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Prince Doesn't Hate The Bootleg Market...He's Jealous Of It It hit me earlier in a thread when a DVD vs the overpriced and underwhelming Opus was discussed.
Ernest L Sewell, IV
Confessions Of A Prince Realist. You might want to sit down for this. "An ass hanging out on stage is an ass hanging out on stage. Period." | |
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I totally see your point and agree with you. I wish we would get pro shot concerts and tours. Hell, even Janet Jackson, Madonna, Britney, AC/DC, Aerosmith, and Journey have released decent DVDs and videos that contain their tours.
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I do not always agree with you but I think this is a good post. At the end of the day we can always theorise as to what Prince's motives are for his attitude towards releasing his material is.
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I know for one I would be waiting in line to buy his stuff if he had. I don't like the new bootlegs as they are not soundboard or anything like that. They dont have any bass or thump the sound is really thin. Now I'm kind of waining out of the live bootleg stuff ebcause of it unless it's a show that I hear is really awesome. When we say that the purpose of life is to find God, surely that desire to find God is an escape from life -Conciouscontact
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I would have remained a relatively casual fan if I had never heard the boots and heard what he and his bands can really do. Every now and then
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funksoldier said: These are a few thoughts of mine.
Prince has been hugely successful always doing things his own way. He feels no need to change. He likes not doing what the others do and rebels against anyone telling him what to do. "I don't need you to tell me, what clothes to wear" springs to mind. He likes to be mysterious. He likes the idea of holding things back. Releasing everything means there is nothing more to give. It maintains interest in him. He is in show business. He knows bootlegs exist and he realizes that the hardcore will be able to access it. I don't think he has too much issue with that anymore. In a way you've backwardly agreed with what I said. I'll explain. His idea of holding back, and being a rebel is the exactly thing that has enticed and created the bootleg market itself. He wants to sit on a Diamonds and Pearls video? Well fuck him, WE'LL put it out for the fans. He wants to sit on a CBII release to clean up the market a bit more? Fine, we'll dig and find the best copies of "Computer Blue" and "Old Friends 4 Sale" we can, and we'll trade that. He feels no need to change? It's passive. The air of mystery he's tried to create (and let's face it, that faded 15 years ago at least) has only added to the fuel that is the fire of bootlegging. I think he has huge issue with bootlegs. The simple fact that he shuts down a fan site shows that his controlling nature starts with simple things, and the implication is that if he gets all butt hurt over a fan site, then he's definitely going to have a broken dick over a bootlegged show being out there in the masses hands. And there's not a damn thing he can do to control or change that. I think, again, that's why he's had some lock down of everything (youTube, etc). He's just throwing a fit. The biggest, and saddest, note of rebellion he has is how he's rebelled against his fans. We bought Paisley Park, we bought his homes, we paid for his cars, and everything else. If he never had a hit, or been a nobody, he'd have nothing. I don't want him kissing our ass, and I don't need a pass to go into PP without notice, but at least acknowledge the fans in a better way than a lawsuit, or another website scam promising huge things and delivering nothing. Although I'm not a NIN fan, Trent Reznor is spot on. He's SO interactive w/ his fans, he's given away songs to be remixed in Apple's GarageBand (TWO songs from With Teeth), and gave away an album or two as well. Any hardcore NIN fan was probably more than grateful for that. You think Prince would EVER do that to just say "Hey, thanks. This one is on me?" Hellz no. People can piss on Wendy and Lisa, or The Family, all the wish, but the fact is people gravitate toward those people not because they were once part of Prince's camp, but because they have built that history w/ the fans being part of Prince's camp, but have continued that on to a new level. They're NICE people. Prince once said he understands a fan's need for things. I question whether he really does, especially in this day and age. W&L understand that. The Family understands that. They're not they only ones, I'm just using them as examples. (NIN is an example of that too of course.) Ernest L Sewell, IV
Confessions Of A Prince Realist. You might want to sit down for this. "An ass hanging out on stage is an ass hanging out on stage. Period." | |
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Anotherwontdare said: I would have remained a relatively casual fan if I had never heard the boots and heard what he and his bands can really do.
