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Reply #60 posted 09/30/05 9:04am

TonyVanDam

avatar

BlaqueKnight said:

I know I rarely ever post on this side of the site, but I was wondering (for the audioheads out there) who do you think Prince's best engineer was? Although I wasn't very fond of the material of that period, I thought Femi Jiya did a hell of a job on everything he touched of Prince's. Anybody else?


Susan Rogers (from Purple Rain to The Black Album) & Peggy Mac(1999).

And don't forget about Jamie Starr (Dirty Mind)! biggrin
[Edited 9/30/05 9:06am]
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Reply #61 posted 09/30/05 10:28am

madhouseman

TonyVanDam said:

BlaqueKnight said:

I know I rarely ever post on this side of the site, but I was wondering (for the audioheads out there) who do you think Prince's best engineer was? Although I wasn't very fond of the material of that period, I thought Femi Jiya did a hell of a job on everything he touched of Prince's. Anybody else?


Susan Rogers (from Purple Rain to The Black Album) & Peggy Mac(1999).

And don't forget about Jamie Starr (Dirty Mind)! biggrin
[Edited 9/30/05 9:06am]


Peggy engineered a lot of Purple Rain (along with her hubby David). She also worked on ATWIAD and Parade. In fact, there were times that Susan and Peggy were tagteaming the production of Parade. Real quick story about the recording of Parade...

The rhythm track (drums) of the first three songs were recorded straight thru in a row with no other instruments for reference. He was hearing it all (including the change in the songs) in his head. Now that is an amazing musician.
The expanded version of my book PRINCE and The Purple Rain Era Studio Sessions 1983-1984 was released in November 2018. (www.amazon.com/gp/product/1538114623/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_bibl_vppi_i0) or www.facebook.com/groups/1...104195943/
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Reply #62 posted 09/30/05 11:47pm

whodknee

Seems to me that only Prince could tell you who the best engineer was. Since the albums are his vision he's the only one that could say whether the results were positive or negative.

I'm sure he's had some good ones-- having to work the odd hours and meet his demands can't be easy. If they weren't very competent I'm sure he'd lose patience and we'd never have heard of them. Hell, that could happen no matter how good they are I suppose.
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Reply #63 posted 10/01/05 5:36am

dmsr74

NPG2045 said:

I love the work he did with Susan Rogers, I haven't seen him mentioned, but what do u guys think of HM Buff?


i worked with him, he's a very nice guy!
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Reply #64 posted 10/01/05 6:10am

amo84

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I'd like to know how big a role the engineers played in prince's recordings, when prince himself Produced, arranged, composed and performed the albums, what exactly do they do, which prince couldnt himself? (dont shoot me, im not an expert) batman
The Beautiful Ones
always smash the picture
always everytime
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Reply #65 posted 10/01/05 6:13am

amo84

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dmsr74 said:

NPG2045 said:

I love the work he did with Susan Rogers, I haven't seen him mentioned, but what do u guys think of HM Buff?


i worked with him, he's a very nice guy!


u've worked with him, are u an succesfull musician?
The Beautiful Ones
always smash the picture
always everytime
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Reply #66 posted 10/01/05 9:19am

madhouseman

amo84 said:

I'd like to know how big a role the engineers played in prince's recordings, when prince himself Produced, arranged, composed and performed the albums, what exactly do they do, which prince couldnt himself? (dont shoot me, im not an expert) batman


An engineer is responsible for making sure things are recorded at the proper levels, that the musician can get the sounds they need (fx, distortion, reverb, flanging, etc.), make sure that the tracks are modulated, that there isn't any sort of phasing that eliminates sounds, puts the tape on the machine, hooks up the instruments, patches the board for new sounds, programs loops or triggers on drum kits, labels the tracks, puts reference tone down on the tape, set up for mixing (and often times smooths out a rough mix) and a few other things. If editing is being done, sets up the computer (and in the old days edits it with a razor-hence the credit for 'Dave the Blade' on Purple Rain), backs up the work done that day, gets the tapes from the vault, fills out the paperwork, adds his or her opinion, sometimes adds their sound to the song if requested (Femi Jiya is on some Batman tracks), and finds ways to get the sounds that the musician may need. For instance, if Prince said he wanted something different sounding (like a toilet flushing in the song 'Tricky') he can patch a microphone down the hall to record the natural reverb in the bathroom of a toilet being flushed.

