Update #4: The poll is now closed. For the final results, scroll down in this thread, or click here:

http://www.cs.cornell.edu...thm=runoff

Update #3: I just started the poll. Click here to vote:

http://www.cs.cornell.edu...920268f769

Please don't comment on the preliminary results until the poll is closed. I plan to close the poll on Wednesday, 1 June, but if the preliminary results are leaked I may have to close it early.

Vote, and make your voice be heard!

Original post:

I am about to start a Condorcet poll to rank Prince's U.S. singles, as I did previously with his albums:

http://prince.org/msg/7/357438

I want to include singles that were officially released in the U.S. (not promo-only singles). Before I start the poll, however, I want to make sure I've included everything in that category. Here is the list I've come up with:

Soft And Wet

Just As Long As We're Together

I Wanna Be Your Lover

Why You Wanna Treat Me So Bad?

Still Waiting

Uptown

Dirty Mind

Controversy

Let's Work

Do Me, Baby

1999

Little Red Corvette

Delirious

Let's Pretend We're Married

When Doves Cry

Let's Go Crazy

Purple Rain

I Would Die 4 U

Take Me With U

Raspberry Beret

Pop Life

America

Kiss

Mountains

Anotherloverholenyohead

Sign 'O' The Times

If I Was Your Girlfriend

U Got The Look

I Could Never Take The Place Of Your Man

Alphabet St.

Glam Slam

I Wish U Heaven

Batdance

Partyman

The Arms of Orion

Scandalous!

Thieves In The Temple

New Power Generation

Gett Off

Cream

Insatiable

Diamonds And Pearls

Money Don't Matter 2night

Sexy M.F.

My Name Is Prince

7

Damn U

The Morning Papers

Pink Cashmere

Peach

The Most Beautiful Girl In The World

Letitgo

Space

Eye Hate U

Gold

The Greatest Romance Ever Sold

U Make My Sun Shine

Musicology

S.S.T.

Te Amo Corazón

Black Sweat

Fury

Guitar

Chelsea Rodgers

F.U.N.K.

The One U Wanna C

Dance 4 Me

Please reply if I've missed anything that meets my criteria above. I will wait until tomorrow to start the actual poll.

Update: Added "Do Me, Baby" and deleted "Dinner With Delores," as princevault.com suggests that the former was an official 7" release in the U.S. and the latter was only released in the U.S. as a promo.

[Edited 5/29/11 8:34am]

Update #2: Added "U Make My Sun Shine."

[Edited 5/29/11 9:16am]

[Edited 5/30/11 7:29am]

[Edited 5/31/11 4:37am]

[Edited 6/1/11 4:28am]

ask PrinceVault...that's what other's are gonna tell you

BobGeorge909 said:

ask PrinceVault...that's what other's are gonna tell you

Thanks. I looked through and made a couple of adjustments, although some of the links on princevault.com no longer work. There may be some disagreement as to exactly what constitutes an official U.S. single release. For example, I have not included singles officially released as duets with another artist, or (as far as I can tell) singles that were available only through NPG Music Club. I have also excluded singles that were not credited to Prince or O+>.

If these decisions are controversial, please let me know today, since I can't change the list once the poll has started. Thanks.

electricberet said:

BobGeorge909 said:

ask PrinceVault...that's what other's are gonna tell you

Thanks. I looked through and made a couple of adjustments, although some of the links on princevault.com no longer work. There may be some disagreement as to exactly what constitutes an official U.S. single release. For example, I have not included singles officially released as duets with another artist, or (as far as I can tell) singles that were available only through NPG Music Club. I have also excluded singles that were not credited to Prince or O+>.

If these decisions are controversial, please let me know today, since I can't change the list once the poll has started. Thanks.

I say include the duets, but it's just my opinion. Islands in the stream is a Kenny Roger's song as much as it's a Dolly or Gibb song. Which Duet(s) are U fereffing to...

oops...that came out perfect, so i'll leave it, but I meant referring. I think I'm a tad dyslexic...lol.

BobGeorge909 said:

electricberet said:

Thanks. I looked through and made a couple of adjustments, although some of the links on princevault.com no longer work. There may be some disagreement as to exactly what constitutes an official U.S. single release. For example, I have not included singles officially released as duets with another artist, or (as far as I can tell) singles that were available only through NPG Music Club. I have also excluded singles that were not credited to Prince or O+>.

If these decisions are controversial, please let me know today, since I can't change the list once the poll has started. Thanks.