That's exactly what I meant. I was pretty hard core back in the day, but my first boot was The Black Album in 1987, while in the Navy. In fact, a friend in the Navy who is now on the Org gave it to me. (Thanks to the Org, we reconnected after 20 years of missing each other over the years...he's not that big of an internet guy, I am.) It was when I got the Black Album that I knew there was tons more out there. That pushed me into an even bigger realm of fandom (like you and others for sure.) Ernest L Sewell, IV
Confessions Of A Prince Realist. You might want to sit down for this. "An ass hanging out on stage is an ass hanging out on stage. Period." | |
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funksoldier said: I do not always agree with you but I think this is a good post. At the end of the day we can always theorise as to what Prince's motives are for his attitude towards releasing his material is.
These are a few thoughts of mine. Prince has been hugely successful always doing things his own way. He feels no need to change. He likes not doing what the others do and rebels against anyone telling him what to do. "I dont need you to tell me, what clothes to wear" springs to mind. He likes to be mysterious. He likes the idea of holding things back. Releasing everything means there is nothing more to give. It maintains interest in him. He is in show business. He knows bootlegs exist and he realises that the hardcore will be able to access it. I dont think he has too much issue with that anymore. Can we stop with the Prince is a rebel routine? He's aligning himself with corporate interests and using them to attack his fans. He's part of the machine he spent his whole life battling. That is reality. 2009: Mermaids and Dolphins... | |
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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: Can we stop with the Prince is a rebel routine? He's aligning himself with corporate interests and using them to attack his fans. He's part of the machine he spent his whole life battling. That is reality.
Yep, and that's why he lost his mojo years ago. Ernest L Sewell, IV
Confessions Of A Prince Realist. You might want to sit down for this. "An ass hanging out on stage is an ass hanging out on stage. Period." | |
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ernestsewell said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: Can we stop with the Prince is a rebel routine? He's aligning himself with corporate interests and using them to attack his fans. He's part of the machine he spent his whole life battling. That is reality.
Yep, and that's why he lost his mojo years ago. If Prince doesn't stay on top of what's his then who will. He's not like most artists living off an advance for the next cd. If he's not tkaing care of his business then nobody will. I've seen you make that statement a few times before. What keeps you around then? You're obviously not expecting some great "comeback" from Prince. I'm being curious not critical because a lot of orgers share your sentiment but they're still fans. [Edited 9/29/09 15:55pm] I've got a new thread and a dildo 4 U. If U don't like the new thread then U can go fuck yourself! | |
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HonestMan13 said: ernestsewell said: Yep, and that's why he lost his mojo years ago. If Prince doesn't stay on top of what's his then who will. He's not like most artists living off an advance for the next cd. If he's not tkaing care of his business then nobody will. I've seen you make that statement a few times before. What keeps you around then? You're obviously not expecting some great "comeback" from Prince. I'm being curious not critical because a lot of orgers share your sentiment but they're still fans. [Edited 9/29/09 15:55pm] fans who will do everything they can not to enable his maniacal behavior. I didn't sign up for lotus, won't purchase anything Prince ever until he appologizes and stops his bullshit. I'm OK never giving him one red cent ever again 2009: Mermaids and Dolphins... | |
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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: HonestMan13 said: If Prince doesn't stay on top of what's his then who will. He's not like most artists living off an advance for the next cd. If he's not tkaing care of his business then nobody will. I've seen you make that statement a few times before. What keeps you around then? You're obviously not expecting some great "comeback" from Prince. I'm being curious not critical because a lot of orgers share your sentiment but they're still fans. [Edited 9/29/09 15:55pm] fans who will do everything they can not to enable his maniacal behavior. I didn't sign up for lotus, won't purchase anything Prince ever until he appologizes and stops his bullshit. I'm OK never giving him one red cent ever again What does P have to apologize for? I have no problem with someone choosing not to support someone, but why should he apologize for anything? The worst thing I think he's done was Crystal Ball (as for marketing). The rest of it has been pretty fair to me. Sure, I feel disappointed in LotusFlow3r.com, but I chose to spend $77 and got the shirt, downloads and videos as promoted, but that's all that was advertised. **--••--**--••**--••--**--••**--••--**--••**--••-