Overall, engineers are solution people. They are responsible for making sure the artist can take the sounds they hear in their head and translate them to tape. If they can't, then they find a way to get as close as possible. The best ones bring something that the artist didn't expect to the table and if he likes it, it ends up on the song.

I'm sure there are other things the engineers do, but I can't think of them at the moment.
The expanded version of my book PRINCE and The Purple Rain Era Studio Sessions 1983-1984 was released in November 2018. (www.amazon.com/gp/product/1538114623/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_bibl_vppi_i0) or www.facebook.com/groups/1...104195943/
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Reply #67 posted 10/02/05 1:26pm

amo84

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An engineer is responsible for making sure things are recorded at the proper levels, that the musician can get the sounds they need (fx, distortion, reverb, flanging, etc.), make sure that the tracks are modulated, that there isn't any sort of phasing that eliminates sounds, puts the tape on the machine, hooks up the instruments, patches the board for new sounds, programs loops or triggers on drum kits, labels the tracks, puts reference tone down on the tape, set up for mixing (and often times smooths out a rough mix) and a few other things. If editing is being done, sets up the computer (and in the old days edits it with a razor-hence the credit for 'Dave the Blade' on Purple Rain), backs up the work done that day, gets the tapes from the vault, fills out the paperwork, adds his or her opinion, sometimes adds their sound to the song if requested (Femi Jiya is on some Batman tracks), and finds ways to get the sounds that the musician may need. For instance, if Prince said he wanted something different sounding (like a toilet flushing in the song 'Tricky') he can patch a microphone down the hall to record the natural reverb in the bathroom of a toilet being flushed.

Overall, engineers are solution people. They are responsible for making sure the artist can take the sounds they hear in their head and translate them to tape. If they can't, then they find a way to get as close as possible. The best ones bring something that the artist didn't expect to the table and if he likes it, it ends up on the song.

I'm sure there are other things the engineers do, but I can't think of them at the moment.[/quote]

thank u very much, that's alot..
The Beautiful Ones
always smash the picture
always everytime
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Reply #68 posted 10/03/05 7:05pm

engineer9

amo84 said:

An engineer is responsible for making sure things are recorded at the proper levels, that the musician can get the sounds they need (fx, distortion, reverb, flanging, etc.), make sure that the tracks are modulated, that there isn't any sort of phasing that eliminates sounds, puts the tape on the machine, hooks up the instruments, patches the board for new sounds, programs loops or triggers on drum kits, labels the tracks, puts reference tone down on the tape, set up for mixing (and often times smooths out a rough mix) and a few other things. If editing is being done, sets up the computer (and in the old days edits it with a razor-hence the credit for 'Dave the Blade' on Purple Rain), backs up the work done that day, gets the tapes from the vault, fills out the paperwork, adds his or her opinion, sometimes adds their sound to the song if requested (Femi Jiya is on some Batman tracks), and finds ways to get the sounds that the musician may need. For instance, if Prince said he wanted something different sounding (like a toilet flushing in the song 'Tricky') he can patch a microphone down the hall to record the natural reverb in the bathroom of a toilet being flushed.

Overall, engineers are solution people. They are responsible for making sure the artist can take the sounds they hear in their head and translate them to tape. If they can't, then they find a way to get as close as possible. The best ones bring something that the artist didn't expect to the table and if he likes it, it ends up on the song.

