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Reply #270 posted 02/18/11 9:16am

catpark

2elijah said:

catpark said:

2elijah said: I never said anything about that, ur misquoting me, I said about Africans ie west Africans in particular not accepting Carribeans/Americans as Africans not the other way around. I know about Carribean history.

Okay, no need to be defensive, lol Didn't mean to ruffle your fathers, and I did not misquote you. You made a comment about West Africans not accepting, Caribbean/African Americans as "Africans". That's not unusual, because all 3 groups practice different cultures, and were born in different places. However, there are many Africans who tell Black Americans/Black Caribbeans that they "are part of them", so it's really based on the individual(s) Africans that you encounter and their views on non-native born Africans.

I've heard that same comment over the years come from Black Caribbeans born in the Caribbean, tell me I'm not considered one of them because I was born in the states. Yet both my parents are from the Caribbean and the West Indian culture was practiced at home. To me that's like telling a Puerto Rican, born in NYC, that they are not Puerto Rican, because they were not born in Puerto Rico. lol Anyway, have a blessed day.biggrin

I'm not being defensive at all and i dont know why ur saying uve ruffled my feathers, if anything i find it quite interesting to see what other peoples ideas from around the world are like etc, and btw I was misquoted.

But going by what uve just said yes there is a lot of people saying people are not from here and there coz they wasnt born there etc etc, but trust me i know a lot of Ghanians and Negrians and i like i said before the majority of them do not accept Black Americans/Carribeans from African lineage as part of there own culture especially the older generation. Lucky the younger generation are looking pass this and moving forward not backwards.

FUNKNROLL! dancing jig "February 2014, wow". 'dre. nod
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Reply #271 posted 02/18/11 9:18am

9037355

avatar

It is Beautiful their relation bring deep talk and lots of healthy sharing dove

••••••••••••••••••••••••••••• S(((O)))u¬...._-..-_......_-∆-...••••••••••••••••••••••••••••
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Reply #272 posted 02/18/11 9:19am

2elijah

babynoz said:

Efan said:

A serious question: Why is the "one-drop rule" racist but "one drop of anything else = NOT black" not racist?

I'd love know that myself, lol It's all quite arbitrary, no?

Given the fact that people are arguing that it's a social construct with no scientific basis, to me that says that it is even moreso an individual "choice" and should be respected as such whether it's Sheila, Misty or Tigger Woods.

It's funny that you never see this type of raucus debate, nitpicking, pontificating, microscopic scrunity about percentages and such unless we're talking about black folks. disbelief

That's a very good question Efan has expressed.

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Reply #273 posted 02/18/11 9:21am

catpark

OldFriends4Sale said:

catpark said:

lol stupid phone!

lol either I'm old or I just can't do the phone thing

Ur not old, the phone is just a pain. it looks pretty but thats all, looks can be very deceiving lol

FUNKNROLL! dancing jig "February 2014, wow". 'dre. nod
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Reply #274 posted 02/18/11 9:23am

2elijah

catpark said:

2elijah said:

Okay, no need to be defensive, lol Didn't mean to ruffle your fathers, and I did not misquote you. You made a comment about West Africans not accepting, Caribbean/African Americans as "Africans". That's not unusual, because all 3 groups practice different cultures, and were born in different places. However, there are many Africans who tell Black Americans/Black Caribbeans that they "are part of them", so it's really based on the individual(s) Africans that you encounter and their views on non-native born Africans.

I've heard that same comment over the years come from Black Caribbeans born in the Caribbean, tell me I'm not considered one of them because I was born in the states. Yet both my parents are from the Caribbean and the West Indian culture was practiced at home. To me that's like telling a Puerto Rican, born in NYC, that they are not Puerto Rican, because they were not born in Puerto Rico. lol Anyway, have a blessed day.biggrin

I'm not being defensive at all and i dont know why ur saying uve ruffled my feathers, if anything i find it quite interesting to see what other peoples ideas from around the world are like etc, and btw I was misquoted.

But going by what uve just said yes there is a lot of people saying people are not from here and there coz they wasnt born there etc etc, but trust me i know a lot of Ghanians and Negrians and i like i said before the majority of them do not accept Black Americans/Carribeans from African lineage as part of there own culture especially the older generation. Lucky the younger generation are looking pass this and moving forward not backwards.

Okay, and it's understandable that some African ethnic groups feel that way, but whether they like it or not, Black Americans/Black Caribbeans, have the blood of many African, ethnic groups running through their veins, as well as many others. The non-acceptance of that by the older Africans you speak of, can't change that, but thanks for sharing that info.

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Reply #275 posted 02/18/11 9:25am

OldFriends4Sal
e

2elijah said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Daphne will have to clear that up, but I believe she is making reference to the false idea that Africans got their slanted eyes because Asians invade Africa... It was just worded/read differently. I don't think she is saying Asians invaded Africa, she is commenting on the idea that "Romans & Greeks" invaded enslaved and raped Egyptians and that's why they are lighter skinned. <- that is the incorrect information... and I believe U agreed with Jasons post earlier

Let's get that straight, shall we? As far as Jason's post, I replied to your comment to him, where you assumed Jason stated "Egyptians didn't enslave people", when in fact, "Jason" never implied that. Next.

check post 155 & 167 Jason did say it, and you praised his ignorance

2Elijah: Tell it like it is Jason. clapping I'm glad somebody is finally spreading some real knowledge and not some "made-up" bs.

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Reply #276 posted 02/18/11 9:28am

2elijah

OldFriends4Sale said:

2elijah said:

Let's get that straight, shall we? As far as Jason's post, I replied to your comment to him, where you assumed Jason stated "Egyptians didn't enslave people", when in fact, "Jason" never implied that. Next.

check post 155 & 167 Jason did say it, and you praised his ignorance

2Elijah: Tell it like it is Jason. clapping I'm glad somebody is finally spreading some real knowledge and not some "made-up" bs.

That's right I praised him on his post, but after that post, corrected you on accusing Jason of saying something he "never mentioned" in his post. That's not too difficult for you to understand now is it? popcorn

[Edited 2/18/11 9:29am]

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Reply #277 posted 02/18/11 9:30am

dJJ

I'm white. European. Can I appreciate/ understand black issues do you think?

99% of my posts are ironic. Maybe this post sides with the other 1%.
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Reply #278 posted 02/18/11 9:31am

OldFriends4Sal
e

2elijah said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

check post 155 & 167 Jason did say it, and you praised his ignorance

2Elijah: Tell it like it is Jason. clapping I'm glad somebody is finally spreading some real knowledge and not some "made-up" bs.