I say include the duets, but it's just my opinion. Islands in the stream is a Kenny Roger's song as much as it's a Dolly or Gibb song. Which Duet(s) are U fereffing to...

oops...that came out perfect, so i'll leave it, but I meant referring. I think I'm a tad dyslexic...lol.

The most famous duet would be "A Love Bizarre," but I'm not sure whether it qualifies even if duets are included. It was released as a Sheila E. single, but the back cover and label state "Produced, Written, and Arranged by Sheila E. and Prince." I'm tempted to include it just because it's one of my favorite Prince songs, but I probably should stick to the rules.

"Love Sign" is another single credited as a duet, but it was promo only, so it doesn't qualify. On the other hand, "U Make My Sun Shine" was officially released in the U.S. as a duet between Prince and Angie Stone.

"Caroline, No" was released as a Brian Wilson single, but I think most people would included it in a ranking of Beach Boys singles, since it was included on a Beach Boys album. Same goes for "In Another Land," credited to Bill Wyman on the single but released on "Their Satanic Majesties Request." However, Prince is different, because if you include singles without his name on them, that raises the question of whether singles by The Time, Vanity 6, Apollonia 6, etc. should be included, and that opens up quite a can of worms.

electricberet said:

BobGeorge909 said:

I say include the duets, but it's just my opinion. Islands in the stream is a Kenny Roger's song as much as it's a Dolly or Gibb song. Which Duet(s) are U fereffing to...

oops...that came out perfect, so i'll leave it, but I meant referring. I think I'm a tad dyslexic...lol.

The most famous duet would be "A Love Bizarre," but I'm not sure whether it qualifies even if duets are included. It was released as a Sheila E. single, but the back cover and label state "Produced, Written, and Arranged by Sheila E. and Prince." I'm tempted to include it just because it's one of my favorite Prince songs, but I probably should stick to the rules.

"Love Sign" is another single credited as a duet, but it was promo only, so it doesn't qualify. On the other hand, "U Make My Sun Shine" was officially released in the U.S. as a duet between Prince and Angie Stone.

"Caroline, No" was released as a Brian Wilson single, but I think most people would included it in a ranking of Beach Boys singles, since it was included on a Beach Boys album. Same goes for "In Another Land," credited to Bill Wyman on the single but released on "Their Satanic Majesties Request." However, Prince is different, because if you include singles without his name on them, that raises the question of whether singles by The Time, Vanity 6, Apollonia 6, etc. should be included, and that opens up quite a can of worms.

I wouldn't say ALB is an official Prince single. I'm sure ALB would do well in the poll to. UMMS is though....IMO. LS is up in the air in limo status I suppose, but if there's a video, I think it counts...but there was no "single" to purchase, so I unno. In the grand scheeme of your poll I don't think this one(or all three) make a discernable difference.

BobGeorge909 said:

electricberet said:

The most famous duet would be "A Love Bizarre," but I'm not sure whether it qualifies even if duets are included. It was released as a Sheila E. single, but the back cover and label state "Produced, Written, and Arranged by Sheila E. and Prince." I'm tempted to include it just because it's one of my favorite Prince songs, but I probably should stick to the rules.

"Love Sign" is another single credited as a duet, but it was promo only, so it doesn't qualify. On the other hand, "U Make My Sun Shine" was officially released in the U.S. as a duet between Prince and Angie Stone.

"Caroline, No" was released as a Brian Wilson single, but I think most people would included it in a ranking of Beach Boys singles, since it was included on a Beach Boys album. Same goes for "In Another Land," credited to Bill Wyman on the single but released on "Their Satanic Majesties Request." However, Prince is different, because if you include singles without his name on them, that raises the question of whether singles by The Time, Vanity 6, Apollonia 6, etc. should be included, and that opens up quite a can of worms.

I wouldn't say ALB is an official Prince single. I'm sure ALB would do well in the poll to. UMMS is though....IMO. LS is up in the air in limo status I suppose, but if there's a video, I think it counts...but there was no "single" to purchase, so I unno. In the grand scheeme of your poll I don't think this one(or all three) make a discernable difference.

I decided to add "U Make My Sun Shine," since the list is top-heavy with earlier releases anyway. I'll leave off "A Love Bizarre," which should probably be included in a future poll of associated artist releases.

sounds good to me...U have a link to the last poll? And lemme know the link to this one when U've got it.

BobGeorge909 said:

sounds good to me...U have a link to the last poll? And lemme know the link to this one when U've got it.

nevermind. it was in the first post...lol

I didn't reliaze you said "grand scheme of things" untll I just read that thread. I wasn't trying to copy/mock you at all when I said it.

