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Reply #30 posted 08/12/17 10:57am

poppys

NorthC said:

I can't say too much about race relations in th US, but I find the whole issue about the statue interesting. We have a similar issue in Holland. Jan Pieterszoon Coen was the governor of the Dutch East India Company in the 17th century. The company was after the monopoly of the nutmeg trade in the Banda Islands in present day Indonesia, the only place where the nutmeg trees grew. Coen had thousands of people killed to establish the monopoly and laid the foundation of the Dutch colonial empire in Indonesia. He has a statue in his hometown of Hoorn and every so often, you hear about people (usually left wingers) who want it removed and others (usually right wingers) who want to keep it. Even though I usually side with the left, I'd say, keep those statues. If only as a reminder. Whether we like it or not, people like Lee and Coen are part of history and I don't think we should remove all controversial figures from public view and only see history with our own 21st century eyes. But... over here, no one is rioting about it, so in Charlotteville, there must be more to it than just a statue...

Hello North C. There is much more to it than just a statue. In a nutshell, your country (and others) brought slaves to colonialized places, and left when slavery was abolished. Not so with the US. Even if many slave holders were Europeans, some settled here and became Americans. You never had a turf war, we did.

I live in a city that is 56% black, New Orleans. Should our children (of all colors) walk by 150 year old monuments of the Confederacy on their way to school everyday? No, we need to move forward with positive role models here.


[Edited 8/12/17 11:06am]

Kick the old-school joints. For the true funk soldiers.
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Reply #31 posted 08/12/17 10:58am

mjscarousal

SuperFurryAnimal said:



mjscarousal said:


SuperFurryAnimal said:



Trump had to be careful how he addresses it. Obama fanned the flames when he spoke on Baltimore. He just tweeted calling for peace. ANTIFA is also an issue in Merica and probably this reaction is in response to some of ANTIFA.



Obama didn't fan any flames. He was neutral and was pro law enforcement in race vs police relations which really pissed me off during his presidency. As a Black president, he could have advocated more on Black issues and police brutality is definitely one of them. [Edited 8/12/17 10:36am]


It seems like factions of groups are starting to organize by social media and we see more of this violence. I think the President has to be careful how they address the situations. It is complex with ANTIFA and possibly other groups involved. Outside groups were sent into BLM too and we addressed it here in PR.


Calling for Peace and condemning Hate and Violence is good start but not getting into the specific or getting involved when State gov should handle issue. When a riot is starting to breakout all through a city (Baltimore) it is not good to make a blanket statement that group has a reason. It sends the wrong message instead calling for Peace is smart.



No, Obama could have done more for Black people, he is a [Slur snip - luv4u]. I will NEVER forget when he said Black people have an unjust mistrust for law enforcement but I'm quite sure he would have different feelings if his little girl was shot in the back by police.

I've participated and organized protests with BLM and they are all are peaceful. They turn violent because of police and racists that want to start trouble. The police brutality against Black people is real. It dates back to slavery but people want to sweep these issues under the rug.
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Reply #32 posted 08/12/17 11:00am

mjscarousal

poppys said:



NorthC said:


I can't say too much about race relations in th US, but I find the whole issue about the statue interesting. We have a similar issue in Holland. Jan Pieterszoon Coen was the governor of the Dutch East India Company in the 17th century. The company was after the monopoly of the nutmeg trade in the Banda Islands in present day Indonesia, the only place where the nutmeg trees grew. Coen had thousands of people killed to establish the monopoly and laid the foundation of the Dutch colonial empire in Indonesia. He has a statue in his hometown of Hoorn and every so often, you hear about people (usually left wingers) who want it removed and others (usually right wingers) who want to keep it. Even though I usually side with the left, I'd say, keep those statues. If only as a reminder. Whether we like it or not, people like Lee and Coen are part of history and I don't think we should remove all controversial figures from public view and only see history with our own 21st century eyes. But... over here, no one is rioting about it, so in Charlotteville, there must be more to it than just a statue...

Hello North C. There is much more to it than just a statue. In a nutshell, your country (and others)brought slaves to colonialized places, and left when slavery was abolished. Not so with the US. Even if many slave holders were Europeans, some settled here and became Americans. You never had a turf war, we did.

I live in a city that is 56% black. Should our children (of all colors) walk by 150 year old monuments of the Confederacy on their way to school everday? No, we need to move forward with positive role models here.