That's right I praised him on his post, but after that post, corrected you on accusing Jason of saying something he "never mentioned" in his post. That's not too difficult for you to understand now is it? popcorn

[Edited 2/18/11 9:29am]

Uhhhh I said check post 155 & 167 JASON did say that about the Egyptians being invaded raped and enslaved by the Romans & Greeks

JASON: THE ORIGINAL EGYPTIANS WERE BLACK. THE REAL NAME OF EGYPT WAS KEMET, WHICH MEANS THE LAND OF THE BLACK AND BURNT SKINNED PEOPLE. STUDY THEIR ART, PAINTINGS AND THE KEBRANEGAST BEFORE THEY WERE INVADED BY THE GREEKS. THE REASON THAT THEY ARE LIGHT SKINNED TODAY IS BECAUSE THE GREEKS AND THE ROMANS INVADED THEIR LAND. THEY ENSLAVED THE MEN AND RAPED THE WOMEN TO PRODUCE THE LIGHTER HUE EGYPTIAN TODAY. YOU ARE AN EMBARRASSMENT, SO LEAVE THIS SUBJECT ALONE DUDE

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Reply #279 posted 02/18/11 9:35am

OldFriends4Sal
e

dJJ said:

I'm white. European. Can I appreciate/ understand black issues do you think?

Yes you can, if it wasn't for other 'white-Americans' marching with Dr Martin Luther King jr and right along side the Civil Rights Movement. It wouldn't have gotta AS far as quickly as it did.

It would have to take white people to condemn the actions and behaviors of the racist whites

the Freedom Fighter buses that went throught the South were made up of Blacks & Whites

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Reply #280 posted 02/18/11 9:40am

2elijah

OldFriends4Sale said:

2elijah said:

That's right I praised him on his post, but after that post, corrected you on accusing Jason of saying something he "never mentioned" in his post. That's not too difficult for you to understand now is it? popcorn

[Edited 2/18/11 9:29am]

Uhhhh I said check post 155 & 167 JASON did say that about the Egyptians being invaded raped and enslaved by the Romans & Greeks

JASON: THE ORIGINAL EGYPTIANS WERE BLACK. THE REAL NAME OF EGYPT WAS KEMET, WHICH MEANS THE LAND OF THE BLACK AND BURNT SKINNED PEOPLE. STUDY THEIR ART, PAINTINGS AND THE KEBRANEGAST BEFORE THEY WERE INVADED BY THE GREEKS. THE REASON THAT THEY ARE LIGHT SKINNED TODAY IS BECAUSE THE GREEKS AND THE ROMANS INVADED THEIR LAND. THEY ENSLAVED THE MEN AND RAPED THE WOMEN TO PRODUCE THE LIGHTER HUE EGYPTIAN TODAY. YOU ARE AN EMBARRASSMENT, SO LEAVE THIS SUBJECT ALONE DUDE

How many times does it have to be posted that I praised Jason for his post? How many times does it have to get through to you that you were "WRONG" in assuming Jason stated that "Egyptians never enslaved people". It seems when people call you on your BS, you dance around it. Keep trying. You're doing a good job of making a complete ass out of yourself all over this thread. Next.

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Reply #281 posted 02/18/11 9:49am

2elijah

dJJ said:

I'm white. European. Can I appreciate/ understand black issues do you think?

Of course you can, and your skin color/ethnicity has nothing to do with it. Anyone can learn about any culture/ethnic group as long as they go into it with an open mind. Do a lot of research and compare the information you've found with one another, to make sure you're not getting "misleading" information on it. Speak to "various" people from the group(s) of interest you're researching, regarding their culture, life experiences, etc. and include that in what you've research. Good luck. biggrin

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Reply #282 posted 02/18/11 9:55am

OldFriends4Sal
e

2elijah said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Uhhhh I said check post 155 & 167 JASON did say that about the Egyptians being invaded raped and enslaved by the Romans & Greeks

JASON: THE ORIGINAL EGYPTIANS WERE BLACK. THE REAL NAME OF EGYPT WAS KEMET, WHICH MEANS THE LAND OF THE BLACK AND BURNT SKINNED PEOPLE. STUDY THEIR ART, PAINTINGS AND THE KEBRANEGAST BEFORE THEY WERE INVADED BY THE GREEKS. THE REASON THAT THEY ARE LIGHT SKINNED TODAY IS BECAUSE THE GREEKS AND THE ROMANS INVADED THEIR LAND. THEY ENSLAVED THE MEN AND RAPED THE WOMEN TO PRODUCE THE LIGHTER HUE EGYPTIAN TODAY. YOU ARE AN EMBARRASSMENT, SO LEAVE THIS SUBJECT ALONE DUDE

How many times does it have to be posted that I praised Jason for his post? How many times does it have to get through to you that you were "WRONG" in assuming Jason stated that "Egyptians never enslaved people". It seems when people call you on your BS, you dance around it. Keep trying. You're doing a good job of making a complete ass out of yourself all over this thread. Next.

What? Are you batty? I never said Jason said "Egyptians never enslaved people." You're not calling me on anything. You praised Jason unintelligent post and clapped it up. I said you backed that foolishness, in saying the Romans & Greeks enslaved the Egyptians and raped them and that's why they are lighter skinned. Jasons commet is an insult because he's saying because the Egyptians are Black and became light, just like the American slave trade, it had to be the 'whites' enslaving and raping the 'blacks' Are u batty or what? Don't try to twist the words sista. Your totally trying to play with the words. Your making a total jack as$ out of yourself . YOU are caught with ur foot in your mouth

Here are some modern day Egyptians or the originals. So I guess his post is still WRONG. Especially since he ASSUMES that the Middle Eastern/Arabs are the lighter skinned descendants of the original Egyptians... NOT

And you agreed with that too

[Edited 2/18/11 10:05am]

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Reply #283 posted 02/18/11 10:37am

2elijah

OldFriends4Sale said:

2elijah said:

How many times does it have to be posted that I praised Jason for his post? How many times does it have to get through to you that you were "WRONG" in assuming Jason stated that "Egyptians never enslaved people". It seems when people call you on your BS, you dance around it. Keep trying. You're doing a good job of making a complete ass out of yourself all over this thread. Next.

What? Are you batty? I never said Jason said "Egyptians never enslaved people." You're not calling me on anything. You praised Jason unintelligent post and clapped it up. I said you backed that foolishness, in saying the Romans & Greeks enslaved the Egyptians and raped them and that's why they are lighter skinned. Jasons commet is an insult because he's saying because the Egyptians are Black and became light, just like the American slave trade, it had to be the 'whites' enslaving and raping the 'blacks' Are u batty or what? Don't try to twist the words sista. Your totally trying to play with the words. Your making a total jack as$ out of yourself . YOU are caught with ur foot in your mouth

Here are some modern day Egyptians or the originals. So I guess his post is still WRONG. Especially since he ASSUMES that the Middle Eastern/Arabs are the lighter skinned descendants of the original Egyptians... NOT

And you agreed with that too

[Edited 2/18/11 10:05am]

You have a really weak ego, because I remember you asking me not to post to your threads, yet you're all over mine, calling me names like a man with a bruised ego who had his ass handed to him.

There you go putting words in my yet not living up to your bs. Who said that the reason behind the existence of lighter-skinned Blacks is all due to rapings by whites? It's obvious you read what you wanted when I praised Jason for posting his own information. I praised him for posting "real knowledge" which does not necessarily mean I agreed to everything that was in his post, that was your assinine assumption. I only agreed to some of what he stated. Unless you can find the exact words of me actually stating that all lighter-skinned blacks came from rapings of white males, then the bs you are accusing me of is not valid. It is obvious you can't deal with anyone challenging you on some of the "color-struck, personally-created apartheid misleading bs" you've been feeding people with on this thread.