I'm sure there are other things the engineers do, but I can't think of them at the moment.


thank u very much, that's alot..[/quote]

Wow. Madhouseman, I don't know if you worked for Prince, but you were obviously an audio engineer (like Jesss above as well). My guess is that you worked for P.P. but are keeping it on the D.L. and that is cool. I've read a few of the other responses you've made in other topics and it is obvious that you were involved with at least some of the recordings of his. Either that, or you know A LOT of people up there! lol. It's funny, there are certain people who post on here that seem to know what time it is. DavidEye, BorisFishPaw and you seem to have nailed a lot of the information. I know that some of it is listed in books out there and some of the books really get it. The books D.M.S.R., A Pop Life and Possessed all get large parts of the reality of working with the man right. Possessed gets a lot of crap from diehards, but I can tell you that he really hit many of the stories on the head (and still missed a bunch of even worse stories) and at the same time got some really sweet stuff right like when he celebrated Susan Rogers buying a house. The man ran HOT and COLD, sometimes in only a few minutes time. Yes there is a large turnover and notice there aren't many people that have come back (except for Eric Leeds, Sheila and Femi, I can think of very few, but Femi is the only engineer I can think of). People who work there usually get burned out and need to leave. The definitive book on Prince hasn't been written but if you blend those three books, you may get an idea of what it is like to be one of his engineers or employees.

Now be honest Madhousmman. Did you work for Paisley?
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Reply #69 posted 10/03/05 10:03pm

prettymansson

love this post...i did some work out at paisley...and spent a bit of time with the man...i agree that things can get "pretty odd" in chanhasen lol
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Reply #70 posted 10/03/05 10:34pm

ufoclub

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so many ex-employees.... so little new bootlegs.... neutral
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Reply #71 posted 10/04/05 5:13am

amo84

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prettymansson said:

love this post...i did some work out at paisley...and spent a bit of time with the man...i agree that things can get "pretty odd" in chanhasen lol

'the man'....have u ben around prince!? that's fucking cool!!
batman
The Beautiful Ones
always smash the picture
always everytime
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Reply #72 posted 10/04/05 2:52pm

Jestyr

engineer9 said:

amo84 said:

An engineer is responsible for making sure things are recorded at the proper levels, that the musician can get the sounds they need (fx, distortion, reverb, flanging, etc.), make sure that the tracks are modulated, that there isn't any sort of phasing that eliminates sounds, puts the tape on the machine, hooks up the instruments, patches the board for new sounds, programs loops or triggers on drum kits, labels the tracks, puts reference tone down on the tape, set up for mixing (and often times smooths out a rough mix) and a few other things. If editing is being done, sets up the computer (and in the old days edits it with a razor-hence the credit for 'Dave the Blade' on Purple Rain), backs up the work done that day, gets the tapes from the vault, fills out the paperwork, adds his or her opinion, sometimes adds their sound to the song if requested (Femi Jiya is on some Batman tracks), and finds ways to get the sounds that the musician may need. For instance, if Prince said he wanted something different sounding (like a toilet flushing in the song 'Tricky') he can patch a microphone down the hall to record the natural reverb in the bathroom of a toilet being flushed.

Overall, engineers are solution people. They are responsible for making sure the artist can take the sounds they hear in their head and translate them to tape. If they can't, then they find a way to get as close as possible. The best ones bring something that the artist didn't expect to the table and if he likes it, it ends up on the song.

I'm sure there are other things the engineers do, but I can't think of them at the moment.


thank u very much, that's alot..


Wow. Madhouseman, I don't know if you worked for Prince, but you were obviously an audio engineer (like Jesss above as well). My guess is that you worked for P.P. but are keeping it on the D.L. and that is cool. I've read a few of the other responses you've made in other topics and it is obvious that you were involved with at least some of the recordings of his. Either that, or you know A LOT of people up there! lol. It's funny, there are certain people who post on here that seem to know what time it is. DavidEye, BorisFishPaw and you seem to have nailed a lot of the information. I know that some of it is listed in books out there and some of the books really get it. The books D.M.S.R., A Pop Life and Possessed all get large parts of the reality of working with the man right. Possessed gets a lot of crap from diehards, but I can tell you that he really hit many of the stories on the head (and still missed a bunch of even worse stories) and at the same time got some really sweet stuff right like when he celebrated Susan Rogers buying a house. The man ran HOT and COLD, sometimes in only a few minutes time. Yes there is a large turnover and notice there aren't many people that have come back (except for Eric Leeds, Sheila and Femi, I can think of very few, but Femi is the only engineer I can think of). People who work there usually get burned out and need to leave. The definitive book on Prince hasn't been written but if you blend those three books, you may get an idea of what it is like to be one of his engineers or employees.