Thank you!!!
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Reply #33 posted 08/12/17 11:09am

SuperFurryAnim
al

avatar

mjscarousal said:


No, Obama could have done more for Black people, he is a [Slur snip - luv4u]. I will NEVER forget when he said Black people have an unjust mistrust for law enforcement but I'm quite sure he would have different feelings if his little girl was shot in the back by police. I've participated and organized protests with BLM and they are all are peaceful. They turn violent because of police and racists that want to start trouble. The police brutality against Black people is real. It dates back to slavery but people want to sweep these issues under the rug.

Have an exit plan in case a nuke goes off the the real war begins among all the groups the various factions.

I AM AMERICAN. ANTI-COMMUNIST. ANTI-FASCIST.
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Reply #34 posted 08/12/17 11:13am

SuperFurryAnim
al

avatar

[This has nothing to do with the topic, stay on track snip - luv4u]

I AM AMERICAN. ANTI-COMMUNIST. ANTI-FASCIST.
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Reply #35 posted 08/12/17 11:16am

2elijah

avatar

SuperFurryAnimal said:

Generic statement condemning violence, hate and calling for peace is smart. Trump should not even be in the game of speaking on ANTIFA and the Extremist Right.


Oh please, trump promoted the hate rhetoric of the extreme right/white nationalists, during the presidential campaign. Deflect and push the blame on others all you want. That's the kind of president you support. Own it.
'Trump voters got Hoodwinked by Trump' popcorn coke
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Reply #36 posted 08/12/17 11:19am

jjhunsecker

avatar

2elijah said:

poppys said:

Charlottesville City Council recently voted to remove Confederate statues. The kkk et al staged a protest and were outnumbered by a counter protest including little old ladies of all colors. Backlash?

Yep, and the white nationalists were throwing bottles of police. How is it that Melania sent out a tweet and not her husband?? What a crock of bull. All of a sudden he isn't tweeting? This proves he is no leader for 'all' Americans. Some repubs and dems and members of trump admin, are calling for the firing of Bannon. He should have never been part of that administration period. [Edited 8/12/17 9:47am]

Or Sebastian Gorka, who was a member of a Nazi sympathizer party in his native Hungary

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Reply #37 posted 08/12/17 11:21am

jjhunsecker

avatar

SuperFurryAnimal said:

2elijah said:

SuperFurryAnimal said: Brown is Brown dude. Latinos/Hispanics will be the majority. Fact is, white nationalists fear that. Border control will not stop this country from turning Brown.

Who knows 2E it may become vogue to move outta here. I know I have passport ready and places I can move to just in case some sort of Nazi like regime takes over.

Are we sure it hasn't ?

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Reply #38 posted 08/12/17 11:23am

SoulAlive

I predicted that things like this would happen if Trump became president.During his campaign,we saw a lot of this blatant hate and racism at his rallies.He promotes this.
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Reply #39 posted 08/12/17 11:24am

mjscarousal

2elijah said:

SuperFurryAnimal said:

Generic statement condemning violence, hate and calling for peace is smart. Trump should not even be in the game of speaking on ANTIFA and the Extremist Right.


Oh please, trump promoted the hate rhetoric of the extreme right/white nationalists, during the presidential campaign. Deflect and push the blame on others all you want. That's the kind of president you support. Own it.


nod
[Edited 8/12/17 11:24am]
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Reply #40 posted 08/12/17 11:24am

jjhunsecker

avatar

mjscarousal said:

SuperFurryAnimal said:

^^Trump is busy dealing with North Korea.

I don't mind a rally or demonstration but when protesters block roadways and disrupt businesses and are violent it should be ended and sounds like the cops ended it.

They had to bring the national guard out and the governor issued a state of emergency. There is no excuse he should make a statement but I don't expect him too because he is a bigot and doesn't care about race issues. I don't expect a president who calls hispanics rapists to say anything about white supremacists giving hate speeches.

Why does this not surprise me ? :

During a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Va. on Saturday, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke said the event is in line with President Trump’s “promises.”

“This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back,” Duke said. “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back.”

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Reply #41 posted 08/12/17 11:26am

2elijah

avatar

jjhunsecker said:



SuperFurryAnimal said:




2elijah said:


SuperFurryAnimal said: Brown is Brown dude. Latinos/Hispanics will be the majority. Fact is, white nationalists fear that. Border control will not stop this country from turning Brown.


