It has been widely agreed upon that Wendy & Lisa were a huge influence on Prince during the Parade/Dream Factory era. This is by far my favourite phase of Prince's music, so when Wendy & Lisa began to release solo albums I relished the prospect of listening to develop this style of music further. However, their albums, to me at least, have displayed little of the creativity of Parade and have been fairly focussed on producing radio-friendly pop. So I guess that either their influence on Prince during the Parade era has been exaggerated, or they have consciously decided on producing material that might gain them some commercial success. I suspect it is the latter. While I can understand this, I personally find it disappointing that we didn't get to see them experiment more and build on the sound they developed with Prince. Does anyone have any thoughts on this matter?

warning2all said:

yes. they were big influences but it's inflated. if anything they were his best collaborators but people give them and the revolution way too much credit...nostalgia and all that

warning2all said:

warning2all said:

Wendy & Lisa's debut album, I thought, continued their "sound", and a logical continuation from "Parade". If you listen to it & "Sign o the Times", bqck to back you can hear what Prince brought to them & what they brought to Prince, and how it is immediately- without- each others sound. After 1987 they both changed. As people do. The Parade/Dream Factory era was lightening in a bottle. Prince went on to write a lot of fine songs and his musicianship got even better, but the quality of music had not the same "magic". The girl's influence is not exaggerated.

You make some good points but I can't escape the overwhelming sense of disappointment I feel that their career did not extend down more creative avenues. If my understanding is correct, they wrote the music for Mountains, which to me is the perfect combination of soul/funk/jazz/weirdness. Also Power Fantastic grew out of one of Lisa's piano compositions. These two facts alone suggest some serious musical talent and it would have been amazng to see this developed over Wendy & Lisa's albums. But I can barely detect a trace of this in their work.

Lisa was with Prince a lot lot during previous albums
She lived with him and they did a lot outside of badmembers
So I don't think she (just popped out of nowhere in 1985) and started having a chemistry with Prince
It started way earlier,
I bleive there are others like Morris Day Dr Fink Sheila E Dez and a few others that were symbiotic persons in the developement of Princes sound/direction

.

I don't think the connection with Wendy & Lisa started for the Parade/Dream Factory sessions
it started in 1983

It was not about 'their sound'
They have said like the other members, and an 2015 BrownMark interview also confirms this
that they all were their to fulflll Prince's vision and direction

So of course styles sounds instruments etc are giong to be brought into 'Prince's vision'

So just because of that doesn't mean we will hear 'Prince' in their albums
.
I read some interviews from them talking about what they went through after the Revolution, how they were being marketed. Those earliest albums were created for what you said Pop Music to make some money. They talked about how they were styled and everything.

.
They also never wante to be 'frontman' performers

'There are a whole lot of frontmen/women who should not be, who would shine better backing someone else up'

They are in a veery successful place now, almost like when they were with Prince -composing etc
I would suspect it would take a while to find their spot.
There are 1000s of people like them, who will neveer get the status acknowledgement because people look at the Brittneys JLo's and Rhianna's in the frontman position.

massing said:

It has been widely agreed upon that Wendy & Lisa were a huge influence on Prince during the Parade/Dream Factory era. This is by far my favourite phase of Prince's music, so when Wendy & Lisa began to release solo albums I relished the prospect of listening to develop this style of music further. However, their albums, to me at least, have displayed little of the creativity of Parade and have been fairly focussed on producing radio-friendly pop. So I guess that either their influence on Prince during the Parade era has been exaggerated, or they have consciously decided on producing material that might gain them some commercial success. I suspect it is the latter. While I can understand this, I personally find it disappointing that we didn't get to see them experiment more and build on the sound they developed with Prince. Does anyone have any thoughts on this matter?

I think this is the case, but not their decision and more like their record company at the time.

motherfunka said:

massing said:

It has been widely agreed upon that Wendy & Lisa were a huge influence on Prince during the Parade/Dream Factory era. This is by far my favourite phase of Prince's music, so when Wendy & Lisa began to release solo albums I relished the prospect of listening to develop this style of music further. However, their albums, to me at least, have displayed little of the creativity of Parade and have been fairly focussed on producing radio-friendly pop. So I guess that either their influence on Prince during the Parade era has been exaggerated, or they have consciously decided on producing material that might gain them some commercial success. I suspect it is the latter. While I can understand this, I personally find it disappointing that we didn't get to see them experiment more and build on the sound they developed with Prince. Does anyone have any thoughts on this matter?