Now be honest Madhousmman. Did you work for Paisley?[/quote]


No. Madhouseman did the research for the book D.M.S.R. by Per Nilsen which detailed much of Prince's recording career up until 1988. He is not an audio engineer. However, I worked at Sunset Sound as an assistant engineer around the time he came in to do some of his research.
[Edited 10/4/05 14:54pm]
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Reply #73 posted 10/04/05 7:57pm

engineer9

Jestyr said:

engineer9 said:



Wow. Madhouseman, I don't know if you worked for Prince, but you were obviously an audio engineer (like Jesss above as well). My guess is that you worked for P.P. but are keeping it on the D.L. and that is cool. I've read a few of the other responses you've made in other topics and it is obvious that you were involved with at least some of the recordings of his. Either that, or you know A LOT of people up there! lol. It's funny, there are certain people who post on here that seem to know what time it is. DavidEye, BorisFishPaw and you seem to have nailed a lot of the information. I know that some of it is listed in books out there and some of the books really get it. The books D.M.S.R., A Pop Life and Possessed all get large parts of the reality of working with the man right. Possessed gets a lot of crap from diehards, but I can tell you that he really hit many of the stories on the head (and still missed a bunch of even worse stories) and at the same time got some really sweet stuff right like when he celebrated Susan Rogers buying a house. The man ran HOT and COLD, sometimes in only a few minutes time. Yes there is a large turnover and notice there aren't many people that have come back (except for Eric Leeds, Sheila and Femi, I can think of very few, but Femi is the only engineer I can think of). People who work there usually get burned out and need to leave. The definitive book on Prince hasn't been written but if you blend those three books, you may get an idea of what it is like to be one of his engineers or employees.

Now be honest Madhousmman. Did you work for Paisley?



No. Madhouseman did the research for the book D.M.S.R. by Per Nilsen which detailed much of Prince's recording career up until 1988. He is not an audio engineer. However, I worked at Sunset Sound as an assistant engineer around the time he came in to do some of his research.
[Edited 10/4/05 14:54pm]


I figured Madhouseman knew something about the process and the people involved. Is that how you two became friends? Were you working for Prince at the time? DMSR seemed like an incredibly detailed book and now that I think about it, most of the book wraps around Prince's recordings. Good job to everyone involved in that book.

It sounds like there are a lot of people who have worked for him on this site.
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Reply #74 posted 10/05/05 12:06am

madhouseman

engineer9 said:

Jestyr said:




No. Madhouseman did the research for the book D.M.S.R. by Per Nilsen which detailed much of Prince's recording career up until 1988. He is not an audio engineer. However, I worked at Sunset Sound as an assistant engineer around the time he came in to do some of his research.
[Edited 10/4/05 14:54pm]


I figured Madhouseman knew something about the process and the people involved. Is that how you two became friends? Were you working for Prince at the time? DMSR seemed like an incredibly detailed book and now that I think about it, most of the book wraps around Prince's recordings. Good job to everyone involved in that book.

It sounds like there are a lot of people who have worked for him on this site.


Thanx for the compliments but, like Jestyr said, I am not an engineer (I am a TV Producer actually). I am a fan who has interviewed many of the people around the man and in the studio about his recordings. Most of my information comes from the hours and days I've spent with many of those with the battle stories! loll. I did spend some time at Sunset Sound but I never worked there. Jestyr did work there with Wendy and Lisa as I recall so I bet he's got some great stories to tell. Engineer9, when did you work with Prince?
The expanded version of my book PRINCE and The Purple Rain Era Studio Sessions 1983-1984 was released in November 2018. (www.amazon.com/gp/product/1538114623/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_bibl_vppi_i0) or www.facebook.com/groups/1...104195943/
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Reply #75 posted 10/05/05 7:21am

Novabreaker

ufoclub said:

so many ex-employees.... so little new bootlegs.... neutral


I know. Sucks, ha?
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Reply #76 posted 10/05/05 12:19pm

JessS

Novabreaker said:

ufoclub said:

so many ex-employees.... so little new bootlegs.... neutral


I know. Sucks, ha?


