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3121 said: Dave1992 said: Of course we hear it, but I suppose you also know something about harmonics and composition when you play those instruments and that is why the comparison is completely irrelevant in this case. No professional guitarist would ever say that it was interntional to play those three notes in a similar way and then to take it further to the dominant the same cadenza over and over again (especially in Just My Imagination). To make it short, there are hundreds of songs that use the same three notes in a certain cadenza or have a similar "sound" to it, because of measure-accents, arrangements etc., but it would be irrelevant to do so, because we only have 12 notes in our staves and because it is completely natural for a musician like Prince, who has played thousands of spontanious solos in his life, to produce something that resembles a past work. However, as I already pointed out, if you want to capture a certain emotion and want to solo to a climax, what Prince did is kind of the best and standard way to do it (in both Just My Imagination and Crimson And Clover), without belittling his brilliance, though! There are certain points in here that couldnt really follow. dave. Im not sure if its perhaps a language/translation problem we are experiencing. For instance, here, in musical terms, a 'stave' denotes what music notation is written on. It doesnt determine a key or the amount of tones contained within it. In that regard, a stave could contain as many or as few notes as the music requires. I am aware that different countries use and share different terminology for music transcript. I do not mention this to be petty but i think it may perhaps illuminate where the difference in our understanding lies. also, it could be that i mis-interpret a point that you make simply through our respective languages. To look at the music in such a technical way is perhaps what seperates what we are experiencing. Im am not looking at the composition as harmonic intervals between notes. To me that exercise is just mathmatics and total strips music of what its essential value. I am able to do that as i can sight read music to grade 8 level. however, that isnt what excites or draws me to music and it certainly isnt how i draw comparison or appreciate music. I prefer to consider music by how it makes me feel upon hearing it. the rest is irrelevant to me. In that sense, the two compositions discussed in the thread share so much to my mind. Its more than the solo.. im not listening for a carbon copy or a repeated cadenza.. a note for note transcript or harmonic comparisons. They exist, i am sure. No, for me, Its tension and relief within the music. the control. the euphoria, the depression - the feeling. The two songs could be brothers. they share so, so much. I fully appreciate all that you say. you clearly understand music theory. Trying to convince me that what i hear isnt there would be a pointless exercise. as i imagine it would be with you. Its all part of the subjective beauty of the individuals musical experience. I have very much enjoyed reading yours and others remarks and interpretations of the music as it is for you. [Edited 1/8/10 6:22am] Thanks for the response. No, I did mean to use the word stave. Turkish staves, for instance, make it possible to produce "eighth tones", which takes their stave up to 96 notes. This all excludes octaves, because a D remains a D for the ear, of course. Unfortunately, a discussion makes it nearly impossible to support our thesis by personal feelings we get when we listen to a song, because everything we have encountered in our lives, the place we heard a song for the first time, the way we felt when we did, the colours we feel when we listen to it again, ... all comes from personal experience and there is no way to be "right" or "wrong" and, for that matter, no reason for discussion. As cold as it may sound, it leaves us with nothing but Maths and technical arguments; in the end that is what writing music is about. The rest comes from personal experience and a song-writer will have a very hard time trying to convince listeners with his own personal experience. The music has to be good, technically, and there is a way to learn how to make it sound good. Again - pop music, that is. . [Edited 1/8/10 7:32am] |
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Good thread, but I don't think they sound a like at all. Just My Imagination had been his best solo IMO, but Crimson & Clover, Whole Lotta Love(Alladin Version) have done something to me. As a guitarist the tone Prince achieves at times are sick!!!!! | |
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The solos are similar as far as I'm concerned, but I have to say that I didn't really notice it until it was pointed out to me. The guitar tone and emotion of the Small Club performance have always been what makes that show my Holy Grail. I'm cranking Crimson And Clover right now. Seems I have a new found respect for the track. 
Now I have to dig out the Ellen Show audio and blast it too. If prince.org were to be made idiot proof, someone would just invent a better idiot. | |
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squirrelgrease said: The solos are similar as far as I'm concerned, but I have to say that I didn't really notice it until it was pointed out to me. The guitar tone and emotion of the Small Club performance have always been what makes that show my Holy Grail. I'm cranking Crimson And Clover right now. Seems I have a new found respect for the track.
Now I have to dig out the Ellen Show audio and blast it too. 
as much as i love the 'just my imagination' solo on 'small club', I think that it is eclipsed by the one on 'still would stand all time'. That is just euphoric to me. Gotta agrre, though, the tone of his guitar throughout that show is sick  Such an incredible performance. Has anybody on the org ever come forward and claimed they were there that night? | |
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3121 said: squirrelgrease said: The solos are similar as far as I'm concerned, but I have to say that I didn't really notice it until it was pointed out to me. The guitar tone and emotion of the Small Club performance have always been what makes that show my Holy Grail. I'm cranking Crimson And Clover right now. Seems I have a new found respect for the track.
Now I have to dig out the Ellen Show audio and blast it too.
as much as i love the 'just my imagination' solo on 'small club', I think that it is eclipsed by the one on 'still would stand all time'. That is just euphoric to me. Gotta agrre, though, the tone of his guitar throughout that show is sick Such an incredible performance. Has anybody on the org ever come forward and claimed they were there that night?Yes. A few years ago an orger told his story. Hopefully someone remembers the thread and can dig it up. If prince.org were to be made idiot proof, someone would just invent a better idiot. | |
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