Anti-Islamic Dutch lawmaker speaks at US college

Anti-Islamic Dutch lawmaker speaks at US college


Student protesters stand outside as Dutch politician Geert Wilders speaks at Temple University, Tuesday, Oct.. 20, 2009, in Philadelphia. Wilders has outraged Muslims by comparing their holy book, the Quran, to Adolf Hitler's 'Mein Kampf' and for his calls to end Muslim immigration to the Netherlands.

"Where Islam sets roots, freedom dies," Geert Wilders told the students during his 30-minute address organized by a new student group called Temple University Purpose and funded by the California-based David Horowitz Freedom Center.

His remarks were met by a mixture of applause and boos, and occasionally gasps particularly when he stated that "our Western culture is far better than the Islamic culture and we should defend it."
[...]
"Wilders also criticized President Barack Obama for his efforts to extend a hand to the Islamic world, saying that such appeasement marks "the beginning of the end."

If the spread of Islam continues unabated in the Western world, "you might at the end of the day lose your Constitution," he told the assembly. "Wake up, defend your freedom."

"A question-and-answer session was cut short after the tone of the event began to turn nasty, with some in the crowd of several hundred students began shouting jeers. Wilders' security detail quickly ushered him from the room."

source: http://news.yahoo.com/s/a...troversy_7


It is great to see that people protest against his hate speech. We can learn something from that in The Netherlands. This 'performance' shows once again what a coward Wilders is. Leaving the stage after 17 minutes because people started booing. If you think you have such an important message that will save the world you should at least try to counter your opponents.

It was also great to see such a mixed audience. Must be new to Wilders too.



Let's hope Wilders gets the same 'warm welcome' at Columbia University in New York.

I'm also against hate, dogma and repression. That is why I think Islam should be fought against.
It's good to see that many people are thinking about this subject and start to see how dangerous this religion really is.

The speech at this college's just show's that in the USA the freedom of speech is not yet under threat. In the UK, Wilders was refused, at first. And In the Netherlands he is prosecuted. Both countries have more muslims, and they are a bigger part of the constituancy. The higher the numbers, the greater their influance, the more strain there is on freedom of speech. All because of complaints by Islamic people. Before the speech in the USA, the Temple Muslim Students Association tried to prevent him from speaking. That is not that strange, because it is genuine reflex amongst followers of the Islam, whenever their precious ideology is being criticized.

Kurt Westergaard, the cartoonis (another hatemongorer in the eyes of Islam appeasers), had the same problems.

http://dailycartoonist.co...ntroversy/

Both men, are being targetted by followers of the Islam, to be killed. That is the prise for openly critisizing the Islam. That is why Wilders, adhere's the advice of his security team when the say it is wise to leave. The examples of people being killed in the name of Islam are so numerous that only a fool would stay. Wilders has stated in the past, that not only his security is at risk, but also the people that protect him.

Despite the constant threat of violence, the hatemails, the mock of of the opposers, Wilders is persistent in his critisism. He lives, literarly in prissons and military basis everyday on a different place, mostly seperated from his wife in order to be protected. That are not acts of a coward. A coward would not give up his personal freedom. A coward would refrain from critisizing Islam and appease its followers in order to stay "friendly" with the true hatemongorers....the islamists.




Wilders prosecution and his some of his views about how freedom is under threat:
http://article.nationalre...c2ZmFlMTk=

The UN has criminilized defamation of Islam:
http://www.washingtontime...ch-killer/

Appeasement by our elite:
http://www.wnd.com/news/a...E_ID=48736

Freedom IS under threat, wether you like it or not.

Give me a break mordang. "That is why I think Islam should be fought against." Why? "The speech at this college's just show's that in the USA the freedom of speech is not yet under threat." Try telling that to anyone who wants to have a serious dialog about Israel. "I'm also against hate, dogma and repression." I will give you the benefit of the doubt on that one, because I have not seen any of your past comments on any issues. But if you are against those things cool. However, if you are not, lets be against all hate speechs, dogma groups, and against all repression, ally or not.

JellyBean said:

Just by coincidence Pat Condell has a new blogvideo out today on the subject of freedom of speech vs Islam. Love Pat for his sharp tone and clear analysis.

^

dothejump said:

mordang said:

Dewrede said:

dothejump said:

you are clearly brainwashed into thinking critisizing one's religion is hate speech and racist
you're caught up in your political correct dogma , it's really pathetic
get those blindfolds off !


clearly you don't care about freedom of speech or you'd defend it
no matter how much you might disagree with what's being said
[Edited 10/22/09 19:13pm]

Dewrede said:

Hi Parade, I can't place your last comment into context. Who wants who to shut up? Perhaps you reffer to Wilders who want to forbid the quran? I do not agree with him on that one. But he reasons that the Quran is a fascist book, that insites hate.

I hope that at least you agree that the criminalisation of criticism of Islam by the United Nations, by Islamic countries is in violation of the very fundament of our human rights, namely freedom of speech? This is a consious, deliberate and strategic administrative tool that a religious group of powerholders brought to live, because they do think that their religion towers over any other thought, idea, or freedom in this universe. That is why Wilders uses the term "where Islam gets hold, freedom dies".