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daPrettyman said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: fans who will do everything they can not to enable his maniacal behavior. I didn't sign up for lotus, won't purchase anything Prince ever until he appologizes and stops his bullshit. I'm OK never giving him one red cent ever again What does P have to apologize for? I have no problem with someone choosing not to support someone, but why should he apologize for anything? The worst thing I think he's done was Crystal Ball (as for marketing). The rest of it has been pretty fair to me. Sure, I feel disappointed in LotusFlow3r.com, but I chose to spend $77 and got the shirt, downloads and videos as promoted, but that's all that was advertised. apologize for trying to shut down the fansites for one. He demanded the sites tell him how they were going to compensate him for pictures of people's tatoos. Legally Prince doesn't even know what rights he does and does not have. he simply had the monetary might to try and extort money from the sites. If he wants to blame websherriff for this draconian approach, then at least admit he fucked up in using them. He owes the fans appologies for so much more but he can start right there. 2009: Mermaids and Dolphins... | |
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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: HonestMan13 said: If Prince doesn't stay on top of what's his then who will. He's not like most artists living off an advance for the next cd. If he's not tkaing care of his business then nobody will. I've seen you make that statement a few times before. What keeps you around then? You're obviously not expecting some great "comeback" from Prince. I'm being curious not critical because a lot of orgers share your sentiment but they're still fans. [Edited 9/29/09 15:55pm] fans who will do everything they can not to enable his maniacal behavior. I didn't sign up for lotus, won't purchase anything Prince ever until he appologizes and stops his bullshit. I'm OK never giving him one red cent ever again :claps: [Edited 9/29/09 16:41pm] a yo prince im really happy for you imma let you finish but Michael Jackson had one of the best records of all time! | |
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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: daPrettyman said: What does P have to apologize for? I have no problem with someone choosing not to support someone, but why should he apologize for anything? The worst thing I think he's done was Crystal Ball (as for marketing). The rest of it has been pretty fair to me. Sure, I feel disappointed in LotusFlow3r.com, but I chose to spend $77 and got the shirt, downloads and videos as promoted, but that's all that was advertised. apologize for trying to shut down the fansites for one. He demanded the sites tell him how they were going to compensate him for pictures of people's tatoos. Legally Prince doesn't even know what rights he does and does not have. he simply had the monetary might to try and extort money from the sites. If he wants to blame websherriff for this draconian approach, then at least admit he fucked up in using them. He owes the fans appologies for so much more but he can start right there. I get ur point. However, I still don't think he owes us an apology. I think he did all of the fan site thing so people won't be giving his music away for free. If you notice, Warners did the same thing on youtube as Prince. I don't see a problem with him wanting compensation for the broadcast of his material, but I do have a problem when he releases songs like "Pfunk" (as it was originally called). I still can't stand listening to that song because of the sentiment behind it. I have suspicion that P has a bunch of lawyers working for him that put a lot of stuff in his ear. **--••--**--••**--••--**--••**--••--**--••**--••-
U 'gon make me shake my doo loose! Check out my new Avon site | |
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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: daPrettyman said: What does P have to apologize for? I have no problem with someone choosing not to support someone, but why should he apologize for anything? The worst thing I think he's done was Crystal Ball (as for marketing). The rest of it has been pretty fair to me. Sure, I feel disappointed in LotusFlow3r.com, but I chose to spend $77 and got the shirt, downloads and videos as promoted, but that's all that was advertised. apologize for trying to shut down the fansites for one. He demanded the sites tell him how they were going to compensate him for pictures of people's tatoos. Legally Prince doesn't even know what rights he does and does not have. he simply had the monetary might to try and extort money from the sites. If he wants to blame websherriff for this draconian approach, then at least admit he fucked up in using them. He owes the fans appologies for so much more but he can start right there. amen! Tell it like it is! I'm starting to get tired of this "prince can't do no wrong" BS and I agree with you I think prince should make a video himself and put it on YouTube making a public apologie to the fans reguarding lotusflower and for suing his own fanbase like that he really needs to get his act together or else his fanbase will drop and no fanbase means no cash or support it was his fans that made him what he is now and he should NEVER forget that a yo prince im really happy for you imma let you finish but Michael Jackson had one of the best records of all time! | |
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Prince doesn't have to apologize to anybody for taking control of his own business practices. If you don't like his business methods then don't support him with your money. R.Kelly pissed on a teenager and I no longer buy his CDs. If you feel Prince has committed some legal affront to you then go through the justice system for compensation/retribution.