I think this is the case, but not their decision and more like their record company at the time.

I would say their influence on Prince was just that - influence. Their musical ideas and playing aided his own existing inspiration and sent it in directions it probably would not have gone had they not been in the band and close to him. He certainly never really sounded quite the same after they left his camp, so they must have taken something with them, maybe it's an indefinable something, who knows?

For one, I feel that their first two post-Prince albums at least were a good mix of the artistic and commercial pop/ rock, with a satisfying continuation of a lot of the sounds they were exploring when with Prince .

I haven't really heard their post-1990 stuff enough to have a view so far.

[Edited 6/27/15 14:41pm]

Thank you for the replies. I hadn't been aware of the pressure they were under from their record company, but this information really clears things up for me and makes sense of their decision to produce radio-friendly material. From my point of view it's a real shame though, as I feel they had so much more to offer artistically at the time.

Wendy had a big part in the rendition of Sister at the NYC Prince Tribute sung by Bilial

I dont think their influence is exagerated at all. They may have only contributed instruments and writing to a few songs, but they opened Prince up to music styles he was not hip to. As Wendy said in "Song About"..."I gave colors to you you'd never seen...."

UncleJam said:

I dont think their influence is exagerated at all. They may have only contributed instruments and writing to a few songs, but they opened Prince up to music styles he was not hip to. As Wendy said in "Song About"..."I gave colors to you you'd never seen...."

lol........cause Prince had no radio or record stores.

I think Wendy & Lisa brought a lot of great ideas. When I listen to the 84-86 unreleased demos, there's a different sound and vibe. There's big, unusual melodies and harmonies that I never heard in his music before then. Van Hunt said it the best;"There's a sound before Wendy & Lisa, and after".

SPYZFAN1 said:

I think Wendy & Lisa brought a lot of great ideas. When I listen to the 84-86 unreleased demos, there's a different sound and vibe. There's big, unusual melodies and harmonies that I never heard in his music before then. Van Hunt said it the best;"There's a sound before Wendy & Lisa, and after".

You hear it in the 1983/84 music too

We get a big jump in sound from 1999 to Purple Rain, and the ATWIAD is heavily influenced by Purple Rain. the Family Music...

But I'm going to say the 1983/84 period was a beginning of opening up to the band in a bigger way.
Not until that period did we hear (on PR GLife ICC A6) a wide range of sound and instrumentations that never existed in Prince music: like accordions, cellos, violas, violins, congas, string arrangements etc the PR era gave a wide range of music styles too like: Next Time Wipe the Lipstick.. Glamorous Life, Manic Monday, Computer Blue, Purple Rain, In A Spanish Villa, Dance Electric, Our Destiny, Roadhouse Garden, 17 Days, IWD4U, Ice Cream Castles, Erotic City, Noon Rendezvous

And many others that were the result of what I believe is the same explosion of growth diverse sounds and directions.

massing said:

Thank you for the replies. I hadn't been aware of the pressure they were under from their record company, but this information really clears things up for me and makes sense of their decision to produce radio-friendly material. From my point of view it's a real shame though, as I feel they had so much more to offer artistically at the time.

I think it's also the fact that they just weren't as good songwriters as prince. They had (probably still have) a wider range in what they liked to play and their musical palette is definitely broader than Prince's, but his songs were visionary, theirs were a little workmanlike.

These days they do fantastic work as tv composers, but they're stilll bouncing off other people's ideas. I think it's where they work best.

Having said that i'd love to hear a few more pop albums by them, maybe some day...

Those are good points OF4S. The songs you mentioned are great examples.

A little. Clare Fischer string arrangements had a lot to do with interesting sounds of The Family and especially the very ambitious Parade. But, in the end, it is how Prince produced them (and wrote the bulk of).

jaawwnn said:

massing said:

Thank you for the replies. I hadn't been aware of the pressure they were under from their record company, but this information really clears things up for me and makes sense of their decision to produce radio-friendly material. From my point of view it's a real shame though, as I feel they had so much more to offer artistically at the time.

I think it's also the fact that they just weren't as good songwriters as prince. They had (probably still have) a wider range in what they liked to play and their musical palette is definitely broader than Prince's, but his songs were visionary, theirs were a little workmanlike.

These days they do fantastic work as tv composers, but they're stilll bouncing off other people's ideas. I think it's where they work best.

