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Thread started 08/29/11 7:49am

cam32

Building Prince symbol guitar update

http://princesymbolguitar...eated.html

Constant updates of the Symbol guitar build X3 !

[Edited 9/2/11 9:33am]

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Reply #1 posted 08/29/11 7:54am

purplethunder3
121

avatar

Keep up the good work! Looking forward to following your progress. biggrin

Hyperactive when I was small
Hyperactive now I'm grown
Hyperactive 'till I'm dead and gone...
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Reply #2 posted 08/29/11 1:56pm

purplemonster0
4

Whoa! Great work!

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Reply #3 posted 08/29/11 4:29pm

mwu

I do not think there is an angle on the headstock like gibson style?

Also, the upper horn size seems a little smaller than the original, are you stricly following original specs or is it some free interpretation ?

Otherwise great work ! Looking forward the next update wink

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Reply #4 posted 08/30/11 5:29am

cam32

mwu said:

I do not think there is an angle on the headstock like gibson style?

Also, the upper horn size seems a little smaller than the original, are you stricly following original specs or is it some free interpretation ?

Otherwise great work ! Looking forward the next update wink

Cheers for looking.

I wanted to angle the headstock for strenght and playability. Fender usually have a no angle and Gibson usually do(but no scarf joint its out of solid wood). Both companies headstocks can snap (i have seen it many times in my work experience in Demark street London).

When doing repair work i was taught that once repaired the glue joint is stronger than the grain.

With it being such an unusual shaped guitar it is more likely to get knocked. (reasons why i biscuit jointed the lower bout). i also heard prince would sometimes at the end of the gig throw the symbol guitar up in the air and let it drop and it would break into many pieces.

When the guitar is finished the thickness of the headstock will be alot thinner than in the pics now so i dont think the angle will notice as much but will be alot stronger.

As for the upper bout i agree with you. I took a head on picture of the symbol guitar and enlarged it to actual size. The picture i used had a cloud guitar and hohner the prinz next to it. i know someone with both these guitars and enlarged it so the picture matched both guitars. It is possible that as the copy got bigger that part of detail was lost in pixelation.

I am looking to get as accurate as possible or else whats the point? i will change the upper bout as i think mine runs straight where it should slope upwards. Ill biscuit joint some wood onto the bout and alter it.

Thanks for your comments. I want to get it as spot on as possible ( whilst being strong enough to last the test of time ) and need Prince fans with an eagle eye like yours to get it accurate.

Cheers

Cam

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Reply #5 posted 08/30/11 6:51pm

mwu

Ur welcome, I m always glad to talk about Prince guitar and looking forward the completon of your work !

As for the headstock, I agree with you. Techniclay there is no angled headstock on the original symbol, but you can have one for the reasons you mentioned.

I remember correctly, the first model of cloud had angle headstock, then the later made copy had straight one.

I will be curious to have a look at your model picture. Was it an original cloud ? or a copy ?

I have a couple of prince guitar pictures that might be better candidate to build a template.

Stay tuned !

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Reply #6 posted 08/31/11 11:23am

cam32

mwu said:

Ur welcome, I m always glad to talk about Prince guitar and looking forward the completon of your work !

As for the headstock, I agree with you. Techniclay there is no angled headstock on the original symbol, but you can have one for the reasons you mentioned.

I remember correctly, the first model of cloud had angle headstock, then the later made copy had straight one.

I will be curious to have a look at your model picture. Was it an original cloud ? or a copy ?

I have a couple of prince guitar pictures that might be better candidate to build a template.

Stay tuned !

Cant find the picture on the web. Its a white cloud purple symbol and hohner the prinz on a sofa.

My friend showed me a good picture of the gold symbol. Prince's actual one that i have been getting all the detail from.

It was a hohner the prinz and ESP edwards cloud. I'd be interested in the pic for a new body template. i have biscuit jointed tulip wood on the upper bout so will be redoing the upper bout tomorrow.

new update posted but its only truss rods so nothing too interesting.

symbol guitar below looks quite nice. shows it in perspective.

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Reply #7 posted 08/31/11 3:15pm

mwu

Very interesting picture indeed, thanks for sharing.

From right to left, we have:

  • A symbole guitar quite similar to original specs (made by who?)
  • A prinz or so honner copy.
  • A blue shecter cloud copy bought on NPGMC
  • A genuine yellow Cloud build by andy beach and zeke clark
  • Last but not least, loks like the Cloud prototype made by scheter and displayed on their website a while ago.

Where this picture come from?It is a nice collection.

Please wait before doing modification to your guitar, I would like to send you a better template, just let me find the time to find the picture back.

Cheers.

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Reply #8 posted 08/31/11 3:46pm

cam32

mwu said:

Very interesting picture indeed, thanks for sharing.


From right to left, we have:


  • A symbole guitar quite similar to original specs (made by who?)

  • A prinz or so honner copy.

  • A blue shecter cloud copy bought on NPGMC

  • A genuine yellow Cloud build by andy beach and zeke clark

  • Last but not least, loks like the Cloud prototype made by scheter and displayed on their website a while ago.