I've got a new thread and a dildo 4 U. If U don't like the new thread then U can go fuck yourself! | |
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what could possibly be holding him back from releasing stuff you want???? THE B EST
I wish him the worst of luck for the rest of his life....******..I've been ther | |
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myfavorite said: what could possibly be holding him back from releasing stuff you want????
this is what is so stupid about the ENTIRE THING. He does all these backflips to get money for stupid ass pictures of tattoos enflaming and enraging the base, but that base would do backflips to max out their credit cards if he just released shit! It's insane. It's like a man with a PHD trying to make his wealth from walking the streets collecting cans from trashcans for recycling money! 2009: Mermaids and Dolphins... | |
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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: this is what is so stupid about the ENTIRE THING. He does all these backflips to get money for stupid ass pictures of tattoos enflaming and enraging the base, but that base would do backflips to max out their credit cards if he just released shit! It's insane. It's like a man with a PHD trying to make his wealth from walking the streets collecting cans from trashcans for recycling money!
That is brilliant, and spot on! Ernest L Sewell, IV
Confessions Of A Prince Realist. You might want to sit down for this. "An ass hanging out on stage is an ass hanging out on stage. Period." | |
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ernestsewell said: SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: this is what is so stupid about the ENTIRE THING. He does all these backflips to get money for stupid ass pictures of tattoos enflaming and enraging the base, but that base would do backflips to max out their credit cards if he just released shit! It's insane. It's like a man with a PHD trying to make his wealth from walking the streets collecting cans from trashcans for recycling money!
That is brilliant, and spot on! I mean it just isn't that hard to grasp! 2009: Mermaids and Dolphins... | |
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I don't think he's jealous, I just think he don't like people putting out his art without his content or permission. He should have some type of share of the profits. It's about ownership 4 him. The bootleg market is messing up his money but, then again he has so much amazing work that he may feel that it's not gonna do nothing except build it up even more. I think he could use the bootleg market to his advantage. I think he knows this as well. I think tha fansites could have worked side-by-side with his official site. Prince didn't and still does not have forums on his official site. It's stuff like this could have work well 4 him. He could have done it his way. The Housequake fansite was the perfect site and the best site on Prince besides his offical site. Those sites could have work hand-and-hand. I really wished that would have happen bcuz the sites could benefit from it in a heartbeat and (more importantly) the fans could benefit from this. Over the last 10 years Prince has put out stuff from the vault that we thought didn't exist nor know nothing about. He's teased us with some of the cool stuff sitting there in the vault. He has so many projects and songs sitting there that it would not hurt putting some of it out but, I guess he feels like 'y should I put it out?'. 'I still have so much 2 say now just like I did b4'. I think he wants 2 put out his art his way and does not feel that somebody else should leak nor profit off his art. I think in some ways, he is being foolish and selfish about some of things he's been doing in regards 2 his art and protecting it. It's so many things right now that he could do on his official site that (I think) could benefit him and could hurt the bootleg market but, hey I'm just a fan voicing my opinion. | |
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sms130 said: I don't think he's jealous, I just think he don't like people putting out his art without his content or permission. He should have some type of share of the profits. It's about ownership 4 him. The bootleg market is messing up his money but, then again he has so much amazing work that he may feel that it's not gonna do nothing except build it up even more. I think he could use the bootleg market to his advantage. I think he knows this as well. I think tha fansites could have worked side-by-side with his official site. Prince didn't and still does not have forums on his official site. It's stuff like this could have work well 4 him. He could have done it his way. The Housequake fansite was the perfect site and the best site on Prince besides his offical site. Those sites could have work hand-and-hand. I really wished that would have happen bcuz the sites could benefit from it in a heartbeat and (more importantly) the fans could benefit from this. Over the last 10 years Prince has put out stuff from the vault that we thought didn't exist nor know nothing about. He's teased us with some of the cool stuff sitting there in the vault. He has so many projects and songs sitting there that it would not hurt putting some of it out but, I guess he feels like 'y should I put it out?'. 'I still have so much 2 say now just like I did b4'. I think he wants 2 put out his art his way and does not feel that somebody else should leak nor profit off his art. I think in some ways, he is being foolish and selfish about some of things he's been doing in regards 2 his art and protecting it. It's so many things right now that he could do on his official site that (I think) could benefit him and could hurt the bootleg market but, hey I'm just a fan voicing my opinion.