Had you actually read any of my posts in the past in the P&R section, which you have, and note that I mentioned on this thread long before Jason put your ass in check, you may have read where I noted the reason for the many physical/facial, skin tones of the "human species" from the time the first ancient humans travelled out of Africa to populate the entire globe. Their skin/hair textures/physical features, etc., were affected due to the climate and environment they lived in/travelled to, when groups left Africa in small groups, and that is the reason humans look different from one another today. Also, many of the ancient Africans were not all the same skin tones, even before travelling out of Africa. They varied in complexion--get that? It depended on what part of the area known today as Africa, that they were living in and the environment/climate they were exposed to. As far as rapings that took place during the "transatlantic slave trade" where it involved slave owners/traders/sellers, who took part in the many rapings of African women/girls, that was also a contributing factor to many, various complexions among those who were a product of that situation, during that time period. Today, there are interracial relationships where there are many children born of biracial parentage.

Now I will close on that note, I've already wasted too much of my good time responding to your bs. In the meantime, do some research on Spencer Wells and Dr. Stephen Oppenheimer. You may well, actually learn something about the "human species". Have a blessed day.

[Edited 2/18/11 10:47am]

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Reply #284 posted 02/18/11 10:46am

OldFriends4Sal
e

LOL ^^^ ok I'll leave u unlone ... it can be hard to admit agreeing with a wrong statement.

Batty, Jason STATED that was the reason you have lighter skinned Egyptians, because they were raped. ... what u clapped it up for. I stated other facts of mixing that took place between Romans Ethiopians Greeks Hebrews Egyptians/Nubians Arabs

BS You praise Jason because you thought he was in agreement with u. And you didn't take the time to read the idiotic uneducated post full of racist idealogy. the stuff u clapped it up for ...

If the information is historically and factually WRONG, then how is it REAL? It's FALSE

Jason put me in CHECK? LMAO how? But posting WRONG information based on stuff he didn't study at all? You both better lotion your ass cheeks because I'm pulling out my leather paddle ... Jason jumped ship cause he knew is ignorant a$$ put some stupid garbage out there ... that you clapped it up for... yes sa massa

Oh cut with the "You can't deal with..." crap I'm still RIGHT here, posting and challenging hon

Where's Jason the one who believes it's always been blacks lot in life to be slaves... the one u clapped it up for

[Edited 2/18/11 11:05am]

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Reply #285 posted 02/18/11 10:50am

Spinlight

avatar

OldFriends4Sale said:

LOL ^^^ ok I'll leave u unlone ... it can be hard to admit agreeing with a wrong statement.

Where's Jason the one who believes it's always been blacks lot in life to be slaves... the one u clapped it up for

clapping Speakin' of clapping!

[Edited 2/18/11 10:51am]

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Reply #286 posted 02/18/11 10:54am

OldFriends4Sal
e

Spinlight said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

LOL ^^^ ok I'll leave u unlone ... it can be hard to admit agreeing with a wrong statement.

Where's Jason the one who believes it's always been blacks lot in life to be slaves... the one u clapped it up for

clapping Speakin' of clapping!

I'm going 2 Soul clap 4 your posts man clapping clapping clapping ma brutha

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Reply #287 posted 02/18/11 11:31am

prodigalfan

avatar

OldFriends4Sale said:

prodigalfan said:

I had this very conversation a few months back on the org and some orgers had some very valid points.

Culture, nationality and race can be very different things. You can be a citiizen of Mexico... and therefore Mexican, and living in Mexico, have the culture of Mexicans.. (food, music, traditions) yet still be of black descent.

I think were a lot of confusion comes in is that Black is very much an American identity.

In latin american countrys prior to the 1900's they had over 20-30 different terms to describe people who were not Euro/Spanish, African or Native-American but some verying degrees of mix. They even had a term for a"100%" African who was wealthy, which put him in a different catagory. So yes a person can be fully engulfed in "mexican" culture and be of 100% African genetics. Same in American, but most americans are so racist that they don't see themselves as American 1st. If Wesley Snipes and Anderson Cooper went to Africa or some other country they would see 2 Americans 1st.

Like someone said... Africans were dropped off not only in North America but also in Central and South America and the Carribean islands.

At some point, those Africans in South America intermixed with the people of Spanish descent and adopted the culture, and family name. Soon, Mexico and its culture has more meaning than a place never visited, Africa.

Very True, and even though some cultural things may remain or become meshed with Spanish things, "Mexican" culture is their culture. A lot of Mexicans are mostly still Native-American just wearing the colonizers clothing and speaking his language. There is a lot of revival of Native & Mayan culture in Mexico now. A lot of Native-American groups are helping raise awareness and revival of Native culture in the peoples of Mexico & S.America & Hawaii

So I guess the question is... if you LOOK of African descent, but have a latino family name, was raised in latino culture, etc.... are you black? Latino?

It's all in name. Latino is the term used of anyone from the Spanish/Portugese lands. So someone from Spain wouldn't be described as Latino. Latino is almost like the 1st def of Creole (dealing with foreign born)

I have heard the phrase "Hispanic, not of african descent"... so I guess one can assume there must be a group of people who ARE Hispanic and are of African descent.

YES, a lot of this is very much American derived. There are people who are Hispanic who are very much "European" or 'white' but because Hispanic countries didn't apply the 1 Drop Rule or have the miscogenation laws against mixing or races, the 1 Drop Rule is applied to Hispanic people

I think Sheila is multiracial... and black is one of those races... just like Vanity, Troy, Mani, Jill Jones, Susan Moonsie (who it appears to me was another Black Hispanic... didn't she come from Trinidad?)

Totally agree, Well Susan Moonsie wouldn't be ..Hispanic but Carribean. Haiti Jamaica Dominican Republic and a few other islands are mostly of French colonization. And the term Creole defines their culture. the Dominican Republic is like 1/2Latin 1/2Creole

Speaking of Trinidad... I work with a woman who is from Trinidad. She looks black, but she has the accent of spanish/carribean island. She looks like Cora from MTV Real World.

Trinidad is 7 miles from Venezuela...Anyone who says they are from Venezuela would automatically be classified as Latino/hispanic right? But I am telling you, this woman would NOT be identified as anything BUT Black... until you hear her speak.

I know people like that too. You'd swear they just came from Nigeria or Ghana until they speak and they speak Spanish with Spanish names

I think Sheila has a lot of physical features that resemble African American. And I am not speaking of hair texture or skin tone... because really, "Black" people really do come in all shades.

She does, but she has just as many or more that come from the other ethnic groups she is mixed with. She is a multiracial woman. Here is Sheila's Creole mother in the middle

Thanks for reply. and thanks for the picture. I imagined Sheila's mom looking more average AA and not so exotic looking. Her "Black" mom looks more racially ambiguious than Sheila herself.
"Remember, one man's filler is another man's killer" -- Haystack
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Reply #288 posted 02/18/11 11:41am

OldFriends4Sal
e

prodigalfan said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

Thanks for reply. and thanks for the picture. I imagined Sheila's mom looking more average AA and not so exotic looking. Her "Black" mom looks more racially ambiguious than Sheila herself.