Where this picture come from?It is a nice collection.



Please wait before doing modification to your guitar, I would like to send you a better template, just let me find the time to find the picture back.



Cheers.




That pic was just from internet. It's similar to the one I used to make the template that I can't find now.
You know your prince guitars!
I'll await the image. Cheers.
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Reply #9 posted 08/31/11 6:08pm

lust

avatar

Fantastic.

Keep updating. I wish I was creative like that.

If the milk turns out to be sour, I aint the kinda pussy to drink it!
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Reply #10 posted 09/01/11 11:56am

cam32

New update with the fret slots. a mission cutting them all but has to be done.

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Reply #11 posted 09/01/11 1:07pm

AtlantaHatGuy

"A symbol guitar quite similar to original specs (made by who?)"

that guitar was made by a French luthier who got a letter from prince's attorneys in 2004 or 2005 informing him that he needed to stop building unauthorized copies....

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Reply #12 posted 09/01/11 1:25pm

cam32

AtlantaHatGuy said:

"A symbol guitar quite similar to original specs (made by who?)"



that guitar was made by a French luthier who got a letter from prince's attorneys in 2004 or 2005 informing him that he needed to stop building unauthorized copies....



Maybe I'll keep all 3 then. Look good on my wall !
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Reply #13 posted 09/01/11 2:58pm

mwu

AtlantaHatGuy said:

"A symbol guitar quite similar to original specs (made by who?)"

that guitar was made by a French luthier who got a letter from prince's attorneys in 2004 or 2005 informing him that he needed to stop building unauthorized copies....

That it what I though in the first place, I could recognise the style of the copy.

There might be 10-15 symbol copies floating around the world.

If I m not wrong, the french guy name start with a L and the guitar were actually made by a spanish luthier.

A bunch of cloud copy were also made with the same high quality vibe.

Are they your guitars wink ?

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Reply #14 posted 09/01/11 6:20pm

mike3121

Cool seeing the beginning stages

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Reply #15 posted 09/02/11 12:53am

cam32

mwu said:



AtlantaHatGuy said:


"A symbol guitar quite similar to original specs (made by who?)"



that guitar was made by a French luthier who got a letter from prince's attorneys in 2004 or 2005 informing him that he needed to stop building unauthorized copies....




That it what I though in the first place, I could recognise the style of the copy.


There might be 10-15 symbol copies floating around the world.


If I m not wrong, the french guy name start with a L and the guitar were actually made by a spanish luthier.


A bunch of cloud copy were also made with the same high quality vibe.



Are they your guitars wink ?



All 3 are mine. Just got to figure out what to do with them all after I build them.
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Reply #16 posted 09/02/11 3:16am

AtlantaHatGuy

mwu said:

AtlantaHatGuy said:

"A symbol guitar quite similar to original specs (made by who?)"

that guitar was made by a French luthier who got a letter from prince's attorneys in 2004 or 2005 informing him that he needed to stop building unauthorized copies....

That it what I though in the first place, I could recognise the style of the copy.

There might be 10-15 symbol copies floating around the world.

If I m not wrong, the french guy name start with a L and the guitar were actually made by a spanish luthier.

A bunch of cloud copy were also made with the same high quality vibe.

Are they your guitars wink ?

No, those aren't mine....but I have 3 out of the 5.....

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Reply #17 posted 09/02/11 7:07am

thecloud

Excellent work, once I purchase a bigger house i'll get back into guitar building.

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Reply #18 posted 09/02/11 9:31am

cam32

thecloud said:

Excellent work, once I purchase a bigger house i'll get back into guitar building.

New update. Starting to look like it should? what do you think?

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Reply #19 posted 09/03/11 11:09am

cam32

Thanks for all the org notes!
[Edited 9/3/11 14:22pm]
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Reply #20 posted 09/03/11 4:59pm

thecloud

Cam, Your work looks good! To put it bluntly VERY GOOD. This is inspiring & I learned with the cloud & telecaster I built that this is a tedious & sometimes frustrating process especially when you don't have the perfected skill to do it. I considered going to luthier school, but couldn't find one in the Philadelphia, Pa area that was close. There was a guy a few years ago who dangerous when it came to building replicas & he was very helpful in guiding me along the way. I mean you couldn't tell the difference between P's axes & his he built. I see your building 3, i'd love to see at least one with a different finish than Gold/Black/White/Purple that he used on stage. I'd love to see one with that "Blue Angel" baby blue finish with gold hardware including frets. I have a sheet of symbol fret markers & can show where to get them from for fairly cheap! PM me if you want to go further & are you in the states?

