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Reply #120 posted 12/12/17 11:26am

MrMoops



3. "What If". Is it me or is the end of the strings/horns version a bit... off? It sounds like somebody took the multitrack from the strings/horns sessions, unmuted all the tracks, and added the released version on top of the strings/horns. The mix is a bit weird.

[Edited 12/11/17 11:04am]

-

I produced this session and collaborated on the orchestration and can probably shed some light on it.

You are correct that it is a mess.

problem 1 is that the strings and horns are not lined up correctly, making them out of sync with the original track.

problem 2 is that the whole song would need to be remixed to properly fit the 60 or so added tracks of the orchestra instead of just dropping it on top of the stereo mix of the original version.

It also bums me out that Rumeta got released the way it did.

The horns and string were written as an ensemble and not intended to be heard seperately.

It takes away from the intent of the orchestration.

I don't know how these things got released this way, but it certainly doesn't do any justice to the work we did on the tracks,

and I think it is disrespectful to music and the musicians that worked on them. But I guess since it's just in the small bootleg community, it is what it is.

-MBN

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Reply #121 posted 12/12/17 12:24pm

ufoclub

avatar

"Sticky Wicked"! That is some great shit. So is this quality of "High Fashion". True jams.

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Reply #122 posted 12/12/17 12:25pm

paulludvig

MrMoops said:



3. "What If". Is it me or is the end of the strings/horns version a bit... off? It sounds like somebody took the multitrack from the strings/horns sessions, unmuted all the tracks, and added the released version on top of the strings/horns. The mix is a bit weird.

[Edited 12/11/17 11:04am]

-

I produced this session and collaborated on the orchestration and can probably shed some light on it.

You are correct that it is a mess.

problem 1 is that the strings and horns are not lined up correctly, making them out of sync with the original track.

problem 2 is that the whole song would need to be remixed to properly fit the 60 or so added tracks of the orchestra instead of just dropping it on top of the stereo mix of the original version.

It also bums me out that Rumeta got released the way it did.

The horns and string were written as an ensemble and not intended to be heard seperately.

It takes away from the intent of the orchestration.

I don't know how these things got released this way, but it certainly doesn't do any justice to the work we did on the tracks,

and I think it is disrespectful to music and the musicians that worked on them. But I guess since it's just in the small bootleg community, it is what it is.

-MBN

Thanks for the info! Did you work on Pangea as well?

The wooh is on the one!
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Reply #123 posted 12/12/17 1:03pm

djThunderfunk

avatar

MrMoops said:



3. "What If". Is it me or is the end of the strings/horns version a bit... off? It sounds like somebody took the multitrack from the strings/horns sessions, unmuted all the tracks, and added the released version on top of the strings/horns. The mix is a bit weird.

[Edited 12/11/17 11:04am]

-

I produced this session and collaborated on the orchestration and can probably shed some light on it.

You are correct that it is a mess.

problem 1 is that the strings and horns are not lined up correctly, making them out of sync with the original track.

problem 2 is that the whole song would need to be remixed to properly fit the 60 or so added tracks of the orchestra instead of just dropping it on top of the stereo mix of the original version.

It also bums me out that Rumeta got released the way it did.

The horns and string were written as an ensemble and not intended to be heard seperately.

It takes away from the intent of the orchestration.

I don't know how these things got released this way, but it certainly doesn't do any justice to the work we did on the tracks,

and I think it is disrespectful to music and the musicians that worked on them. But I guess since it's just in the small bootleg community, it is what it is.

-MBN


Thank you SO much for sharing! Very cool of you. cool

"I've made up my mind. Don't try to confuse me with the facts." - Harry J. Anslinger
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Reply #124 posted 12/12/17 2:07pm

blizzybiz

MrMoops said:



3. "What If". Is it me or is the end of the strings/horns version a bit... off? It sounds like somebody took the multitrack from the strings/horns sessions, unmuted all the tracks, and added the released version on top of the strings/horns. The mix is a bit weird.

[Edited 12/11/17 11:04am]

-

I produced this session and collaborated on the orchestration and can probably shed some light on it.