BobGeorge909 said:

sounds good to me...U have a link to the last poll? And lemme know the link to this one when U've got it.

I'll add the link to the new poll in this thread and change the topic to indicate that voting is open. Last time I had to close the poll early because people started discussing the results before I closed the poll, and that can lead to strategic voting. It was my fault because I didn't indicate that people shouldn't talk about the results until the poll is closed. (After you vote, you get to see the standings as of the time you voted.)

I should make another point while we're discussing this. I'd like people to rank the songs listed as A-sides of singles without regard to what was on the B-side. The B-sides deserve their own poll. Part of the purpose here (other than just having fun) is to see what people think of the decisions that were made to release particular songs as A-sides in the U.S. market (where Prince got his start).

[Edited 5/29/11 9:34am]

BobGeorge909 said:

I didn't reliaze you said "grand scheme of things" untll I just read that thread. I wasn't trying to copy/mock you at all when I said it.

No offense taken. It's just a way to have some fun, unless someone from WMG is using this for market research, which I doubt.

electricberet said:

BobGeorge909 said:

I didn't reliaze you said "grand scheme of things" untll I just read that thread. I wasn't trying to copy/mock you at all when I said it.

No offense taken. It's just a way to have some fun, unless someone from WMG is using this for market research, which I doubt.

I'm beginning to smell a conspiracy...

I think U just might be an undercover WMG agent trying to get inside info....I got my eyes on you...

j/k

BobGeorge909 said:

electricberet said:

No offense taken. It's just a way to have some fun, unless someone from WMG is using this for market research, which I doubt.

I'm beginning to smell a conspiracy...

I think U just might be an undercover WMG agent trying to get inside info....I got my eyes on you...

j/k

Or I could be a double agent, an orger infiltrating WMG by pretending to be someone from WMG infiltrating the org. You just never know...

Maybe you should also include singles released in the British Market only like Boys and Girls as well.

Adorecream said:

Maybe you should also include singles released in the British Market only like Boys and Girls as well.

You make a good point, but it would raise some problems. The list is pretty long as it is, and if it gets much longer people will be frightened off. If I add the singles released in the U.K. but not the U.S., there's no reason to exclude singles that were released in other countries, such as "Bambi," which was a single in Belgium and the Netherlands according to princevault.com, and "Automatic," which was a single only in Australia. Also, "Gotta Stop (Messin' About)" was released as an A-side in the U.K. but was a non-album B-side everywhere else, and I'd like to do a separate poll eventually of non-album B-sides.

So I think what I'll do is stick to the U.S. singles in this poll. A poll focusing on U.K. singles (or European singles, or non-U.S. singles) could easily be conducted later on. I think it does make sense to start with the U.S. because that is where Prince is from and where his career got its start. No disrespect to my friends across the Atlantic. I've spent a lot of time in the U.K. and I know you love the little purple man there as much as we do. But some songs have been released in particular markets because of perceptions about local taste that may not tell us much about how popular songs are globally. Of course the U.S. is also a local market, but it's a big one and encompasses a wide range of musical tastes.

Ultimately, if people continue to be interested in these polls, I might do one to rank the individual songs on each album along with the B-sides. Then I could take the highest ranking songs from each poll and put them together in a contest for the org's favorite Prince song. Of course, I could try to just rank all of the songs in one huge poll, but I doubt I would get much of a response rate for that as it would take too long to fill out. Having a separate ranking for U.S. singles, in addition to album-specific polls, helps to make sure that certain classic tracks don't get left off because they happen to be included on a particularly strong album.

If anyone is wondering why it matters, I don't think it does, except that we often like to rank things and this is a more sophisticated way of doing it.

[Edited 5/29/11 21:05pm]

Cool, I can't wait to vote. I love to rank stuff. I actually suggested UK, as we had some weird singles in New Zealand (Insatiable was released) and Did You Know "I wanna be your lover" got to #3 on our chart here, possibly the highest in the world.

Adorecream said:

Cool, I can't wait to vote. I love to rank stuff. I actually suggested UK, as we had some weird singles in New Zealand (Insatiable was released) and Did You Know "I wanna be your lover" got to #3 on our chart here, possibly the highest in the world.

Hope you enjoy it and that lots of people vote. I had good participation for my album poll, but that one didn't take as long to complete. It's going to be quite a challenge to rank all these different songs, but it might be a good occasion to listen to some of them again. I didn't even have some of the more recent singles, but I downloaded them from amazon so that I can vote in the poll.

The poll is now open. You'll find the link in the top post in this thread. You'll get to see preliminary standings when you vote, but please don't discuss the results until the poll is closed. Have fun!

