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Forums > Politics & Religion > Meghan Markle 'Won't Be Allowed to Be Black Princess' by Royal Family, Experts Say
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Reply #90 posted 12/01/17 6:33am

poppys

Lianachan said:

Here's the levels of don't-give-a-shitness across the UK, broken down by region.

DP9UGcaWAAAht4y.jpg:large

That's interesting. Obviously Americans, vile as we are, had no interest in perpetuating the royal thing once we got the joint.



[Edited 12/1/17 6:40am]

If your last December came, what would u do?
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Reply #91 posted 12/01/17 7:50am

Lianachan

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More detail.


A-nis bidh fios aig daoine nuair a tha mi a 'mionnachadh aig dhaibh.
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Reply #92 posted 12/01/17 10:48am

morningsong

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Lianachan said:

Here's the levels of don't-give-a-shitness across the UK, broken down by region.


DP9UGcaWAAAht4y.jpg:large

Oddly, the BBC can only find fawning lunatics drapped in the Butcher's Apron whenever they interview the public about it.




ETA - Of course, you can extrapolate from that to guess how much of an issue the racial heritage of Meghan Markle is for people here. We don't have anything like the kinds of racial bullshit transpondeans have, and seem to expect of everywhere else.

[Edited 12/1/17 5:19am]



I read that JK Rowling had to come to her defense, but it wasn't regarding her race it was regarding the fact she is a divorcee, her previously being married is more upsetting than her race and I think in this day and age even that is way at the bottom of the list to give a damn about.

“Do I dare Disturb the universe?”
― T.S. Eliot

“Only by acceptance of the past, can you alter it”
― T.S. Eliot
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Reply #93 posted 12/01/17 4:44pm

TonyVanDam

Dasein said:

[Misleading thread title edit - luv4u]


From Newsweek:


"Britain’s relationship with race will change forever," screamed the headline above a
Guardian column after news of Prince Harry's engagement to Meghan Markle broke on
Monday, but the excitement might be premature — Markle will likely be instructed by
royal advisors to hide that she is biracial and probably won't end up doing much to im-
prove the rocky race relations in the United Kingdom, according to two noted British
scholars.

“She won’t be allowed to be a black princess. The only way she can be accepted is to pass
for white,” Kehinde Andrews, an associate professor of sociology at Birmingham City Univer-
sity who launched the first black studies degree in Europe, told Newsweek. “If there are
people who are celebrating, it’s a bit naive, and they’ll be very disappointed.”

Markle, whose mother is black and whose father is white, is being touted by some as a beacon
of progress for the United Kingdom and its royal family, which has an exclusively white
lineage with the exception of Princess Sophie Charlotte, who married King George III in 1761
and was rumored to have African ancestry.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Thoughts?


I'll take a step further in saying that Meghan has lived a white European life years before meeting Prince Harry.


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Reply #94 posted 12/02/17 12:00am

midnightmover

It's a shame that people have to try and turn this into an angry racial issue. The fact that the UK is basically shrugging its shoulders at this wedding is a sign of massive progress in our country.

I'm not a fan of the monarchy, but as a mixed race person myself it's good to know that we have come a long, long way. I can also confirm from direct experience that it's old conservative women that are most thrilled by this marriage. Everyone else is nonplussed.

As for the vital question of whether she's "hot" or not, I can say she's not really my cup of tea, but I'm not the one marrying her.

“The man who never looks into a newspaper is better informed than he who reads them, inasmuch as he who knows nothing is nearer to truth than he whose mind is filled with falsehoods and errors.”
- Thomas Jefferson
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Reply #95 posted 12/02/17 4:45am

deebee

avatar

Dasein said:

deebee said:

From the article:

On Monday, the white neighbor of one of ["noted British scholar" Kehinde] Andrews’s friends was in 'almost mourning' because the royal family should 'reflect the natives of the country,' the neighbor said. 'After all, you wouldn’t have a white person in the Indian royal family,' she added, according to Andrews.

From a Times/YouGov poll on news of the royal engagement:

Pleased: 39%
Disappointed: 4%
Indifferent: 52%

That unlucky friend must be living next door to one of the 4%. I wonder if the 'noted scholar' would like to say a few words about his sampling method. Sounds one notch above "a bloke down the pub told me."


Just to play devil's advocate here: I'm sure the "noted scholar" would question the validity of that
Times/YouGov poll as well!

But, how true is the claim that there are "rocky race relations in the United Kingdom" anyways? I
lived in East Finchley for about a year and remember I didn't feel the same tension in London that
I felt/feel as a Black American. Now, this could all be in my head, but the question remains . . .