Having said that i'd love to hear a few more pop albums by them, maybe some day...

I prefer what they write now over what he writes. Much more like people who have experienced life.

Cinny - Eric Leeds has as much to do with that Family sound as Claire Fisher. They both brough their own vision and sound to it.

Zannaloaf said:

jaawwnn said:

I think it's also the fact that they just weren't as good songwriters as prince. They had (probably still have) a wider range in what they liked to play and their musical palette is definitely broader than Prince's, but his songs were visionary, theirs were a little workmanlike.

These days they do fantastic work as tv composers, but they're stilll bouncing off other people's ideas. I think it's where they work best.

Having said that i'd love to hear a few more pop albums by them, maybe some day...

I prefer what they write now over what he writes. Much more like people who have experienced life.

I wouldn't disagree with this.

Zannaloaf said:

jaawwnn said:

I think it's also the fact that they just weren't as good songwriters as prince. They had (probably still have) a wider range in what they liked to play and their musical palette is definitely broader than Prince's, but his songs were visionary, theirs were a little workmanlike.

These days they do fantastic work as tv composers, but they're stilll bouncing off other people's ideas. I think it's where they work best.

Having said that i'd love to hear a few more pop albums by them, maybe some day...

I prefer what they write now over what he writes. Much more like people who have experienced life.

Cinny - Eric Leeds has as much to do with that Family sound as Claire Fisher. They both brough their own vision and sound to it.

OMG that's so true! A few years back I was travelling back home listening to music on my iPod and put 20TEN on, I wanted to give it another go and try and get into it a bit more, I think I maybe got half way through and turned it off. I put Wendy & Lisa's 'White Flags Of Winter Chimmneys' on instead. The opening bars of 'Balloon' had more emotional resonance than anything on 20TEN. That's what's been missing from Prince's work for so long. Real emotion that can connect with people.

Wendy & Lisa put their heart and soul into everything they do.

Zannaloaf said:

Cinny - Eric Leeds has as much to do with that Family sound as Claire Fisher. They both brough their own vision and sound to it.

Oh, totally, him too! I just think when people quickly refer back to the GRAND sound of the mid 80s stuff, they quickly attributed the extra instrumentation to their writing or playing.

V10LETBLUES said:

Personnel, age and time matter a lot when it comes to art. Look at a band like Jefferson Starship who recorded wonderful tracks like Miracles in the 70's to truly disgusting dreck like We Built This City in the 80's. That's the same exact trajectory Prince has has been on. Look at the incredible tracks by The Cars in the late 70's/early 80's with Let The Good Times Roll, then finished off with cheesy dreck like You Might Think and all the other mid 80's crap. It happens, maybe it's strictly a factor of age and diminishing mental abilities or sharpness, enthusiasm and care, but cheesy is the way most artists end their careers. Look at Vegas, the dieing grounds of legends.

I think it is a matter of ambition, being "hungry", in the early years for an artist to prove to THEMSELVES what they are capable of.

IMO - Not inflated. They have a unique sound of their own that unfortunately doesn't 'scale'. Lacks the urgency of an attention-seeker w/something to say. They're confident in their own right.

But their collaborations w/other artists always seem to amplify, and call to mind their influence on Prince:

1. Seal - Seal (1991). This one has many 'Parade' moments. The segues, oh the segues! Even when there's an abrupt start, it's a segue.

2. Neil Finn - One Nil (2001). The Tchad Blake years...

3. Grace Jones - Hurricane (2008). Williams Blood - cinematic autobigraphy epic. Grace picked the right team for this. W&L's backing vox are pumped full of soul!

[Edited 7/9/15 5:28am]

S3V3N said:

IMO - Not inflated. They have a unique sound of their own that unfortunately doesn't 'scale'. Lacks the urgency of an attention-seeker w/something to say. They're confident in their own right.

But their collaborations w/other artists always seem to amplify, and call to mind their influence on Prince:

1. Seal - Seal (1991). This one has many 'Parade' moments. The segues, oh the segues! Even when there's an abrupt start, it's a segue.

2. Neil Finn - One Nil (2001). The Tchad Blake years...

3. Grace Jones - Hurricane (2008). Williams Blood - cinematic autobigraphy epic. Grace picked the right team for this. W&L's backing vox are pumped full of soul!

I should check these out. I only ever compared the Revolution output to their work as a pop duo.