Who knows 2E it may become vogue to move outta here. I know I have passport ready and places I can move to just in case some sort of Nazi like regime takes over.



Are we sure it hasn't ?


I already have a passport. This country is getting crazier everyday. These types of protests in 2017 with a country that is now racially diverse, but can't resolve or discuss race issues, is pathetic. Yet we are suppose to be an example of freedom and tolerance to other countries? Doesn't make sense, that we still have some folks who refuse to accept the existence of other racial/ethnic/cultural/ religious groups.
'Trump voters got Hoodwinked by Trump' popcorn coke
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Reply #42 posted 08/12/17 11:27am

SuperFurryAnim
al

avatar

jjhunsecker said:

mjscarousal said:

SuperFurryAnimal said: They had to bring the national guard out and the governor issued a state of emergency. There is no excuse he should make a statement but I don't expect him too because he is a bigot and doesn't care about race issues. I don't expect a president who calls hispanics rapists to say anything about white supremacists giving hate speeches.

Why does this not surprise me ? :

During a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Va. on Saturday, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke said the event is in line with President Trump’s “promises.”

“This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back,” Duke said. “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back.”

Duke doesn't speak for Trump.

I AM AMERICAN. ANTI-COMMUNIST. ANTI-FASCIST.
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Reply #43 posted 08/12/17 11:27am

mjscarousal

SuperFurryAnimal said:



mjscarousal said:



No, Obama could have done more for Black people, he is a [Slur snip - luv4u]. I will NEVER forget when he said Black people have an unjust mistrust for law enforcement but I'm quite sure he would have different feelings if his little girl was shot in the back by police. I've participated and organized protests with BLM and they are all are peaceful. They turn violent because of police and racists that want to start trouble. The police brutality against Black people is real. It dates back to slavery but people want to sweep these issues under the rug.


Have an exit plan in case a nuke goes off the the real war begins among all the groups the various factions.



And we would have you to blame because you voted for the idiot. The real war is HERE.
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Reply #44 posted 08/12/17 11:28am

2elijah

avatar

jjhunsecker said:



mjscarousal said:


SuperFurryAnimal said:

^^Trump is busy dealing with North Korea.


I don't mind a rally or demonstration but when protesters block roadways and disrupt businesses and are violent it should be ended and sounds like the cops ended it.



They had to bring the national guard out and the governor issued a state of emergency. There is no excuse he should make a statement but I don't expect him too because he is a bigot and doesn't care about race issues. I don't expect a president who calls hispanics rapists to say anything about white supremacists giving hate speeches.

Why does this not surprise me ? :



During a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Va. on Saturday, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke said the event is in line with President Trump’s “promises.”


“This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back,” Duke said. “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back.”



What a fool. This country does not belong to White Americans. If that's the case then change the pledge of allegiance, and national anthem.
'Trump voters got Hoodwinked by Trump' popcorn coke
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Reply #45 posted 08/12/17 11:29am

jjhunsecker

avatar

2elijah said:

jjhunsecker said:

Are we sure it hasn't ?

I already have a passport. This country is getting crazier everyday. These types of protests in 2017 with a country that is now racially diverse, but can't resolve or discuss race issues, is pathetic. Yet we are suppose to be an example of freedom and tolerance to other countries? Doesn't make sense, that we still have some folks who refuse to accept the existence of other racial/ethnic/cultural/ religious groups.

Even Republicans (some) have said these hate greats have become emboldened since the election. They have one of their own- Bannon- sitting right there in the White House !! As much as I disliked George W. Bush= HE would never have had that

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Reply #46 posted 08/12/17 11:30am

jjhunsecker

avatar

2elijah said:

jjhunsecker said:

Why does this not surprise me ? :

During a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Va. on Saturday, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke said the event is in line with President Trump’s “promises.”

“This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back,” Duke said. “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back.”

What a fool. This country does not belong to White Americans. If that's the case then change the pledge of allegiance, and national anthem.

And the question: Take it back from WHOM ? And it give it to WHOM ?

