independent and unofficial
Prince fan community site
Mon 16th Oct 2017 8:52pm
Welcome! Sign up or enter username and password to remember me
Forum jump
Forums > Politics & Religion > For you theology geeks: A bit of heretical humour on this St. Paddy's Day
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Page 2 of 2 <12
  New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
Reply #30 posted 03/20/17 8:17pm

toejam

avatar

So you think it's more likely true than illogical nonsense BECAUSE I, little ol' toejam, say it's illogical? I'm flattered, but I don't believe you.

Do yourself a favor. Forget what I think about it and ask yourself why YOU think it is more likely true than illogical nonsense. For me, recognising the age old highfalutin philosophical problem of our inability to attain absolute certainty in the highly philosophical sense of that term is not good enough to overturn the conclusion that the Trinity is illogical nonsense.

It is illogical to say that Jesus, The Father and The Holy Spirit are each fully and distinct god persons in their own right alongside the claim that there is only one god. One fully and distinct god + another fully and distinct god + another fully and distinct god does not equal one god. 1+1+1 does not equal 1. It equals 3.

.
[Edited 3/20/17 20:32pm]
Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #31 posted 03/20/17 8:56pm

morningsong

avatar

toejam said:

So you think it's more likely true than illogical nonsense BECAUSE I, little ol' toejam, say it's illogical? I'm flattered, but I don't believe you.

Do yourself a favor. Forget what I think about it and ask yourself why YOU think it is more likely true than illogical nonsense. For me, recognising the age old highfalutin philosophical problem of our inability to attain absolute certainty in the highly philosophical sense of that term is not good enough to overturn the conclusion that the Trinity is illogical nonsense.

It is illogical to say that Jesus, The Father and The Holy Spirit are each fully and distinct god persons in their own right alongside the claim that there is only one god. One fully and distinct god + another fully and distinct god + another fully and distinct god does not equal one god. 1+1+1 does not equal 1. It equals 3.

.
[Edited 3/20/17 20:32pm]


I've already said it's not my argument. And I still feel that way. I asked why do I have to agree or even answer based on your algorithm?
[Edited 3/20/17 20:56pm]
“Do I dare Disturb the universe?”
― T.S. Eliot

“Only by acceptance of the past, can you alter it”
― T.S. Eliot
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #32 posted 03/20/17 10:16pm

toejam

avatar

I'm simply trying get you to answer the question of why you think it is more likely not false illogical nonsense than it actually being so, given that you accept that as a possibility.

I think you see very clearly the illogic I'm pointing out, but your faith has you locked into presupposing that it can't be. And so you dodge fair criticism by appealing to the philosophical problem of how we can't know anything with absolute certainty. Some see this as humility. I see it as an empty excuse to avoid the obvious - The Trinity is an illogical and rather obviously politically construed and compromised proposition.

It is illogical to say that Jesus, The Father and The Holy Spirit are each fully and distinct god persons in their own right alongside the claim that there is only one god. One fully and distinct god + another fully and distinct god + another fully and distinct god does not equal one god.

.
[Edited 3/20/17 22:18pm]
Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #33 posted 03/21/17 7:14am

2freaky4church
1

avatar

Jesus is the son of God, not God. He represents God in human form.

"2freaky is a complete stud." DJ
"2freaky is very down." 2Elijah.
"2freaky convinced me to join Antifa: OnlyNDA
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #34 posted 03/21/17 7:27am

Dasein

^

Stay out of this.

wink


[Edited 3/21/17 10:00am]

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #35 posted 03/22/17 11:03am

morningsong

avatar

toejam said:

I'm simply trying get you to answer the question of why you think it is more likely not false illogical nonsense than it actually being so, given that you accept that as a possibility. I think you see very clearly the illogic I'm pointing out, but your faith has you locked into presupposing that it can't be. And so you dodge fair criticism by appealing to the philosophical problem of how we can't know anything with absolute certainty. Some see this as humility. I see it as an empty excuse to avoid the obvious - The Trinity is an illogical and rather obviously politically construed and compromised proposition. It is illogical to say that Jesus, The Father and The Holy Spirit are each fully and distinct god persons in their own right alongside the claim that there is only one god. One fully and distinct god + another fully and distinct god + another fully and distinct god does not equal one god. . [Edited 3/20/17 22:18pm]

Where is you point of agreement? I mean, say if Prince, or another believe who may use the same equation to dispute my belief, I would assume that The Word would be the point of agreement between us and then we would continue the discussion from there. Since most around here say they are unbelievers than I assumed that either general science or philosophy would be the point of agreement. Personally, at this moment my question is based on Astronomy, where there are things that people I consider 1,000x smarter than me have claimed to observed things that behave in ways that would be considered "illogical" based on general understanding on how things behave. But the fact that these things behave as they behave then the idea of it being illogical is a moot point, it is just a matter of learning to understand their nature. So far, with you personally I've come to believe the only point of agreement is to say you're right (or wrong), which to be blunt, I don't care about and have no intention on answering because there's nothing in it for me. My question really was a general one and wasn't specific directed to you, so I'm a bit confused why Dasein has taken it upon himself to decide who can answer in this thread.

