 by BartVanHemelen]
© Bart Van Hemelen
This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights.
It is not authorized by Prince or the NPG Music Club. You assume all risk for
your use. All rights reserved.
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Reply #27 posted 05/19/03 2:05am

BartVanHemelen

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LaMont said:

Precisely..Prince is too big to steal songs and have it swept under the rug. Any attorney would take a case against a big money music legend like Prince if it was winable - its not, and that is why it doesnt happen.


Reader's advice: take anything said by Lamont aka Face as incorrect until proven correct. The above is a prime example. FACT: there was a lawsuit a while ago and in the end they settled simply because Prince had such deep pockets that he could drag the case on for years while the original songwriters were in debt. And thus they settled (i.e. Prince DID NOT WIN) for an amount that barely covered their court costs.
© Bart Van Hemelen
This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights.
It is not authorized by Prince or the NPG Music Club. You assume all risk for
your use. All rights reserved.
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Reply #28 posted 05/19/03 2:08am

BartVanHemelen

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DavidEye said:

Johhny Kemp?! Is he the same Johnny Kemp who sang that huge 1988 hit "Just Got Paid"? How did he get involved with co-writing "Soul Sanctuary"?


Gee, how would a songwriter get involved in writing a song?

AGAIN: these were songs Sandra wrote independently, occasionally together with other songwriters (or maybe she incorporated elements from other songs?) and then she presented them to Prince who then took off and decided to make them his own without consulting her.

Just ask Kate Bush what she thought about their "collaboration" for another example...
© Bart Van Hemelen
This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights.
It is not authorized by Prince or the NPG Music Club. You assume all risk for
your use. All rights reserved.
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Reply #29 posted 05/19/03 2:43am

CalhounSq

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Thanks for the breakdown, theMuse smile I wonder how accurate their figures could possibly be. He should have made much more (based on nothing more than my opinion, lol) for all the years he's been in the biz, especially $ from touring...
heart prince I never met you, but I LOVE you & I will forever!! Thank you for being YOU - my little Princey, the best to EVER do it prince heart
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