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Reply #47 posted 08/12/17 11:31am

Silvertongue7

SuperFurryAnimal said:



jjhunsecker said:




mjscarousal said:


SuperFurryAnimal said: They had to bring the national guard out and the governor issued a state of emergency. There is no excuse he should make a statement but I don't expect him too because he is a bigot and doesn't care about race issues. I don't expect a president who calls hispanics rapists to say anything about white supremacists giving hate speeches.

Why does this not surprise me ? :



During a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Va. on Saturday, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke said the event is in line with President Trump’s “promises.”


“This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back,” Duke said. “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back.”





Duke doesn't speak for Trump.


Does Trump agree?
Someone's in my body, someone's in my body...
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Reply #48 posted 08/12/17 11:31am

2elijah

avatar

SoulAlive said:

I predicted that things like this would happen if Trump became president.During his campaign,we saw a lot of this blatant hate and racism at his rallies.He promotes this.

Yes and now look what's happening? They had to call the national guard in. Some groups were armed, some had bats, and other kinds of weapons.l, and throwing things at the police, and the police didn't do anything? Go figure. They were slow to react.
[Edited 8/12/17 11:35am]
'Trump voters got Hoodwinked by Trump' popcorn coke
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Reply #49 posted 08/12/17 11:31am

jjhunsecker

avatar

SuperFurryAnimal said:

jjhunsecker said:

Why does this not surprise me ? :

During a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Va. on Saturday, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke said the event is in line with President Trump’s “promises.”

“This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back,” Duke said. “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back.”

Duke doesn't speak for Trump.

But he sure feels a kinship with him, don't he ? Duke LOVES him some Trump !

You need to ask yourself : WHY ??

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Reply #50 posted 08/12/17 11:32am

2elijah

avatar

jjhunsecker said:



2elijah said:


jjhunsecker said:


Why does this not surprise me ? :



During a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Va. on Saturday, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke said the event is in line with President Trump’s “promises.”


“This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back,” Duke said. “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back.”




What a fool. This country does not belong to White Americans. If that's the case then change the pledge of allegiance, and national anthem.

And the question: Take it back from WHOM ? And it give it to WHOM ?


That's what I'm wondering? Where are the Native American groups to denounce this so-called 'taking back?'
'Trump voters got Hoodwinked by Trump' popcorn coke
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Reply #51 posted 08/12/17 11:33am

jjhunsecker

avatar

2elijah said:

SoulAlive said:
I predicted that things like this would happen if Trump became president.During his campaign,we saw a lot of this blatant hate and racism at his rallies.He promotes this.
Yes and now look what's happening? They had to call the national guard in. Some groups were armed, some had bats, and other kinds of weapons.

And these same scumbags were apparently marching around last night with torches, as if they were the villagers hunting down Frankenstein's monster... What a bunch of idiots !

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Reply #52 posted 08/12/17 11:34am

mjscarousal

jjhunsecker said:



mjscarousal said:


SuperFurryAnimal said:

^^Trump is busy dealing with North Korea.


I don't mind a rally or demonstration but when protesters block roadways and disrupt businesses and are violent it should be ended and sounds like the cops ended it.



They had to bring the national guard out and the governor issued a state of emergency. There is no excuse he should make a statement but I don't expect him too because he is a bigot and doesn't care about race issues. I don't expect a president who calls hispanics rapists to say anything about white supremacists giving hate speeches.

Why does this not surprise me ? :



During a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Va. on Saturday, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke said the event is in line with President Trump’s “promises.”


“This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back,” Duke said. “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back.”




That's exactly how Trump won, he won because of hate. This doesn't surprise me, white people feel entitled to everything just because their white. White people want to take America back to slavery and Jim Crow
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Reply #53 posted 08/12/17 11:38am

poppys

jjhunsecker said:

SuperFurryAnimal said:

Duke doesn't speak for Trump.

But he sure feels a kinship with him, don't he ? Duke LOVES him some Trump !

You need to ask yourself : WHY ??

nod Trump has shown his racism for decades now. Built on it and got results.


[Edited 8/12/17 11:40am]

Kick the old-school joints. For the true funk soldiers.
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Reply #54 posted 08/12/17 11:38am

2elijah

avatar

mjscarousal said:

jjhunsecker said:



mjscarousal said:


SuperFurryAnimal said:

^^Trump is busy dealing with North Korea.


I don't mind a rally or demonstration but when protesters block roadways and disrupt businesses and are violent it should be ended and sounds like the cops ended it.