Apart from the facts that bootlegging tracks you are working on in the studio is a/ illegal , b/ unprofessional , c/ disrespectful , it also pretty much guarantees that should you get caught, you're thru with that artist and anyone else that hears what you've done - don't forget, this is how we make our living. The tracks we work on are all'works in progress', and until the final mix is OK'd, and the artist signs off on them, they shouldn't be released.We are involved in the tracks as much as he is, and we want to get them right before putting them out there, or in P's case, perhaps not putting them out there !!
At PP, security is very strict, and no one leaves there with anything except P. When I was there, apart from the confidentiality agreement, you were also told of the rules regarding copies....so we made aware of the importance and security placed on everythng.
However, others have different forms of security...I worked with the Stones, and at the end of each session, the tapes were put into multiple flight cases, and padlocked, and I was the only one who had the key. This was done mainly because most times, bootlegging is committed by a studio runner, or an assistant.....at PP they don't have either of those types, and apart from the engineers, and the occasional PP helper, no one is allowed into the studios.
The bootlegs of Prince that are out there, if they exist from studio sessions, i can gaurantee, were made by people who no longer work there or anywhere else.
Sorry!!
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Reply #77 posted 10/05/05 6:29pm

ufoclub

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well I'm not condoning endangering your job or professionalism, just hoping that long past ones will surface (or might never be heard otherwise).

The art always outlives/outweighs the law and the artist! Furthermore, I would not be "consuming" current official efforts (dvd's, cd's, club membership, concerts) if I wasn't hooked by the leaked bootlegs of past...


JessS said:

Novabreaker said:



I know. Sucks, ha?


Apart from the facts that bootlegging tracks you are working on in the studio is a/ illegal , b/ unprofessional , c/ disrespectful , it also pretty much guarantees that should you get caught, you're thru with that artist and anyone else that hears what you've done - don't forget, this is how we make our living. The tracks we work on are all'works in progress', and until the final mix is OK'd, and the artist signs off on them, they shouldn't be released.We are involved in the tracks as much as he is, and we want to get them right before putting them out there, or in P's case, perhaps not putting them out there !!
At PP, security is very strict, and no one leaves there with anything except P. When I was there, apart from the confidentiality agreement, you were also told of the rules regarding copies....so we made aware of the importance and security placed on everythng.
However, others have different forms of security...I worked with the Stones, and at the end of each session, the tapes were put into multiple flight cases, and padlocked, and I was the only one who had the key. This was done mainly because most times, bootlegging is committed by a studio runner, or an assistant.....at PP they don't have either of those types, and apart from the engineers, and the occasional PP helper, no one is allowed into the studios.
The bootlegs of Prince that are out there, if they exist from studio sessions, i can gaurantee, were made by people who no longer work there or anywhere else.
Sorry!!
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Reply #78 posted 10/06/05 12:15am

Paisley4u

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DorothyParkerWasCool said:[quote]

JessS said:




eek This is a very accurate post....just to add a personal recollection or two....I recorded the album N.E.W.S., which was cut pretty much 97% live. I had actually got the call from Sheila to come up to PP in January, and from there we changed stuff around, mics, tech stuff, etc., and began recording at a frenetic pace....we cut dozens of tracks, until it was announced , one evening, that we were begining a set project which turned out to be NEWS. In fact, it wasn't until i turned up later at PP after another call, that i realised it had even been made into an album. I made a number of trips to PP as well as working here in LA with him.
I also recorded and mixed different parts of Musicology, but wasn't given a credit. I still can't figure out why that happened, but P was kind enough to notify NARAS of the error, and so i was included on all of the Grammy nominations for that CD.
I can tell you this though..he is a genius, he works to his own beat and schedule, and he can mix the sh*t out of a track...something he doesn't give himself credit for.....
However, it is true that he isn't keen on an engineer with alot of experience...i have 14 grammy nominations, and have been doing this a long time...he treated me with courtesy, grace and charm, but i do know from others, experience can be a problem. Now i have worked with the Stones, Eagles, Aretha, Gabriel, etc and most of those artists relish that kind of experience. However P. seems to find it a hindrance. (ironically, these other artists are extremely intrigued by P and can't wait to know how he works)
Now, as this post means my working days with him are probably over, i would just like to finish with casting my vote for Femi, as he deserves it for no other fact than endurance - not necessarily the best recordings, but what he had to put up with....oi vey, the stories i heard !
and watch out for a track somewhere in the vault called "Funk"....we did it at the same time as Musicology, and it is an unbelieveable piece of invention, and mind blowing playing.I still remain a huge fan, and have nothing but the utmost respect for the man.....you have to respect this kind of talent



[color=darkblue]Excellent post. I wish I could hear that Funk track you speak of. I love to hear first hand recollections of Prince's talent from someone who knows the business. So much better than speculation...


I totaly agree,it's nice 2 hear it from people who
have worked with him,because P fans will always say he is
SO talented wink But once again,we get to hear it from people
who know what they are talking about,Thanx
Love4oneanother
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Reply #79 posted 10/06/05 1:52am

BobGeorge909

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NPG2045 said:

He did Emancipation thru Rave Un2 The Joy Fantastic, I'm not sure who did The Gold Experience, I believe it was Chronic Freeze.

HamsterHuey said:



Did he do Emancipation? Or New Power Soul?

Who did The Gold Experience?



I always Thought Chronic Freeze was Prince...who is it?
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Reply #80 posted 10/07/05 6:47am

amo84

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does anyone know if there are cases of prince engineering some songs on his own, since him being such a control freak, couldnt he get off with doing it himself?p.s. im blond have to ask stupidly sometimes wink
The Beautiful Ones
always smash the picture
always everytime
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Reply #81 posted 10/07/05 10:09am

ufoclub

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Reply #82 posted 10/07/05 10:10am

ufoclub

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I bet much of 1999 and before is witout anyone else.

amo84 said:

does anyone know if there are cases of prince engineering some songs on his own, since him being such a control freak, couldnt he get off with doing it himself?p.s. im blond have to ask stupidly sometimes wink
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Reply #83 posted 10/07/05 11:22am

2freaky4church
1

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Definetly not chronic freez.
All you others say Hell Yea!! woot!
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Reply #84 posted 10/08/05 1:33am

amo84

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ufoclub said:

I bet much of 1999 and before is witout anyone else.

amo84 said:

does anyone know if there are cases of prince engineering some songs on his own, since him being such a control freak, couldnt he get off with doing it himself?p.s. im blond have to ask stupidly sometimes wink



yes, 1999, that album was made very much on his own, ..cool
The Beautiful Ones
always smash the picture
always everytime
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Reply #85 posted 10/08/05 8:06am

madhouseman

amo84 said:

ufoclub said:

I bet much of 1999 and before is witout anyone else.




yes, 1999, that album was made very much on his own, ..cool


No. The 1999 album wasn't done by himself at all. A few of the tracks (1999, LRC and Delerious) were RECORDED in Minneapolis (engineered by Don Batts). The rest of the album was recorded (starting in January of 1982) in Los Angeles at Sunset Sound and was engineered by Peggy McCreary (aka Peggy Mac). For example, the basic tracks for Let's Pretend We're Married were recorded on Tuesday March, 30 1982, and it was engineered by Peggy. She was also around for the additional work done the following day and the recording of many of the other tracks over the next few weeks. She was responsible for setting everything up and making sure everything ran as needed. Although there were times that Prince was alone in the studio, she was still the engineer and would sit in the waiting area knitting sweaters. In Minnepolis, Don Batts would be his personal studio engineer. He would set up the studio, maintain the equipment and mic the instruments as needed for that album, but also for some work on albums by The Time and Vanity 6 as well.