Right because her mom isn't Black, she's Creole, she's from a line a mixed race people from Louisiana. Beyonce Knowels mom is Creole too, and so is actress Lynn Whitfield mom. It's considered a different ethnic group.

I agree, from the time i first saw her in the Glamorous Life video I always saw Sheila E as a 'mulatta' Sheila actually to me, has a look that I see as discernably of africa/other admixture, where her brothers have a more stereotypical 'latin' look

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Reply #289 posted 02/18/11 12:59pm

HatrinaHaterwi
tz

avatar

OldFriends4Sale said:

prodigalfan said:

Thanks for reply. and thanks for the picture. I imagined Sheila's mom looking more average AA and not so exotic looking. Her "Black" mom looks more racially ambiguious than Sheila herself.

Right because her mom isn't Black, she's Creole, she's from a line a mixed race people from Louisiana. Beyonce Knowels mom is Creole too, and so is actress Lynn Whitfield mom. It's considered a different ethnic group.

I agree, from the time i first saw her in the Glamorous Life video I always saw Sheila E as a 'mulatta' Sheila actually to me, has a look that I see as discernably of africa/other admixture, where her brothers have a more stereotypical 'latin' look

spit I know some self-hating people who like to think that but that still doesn't make it so. shrug

http://www.loyno.edu/~kch...oles2.html

Creoles

Origin

The term Creole can create some difficulty in determining one's actual race due to the origin of the word and different uses it has to describe race. The earliest recollection of the word creole comes in the early 16th century from Garcilaso de la Vega. In his book, "Royal Commentaries of the Incas and General History of Peru," Garcilaso de la Vega tells us that the word criollos or criollas was first invented by the Negroes to mean a Negro born in the Indies. Its use was devised to distinguish between Negros born in the Indies compared to those that were born in the New World since the former were held in high honor since they were born in their own country. He later goes on to state that the Spanish copied the term from the Negroes to describe people born in the new world. This means that all people born in the New World, both Spaniards and Guinea Negroes, were now considered criollo.


The other origin of the word criollo comes from Father J. de Acosta in 1590. De Acosta decided that mixed breeds from the New World were neither Spanish, African on Indian, meaning that they had no race. De Acosta decided to identify them as criollos, which came from the Latin word crear, meaning create. From that time, and approximately the next 250 years, Creole (or criollo) referred to not a color or race, but a person that was born in the New World.

The word also has many meanings throughout the different parts of the world. In the 16th century the term was used in parts of the United States to describe native born persons who were descendants of French, Spanish and Portuguese who were settlers in Latin America, the West Indies and Southern United States. In Louisiana, specifically they were French speaking white descendants of early French and Spanish settlers. These creoles settled between Baton Rouge, Louisiana and the Gulf Coast and small communities in eastern Missouri and Southern Alabama.

They were considered elite members of society and they celebrated their French culture and lived according to the mannerisms and traditions of European society. Many of them refused to learn English and remained loyal to the colonies. Once the Spanish took possession of New Orleans, they began to use Criollo with regards to the French. The term was later adopted and became Creole. The French and Spanish born in Nouvelle Orleans were then considered Creoles while those born in the Old World were simply called French or Spanish. The French Creoles were skeptical of the New Americans who were migrating from Kentucky and other parts of the United States. They considered them uncouth and irreligious. They maintained a strict separation in New Orleans by living in one part of the city east of Canal Street while the New Americans settled west of Canal Street. The New Americans were appalled at the way of life in Creole society. They were disturbed by the dominance of the French language, the number of free people of color and the way slaves were allowed to practice African traditions. Louisiana was unlike any place in the United States at the time because of the racial makeup. French men often took African women as mistresses or common law wives and sometimes married them.

Louisiana Creoles "Free People of Color"

When the French settlers moved to Louisiana, the placage system was set up due to a shortage of accessible white women. The French wanted to expand its population in the new world, however men were not expected to marry until their early thirties and premarital sex was inconceivable. African woman soon became the concubines of white male colonists, which in some cases they happened to be sons of noblemen, military men, plantation owners, etc. Soon, wealthy white Creole men would marry and, in some cases, they would possess two families. One with the white woman they were legally married to, and one with their mistress of color. The offspring from their mistresses were then grouped into a new class of creoles known as gens de couleur, or free people of color. This class of people would soon expand when refugees from Haiti and other French speaking colonies would migrate to New Orleans, effectively creating a new middle class between the white French Creoles and slaves.

This class of colored people was unique to the South as they were not in the same category as African slaves. They were elite members of society who were often leaders in business, agriculture, politics, and the arts. At one time the center of their residential community was the French Quarter.

Many were educated, owned their own property and businesses. Additionally, some were even slave-owners. They formed a third class in the slave society. This meant that pre-civil war race was mainly divided into four categories. These were white, black, creoles, and free people of color. French Creoles objected to the fact that the term Creole was used to describe Free People of Color but their culture and ideals were often mirrored by them. French Creoles spoke French while Black Creoles spoke Louisiana Creole which was a mixture of English, French, African or Spanish. The end of the civil war was a threat to the Louisiana Creoles of Color because this brought about the two-tiered class system that existed in the rest of the country that was divided predominately by race: black and white.

I knew from the start that I loved you with all my heart.
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Reply #290 posted 02/18/11 1:00pm

silkylee

Some people on this thread said Sheila E. isn't black. hmmm

Maybe my eyes are lying to me. But it looks like 2 black women with 3 white women to me. rolleyes

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Reply #291 posted 02/18/11 1:17pm

silkylee

Willie Lynch letter: The Making of a Slave

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This speech was delivered by Willie Lynch on the bank of the James River in the colony of Virginia in 1712. Lynch was a British slave owner in the West Indies. He was invited to the colony of Virginia in 1712 to teach his methods to slave owners there. The term “lynching” is derived from his last name.

[beginning of the Willie Lynch Letter]