They had to bring the national guard out and the governor issued a state of emergency. There is no excuse he should make a statement but I don't expect him too because he is a bigot and doesn't care about race issues. I don't expect a president who calls hispanics rapists to say anything about white supremacists giving hate speeches.

Why does this not surprise me ? :



During a white nationalist rally in Charlottesville, Va. on Saturday, former Ku Klux Klan leader David Duke said the event is in line with President Trump’s “promises.”


“This represents a turning point for the people of this country. We are determined to take our country back,” Duke said. “We are going to fulfill the promises of Donald Trump. That’s what we believed in. That’s why we voted for Donald Trump, because he said he’s going to take our country back.”




That's exactly how Trump won, he won because of hate. This doesn't surprise me, white people feel entitled to everything just because their white. White people want to take America back to slavery and Jim Crow

Not all white folks, but those in groups like white nationalists, kkk, and related groups, tend to believe in white supremacy ideology. Like I said those particular groups fear the browning of America, and losing majority status by population and politically.
'Trump voters got Hoodwinked by Trump' popcorn coke
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Reply #55 posted 08/12/17 11:39am

mjscarousal

2elijah said:

SoulAlive said:

I predicted that things like this would happen if Trump became president.During his campaign,we saw a lot of this blatant hate and racism at his rallies.He promotes this.

Yes and now look what's happening? They had to call the national guard in. Some groups were armed, some had bats, and other kinds of weapons.l, and throwing things at the police, and the police didn't do anything? Go figure. They were slow to react.
[Edited 8/12/17 11:34am]


But if BLM was out there the police would have been throwing gas canon and pepper spraying us. It's disgraceful how they allowed those racists whites to do that. The police could have done more but the protesters were not black so they weren't a threat. confused
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Reply #56 posted 08/12/17 11:42am

mjscarousal

2elijah said:

mjscarousal said:



That's exactly how Trump won, he won because of hate. This doesn't surprise me, white people feel entitled to everything just because their white. White people want to take America back to slavery and Jim Crow

Not all white folks, but those in groups like white nationalists, kkk, and related groups, tend to believe in white supremacy ideology. Like I said those particular groups fear the browning of America, and losing majority status by population and politically.


There were educated white people who don't participate in those groups that voted for Donald Trump that believe in these same ideologies.
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Reply #57 posted 08/12/17 11:43am

poppys

jjhunsecker said:

2elijah said:

jjhunsecker said: What a fool. This country does not belong to White Americans. If that's the case then change the pledge of allegiance, and national anthem.

And the question: Take it back from WHOM ? And it give it to WHOM ?

Some people ignore that part completely.

Kick the old-school joints. For the true funk soldiers.
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Reply #58 posted 08/12/17 11:44am

2elijah

avatar

mjscarousal said:

2elijah said:


Yes and now look what's happening? They had to call the national guard in. Some groups were armed, some had bats, and other kinds of weapons.l, and throwing things at the police, and the police didn't do anything? Go figure. They were slow to react.
[Edited 8/12/17 11:34am]


But if BLM was out there the police would have been throwing gas canon and pepper spraying us. It's disgraceful how they allowed those racists whites to do that. The police could have done more but the protesters were not black so they weren't a threat. confused

Someone mentioned something like that on one of the news stations. They were inquiring why the police didn't react right away or were slow to react when bottles, and other items were being thrown at them. Especially when it got so bad the National guard, had to be called in, and a state of emergency declared, that quickly. Law was aware of the groups, that were going to show up but looks like they didn't really prepare for it, the way they should have.
[Edited 8/12/17 11:46am]
'Trump voters got Hoodwinked by Trump' popcorn coke
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Reply #59 posted 08/12/17 11:47am

jjhunsecker

avatar

poppys said:

jjhunsecker said:

But he sure feels a kinship with him, don't he ? Duke LOVES him some Trump !

You need to ask yourself : WHY ??

nod Trump has shown his racism for decades now. Built on it and got results.


[Edited 8/12/17 11:40am]

As a New Yorker, I was familiar with Trump from the 80s, when he was still a local figure, before he went national. He was a douchebag back then, and actually seems to have become worse with age and now power.

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Forums > Politics & Religion > Skirmishes erupt in Charlottesville ahead of 'Unite the Right' rally - 1 dead 19 injured