During the recording of Prince's first album at The Record Plant (Oct. - Dec. 1977) in Saulsalito, CA, Prince and his producer Tommy Vicari got into a huge fight because Prince wanted credit for everything, including engineering! That would have eliminated Steve Fontano and Dave Roeder's credit on the album.

Prince cannot completely engineer the tracks himself. Once he gets a groove in his head, he wants someone to make sure that it is recording properly. Yes, there are times that he knows almost as much as the engineers, but odds are, you won't see Prince calibrating the machines, laying down reference tone on the master tape, or detailing the recording logs to send to WB. There is always an engineer somewhere along the line, even if he records the entire song himself, someone else is involved somewhere. That person is the engineer.
The expanded version of my book PRINCE and The Purple Rain Era Studio Sessions 1983-1984 was released in November 2018. (www.amazon.com/gp/product/1538114623/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_bibl_vppi_i0) or www.facebook.com/groups/1...104195943/
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Reply #86 posted 10/08/05 9:38am

ufoclub

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good to know!

I would love to find out how something elaborate like the 12" I Wish u Heaven stuff was put together.

madhouseman said:

amo84 said:




yes, 1999, that album was made very much on his own, ..cool


No. The 1999 album wasn't done by himself at all. A few of the tracks (1999, LRC and Delerious) were RECORDED in Minneapolis (engineered by Don Batts). The rest of the album was recorded (starting in January of 1982) in Los Angeles at Sunset Sound and was engineered by Peggy McCreary (aka Peggy Mac). For example, the basic tracks for Let's Pretend We're Married were recorded on Tuesday March, 30 1982, and it was engineered by Peggy. She was also around for the additional work done the following day and the recording of many of the other tracks over the next few weeks. She was responsible for setting everything up and making sure everything ran as needed. Although there were times that Prince was alone in the studio, she was still the engineer and would sit in the waiting area knitting sweaters. In Minnepolis, Don Batts would be his personal studio engineer. He would set up the studio, maintain the equipment and mic the instruments as needed for that album, but also for some work on albums by The Time and Vanity 6 as well.

During the recording of Prince's first album at The Record Plant (Oct. - Dec. 1977) in Saulsalito, CA, Prince and his producer Tommy Vicari got into a huge fight because Prince wanted credit for everything, including engineering! That would have eliminated Steve Fontano and Dave Roeder's credit on the album.

Prince cannot completely engineer the tracks himself. Once he gets a groove in his head, he wants someone to make sure that it is recording properly. Yes, there are times that he knows almost as much as the engineers, but odds are, you won't see Prince calibrating the machines, laying down reference tone on the master tape, or detailing the recording logs to send to WB. There is always an engineer somewhere along the line, even if he records the entire song himself, someone else is involved somewhere. That person is the engineer.
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Reply #87 posted 10/08/05 3:49pm

shaomi

JessS said:

madhouseman said:

There are a lot of engineers that worked well with him. Peggy Mac was influencial on his sound from Controversy thru Parade. She and her husband David Leonard were often tag teaming Prince's productions, to the point that they were on call whenever he'd be coming to town. When they decided not to move to Minneapolis, they were left behind.

Susan Rogers, although not trained in engineering stepped up to the plate in 1984 and was there for a lot of his best work. Does that make her the best engineer? I'm not sure, but she is listed on most of Prince's best songs.

Don Batts was instrumental in putting together Prince's home studio and making an enviornment that helped Prince create while he was in Minn. Often those tapes were then taken to Los Angeles and worked on by his L.A. teams, but Don was great at creating a place where Prince could wake up in the middle of the night and record.

Each engineer brought different things to Prince. Some (Bob Mockler) were great at bringing out some thick drum sounds. Others (Eddie Miller and Michael Koppelman) were great at programming sounds in the computers. Both of them brought sounds that Prince had never had.

Many of the engineers that Prince has used have not had a ton of experience. Prince likes to have them know how to work the machines, but doesn't like someone knowing more than him. Often, he asks the engineer to set up the board and then tells them to wait outside while he records much of the music himself. He'll even set up a microphone over the console and sing into it, playing with the sound as he is recording it.