Greetings,

Gentlemen. I greet you here on the bank of the James River in the year of our Lord one thousand seven hundred and twelve. First, I shall thank you, the gentlemen of the Colony of Virginia, for bringing me here. I am here to help you solve some of your problems with slaves. Your invitation reached me on my modest plantation in the West Indies, where I have experimented with some of the newest, and still the oldest, methods for control of slaves. Ancient Rome would envy us if my program is implemented. As our boat sailed south on the James River, named for our illustrious King, whose version of the Bible we cherish, I saw enough to know that your problem is not unique. While Rome used cords of wood as crosses for standing human bodies along its highways in great numbers, you are here using the tree and the rope on occasions. I caught the whiff of a dead slave hanging from a tree, a couple miles back. You are not only losing valuable stock by hangings, you are having uprisings, slaves are running away, your crops are sometimes left in the fields too long for maximum profit, you suffer occasional fires, your animals are killed. Gentlemen, you know what your problems are; I do not need to elaborate. I am not here to enumerate your problems, I am here to introduce you to a method of solving them. In my bag here, I HAVE A FULL PROOF METHOD FOR CONTROLLING YOUR BLACK SLAVES. I guarantee every one of you that, if installed correctly, IT WILL CONTROL THE SLAVES FOR AT LEAST 300 HUNDREDS YEARS. My method is simple. Any member of your family or your overseer can use it. I HAVE OUTLINED A NUMBER OF DIFFERENCES AMONG THE SLAVES; AND I TAKE THESE DIFFERENCES AND MAKE THEM BIGGER. I USE FEAR, DISTRUST AND ENVY FOR CONTROL PURPOSES. These methods have worked on my modest plantation in the West Indies and it will work throughout the South. Take this simple little list of differences and think about them. On top of my list is “AGE,” but it’s there only because it starts with an “a.” The second is “COLOR” or shade. There is INTELLIGENCE, SIZE, SEX, SIZES OF PLANTATIONS, STATUS on plantations, ATTITUDE of owners, whether the slaves live in the valley, on a hill, East, West, North, South, have fine hair, course hair, or is tall or short. Now that you have a list of differences, I shall give you an outline of action, but before that, I shall assure you that DISTRUST IS STRONGER THAN TRUST AND ENVY STRONGER THAN ADULATION, RESPECT OR ADMIRATION. The Black slaves after receiving this indoctrination shall carry on and will become self-refueling and self-generating for HUNDREDS of years, maybe THOUSANDS. Don’t forget, you must pitch the OLD black male vs. the YOUNG black male, and the YOUNG black male against the OLD black male. You must use the DARK skin slaves vs. the LIGHT skin slaves, and the LIGHT skin slaves vs. the DARK skin slaves. You must use the FEMALE vs. the MALE, and the MALE vs. the FEMALE. You must also have white servants and overseers [who] distrust all Blacks. But it is NECESSARY THAT YOUR SLAVES TRUST AND DEPEND ON US. THEY MUST LOVE, RESPECT AND TRUST ONLY US. Gentlemen, these kits are your keys to control. Use them. Have your wives and children use them, never miss an opportunity. IF USED INTENSELY FOR ONE YEAR, THE SLAVES THEMSELVES WILL REMAIN PERPETUALLY DISTRUSTFUL. Thank you gentlemen.”

LET’S MAKE A SLAVE

It was the interest and business of slave holders to study human nature, and the slave nature in particular, with a view to practical results. I and many of them attained astonishing proficiency in this direction. They had to deal not with earth, wood and stone, but with men and, by every regard, they had for their own safety and prosperity they needed to know the material on which they were to work, conscious of the injustice and wrong they were every hour perpetuating and knowing what they themselves would do. Were they the victims of such wrongs? They were constantly looking for the first signs of the dreaded retribution. They watched therefore with skilled and practiced eyes, and learned to read with great accuracy, the state of mind and heart of the slave, through his sable face. Unusual sobriety, apparent abstractions, sullenness and indifference indeed, any mood out of the common was afforded ground for suspicion and inquiry. Frederick Douglas LET’S MAKE A SLAVE is a study of the scientific process of man-breaking and slave-making. It describes the rationale and results of the Anglo Saxons’ ideas and methods of insuring the master/slave relationship. LET’S MAKE A SLAVE “The Original and Development of a Social Being Called ‘The Negro.’” Let us make a slave. What do we need? First of all, we need a black nigger man, a pregnant nigger woman and her baby nigger boy. Second, we will use the same basic principle that we use in breaking a horse, combined with some more sustaining factors. What we do with horses is that we break them from one form of life to another; that is, we reduce them from their natural state in nature. Whereas nature provides them with the natural capacity to take care of their offspring, we break that natural string of independence from them and thereby create a dependency status, so that we may be able to get from them useful production for our business and pleasure.

CARDINAL PRINCIPLES FOR MAKING A NEGRO

For fear that our future generations may not understand the principles of breaking both of the beast together, the nigger and the horse. We understand that short range planning economics results in periodic economic chaos; so that to avoid turmoil in the economy, it requires us to have breadth and depth in long range comprehensive planning, articulating both skill sharp perceptions. We lay down the following principles for long range comprehensive economic planning. Both horse and niggers [are] no good to the economy in the wild or natural state. Both must be BROKEN and TIED together for orderly production. For orderly future, special and particular attention must be paid to the FEMALE and the YOUNGEST offspring. Both must be CROSSBRED to produce a variety and division of labor. Both must be taught to respond to a peculiar new LANGUAGE. Psychological and physical instruction of CONTAINMENT must be created for both. We hold the six cardinal principles as truth to be self-evident, based upon following the discourse concerning the economics of breaking and tying the horse and the nigger together, all inclusive of the six principles laid down above. NOTE: Neither principle alone will suffice for good economics. All principles must be employed for orderly good of the nation. Accordingly, both a wild horse and a wild or natur[al] nigger is dangerous even if captured, for they will have the tendency to seek their customary freedom and, in doing so, might kill you in your sleep. You cannot rest. They sleep while you are awake, and are awake while you are asleep. They are DANGEROUS near the family house and it requires too much labor to watch them away from the house. Above all, you cannot get them to work in this natural state. Hence, both the horse and the nigger must be broken; that is breaking them from one form of mental life to another. KEEP THE BODY, TAKE THE MIND! In other words, break the will to resist. Now the breaking process is the same for both the horse and the nigger, only slightly varying in degrees. But, as we said before, there is an art in long range economic planning. YOU MUST KEEP YOUR EYE AND THOUGHTS ON THE FEMALE and the OFFSPRING of the horse and the nigger. A brief discourse in offspring development will shed light on the key to sound economic principles. Pay little attention to the generation of original breaking, but CONCENTRATE ON FUTURE GENERATION. Therefore, if you break the FEMALE mother, she will BREAK the offspring in its early years of development; and when the offspring is old enough to work, she will deliver it up to you, for her normal female protective tendencies will have been lost in the original breaking process. For example, take the case of the wild stud horse, a female horse and an already infant horse and compare the breaking process with two captured nigger males in their natural state, a pregnant nigger woman with her infant offspring. Take the stud horse, break him for limited containment. Completely break the female horse until she becomes very gentle, whereas you or anybody can ride her in her comfort. Breed the mare and the stud until you have the desired offspring. Then, you can turn the stud to freedom until you need him again. Train the female horse whereby she will eat out of your hand, and she will in turn train the infant horse to eat out of your hand, also. When it comes to breaking the uncivilized nigger, use the same process, but vary the degree and step up the pressure, so as to do a complete reversal of the mind. Take the meanest and most restless nigger, strip him of his clothes in front of the remaining male niggers, the female, and the nigger infant, tar and feather him, tie each leg to a different horse faced in opposite directions, set him afire and beat both horses to pull him apart in front of the remaining niggers. The next step is to take a bullwhip and beat the remaining nigger males to the point of death, in front of the female and the infant. Don’t kill him, but PUT THE FEAR OF GOD IN HIM, for he can be useful for future breeding.