In response to this thread, my question still stands, if one is rooted in science as the authority than how can a panentheism belief be constrained to a simplistic basic analogy such as, the trinity can only be seen as 1+1+1?

[Edited 3/22/17 11:04am]

“Do I dare Disturb the universe?”
― T.S. Eliot

“Only by acceptance of the past, can you alter it”
― T.S. Eliot
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #36 posted 03/22/17 1:35pm

toejam

avatar

^Again, I'm trying to ask you why you think The Trinity is more likely not false illogical nonsense than it actually being so, given that you accept that as a possibility. You keep obfuscating away from my question.

You can keep appealing to our inability to arrive at conclusions with absolute certainty in the highly philosophical sense, or note again how other people have observed things that might appear to us to be illogical, and you can continue to make claims about what you perceive as my arrogance, etc. But none of this gets to my question about why you think the Trinity is more likely not false illogical nonsense.

If you consider it a genuine possibility that the Trinity is simply illogical nonsense - a dogma created by the misperception that certain ancient texts couldn't possibly contain error and a hefty dose of political expediency - I'd like to know why you think this is not better solution than the idea that it's actually true - that God exists in the form of a seemingly illogical proposition of there three 'persons' who are each fully god in their own right, yet there being only one god...

.

[Edited 3/22/17 13:38pm]

Toejam @ Peach & Black Podcast: http://peachandblack.podbean.com
Toejam's band "Cheap Fakes": http://cheapfakes.com.au, http://www.facebook.com/cheapfakes
Toejam the solo artist: http://www.youtube.com/scottbignell
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #37 posted 03/22/17 2:24pm

2freaky4church
1

avatar

Francis Collins, who found the human genome was hiking in the winter. Saw a waterfall which turned into 3 distinct parts. He fell on his face worshipping Jesus because it reminded him of the trinity. He has been a Christian and top scientist since.

"2freaky is a complete stud." DJ
"2freaky is very down." 2Elijah.
"2freaky convinced me to join Antifa: OnlyNDA
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #38 posted 03/22/17 2:35pm

morningsong

avatar

2freaky4church1 said:

Francis Collins, who found the human genome was hiking in the winter. Saw a waterfall which turned into 3 distinct parts. He fell on his face worshipping Jesus because it reminded him of the trinity. He has been a Christian and top scientist since.



That is so not true but whatever to your joke. lol lol

“Do I dare Disturb the universe?”
― T.S. Eliot

“Only by acceptance of the past, can you alter it”
― T.S. Eliot
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #39 posted 03/22/17 5:05pm

7thday

avatar

Those twins sound like forerunners of Comic Book Guy on the Simpsons. biggrin

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #40 posted 03/22/17 5:11pm

2freaky4church
1

avatar

No, I got that from Hitchens.

"2freaky is a complete stud." DJ
"2freaky is very down." 2Elijah.
"2freaky convinced me to join Antifa: OnlyNDA
  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Reply #41 posted 03/22/17 5:17pm

7thday

avatar

Think of the Trinity as one of those three member wrestling teams that battle another three member wrestling team. (I mean entertainment wrestling, not Olympic wrestling.) So Team Good is Jehovah, Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit against Team Bad which is Satan, the Antichrist and the False Prophet. The script for the wrestling match has already been written, that is the Bible, and each team knows that Team Good will win. Team Bad has a personal grudge against Team Good, and does not even want to follow the rules set out for them. So at the end of the fight, which becomes very real and very bloody, Team Bad will be totally thrown out of wrestling altogether, and Team Good will retire and no one will want to watch the stupid "sport" anymore. We'll all prefer to make love for all time.

  - E-mail - orgNote - Report post to moderator
Page 2 of 2 <12
  New topic   Printable     (Log in to 'subscribe' to this topic)
« Previous topic  Next topic »
Forums > Politics & Religion > For you theology geeks: A bit of heretical humour on this St. Paddy's Day