Femi brings experience. Although he isn't the only one to bring experience, Prince does respect what Femi does because he brought him back to Paisley Park after he was away for many years.

The frustrating thing to a lot of these engineers is that Prince will do what Prince wants to do, regardless of the engineer. If he gets frustrated, he'll tell them to hurry up because he is "losing the groove" or he'll tell the engineer to set him up to mix, and then show up and demand to record (an entirely different set up) immediately. Most of the engineers or band members for that matter, feel like after working for Prince, they are able to do just about anything, because they become problem solvers for him.

The bottom line is that Prince likes to know as much as the engineer and is often like a sponge when it comes to knowing how these rooms work. When he has a question, he'll ask, but more often than not, he likes to be left alone in the room to make the music he wants to make, without having to explain it to anyone.

The last thing you have to remember, is that often the songs are tag-teamed by engineers. Prince works a lot of hours and often there are 2-3 engineers on a song over the course of several sessions. When it comes to giving credit, it often depends on what Prince's mood is the day he is listing the names for the album. More than once, people who worked on the song are left off because they had recently pissed him off!

The best engineer? Wow. Depends on what Prince wanted that day!



eek This is a very accurate post....just to add a personal recollection or two....I recorded the album N.E.W.S., which was cut pretty much 97% live. I had actually got the call from Sheila to come up to PP in January, and from there we changed stuff around, mics, tech stuff, etc., and began recording at a frenetic pace....we cut dozens of tracks, until it was announced , one evening, that we were begining a set project which turned out to be NEWS. In fact, it wasn't until i turned up later at PP after another call, that i realised it had even been made into an album. I made a number of trips to PP as well as working here in LA with him.
I also recorded and mixed different parts of Musicology, but wasn't given a credit. I still can't figure out why that happened, but P was kind enough to notify NARAS of the error, and so i was included on all of the Grammy nominations for that CD.
I can tell you this though..he is a genius, he works to his own beat and schedule, and he can mix the sh*t out of a track...something he doesn't give himself credit for.....
However, it is true that he isn't keen on an engineer with alot of experience...i have 14 grammy nominations, and have been doing this a long time...he treated me with courtesy, grace and charm, but i do know from others, experience can be a problem. Now i have worked with the Stones, Eagles, Aretha, Gabriel, etc and most of those artists relish that kind of experience. However P. seems to find it a hindrance. (ironically, these other artists are extremely intrigued by P and can't wait to know how he works)
Now, as this post means my working days with him are probably over, i would just like to finish with casting my vote for Femi, as he deserves it for no other fact than endurance - not necessarily the best recordings, but what he had to put up with....oi vey, the stories i heard !
and watch out for a track somewhere in the vault called "Funk"....we did it at the same time as Musicology, and it is an unbelieveable piece of invention, and mind blowing playing.I still remain a huge fan, and have nothing but the utmost respect for the man.....you have to respect this kind of talent


Many thanx 4 sharing ur experience, particularly if u think it might jeopardize any further work 4 Prince. Such in4mations r so great 4 us fans. Thanx!!!
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Reply #88 posted 10/09/05 7:40am

RepoMan

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engineer9 said:

This is why the ORG is so great.


AMP all the way baby. Even with AMP hibernating, if you start a discussion on a subject like that you'll see the real knowledgeable are still around.
Repo Man's got all night, every night.
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Reply #89 posted 10/09/05 10:41am

ufoclub

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some sources say: Dirty Mind the album was recorded at a home studio.

songs supposedly done as home studio recordings (at least their core tracks):

Gigolos Get Lonely too
Jerk Out
Irrisistible Bitch and Feel U up
777-9311
Rasperry Beret
New Position
Strange Relationship
I Could Never Take the Place of your Man
Can't Stop this Feeling I Got
Girl
Horny Toad
Mia Bocca
Girl O' My Dreams
Teacher Teacher
LITTLE RED CORVETTE! (might explain the passionate push of levels into distortion... no engineer would have let that happen out of fear of their rep!)
1999
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