You are correct that it is a mess.

problem 1 is that the strings and horns are not lined up correctly, making them out of sync with the original track.

problem 2 is that the whole song would need to be remixed to properly fit the 60 or so added tracks of the orchestra instead of just dropping it on top of the stereo mix of the original version.

It also bums me out that Rumeta got released the way it did.

The horns and string were written as an ensemble and not intended to be heard seperately.

It takes away from the intent of the orchestration.

I don't know how these things got released this way, but it certainly doesn't do any justice to the work we did on the tracks,

and I think it is disrespectful to music and the musicians that worked on them. But I guess since it's just in the small bootleg community, it is what it is.

-MBN

Holy shit, I thought it was just me, or that I had something playing in a browser or something as I listened to it. But I remember listening to it and finally realizing that the strings/horns were out of sync

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Reply #125 posted 12/12/17 3:48pm

Mintchip

avatar

Thanks Moops. It's rad when you chime in.

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Reply #126 posted 12/12/17 8:50pm

MrMoops

paulludvig said:

MrMoops said:

-

I produced this session and collaborated on the orchestration and can probably shed some light on it.

You are correct that it is a mess.

problem 1 is that the strings and horns are not lined up correctly, making them out of sync with the original track.

problem 2 is that the whole song would need to be remixed to properly fit the 60 or so added tracks of the orchestra instead of just dropping it on top of the stereo mix of the original version.

It also bums me out that Rumeta got released the way it did.

The horns and string were written as an ensemble and not intended to be heard seperately.

It takes away from the intent of the orchestration.

I don't know how these things got released this way, but it certainly doesn't do any justice to the work we did on the tracks,

and I think it is disrespectful to music and the musicians that worked on them. But I guess since it's just in the small bootleg community, it is what it is.

-MBN

Thanks for the info! Did you work on Pangea as well?

-

yes, same deal on Pangaea. I produced the session, arranged the horns and woodwinds and collaborated on the string arrangement.

P really flipped over that one. (did Frida Kahlo also)

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Reply #127 posted 12/12/17 10:11pm

BlueShakooo

MrMoops said:





3. "What If". Is it me or is the end of the strings/horns version a bit... off? It sounds like somebody took the multitrack from the strings/horns sessions, unmuted all the tracks, and added the released version on top of the strings/horns. The mix is a bit weird.


[Edited 12/11/17 11:04am]




-


I produced this session and collaborated on the orchestration and can probably shed some light on it.



You are correct that it is a mess.


problem 1 is that the strings and horns are not lined up correctly, making them out of sync with the original track.


!

problem 2 is that the whole song would need to be remixed to properly fit the 60 or so added tracks of the orchestra instead of just dropping it on top of the stereo mix of the original version.



It also bums me out that Rumeta got released the way it did.


The horns and string were written as an ensemble and not intended to be heard seperately.


It takes away from the intent of the orchestration.



I don't know how these things got released this way, but it certainly doesn't do any justice to the work we did on the tracks,


and I think it is disrespectful to music and the musicians that worked on them. But I guess since it's just in the small bootleg community, it is what it is.



-MBN



VERY INTERESTING!!!
THANK YOU!!!
[Edited 12/12/17 22:13pm]
"Don't get too serious, it's just a dream."
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Reply #128 posted 12/13/17 2:11am

Daveoooo

So, back to the music....

Some thoughts/comments as I'm listening to this collection (on random), while I'm working;
*Sister demos are cool, solo guitar funky complicated strumming - reminds me in a way (in a confusing past/future tense) of Girl Thing.
*Million $ Show, to me rather than an "alternative mix" it sounds more the original pre over dub version with synth string and horn parts that were later overdubbed.
*Positivity with Cats rep is cool, I'm sure I heard different guitar licks, or is it due to not being mastered in the same way? also Prince Vault does not list the other demos, so what are these?
*My Name Is Prince and Sexy MF Remixes are pointless additions.

*Purple Rain, extra verse at approx 2-3 min mark, doesn't work in my opinion.

*Pangaea, nice to have but nothing to get excited about it's the non Prince instrumental part of a track.

*It Ain't Ovder Till The Fat Lady Sings is a cool instrumental.

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Reply #129 posted 12/13/17 2:31am

OperatingTheta
n

avatar

MrMoops said:





3. "What If". Is it me or is the end of the strings/horns version a bit... off? It sounds like somebody took the multitrack from the strings/horns sessions, unmuted all the tracks, and added the released version on top of the strings/horns. The mix is a bit weird.


[Edited 12/11/17 11:04am]




-


I produced this session and collaborated on the orchestration and can probably shed some light on it.



You are correct that it is a mess.


problem 1 is that the strings and horns are not lined up correctly, making them out of sync with the original track.


problem 2 is that the whole song would need to be remixed to properly fit the 60 or so added tracks of the orchestra instead of just dropping it on top of the stereo mix of the original version.



It also bums me out that Rumeta got released the way it did.


The horns and string were written as an ensemble and not intended to be heard seperately.


It takes away from the intent of the orchestration.



I don't know how these things got released this way, but it certainly doesn't do any justice to the work we did on the tracks,


and I think it is disrespectful to music and the musicians that worked on them. But I guess since it's just in the small bootleg community, it is what it is.



-MBN



Hopefully these will one day be released and heard as you and Prince intended them.
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Reply #130 posted 12/13/17 2:33am

olb99

avatar

MrMoops said:



3. "What If". Is it me or is the end of the strings/horns version a bit... off? It sounds like somebody took the multitrack from the strings/horns sessions, unmuted all the tracks, and added the released version on top of the strings/horns. The mix is a bit weird.

[Edited 12/11/17 11:04am]

-

I produced this session and collaborated on the orchestration and can probably shed some light on it.

You are correct that it is a mess.

problem 1 is that the strings and horns are not lined up correctly, making them out of sync with the original track.

problem 2 is that the whole song would need to be remixed to properly fit the 60 or so added tracks of the orchestra instead of just dropping it on top of the stereo mix of the original version.

It also bums me out that Rumeta got released the way it did.

The horns and string were written as an ensemble and not intended to be heard seperately.

It takes away from the intent of the orchestration.

I don't know how these things got released this way, but it certainly doesn't do any justice to the work we did on the tracks,

and I think it is disrespectful to music and the musicians that worked on them. But I guess since it's just in the small bootleg community, it is what it is.

-MBN

.

Thanks for the information, Mike! I'm glad to read that I'm not crazy. I hope that we'll someday get to hear those sessions as they were meant to be heard. I understand your frustration.

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Reply #131 posted 12/13/17 3:46am

dance4me3121

MrMoops said:



paulludvig said:




MrMoops said:



-


I produced this session and collaborated on the orchestration and can probably shed some light on it.



You are correct that it is a mess.


problem 1 is that the strings and horns are not lined up correctly, making them out of sync with the original track.


problem 2 is that the whole song would need to be remixed to properly fit the 60 or so added tracks of the orchestra instead of just dropping it on top of the stereo mix of the original version.



It also bums me out that Rumeta got released the way it did.


The horns and string were written as an ensemble and not intended to be heard seperately.


It takes away from the intent of the orchestration.



I don't know how these things got released this way, but it certainly doesn't do any justice to the work we did on the tracks,


and I think it is disrespectful to music and the musicians that worked on them. But I guess since it's just in the small bootleg community, it is what it is.



-MBN



Thanks for the info! Did you work on Pangea as well?



-


yes, same deal on Pangaea. I produced the session, arranged the horns and woodwinds and collaborated on the string arrangement.


P really flipped over that one. (did Frida Kahlo also)


I like the instrumental version a lot.Did Prince record his vocals for the song?
[Edited 12/13/17 4:51am]
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Reply #132 posted 12/13/17 8:57am

scififilmnerd

avatar

dave1dmarx said:

It would seem that there's vinyl noise on the "Sex Mix" (probably should read "Sax Mix") of Damn U. Anyone out there know why? Was this taken from an acetate or something?

It was previously bootlegged as Damn U (Sax Mix by Eric Leeds). It's from a test pressing made 27 January 1993. smile

rainbow woot! FREE THE 29 MAY 1993 COME CONFIGURATION! woot! rainbow
rainbow woot! FREE THE 1994 CHAOS AND DISORDER CONFIGURATION woot! rainbow
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Reply #133 posted 12/13/17 10:34am

tmcjb

MrMoops said:

paulludvig said:

Thanks for the info! Did you work on Pangea as well?

-

yes, same deal on Pangaea. I produced the session, arranged the horns and woodwinds and collaborated on the string arrangement.

P really flipped over that one. (did Frida Kahlo also)

They are all gorgeous, especially Frida Kahlo. Thank you so much for the excellent work, I hope we hear them soon enough.

"Like the drummer said, you got to die."
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Reply #134 posted 12/13/17 11:43am

paulludvig

MrMoops said:

paulludvig said:

Thanks for the info! Did you work on Pangea as well?

-

yes, same deal on Pangaea. I produced the session, arranged the horns and woodwinds and collaborated on the string arrangement.

P really flipped over that one. (did Frida Kahlo also)

Odd question perhaps, but did Prince choose the titles for these pieces?

The wooh is on the one!
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Reply #135 posted 12/13/17 3:17pm

Dandroppedadim
e

Re: Million $ Show - interesting how a subtle difference in the mix can change a song quite a bit. I prefer the longer ending (hate those clipped endings that go into the next song). On a different note I always thought "Welcome to the 'show' the million $ show" would of been better than "mill" ?????
also what's that about "turn the music up so that this here vain" makes no sense! anyone know the real lyric? peace.

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Reply #136 posted 12/13/17 4:36pm

dave1dmarx

scififilmnerd said:

dave1dmarx said:

It would seem that there's vinyl noise on the "Sex Mix" (probably should read "Sax Mix") of Damn U. Anyone out there know why? Was this taken from an acetate or something?

It was previously bootlegged as Damn U (Sax Mix by Eric Leeds). It's from a test pressing made 27 January 1993. smile

Ah... Well, that explains the vinyl noise. Thanks for clearing that up!! biggrin

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Reply #137 posted 12/14/17 3:10am

TheEnglishGent

avatar

Dandroppedadime said:

Re: Million $ Show - interesting how a subtle difference in the mix can change a song quite a bit. I prefer the longer ending (hate those clipped endings that go into the next song). On a different note I always thought "Welcome to the 'show' the million $ show" would of been better than "mill" ?????
also what's that about "turn the music up so that this here vain" makes no sense! anyone know the real lyric? peace.

The start of that verse he says, "Only the haters ever complain", then that later line is, "Turn the music up so they diss in vain".

RIP sad
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Reply #138 posted 12/14/17 9:25am

gandorb

TheEnglishGent said:



Dandroppedadime said:


Re: Million $ Show - interesting how a subtle difference in the mix can change a song quite a bit. I prefer the longer ending (hate those clipped endings that go into the next song). On a different note I always thought "Welcome to the 'show' the million $ show" would of been better than "mill" ?????
also what's that about "turn the music up so that this here vain" makes no sense! anyone know the real lyric? peace.



The start of that verse he says, "Only the haters ever complain", then that later line is, "Turn the music up so they diss in vain".



Talkin about the org cool
[Edited 12/14/17 12:02pm]
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Reply #139 posted 12/14/17 11:11am

jjam

Gotta say that nothing can make Million $ Show anything more than a shitfest. That intro from all those classic tracks...and it goes limp.

I'm probably in the minority but I'd love for a version of Way Back Home without the voiceover on the intro to surface some day. Maybe that'll be on Blast From The Past 34.0...

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Reply #140 posted 12/14/17 11:22am

MrMoops

dance4me3121 said:

MrMoops said:

-

yes, same deal on Pangaea. I produced the session, arranged the horns and woodwinds and collaborated on the string arrangement.

P really flipped over that one. (did Frida Kahlo also)

I like the instrumental version a lot.Did Prince record his vocals for the song? [Edited 12/13/17 4:51am]

-

Pangaea was written and sung by Eryn Allen Kayne.

The section at the end is orchestrated along with Prince's guitar.

Frida Kahlo was a female vocalist, I don't know any more about it than that.

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Reply #141 posted 12/14/17 11:23am

MrMoops

paulludvig said:

MrMoops said:

-

yes, same deal on Pangaea. I produced the session, arranged the horns and woodwinds and collaborated on the string arrangement.

P really flipped over that one. (did Frida Kahlo also)

Odd question perhaps, but did Prince choose the titles for these pieces?

Pangaea is Eryn Allen Kane's song.

I don't know about the others

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Reply #142 posted 12/14/17 11:49am

MrMoops

Daveoooo said:

So, back to the music....

Some thoughts/comments as I'm listening to this collection (on random), while I'm working;
*Sister demos are cool, solo guitar funky complicated strumming - reminds me in a way (in a confusing past/future tense) of Girl Thing.
*Million $ Show, to me rather than an "alternative mix" it sounds more the original pre over dub version with synth string and horn parts that were later overdubbed.
*Positivity with Cats rep is cool, I'm sure I heard different guitar licks, or is it due to not being mastered in the same way? also Prince Vault does not list the other demos, so what are these?
*My Name Is Prince and Sexy MF Remixes are pointless additions.

*Purple Rain, extra verse at approx 2-3 min mark, doesn't work in my opinion.

*Pangaea, nice to have but nothing to get excited about it's the non Prince instrumental part of a track.

*It Ain't Ovder Till The Fat Lady Sings is a cool instrumental.

-

That's not quite accurate. The section at the end is orchestrated along with, and based on Prince's guitar solo.

So, much of the melodic content of the orchestra in that section are Prince's ideas.

If you were to hear it in context, it still might not change your opinion,

but I will say that after I sent P the finished tracks,

I got one of the strongest positive responses from him that I'd ever received in our 25 year association.

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Reply #143 posted 12/14/17 1:08pm

love2thenines2
003

MrMoops said:

but I will say that after I sent P the finished tracks,

I got one of the strongest positive responses from him that I'd ever received in our 25 year association.




I suppose that u worked on several Prince unreleased projects during all these years.....can u share some info and memorable moments about that? thanks in advance

biggrin
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Reply #144 posted 12/14/17 1:41pm

NorthC

MrMoops said:



dance4me3121 said:


MrMoops said:


-


yes, same deal on Pangaea. I produced the session, arranged the horns and woodwinds and collaborated on the string arrangement.


P really flipped over that one. (did Frida Kahlo also)



I like the instrumental version a lot.Did Prince record his vocals for the song? [Edited 12/13/17 4:51am]

-


Pangaea was written and sung by Eryn Allen Kayne.


The section at the end is orchestrated along with Prince's guitar.


Frida Kahlo was a female vocalist, I don't know any more about it than that.


I always wondered why Prince would want to write a song about the Mexican painter who was Diego Rivera's wife. And then all of a sudden, it's about a singer who just happens to have (or use) the same name? Or did I misunderstand it and it was a vocalist who sang about Frida Kahlo?
But then again, I don't expect you to know what went on in Prince's head when he wrote something. Just like those songs about Dorothy Parker and Van Gogh that really weren't about Dorothy Parker and Van Gogh at all...
[Edited 12/14/17 13:44pm]
Never try to discourage thinking, for you are sure to succeed.
Bertrand Russell
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Reply #145 posted 12/14/17 1:55pm

Silvertongue7

NorthC said:

MrMoops said:



dance4me3121 said:


MrMoops said:


-


yes, same deal on Pangaea. I produced the session, arranged the horns and woodwinds and collaborated on the string arrangement.


P really flipped over that one. (did Frida Kahlo also)



I like the instrumental version a lot.Did Prince record his vocals for the song? [Edited 12/13/17 4:51am]

-


Pangaea was written and sung by Eryn Allen Kayne.


The section at the end is orchestrated along with Prince's guitar.


Frida Kahlo was a female vocalist, I don't know any more about it than that.


I always wondered why Prince would want to write a song about the Mexican painter who was Diego Rivera's wife. And then all of a sudden, it's about a singer who just happens to have (or use) the same name? Or did I misunderstand it and it was a vocalist who sang about Frida Kahlo?
But then again, I don't expect you to know what went on in Prince's head when he wrote something. Just like those songs about Dorothy Parker and Van Gogh that really weren't about Dorothy Parker and Van Gogh at all...
[Edited 12/14/17 13:44pm]

I think he means it was sung by a female vocalist (Rita Ora, if I’m not mistaken). Prince did write on Twitter that the song was about her ‘strange relationship’ she had with Diego Rivera.
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Reply #146 posted 12/14/17 5:47pm

MrMoops

Silvertongue7 said:

NorthC said:
I always wondered why Prince would want to write a song about the Mexican painter who was Diego Rivera's wife. And then all of a sudden, it's about a singer who just happens to have (or use) the same name? Or did I misunderstand it and it was a vocalist who sang about Frida Kahlo? But then again, I don't expect you to know what went on in Prince's head when he wrote something. Just like those songs about Dorothy Parker and Van Gogh that really weren't about Dorothy Parker and Van Gogh at all... [Edited 12/14/17 13:44pm]
I think he means it was sung by a female vocalist (Rita Ora, if I’m not mistaken). Prince did write on Twitter that the song was about her ‘strange relationship’ she had with Diego Rivera.

-

correct. The question was if Prince sang these.

I thought it was Rita singing the Frida Kahlo track, but I had no actually information confirming that.

I think the lyrics are about a woman comparing her obsession with a guy to Frida and Diego's relationship. the hook is

Just like Diego and Frida Kahlo, Kahlo

Wherever you go, I follow, follow

Everyone spits, I swallow, swallow

Baby you've got me like, follow, follow

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Reply #147 posted 12/14/17 6:53pm

OperatingTheta
n

avatar

MrMoops said:



Silvertongue7 said:


NorthC said:
I always wondered why Prince would want to write a song about the Mexican painter who was Diego Rivera's wife. And then all of a sudden, it's about a singer who just happens to have (or use) the same name? Or did I misunderstand it and it was a vocalist who sang about Frida Kahlo? But then again, I don't expect you to know what went on in Prince's head when he wrote something. Just like those songs about Dorothy Parker and Van Gogh that really weren't about Dorothy Parker and Van Gogh at all... [Edited 12/14/17 13:44pm]

I think he means it was sung by a female vocalist (Rita Ora, if I’m not mistaken). Prince did write on Twitter that the song was about her ‘strange relationship’ she had with Diego Rivera.

-


correct. The question was if Prince sang these.


I thought it was Rita singing the Frida Kahlo track, but I had no actually information confirming that.


I think the lyrics are about a woman comparing her obsession with a guy to Frida and Diego's relationship. the hook is


Just like Diego and Frida Kahlo, Kahlo


Wherever you go, I follow, follow


Everyone spits, I swallow, swallow


Baby you've got me like, follow, follow




Fascinating! Thanks for sharing. So Prince was envisioning the new MPLS sound album as a mixed vocal project? Very interesting.
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Reply #148 posted 12/14/17 8:32pm

MrMoops

OperatingThetan said:

MrMoops said:

-

correct. The question was if Prince sang these.

I thought it was Rita singing the Frida Kahlo track, but I had no actually information confirming that.

I think the lyrics are about a woman comparing her obsession with a guy to Frida and Diego's relationship. the hook is

Just like Diego and Frida Kahlo, Kahlo

Wherever you go, I follow, follow

Everyone spits, I swallow, swallow

Baby you've got me like, follow, follow

Fascinating! Thanks for sharing. So Prince was envisioning the new MPLS sound album as a mixed vocal project? Very interesting.

-

I wouldn't necessarily say that. He always had his hand in a bunch of stuff.

non-stop creativity.

I think maybe the new MPLS sound was more likely about the real music, real musicians thing,

but who knows.

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Reply #149 posted 12/15/17 9:02am

Farfunknugin

avatar

Is there anything on here worth downloading that is different form the Closer 2 God batch?

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