P.S. Sorry about any typos in my instructions (I just noticed "the own merit" instead of "their own merit"). I can't find a way to edit the poll once it's been started.

Hmmm... Only five votes so far. Don't be shy!

It was hard, but I think I was honest, I was the 7th voter, and to give you an idea of honesty, my number #1 was not even Top 10. If you get only a few votes, leave it open for longer or try and get a mod to make this a sticky, as its better and more complex than the usual, "Whats the best/worst" threads we get on the org. It should pick up as a lot of us have diverse opinions over Prince songs.

Adorecream said:

It was hard, but I think I was honest, I was the 7th voter, and to give you an idea of honesty, my number #1 was not even Top 10. If you get only a few votes, leave it open for longer or try and get a mod to make this a sticky, as its better and more complex than the usual, "Whats the best/worst" threads we get on the org. It should pick up as a lot of us have diverse opinions over Prince songs.

Thanks for taking the time to vote. I was the first to vote and it wasn't easy. I did notice that, in the current standings, one big hit that I personally don't like (and voted next to last) has moved into the top 5. I take that as a good sign, that the poll is starting to even out some of the more idiosyncratic choices like my dislike for that particular song.

The problem with leaving an anonymous public poll open too long is that eventually you may start to see strategic voting. Certain people who have already voted might send orgnotes to their friends urging them to vote for a particular song, which can skew the results. On the other hand, having too small a voter group makes the results less meaningful. I did get a pretty good response rate for my album poll, but that one was easier to do because there aren't as many albums as singles and most people have strong opinions as to which albums they like better than others.

I agree, your right about orgnotes, it so much better to keep it short and honest and hopefully people will vote for their favourite singles rather than the ones that were the biggest hits (My #1 was only a Top 30 and #2 failed to chart). The fact there is so many makes it hard too, and the fact they have to be ranked in 67 places, only #67 is clear cut, but I virtually like everything that made it into my Top 50 and the Top20 are my favourite songs as well. My favourite song Adore was only a single in Australia and New Zealand.

Adorecream said:

I agree, your right about orgnotes, it so much better to keep it short and honest and hopefully people will vote for their favourite singles rather than the ones that were the biggest hits (My #1 was only a Top 30 and #2 failed to chart). The fact there is so many makes it hard too, and the fact they have to be ranked in 67 places, only #67 is clear cut, but I virtually like everything that made it into my Top 50 and the Top20 are my favourite songs as well. My favourite song Adore was only a single in Australia and New Zealand.

If all goes well, you'll get a chance to vote for Adore soon, because I'll be doing a poll to rank the songs on the SOTT album. My plan is to do polls for each individual album in the order they were ranked in my poll of albums (and SOTT came in at number one on that list). The next poll, though, would be a poll of the non-album tracks that appeared on the B-sides of U.S. singles. Then I'll go through the albums in order. I've also started a thread to solicit nominations for a separate poll on songs that weren't officially released on any of the singles or albums ranked in my other polls:

http://prince.org/msg/7/360072

The idea is that I would eventually take the highest-ranking songs on the A-side poll, the B-side poll, each album poll, and a "catchall" poll of unreleased and associated artist songs written by Prince, and combine them into one big poll that would rank the best of the best. I would include more tracks from SOTT because it ranked #1 in my album poll. I'm doing an A-side poll first, though, because a few songs weren't released on albums at all, and it will also be a check on the accuracy of the individual album polls (any one of which could get a bad sample).

My ultimate goal is to have a list of the top 25 Prince songs in the opinion of Prince fans. That way, if a new fan asks me what Prince songs they really need to listen to, I can point to those songs rather than my own favorites, which may be idiosyncratic in some ways, or the opinion of music critics who aren't as familiar as the fans are with Prince's work. One thing I learned from the album poll is that there is some consensus here on what albums are better than others, even though each album has its passionate defenders. I expect the same to be true of the individual tracks.

I'm off to bed for the evening, but it'll be morning in Europe soon, so keep those votes coming in!

I see we got some more votes overnight. Thanks! Please vote if you'd like to do so. I plan to shut the poll down tomorrow morning Minneapolis time.

We seem to be stalled at 17 votes. 17 is a lucky number in Prince-world, I know, but I think we could probably do a little better. If you have time to vote, please do so now!

[Edited 5/31/11 10:55am]

I tried. I tried...ther's just too many of them.

BobGeorge909 said:

I tried. I tried...ther's just too many of them.

Well, thanks for bumping the thread anyway! Hope we get a few more votes tonight to break some of those ties.