THE BREAKING PROCESS OF THE AFRICAN WOMAN

Take the female and run a series of tests on her to see if she will submit to your desires willingly. Test her in every way, because she is the most important factor for good economics. If she shows any sign of resistance in submitting completely to your will, do not hesitate to use the bullwhip on her to extract that last bit of [b----] out of her. Take care not to kill her, for in doing so, you spoil good economics. When in complete submission, she will train her offsprings in the early years to submit to labor when they become of age. Understanding is the best thing. Therefore, we shall go deeper into this area of the subject matter concerning what we have produced here in this breaking process of the female nigger. We have reversed the relationship; in her natural uncivilized state, she would have a strong dependency on the uncivilized nigger male, and she would have a limited protective tendency toward her independent male offspring and would raise male offsprings to be dependent like her. Nature had provided for this type of balance. We reversed nature by burning and pulling a civilized nigger apart and bullwhipping the other to the point of death, all in her presence. By her being left alone, unprotected, with the MALE IMAGE DESTROYED, the ordeal caused her to move from her psychologically dependent state to a frozen, independent state. In this frozen, psychological state of independence, she will raise her MALE and female offspring in reversed roles. For FEAR of the young male’s life, she will psychologically train him to be MENTALLY WEAK and DEPENDENT, but PHYSICALLY STRONG. Because she has become psychologically independent, she will train her FEMALE offsprings to be psychologically independent. What have you got? You’ve got the nigger WOMAN OUT FRONT AND THE nigger MAN BEHIND AND SCARED. This is a perfect situation of sound sleep and economics. Before the breaking process, we had to be alertly on guard at all times. Now, we can sleep soundly, for out of frozen fear his woman stands guard for us. He cannot get past her early slave-molding process. He is a good tool, now ready to be tied to the horse at a tender age. By the time a nigger boy reaches the age of sixteen, he is soundly broken in and ready for a long life of sound and efficient work and the reproduction of a unit of good labor force. Continually through the breaking of uncivilized savage niggers, by throwing the nigger female savage into a frozen psychological state of independence, by killing the protective male image, and by creating a submissive dependent mind of the nigger male slave, we have created an orbiting cycle that turns on its own axis forever, unless a phenomenon occurs and re-shifts the position of the male and female slaves. We show what we mean by example. Take the case of the two economic slave units and examine them close.

THE NEGRO MARRIAGE

We breed two nigger males with two nigger females. Then, we take the nigger male away from them and keep them moving and working. Say one nigger female bears a nigger female and the other bears a nigger male; both nigger females—being without influence of the nigger male image, frozen with a independent psychology—will raise their offspring into reverse positions. The one with the female offspring will teach her to be like herself, independent and negotiable (we negotiate with her, through her, by her, negotiates her at will). The one with the nigger male offspring, she being frozen subconscious fear for his life, will raise him to be mentally dependent and weak, but physically strong; in other words, body over mind. Now, in a few years when these two offsprings become fertile for early reproduction, we will mate and breed them and continue the cycle. That is good, sound and long range comprehensive planning.

WARNING: POSSIBLE INTERLOPING NEGATIVES

Earlier, we talked about the non-economic good of the horse and the nigger in their wild or natural state; we talked out the principle of breaking and tying them together for orderly production. Furthermore, we talked about paying particular attention to the female savage and her offspring for orderly future planning, then more recently we stated that, by reversing the positions of the male and female savages, we created an orbiting cycle that turns on its own axis forever unless a phenomenon occurred and reshifts positions of the male and female savages. Our experts warned us about the possibility of this phenomenon occurring, for they say that the mind has a strong drive to correct and re-correct itself over a period of time if it can touch some substantial original historical base; and they advised us that the best way to deal with the phenomenon is to shave off the brute’s mental history and create a multiplicity of phenomena of illusions, so that each illusion will twirl in its own orbit, something similar to floating balls in a vacuum. This creation of multiplicity of phenomena of illusions entails the principle of crossbreeding the nigger and the horse as we stated above, the purpose of which is to create a diversified division of labor; thereby creating different levels of labor and different values of illusion at each connecting level of labor. The results of which is the severance of the points of original beginnings for each sphere illusion. Since we feel that the subject matter may get more complicated as we proceed in laying down our economic plan concerning the purpose, reason and effect of crossbreeding horses and niggers, we shall lay down the following definition terms for future generations. Orbiting cycle means a thing turning in a given path. Axis means upon which or around which a body turns. Phenomenon means something beyond ordinary conception and inspires awe and wonder. Multiplicity means a great number. Means a globe. Crossbreeding a horse means taking a horse and breeding it with an ass and you get a dumb, backward, ass long-headed mule that is not reproductive nor productive by itself. Crossbreeding niggers mean taking so many drops of good white blood and putting them into as many nigger women as possible, varying the drops by the various tone that you want, and then letting them breed with each other until another circle of color appears as you desire. What this means is this: Put the niggers and the horse in a breeding pot, mix some asses and some good white blood and what do you get? You got a multiplicity of colors of ass backward, unusual niggers, running, tied to backward ass long-headed mules, the one productive of itself, the other sterile. (The one constant, the other dying, we keep the nigger constant for we may replace the mules for another tool) both mule and nigger tied to each other, neither knowing where the other came from and neither productive for itself, nor without each other.

CONTROLLED LANGUAGE

Crossbreeding completed, for further severance from their original beginning, WE MUST COMPLETELY ANNIHILATE THE MOTHER TONGUE of both the new nigger and the new mule, and institute a new language that involves the new life’s work of both. You know language is a peculiar institution. It leads to the heart of a people. The more a foreigner knows about the language of another country the more he is able to move through all levels of that society. Therefore, if the foreigner is an enemy of the country, to the extent that he knows the body of the language, to that extent is the country vulnerable to attack or invasion of a foreign culture. For example, if you take a slave, if you teach him all about your language, he will know all your secrets, and he is then no more a slave, for you can’t fool him any longer, and BEING A FOOL IS ONE OF THE BASIC INGREDIENTS OF ANY INCIDENTS TO THE MAINTENANCE OF THE SLAVERY SYSTEM. For example, if you told a slave that he must perform in getting out “our crops” and he knows the language well, he would know that “our crops” didn’t mean “our crops” and the slavery system would break down, for he would relate on the basis of what “our crops” really meant. So you have to be careful in setting up the new language; for the slaves would soon be in your house, talking to you as “man to man” and that is death to our economic system. In addition, the definitions of words or terms are only a minute part of the process. Values are created and transported by communication through the body of the language. A total society has many interconnected value systems. All the values in the society have bridges of language to connect them for orderly working in the society. But for these language bridges, these many value systems would sharply clash and cause internal strife or civil war, the degree of the conflict being determined by the magnitude of the issues or relative opposing strength in whatever form. For example, if you put a slave in a hog pen and train him to live there and incorporate in him to value it as a way of life completely, the biggest problem you would have out of him is that he would worry you about provisions to keep the hog pen clean, or the same hog pen and make a slip and incorporate something in his language whereby he comes to value a house more than he does his hog pen, you got a problem. He will soon be in your house.Additional Note: “Henty Berry, speaking in the Virginia House of Delegates in 1832, described the situation as it existed in many parts of the South at this time: “We have, as far as possible, closed every avenue by which light may enter their (the slaves) minds. If we could extinguish the capacity to see the light, our work would be complete; they would then be on a level with the beasts of the field and we should be safe. I am not certain that we would not do it, if we could find out the process and that on the plea of necessity.” From Brown America, The story of a New Race by Edwin R. Embree. 1931 The Viking Press.