How about he go after the bootleggers. It's the equivalent of locking up the person who buys a dime bag and never catching the drug dealers themselves. 2009: Mermaids and Dolphins... | |
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dontcha think him appearing so retentive in fact creates interest enough for fans to seek out his underground stuff? perhaps calculating in itself | |
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sms130 said: I don't think he's jealous, I just think he don't like people putting out his art without his content or permission. He should have some type of share of the profits. It's about ownership 4 him.
... I guess he feels like 'y should I put it out?'. 'I still have so much 2 say now just like I did b4'. I think he wants 2 put out his art his way and does not feel that somebody else should leak nor profit off his art. "What kind of fuck ending is that?" | |
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SupaFunkyOrgangrinderSexy said: funksoldier said: I do not always agree with you but I think this is a good post. At the end of the day we can always theorise as to what Prince's motives are for his attitude towards releasing his material is.
These are a few thoughts of mine. Prince has been hugely successful always doing things his own way. He feels no need to change. He likes not doing what the others do and rebels against anyone telling him what to do. "I dont need you to tell me, what clothes to wear" springs to mind. He likes to be mysterious. He likes the idea of holding things back. Releasing everything means there is nothing more to give. It maintains interest in him. He is in show business. He knows bootlegs exist and he realises that the hardcore will be able to access it. I dont think he has too much issue with that anymore. Can we stop with the Prince is a rebel routine? He's aligning himself with corporate interests and using them to attack his fans. He's part of the machine he spent his whole life battling. That is reality. He has never directly attacked me and I have more bootlegs than I have actually listened to or watched. Okay, he might have closed down some things that I liked to visit but in my opinion, and that’s all it is, an opinion, that's his right. He is the one with the talent, the brand to protect, not me. I wouldn’t like anyone to tell me how to manage my career. So what if NIN have a different model? I hope its working for them. I think that Prince has earned the right to do things as he damn/care well likes. You know, when I listen to a boot from the early eighties I can't get my head around just how long he has been doing this stuff. He is from the old school and has decided that the new school is not really a format he wants to participate fully in. I can deal with that. I am grateful that boots exist, it has taken my appreciation of music (not just Prince) to a whole new level (and I would like to take this op to thank all of you that have got involved over the years) That said, I was a massive fan before I found out about them. I actually like the fact that I know what he can do and others don't. It’s why I don’t feel too bad about the 77 dollars. Over the years I know I have heard things that Prince didn’t want me to. A little bit of karma. u don't really know me, u just think u do | |
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HonestMan13 said: Prince doesn't have to apologize to anybody for taking control of his own business practices. If you don't like his business methods then don't support him with your money. R.Kelly pissed on a teenager and I no longer buy his CDs. If you feel Prince has committed some legal affront to you then go through the justice system for compensation/retribution.
When I got all of my bootlegs I was essentially stealing from Prince and he's been good about not having me arrested. I consider us even, if anything at all. People Call me Rude
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funksoldier said: Prince has been hugely successful always doing things his own way.
WRONG. © Bart Van Hemelen
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HonestMan13 said: Prince doesn't have to apologize to anybody for taking control of his own business practices. If you don't like his business methods then don't support him with your money. R.Kelly pissed on a teenager and I no longer buy his CDs. If you feel Prince has committed some legal affront to you then go through the justice system for compensation/retribution.
When I got all of my bootlegs I was essentially stealing from Prince and he's been good about not having me arrested. I consider us even, if anything at all. I don't think bying bootlegs is stealing, because If he puts out an official DVD or CD (in better quality) of anything I already have on a bootleg, I would buy it. And I know that anyone on the .org would do the same ! How beautiful do the words have to B, before they conquer every heart | |
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BartVanHemelen said: funksoldier said: Prince has been hugely successful always doing things his own way.
WRONG. I think, when you look back over his entire career, he can be described as hugely successful and that he always does things his own way. Ups and downs yes but overall a success. You may feel he could have been more successful, as may I, but I think its diffciult to argue against the premise that Prince has been hugely successful or that he has done things that he didnt want to do. u don't really know me, u just think u do | |
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