I think there's certainly still racism in Britain, but I have heard more than one Black American echo the sentiment that things are better overall. I tend to think it's always bound up with class and geography, though (I would do, as a materialist!), so if you're a young Black man in a poor neighbourhood of a major city, you are likely to face multiple forms of disadvantage in relation to employment, access to education, and certainly policing. The riots a few years back were testament to that, whatever else they became as they went on. And the Grenfell Tower disaster has also thrown into relief the massive inequalities that shape the lived experiences of different social fractions in the same borough.

So I never like to be too complacent or risk overstating the case, but, at the same time, I do think that progress has been made at the level of attitudes and culture during the last 20-30 years. Official tellings of the national story of how Britain 'learned to stop worrying and love multiculturalism' can get rather rose tinted, but there's also something in there that has real roots and is worth defending.

I can't vouch for East Finchley, though! That's Mrs Thatcher's old heartland, which I always associate with the 'blue rinse brigade' (i.e. aging Tory ladies). lol

"Not everything that is faced can be changed; but nothing can be changed until it is faced." - James Baldwin
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Reply #96 posted 12/02/17 12:07pm

deebee

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^ To explain my initial reply a bit more fully, though (which I kind of left hanging as this week's 'to do' list caught up with me!), I suppose I ultimately find all the media chatter about how this announcement and the public response to it shows us 'how far we've progressed' a bit unconvincing and forced. Perhaps it says something about race relations in Britain, but it's all so far removed from everyday reality, especially the material reality people experience - she's a glamorous, attractive actress, who's set to become a fairy-tale princess - that it seems hard to really divine much from it in terms of any real relevance for the wider society. Like, I can't imagine some 17-year-old in Clapham, getting pulled over by the police for the 10th time this week, thinking, "Well, at least things are changing!" When they started earnestly debating it on the news, I found myself longing for the usual fluff about what her frock will be like! lol

That said - though, really, by the same token - the 'second wave' of articles countering the gushingly progressive angle, such as the Newsweek, seem to me similarly to be part of a media debate floating far adrift from any happenings down below, and not really that concerned to look. I mean, you can find pathologically-unhappy Twitter users and bigoted neighbours, sure enough, but I tend to think there's enough 'evidence' out there so as to find that which accords with the particular line a particular pundit is selling. I see an awful lot of faff in the newspapers, but also in academia, these days, and one sees a constant stream of 'bright young things' making a name for themselves selling opinions their audience is keen to buy, and often which suit their class interests; all of which is just the way of the commercial world, but which is part of a social dynamic that's not necessarily the same as genuine inquiry into what's going on.

"Not everything that is faced can be changed; but nothing can be changed until it is faced." - James Baldwin
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Reply #97 posted 12/02/17 12:53pm

maplenpg

deebee said:

^ To explain my initial reply a bit more fully, though (which I kind of left hanging as this week's 'to do' list caught up with me!), I suppose I ultimately find all the media chatter about how this announcement and the public response to it shows us 'how far we've progressed' a bit unconvincing and forced. Perhaps it says something about race relations in Britain, but it's all so far removed from everyday reality, especially the material reality people experience - she's a glamorous, attractive actress, who's set to become a fairy-tale princess - that it seems hard to really divine much from it in terms of any real relevance for the wider society. Like, I can't imagine some 17-year-old in Clapham, getting pulled over by the police for the 10th time this week, thinking, "Well, at least things are changing!" When they started earnestly debating it on the news, I found myself longing for the usual fluff about what her frock will be like! lol

That said - though, really, by the same token - the 'second wave' of articles countering the gushingly progressive angle, such as the Newsweek, seem to me similarly to be part of a media debate floating far adrift from any happenings down below, and not really that concerned to look. I mean, you can find pathologically-unhappy Twitter users and bigoted neighbours, sure enough, but I tend to think there's enough 'evidence' out there so as to find that which accords with the particular line a particular pundit is selling. I see an awful lot of faff in the newspapers, but also in academia, these days, and one sees a constant stream of 'bright young things' making a name for themselves selling opinions their audience is keen to buy, and often which suit their class interests; all of which is just the way of the commercial world, but which is part of a social dynamic that's not necessarily the same as genuine inquiry into what's going on.