I know that some people will only hear (or want to hear) the suspious tone of bigotry or rascism (somehow Islam has become a race) in the warnings against this religion. I guess that is a prejudice that sceptics of the Islam have to negotiate in order to create awareness of certain dangers that I think are implicitly linked to Islam and its booming expansion across Europe.

It is not that I want to sound "hateful" (which I'm not), because of its appealing sound to others. I'd rather talk about the succes of planetfinding, or some other positive devolopement in the human enterprise.

You can, of course, go to many holy texts and find things that are repulsive and radically out of sync with modern liberal democratic values; and you can also find groups of people within the religious communities that refer to those holy books and find people who follow a kind of religious literalism with all kinds of illiberal consequences. As has been said many times, this is true of Christianity as well as Islam.

This is precisely what's at issue in the clip below:



But in the same way as the actual everyday lives of most Christians don't involve doing the things the religious literalists would ask of them, the actual everyday lives of most Muslims don't involve doing the things their religious literalists ask of them. That's not to say there aren't massive problems with certain interpretations, nor that some don't take those interpretations on board, but tarring the whole community with the same brush is like saying all Christians subscribe to the views of Jerry Falwell or Pat Robertson. They certainly have a following (notably, the last US president courted the religious right!), but they don't speak for the majority of members of their faith. In fact, in the case of both religions, most members of the faith think the right-wing literalist preachers are nutters.

When you actually talk to people in your own community who are Muslims, you can see that very clearly, and you realise that the small band of scaremongers really only play on the ignorance of people that don't meet and chat with Muslims in their day-to-day lives. Sadly, those bigoted scaremongers are content to spread fear and ignorance that will most certainly lead to prejudice and hostility; and some - including, it seems, some on this very board - are quite content to help them do it.

This topic isn't about Christians. They are thrown into the discussion randomly whenever arguments against Islam can't be elegantly refuted on their own accord. I have no great love for any religion. My only merrit by which I respect religion or freedom of religion is the merrit of how a certain religion is embracing freedom and human rights. In effect, how it interfers with my life. I can say, that in that view, I feel a whole lot more comfortable with the way Christians tend to react over issues of controversy or ridiculisation of their religion. And I live and work in the biblebelt of the Netherlands (untill 12-12-08, blasfemy was actualy punishable in the community that I live in!), I am quit capable of assesing that interferrence.

I could go to great lengths explaining the differences between Islam and Christianity, (Jezus, love and forgiveness vs Muhammed, warlord, violence, beheadings) but it would almost sound as an endorsement of Christianity and as an atheist/skeptic I'd rather be debunking both. But don't think I would deny anyone his freedom of religion anymore than the I would like to deny anyone the freedom to get a hidious tattoo, even if I'm forced, if only briefly, to look at them. By all means, belief, but don't enforce anything from that belief upon me, including prohibitions that exclude religious people from being ridiculed or ensulted, wether I use that right or not. My freedom, and yours, ends where calls for violence, or hate start.

As I have said in another thread, upon a similar subject, I have spoken with muslims (collegues and my neigbor across the street) and it was a sobering experience. Even moderate muslims, occasionly understand or endorse violence when they think their religion is being critisized (or ridiculed, all is in the eye of the beholder). It is in fact these personal experiences that have led me to investigate, read and get more knowledgable about Islam. And my current view on it, is a consequence of that investigation. That is not ignorance, but if you want to call it that way...it's a free world still. I just hope that muslims can free themself from this harmfull religion (as much as others can from theirs), but the fact that apostacy is not tolerated (In many countries it punishable, even by death, but most common is social exclusion) is not helping.

I encourage anyone to read and learn as much as possible!

I'm not even steering in which direction, just learn. I'm confident that knowledge in itself will create enough awareness about the expansive and violent nature of Islam. As a matter of fact, I don't even write this to convince you...that would be, and you'll even agree with me on that, a very futile enterprise. I'm hoping that just someone, lurking and uncertain or, better, undecided will educate him/herself about the subject and make up their own mind. That alone will be a step forward.

mordang said:

Dewrede said:

mordang said:

mordang said:

It makes you wonder. When the president of Iran,Ahmadinejad, made claims against the holocaust, people were up in arms about his sanity, his right to call out Israel, and other off the wall topics. Now, we have this anti-islamic Dutch lawmaker,Geert Wilders, making off the all comments, but yet he is given a free pass by some people. The same Wilders who made this off the wall comment: "Islam is not a religion, it's the ideology of a retarded culture.", a statement he made to the British Guardian. The same clown who made a movie Fitna that was so offensive, even the Jewish community, in the Netherlands, view it as an attack on Islam, because the film portrays Islam as a terrorist religion.

Now, if we are going to be against "hate speech", shouldn't we also include his comments and film in that window of "hate speech"?

^
the 'prophet' mohammed was a murderer ; he killed jews that didn't want to convert to islam and that is a fact

therefore islam is terror by definition

anyone who doesn't want to acknowledge that has to get their blindfolds off

Wilders is right
[Edited 10/24/09 18:11pm]

Dewrede said:

Dewrede said:

Tremolina said:

JellyBean said:

I think we can agree that the guy has radical views....as long as they do not cause violence or malice, I don't see the problem.

JellyBean said:

Dsoul said:

mordang said:

JellyBean said:

Dsoul said: