Militant said:

I might sound like an elitist here, but when people say "maybe there isn't a vault" or "maybe we've already heard most of it", it's pretty obvious that they know very little about Prince's recording history.

Yes, there is a vault, and yes, there are (at the very least) hundreds of songs in there that haven't even been leaked in ANY form. The evidence is there from studio tracking sheets. A lot of this information can be found in both "DMSR" and "The Vault" - and of course, Prince being Prince, there are plenty more songs that he has recorded at Paisley Park, on his own, without even an engineer being present, that there is simply no documentation of. If you start including alternate versions, remixes, edits with different arrangements, tracks that have been re-done various times over the years, the numbers jump up even higher.

As Nouveau says, it just simply isn't a priority. Why would it be - Prince is still recording as much as he always has. Between new studio releases, which are more or less as regular as they've always been, and non-stop touring - there's very little time for him to focus on "looking back" at what's in the vault or making any concrete plans to do anything with any of it's contents.

I'm sorry, but unless you were there, it's still largely conjecture. Most know there's a vault. And sure, a lot has been released on bootleg. Sure, there may be alternate takes of many songs. However, you cannot base the current state of Prince's vault on anything other than guessing & old information. When he claimed on Oprah years ago that he hoped to write a song a day until he died, many people here took that as gospel - that he actually did write a song a day. Nice to believe, but in reality, very questionable.

And you have no inside information indicating that Prince is still recording as much as he always has. And he most certainly isn't releasing albums at the rate that he used to. When it becomes as difficult as it was to get his last release in his home country (20Ten remains unreleased in the USA) that's not a good sign, no matter how purple colored your glasses are.

I'm not questioning that he was once prolific. Just stating that the well may have run dry and we have no real way of knowing. And what we've also seen in many cases suggests that what's in the vault is not being taken care of. That does not bode well for future releases worth hearing.

It's been said repeatedly that Prince is "always recording." Obviously, not 24/7, but doesn't take very long breaks.

It's also been confirmed, in a forum thread here with an engineer at Paisley Park, that Prince will frequently pull tracks from earlier works and sample himself.

I'm not saying that's why the Vault stays closed, but he did keep "Rave Un2 the Joy Fantastic" locked up for about 12 years because it sounded too much like "Kiss."

It's a shrewd move, and makes great business sense. If he really opened up the Vault, it would be like Coke giving out the real formula for their pop. Up until now, everybody has just tried to imitate the flavor, but never coming close. If it was really out there, the brand would be completely diluted.

Dauphin said:

Up until now, everybody has just tried to imitate the flavor, but never coming close. If it was really out there, the brand would be completely diluted.

But when does the 'brand' become more important than the flavour of the pop itself? I'm reminded of the 'New Coke' fiasco of 1985... the soft-drink equivalent of 'All the Midnights in the World'?

LittlePurpleYoda said:

Militant said:

I might sound like an elitist here, but when people say "maybe there isn't a vault" or "maybe we've already heard most of it", it's pretty obvious that they know very little about Prince's recording history.

Yes, there is a vault, and yes, there are (at the very least) hundreds of songs in there that haven't even been leaked in ANY form. The evidence is there from studio tracking sheets. A lot of this information can be found in both "DMSR" and "The Vault" - and of course, Prince being Prince, there are plenty more songs that he has recorded at Paisley Park, on his own, without even an engineer being present, that there is simply no documentation of. If you start including alternate versions, remixes, edits with different arrangements, tracks that have been re-done various times over the years, the numbers jump up even higher.

As Nouveau says, it just simply isn't a priority. Why would it be - Prince is still recording as much as he always has. Between new studio releases, which are more or less as regular as they've always been, and non-stop touring - there's very little time for him to focus on "looking back" at what's in the vault or making any concrete plans to do anything with any of it's contents.

I'm sorry, but unless you were there, it's still largely conjecture. Most know there's a vault. And sure, a lot has been released on bootleg. Sure, there may be alternate takes of many songs. However, you cannot base the current state of Prince's vault on anything other than guessing & old information. When he claimed on Oprah years ago that he hoped to write a song a day until he died, many people here took that as gospel - that he actually did write a song a day. Nice to believe, but in reality, very questionable.

And you have no inside information indicating that Prince is still recording as much as he always has. And he most certainly isn't releasing albums at the rate that he used to. When it becomes as difficult as it was to get his last release in his home country (20Ten remains unreleased in the USA) that's not a good sign, no matter how purple colored your glasses are.

I'm not questioning that he was once prolific. Just stating that the well may have run dry and we have no real way of knowing. And what we've also seen in many cases suggests that what's in the vault is not being taken care of. That does not bode well for future releases worth hearing.

Did you not read the original post?

Here's the important bit you seem to have missed.

Yes, there is a vault, and yes, there are (at the very least) hundreds of songs in there that haven't even been leaked in ANY form. The evidence is there from studio tracking sheets. A lot of this information can be found in both "DMSR" and "The Vault"

Now go and read either of those books.

Any number of us here could sit here and list names of songs that are both unreleased AND unheard - songs that are known to exist, and in many cases, known exactly when they were recorded.

As for the whole - "unless you were there" thing, well, of course I wasn't. But many people who WERE have also spoken about it. At length. Publically and in private. To lots of people. Including me. I talked to both Fink and Clare and Brent Fischer for over 90 minutes each when I interviewed them for my Parade documentary earlier this year. And I did ask about the vault for my own personal interest. Clare and Brent in particular told me that there is a great deal of material Prince sent them to record string and orchesteral arrangements on that hasn't been released or even bootlegged.

The "well" has certainly not run dry and we certainly do have ways of knowing as much.

HELL - 2Pac's well hasn't even run dry and we've had at least 10 discs of material from his vault, SINCE his death. And his professional career lasted a mere 5 years - 1991-1996. And he was an artist that required collaboration with a producer - ie, he didn't have the ability to wake up in the middle of the night and go record a song by himself. I work with the Shakur family and there's at least another 5 albums of unheard 'Pac material. And there's no way he was as prolific as Prince, and he died at the age of 25.

alphachannel said:

A Theory on Why Prince Won't Open "The Vault

Maybe he has 4got the number 2 the vault?

SPOOKYGAS said:

alphachannel said:

A Theory on Why Prince Won't Open "The Vault

Maybe he has 4got the number 2 the vault?

it's 777

don't tell anyone though

Militant said:

LittlePurpleYoda said:

Did you not read the original post?

Here's the important bit you seem to have missed.

Yes, there is a vault, and yes, there are (at the very least) hundreds of songs in there that haven't even been leaked in ANY form. The evidence is there from studio tracking sheets. A lot of this information can be found in both "DMSR" and "The Vault"

Now go and read either of those books.

Any number of us here could sit here and list names of songs that are both unreleased AND unheard - songs that are known to exist, and in many cases, known exactly when they were recorded.

As for the whole - "unless you were there" thing, well, of course I wasn't. But many people who WERE have also spoken about it. At length. Publically and in private. To lots of people. Including me. I talked to both Fink and Clare and Brent Fischer for over 90 minutes each when I interviewed them for my Parade documentary earlier this year. And I did ask about the vault for my own personal interest. Clare and Brent in particular told me that there is a great deal of material Prince sent them to record string and orchesteral arrangements on that hasn't been released or even bootlegged.

The "well" has certainly not run dry and we certainly do have ways of knowing as much.

HELL - 2Pac's well hasn't even run dry and we've had at least 10 discs of material from his vault, SINCE his death. And his professional career lasted a mere 5 years - 1991-1996. And he was an artist that required collaboration with a producer - ie, he didn't have the ability to wake up in the middle of the night and go record a song by himself. I work with the Shakur family and there's at least another 5 albums of unheard 'Pac material. And there's no way he was as prolific as Prince, and he died at the age of 25.

Militant is correct, there is no ambiguity regarding the existence of a vault and the astonishing quantity of unheard material that's inside it.