So...what doyou think her frock will be like? lol

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Reply #98 posted 12/02/17 2:28pm

poppys

maplenpg said:

deebee said:

^ To explain my initial reply a bit more fully, though (which I kind of left hanging as this week's 'to do' list caught up with me!), I suppose I ultimately find all the media chatter about how this announcement and the public response to it shows us 'how far we've progressed' a bit unconvincing and forced. Perhaps it says something about race relations in Britain, but it's all so far removed from everyday reality, especially the material reality people experience - she's a glamorous, attractive actress, who's set to become a fairy-tale princess - that it seems hard to really divine much from it in terms of any real relevance for the wider society. Like, I can't imagine some 17-year-old in Clapham, getting pulled over by the police for the 10th time this week, thinking, "Well, at least things are changing!" When they started earnestly debating it on the news, I found myself longing for the usual fluff about what her frock will be like! lol

That said - though, really, by the same token - the 'second wave' of articles countering the gushingly progressive angle, such as the Newsweek, seem to me similarly to be part of a media debate floating far adrift from any happenings down below, and not really that concerned to look. I mean, you can find pathologically-unhappy Twitter users and bigoted neighbours, sure enough, but I tend to think there's enough 'evidence' out there so as to find that which accords with the particular line a particular pundit is selling. I see an awful lot of faff in the newspapers, but also in academia, these days, and one sees a constant stream of 'bright young things' making a name for themselves selling opinions their audience is keen to buy, and often which suit their class interests; all of which is just the way of the commercial world, but which is part of a social dynamic that's not necessarily the same as genuine inquiry into what's going on.

So...what doyou think her frock will be like? lol

falloff

If your last December came, what would u do?
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Reply #99 posted 12/03/17 1:58am

maplenpg

In an attempt to respond to the thread honestly though.... I guess I'm one of the minority 44% of northerners that is quite looking forward to the impending royal wedding. I know a disabled athlete who has met Harry at the Invictus Games and speaks very highly of him and Meghan seems lovely. Her heritage and colour are an added bonus. Frankly given all the doom and gloom consuming the news right now, a day that reminds us of love, unity and happiness cannot come too soon.

[Edited 12/3/17 2:10am]

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Reply #100 posted 12/03/17 4:11am

deebee

avatar

maplenpg said:

deebee said:

^ To explain my initial reply a bit more fully, though (which I kind of left hanging as this week's 'to do' list caught up with me!), I suppose I ultimately find all the media chatter about how this announcement and the public response to it shows us 'how far we've progressed' a bit unconvincing and forced. Perhaps it says something about race relations in Britain, but it's all so far removed from everyday reality, especially the material reality people experience - she's a glamorous, attractive actress, who's set to become a fairy-tale princess - that it seems hard to really divine much from it in terms of any real relevance for the wider society. Like, I can't imagine some 17-year-old in Clapham, getting pulled over by the police for the 10th time this week, thinking, "Well, at least things are changing!" When they started earnestly debating it on the news, I found myself longing for the usual fluff about what her frock will be like! lol

That said - though, really, by the same token - the 'second wave' of articles countering the gushingly progressive angle, such as the Newsweek, seem to me similarly to be part of a media debate floating far adrift from any happenings down below, and not really that concerned to look. I mean, you can find pathologically-unhappy Twitter users and bigoted neighbours, sure enough, but I tend to think there's enough 'evidence' out there so as to find that which accords with the particular line a particular pundit is selling. I see an awful lot of faff in the newspapers, but also in academia, these days, and one sees a constant stream of 'bright young things' making a name for themselves selling opinions their audience is keen to buy, and often which suit their class interests; all of which is just the way of the commercial world, but which is part of a social dynamic that's not necessarily the same as genuine inquiry into what's going on.

So...what doyou think her frock will be like? lol


hmmm
It's been mooted on the Twitter....

DPozuyjWkAA5UMJ.jpg

sexy

[Edited 12/3/17 4:29am]

"Not everything that is faced can be changed; but nothing can be changed until it is faced." - James Baldwin
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Reply #101 posted 12/03/17 7:35am

poppys

deebee said:

maplenpg said:

So...what do you think her frock will be like? lol


hmmm
It's been mooted on the Twitter....

DPozuyjWkAA5UMJ.jpg

sexy

Uh oh, they need some Prince wardrobe advice. lol

If your last December came, what would u do?
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Reply #102 posted 12/03/17 10:30pm

maplenpg

deebee said:

maplenpg said:

So...what doyou think her frock will be like? lol


hmmm
It's been mooted on the Twitter....

DPozuyjWkAA5UMJ.jpg

sexy

[Edited 12/3/17 4:29am]

Meghan looks beautiful but Harry... I'm guessing her majesty wouldn't approve lol



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Forums > Politics & Religion > Meghan Markle 'Won't Be Allowed to Be Black Princess' by Royal Family, Experts Say