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Reply #292 posted 02/18/11 1:24pm

Bohemian67

avatar

Wow, I had no idea people can still talk so much about colour. I didn't know it mattered anymore.

The Beautiful ones....Valentine's Day... Misty and Prince....now that's a treat. razz

"Free URself, B the best that U can B, 3rd Apartment from the Sun, nothing left to fear" Prince Rogers Nelson - Forever in my Life -
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Reply #293 posted 02/18/11 1:37pm

2elijah

OldFriends4Sale said:

LOL ^^^ ok I'll leave u unlone ... it can be hard to admit agreeing with a wrong statement.

Batty, Jason STATED that was the reason you have lighter skinned Egyptians, because they were raped. ... what u clapped it up for. I stated other facts of mixing that took place between Romans Ethiopians Greeks Hebrews Egyptians/Nubians Arabs

BS You praise Jason because you thought he was in agreement with u. And you didn't take the time to read the idiotic uneducated post full of racist idealogy. the stuff u clapped it up for ...

If the information is historically and factually WRONG, then how is it REAL? It's FALSE

Jason put me in CHECK? LMAO how? But posting WRONG information based on stuff he didn't study at all? You both better lotion your ass cheeks because I'm pulling out my leather paddle ... Jason jumped ship cause he knew is ignorant a$$ put some stupid garbage out there ... that you clapped it up for... yes sa massa

Oh cut with the "You can't deal with..." crap I'm still RIGHT here, posting and challenging hon

Where's Jason the one who believes it's always been blacks lot in life to be slaves... the one u clapped it up for

[Edited 2/18/11 11:05am]

lol Dude the only one with a batty-twisted, color-struck, self-hating mind is you, which is why you are fighting so hard to prove your BS and jumping on Jason, me and anyone else challenging you on your misinformed bs. You're pissed off because a white guy put your ass in check. You try to twist his words to make him look stupid, to hide your own misinformed bs, you're spreading all over this thread. Your self-hatred is obvious as you work overtime to "whitewash" your own African-ancestry, yet think you can speak on behalf of Black Americans, a group you choose not to identify with, but yet, think you are qualified to speak on their behalf.

If you were that "secure" about the information you've posted here, you wouldn't keep chasing my posts to no end, getting your blood pressure raised, and trying to use me and Jason as bait, to cover up your misinformed BS. Like I said, you're pissed off like hell because a white male (Jason) called you on your misinformed BS and handed your misinformed ass to you on a silver platter...lol Kind of hard for your ego take that , isn't it? lol Again, have a blessed day, I'm sure you'll respond...as usual. lol

[Edited 2/18/11 13:49pm]

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Reply #294 posted 02/18/11 1:47pm

Tremolina

2elijah said:

Tremolina said:

Just because people were taught something that is racist and wrong, doesn't make it okay to keep that evil idea that you are "either this or that" and nothing in between alive and well. Using that logic, we shouldn't blame white supramecists for being racist either, when they apply the one drop rule. Hell, they were taught to think that way and black people do it too, so?

lol I never said it was okay dude. Seriously, where did you get that from in my post? Not all Black people believe in that bs rule, which was designed by groups that had the mentality of white supremacists. The "fact" of the matter is, many groups in this society are already conditioned with that type of mentality, and no one "ever" said it was okay. Hatrina was just pointing out the views of many within society, regarding that one-drop rule; she never said she believed in it, but the unfortunate fact is, that type of mentality is deeply ingrained in the minds of many within American society, just like white supremacists actually believe they are from some twilight-zone superior race. Neither is okay.

[Edited 2/18/11 9:08am]

Actually I was adressing Haterina, not you, "dudette", but it's not correct that Haterina was "just pointing out the views of many within society" when she said "News Flash dear... [...] if you are talking about heritage...the percentage of Blackness doesn't matter either. Especially, in the United States of America because no matter the percentage...if there is a percentage...as history has proven over and over and over and over and over and over and over...again...you're Black!"

That's the one drop rule in its very own essence, which isn't only applied by many, but - as Haterina shows on this thread - she herself also apllies on any American who has any percentage of African heritage in their blood (TW, TM etc.). I pointed this out to Haterina, that this is basically the same idea as white supremacists have applied for ages and which lies at the core of all the hardships that were endured by African Americans because of slavery and segregation, to which she herself, however, hasn't responded yet. So if you don't mind, I will wait for her word on it, instead of taking yours in her name, which by the way also makes me wonder why you are offering yourself as her spokesman, when I adressed her post and she can speak for herself. But that aside.

---

[Edited 2/18/11 13:49pm]

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Reply #295 posted 02/18/11 1:52pm

silkylee

DAMN!!!

This thread caught so much momentum I forgot the topic was about Misty!

The woman is fine.

Not to mention she's extremely flexible.

The possibilities. drooling

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Reply #296 posted 02/18/11 1:57pm

2elijah

Tremolina said:

2elijah said:

lol I never said it was okay dude. Seriously, where did you get that from in my post? Not all Black people believe in that bs rule, which was designed by groups that had the mentality of white supremacists. The "fact" of the matter is, many groups in this society are already conditioned with that type of mentality, and no one "ever" said it was okay. Hatrina was just pointing out the views of many within society, regarding that one-drop rule; she never said she believed in it, but the unfortunate fact is, that type of mentality is deeply ingrained in the minds of many within American society, just like white supremacists actually believe they are from some twilight-zone superior race. Neither is okay.

[Edited 2/18/11 9:08am]

Actually I was adressing Haterina, not you, "dudette", but it's not correct that Haterina was "just pointing out the views of many within society" when she said "News Flash dear... [...] if you are talking about heritage...the percentage of Blackness doesn't matter either. Especially, in the United States of America because no matter the percentage...if there is a percentage...as history has proven over and over and over and over and over and over and over...again...you're Black!"

That's the one drop rule in its very own essence, which isn't only applied by many, but - as Haterina shows on this thread - she herself also apllies on any American who has any percentage of African heritage in their blood (TW, TM etc.). I pointed this out to Haterina, that this is basically the same idea as white supremacists have applied for ages and which lies at the core of all the hardships that were endured by African Americans because of slavery and segregation, to which she herself, however, hasn't responded yet. So if you don't mind, I will wait for her word on it, instead of taking yours in her name, which by the way also makes me wonder why you are offering yourself as her spokesman, when I adressed her post and she can speak for herself. But that aside.

---

[Edited 2/18/11 13:49pm]

Of course she can speak for herself, but I'm also sure you're intelligent enough to understand that this is a public forum, and people address various posts, even when a post was not sent directly to them to respond to. I'm sure this is nothing new to you. Have a good day.biggrin

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Reply #297 posted 02/18/11 2:03pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

2elijah said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

LOL ^^^ ok I'll leave u unlone ... it can be hard to admit agreeing with a wrong statement.

Batty, Jason STATED that was the reason you have lighter skinned Egyptians, because they were raped. ... what u clapped it up for. I stated other facts of mixing that took place between Romans Ethiopians Greeks Hebrews Egyptians/Nubians Arabs

BS You praise Jason because you thought he was in agreement with u. And you didn't take the time to read the idiotic uneducated post full of racist idealogy. the stuff u clapped it up for ...