[Edited 9/3/11 17:00pm]

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Reply #21 posted 09/04/11 12:41am

cam32

thecloud said:

Cam, Your work looks good! To put it bluntly VERY GOOD. This is inspiring & I learned with the cloud & telecaster I built that this is a tedious & sometimes frustrating process especially when you don't have the perfected skill to do it. I considered going to luthier school, but couldn't find one in the Philadelphia, Pa area that was close. There was a guy a few years ago who dangerous when it came to building replicas & he was very helpful in guiding me along the way. I mean you couldn't tell the difference between P's axes & his he built. I see your building 3, i'd love to see at least one with a different finish than Gold/Black/White/Purple that he used on stage. I'd love to see one with that "Blue Angel" baby blue finish with gold hardware including frets. I have a sheet of symbol fret markers & can show where to get them from for fairly cheap! PM me if you want to go further & are you in the states?

[Edited 9/3/11 17:00pm]

Thank you very much, everything is still roughed out at the moment. Will look alot nicer sanded and sprayed!

I live in England near Camridge. A very small village with one pub and thats it ! Slightly different to Philadelphia ? ( born and raised on a playgroud is where i spent most of my days..... couldn't help it )

Very interested in the fret markers if you can send a link.

I would like to do different colours but would add to the cost. Wasnt sure if they'd sell if they weren't Gold or Purple.

http://www.guitarbuilding.../Cloud.htm

For your cloud did you use the above templates? you can get them for many guitars but not the symbol. If you use these with a router bit with a follower bearing on the top you cant go wrong. most of the hard work is done then and there is a set of plans on the cloud central website.

would be very interested in seeing what you have made.

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Reply #22 posted 09/06/11 3:27am

thecloud

PM me with an e-mail address

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Reply #23 posted 09/08/11 12:14pm

cam32

New update, The necks are now routed into the bodies.

Please look comment and follow the Blog.

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Reply #24 posted 09/08/11 2:14pm

thecloud

Are you a luthier? Just was wondering how did you learn this craft cause this is brillant!

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Reply #25 posted 09/08/11 2:48pm

cam32

thecloud said:

Are you a luthier? Just was wondering how did you learn this craft cause this is brillant!



No I'm not. I work at a school in design and technology, before that a cabinet maker and before that I did a degree in instrument making at London metropolitan (acoustic guitars)

It's just fun, I love wood working and playing guitar. Put them together and there you go. I make myself guitars that are exactly how I want them. Shape, tone, neck profile, weight, whatever I want.
. Cant wait to show you all the finished purple guitars.

Cam
[Edited 9/8/11 23:08pm]
[Edited 9/8/11 23:11pm]
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Reply #26 posted 09/08/11 2:57pm

IamFunkay7

cam32 said:

thecloud said:

Are you a luthier? Just was wondering how did you learn this craft cause this is brillant!

No I'm not. I work at a school in design and technology, before that a cabinet maker and before that I did a degree in instrument making at London metropolitan (acoustic guitars) It's just fun, I love wood working and playing guitar. Put them together and there you go. I make myself guitars that are exactly how I want them. Shape, tone, neck profile, weight, whatever I want. That all costs so decided to see if I can make and sell a few guitars. Can wait to show you all the finished purple guitars. Cam

When you are done, let us know. I am interested in buying another guitar.

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Reply #27 posted 09/08/11 3:14pm

cam32

IamFunkay7 said:



cam32 said:


thecloud said:

Are you a luthier? Just was wondering how did you learn this craft cause this is brillant!



No I'm not. I work at a school in design and technology, before that a cabinet maker and before that I did a degree in instrument making at London metropolitan (acoustic guitars) It's just fun, I love wood working and playing guitar. Put them together and there you go. I make myself guitars that are exactly how I want them. Shape, tone, neck profile, weight, whatever I want. That all costs so decided to see if I can make and sell a few guitars. Can wait to show you all the finished purple guitars. Cam

When you are done, let us know. I am interested in buying another

guitar.




Cheers thats nice to hear. After 3 symbols will be making 5 clouds all in different colours.
Always up for making custom guitars too. Only one in the world is the best feeling.

Cheers.
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Reply #28 posted 09/16/11 5:40pm

notjoemama

posted comments on your blog, these things are looking great... do you plan on shaping the top part of the horn on the backside like the original??? What color do you plan on painting these???

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Reply #29 posted 09/17/11 2:11am

cam32

notjoemama said:

posted comments on your blog, these things are looking great... do you plan on shaping the top part of the horn on the backside like the original??? What color do you plan on painting these???

Detailed pics are hard to find of the back. The picture on the right has given me the most information of the front and what i've based mine on.

When i was looking at pics of the purple symbol i didnt notice the 3 dimples on the lower horn/bout or the detail around the outside of the main circular body.

The pic on the left showed me the scroll so have put that in but upper horn/bout is always covered.

On the back of the guitar i cant see the 3 dimples lower bout/horn as on the other side.

If you have reason to believe the upper bout/horn should have that section consider it carved. if you have any pics or descriptions i would love to see/hear from you.

Things i'm unsure about are

the cavities on the back of the guitar to allow access to the pickups looks like its just circle but cant see what it does for the volume tone and pickup switch. Also is it all flat as the front has a step from the bouts/horns to the circular part of the body.

The rest i think ive got hopefully.

I will either do 3 purple, 1 purple 1 gold and 1 white or 2 purple and 1 gold. cant decide.

Any colour ideas?

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