If the information is historically and factually WRONG, then how is it REAL? It's FALSE

Jason put me in CHECK? LMAO how? But posting WRONG information based on stuff he didn't study at all? You both better lotion your ass cheeks because I'm pulling out my leather paddle ... Jason jumped ship cause he knew is ignorant a$$ put some stupid garbage out there ... that you clapped it up for... yes sa massa

Oh cut with the "You can't deal with..." crap I'm still RIGHT here, posting and challenging hon

Where's Jason the one who believes it's always been blacks lot in life to be slaves... the one u clapped it up for

[Edited 2/18/11 11:05am]

lol Dude the only one with a batty-twisted, color-struck, self-hating mind is you, which is why you are fighting so hard to prove your BS and jumping on Jason, me and anyone else challenging you on your misinformed bs. You're pissed off because a white guy put your ass in check. You try to twist his words to make him look stupid, to hide your own misinformed bs, you're spreading all over this thread. Your self-hatred is obvious as you work overtime to "whitewash" your own African-ancestry, yet think you can speak on behalf of Black Americans, a group you choose not to identify with, but yet, think you are qualified to speak on their behalf.

If you were that "secure" about the information you've posted here, you wouldn't keep chasing my posts to no end, getting your blood pressure raised, and trying to use me and Jason as bait, to cover up your misinformed BS. Like I said, you're pissed off like hell because a white male (Jason) called you on your misinformed BS and handed your misinformed ass to you on a silver platter...lol Kind of hard for your ego take that , isn't it? lol Again, have a blessed day, I'm sure you'll respond...as usual. lol

[Edited 2/18/11 13:49pm]

Will you please tell me where absent dude Jason put me in check lol???

His post is full of WRONG information about history and he put me in check?? your laughable

I don't care if he was as KoreanGreekNigerian guy he didn't put me in check, and I'm laughing because you caught with your foot in your mouth and mine in your ....

Aren't YOU the one speaking on behalf of all things BLACK ... are you an Afrocentrist?

Again sugar cain dumplings, You clapped it up for a ignorant racist post ONLY because you thought he was coming for me, you didn't read his uneducated post and now you can concede to the FACT that your wrong. Plain and simple. And I'm going to keep responding

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Reply #298 posted 02/18/11 2:08pm

OldFriends4Sal
e

HatrinaHaterwitz said:

OldFriends4Sale said:

spit I know some self-hating people who like to think that but that still doesn't make it so. shrug

http://www.loyno.edu/~kch...oles2.html

Creoles

Origin

The term Creole can create some difficulty in determining one's actual race due to the origin of the word and different uses it has to describe race. The earliest recollection of the word creole comes in the early 16th century from Garcilaso de la Vega. In his book, "Royal Commentaries of the Incas and General History of Peru," Garcilaso de la Vega tells us that the word criollos or criollas was first invented by the Negroes to mean a Negro born in the Indies. Its use was devised to distinguish between Negros born in the Indies compared to those that were born in the New World since the former were held in high honor since they were born in their own country. He later goes on to state that the Spanish copied the term from the Negroes to describe people born in the new world. This means that all people born in the New World, both Spaniards and Guinea Negroes, were now considered criollo.


The other origin of the word criollo comes from Father J. de Acosta in 1590. De Acosta decided that mixed breeds from the New World were neither Spanish, African on Indian, meaning that they had no race. De Acosta decided to identify them as criollos, which came from the Latin word crear, meaning create. From that time, and approximately the next 250 years, Creole (or criollo) referred to not a color or race, but a person that was born in the New World.

The word also has many meanings throughout the different parts of the world. In the 16th century the term was used in parts of the United States to describe native born persons who were descendants of French, Spanish and Portuguese who were settlers in Latin America, the West Indies and Southern United States. In Louisiana, specifically they were French speaking white descendants of early French and Spanish settlers. These creoles settled between Baton Rouge, Louisiana and the Gulf Coast and small communities in eastern Missouri and Southern Alabama.

They were considered elite members of society and they celebrated their French culture and lived according to the mannerisms and traditions of European society. Many of them refused to learn English and remained loyal to the colonies. Once the Spanish took possession of New Orleans, they began to use Criollo with regards to the French. The term was later adopted and became Creole. The French and Spanish born in Nouvelle Orleans were then considered Creoles while those born in the Old World were simply called French or Spanish. The French Creoles were skeptical of the New Americans who were migrating from Kentucky and other parts of the United States. They considered them uncouth and irreligious. They maintained a strict separation in New Orleans by living in one part of the city east of Canal Street while the New Americans settled west of Canal Street. The New Americans were appalled at the way of life in Creole society. They were disturbed by the dominance of the French language, the number of free people of color and the way slaves were allowed to practice African traditions. Louisiana was unlike any place in the United States at the time because of the racial makeup. French men often took African women as mistresses or common law wives and sometimes married them.

Louisiana Creoles "Free People of Color"

When the French settlers moved to Louisiana, the placage system was set up due to a shortage of accessible white women. The French wanted to expand its population in the new world, however men were not expected to marry until their early thirties and premarital sex was inconceivable. African woman soon became the concubines of white male colonists, which in some cases they happened to be sons of noblemen, military men, plantation owners, etc. Soon, wealthy white Creole men would marry and, in some cases, they would possess two families. One with the white woman they were legally married to, and one with their mistress of color. The offspring from their mistresses were then grouped into a new class of creoles known as gens de couleur, or free people of color. This class of people would soon expand when refugees from Haiti and other French speaking colonies would migrate to New Orleans, effectively creating a new middle class between the white French Creoles and slaves.

This class of colored people was unique to the South as they were not in the same category as African slaves. They were elite members of society who were often leaders in business, agriculture, politics, and the arts. At one time the center of their residential community was the French Quarter.

Many were educated, owned their own property and businesses. Additionally, some were even slave-owners. They formed a third class in the slave society. This meant that pre-civil war race was mainly divided into four categories. These were white, black, creoles, and free people of color. French Creoles objected to the fact that the term Creole was used to describe Free People of Color but their culture and ideals were often mirrored by them. French Creoles spoke French while Black Creoles spoke Louisiana Creole which was a mixture of English, French, African or Spanish. The end of the civil war was a threat to the Louisiana Creoles of Color because this brought about the two-tiered class system that existed in the rest of the country that was divided predominately by race: black and white.

Stop trying to claim a group of people that don't identify as Black-American. I thought we were the land of the Free. But your a 1 Droppist so someone with 1/16th black is still black to you.

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Reply #299 posted 02/18/11 3:08pm

jason7sh

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Trying to have an intelligent dialogue about race & ethnicity with OldFriends4Sale is like trying

to figure out which trailor park in America he is from, it's just plain confusing and worthless. I've

never stated that Egyptians never enslaved anyone, however, the slavery that they participated in

can not compare with the evil and dehumanizing acts done by some of my English ancestors. If I could

pay reparations for what took place, I would.

This entire topic has morphed into a historical nightmare all because a few dipsticks could not accept

Sheila E as an African American. This type of bigotry is so sad. To all the African Americans on this sight

please be advised that all White people don't think the same because I'm totally opposed to some of this

racist and bigoted historical revisionism.

Jason
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