JOHN 15:19 PART II

ekalb101 said:

my lord..you all have posted 240 comments on that other thread....oye!!!

this was the original question asked.....


zkp2003 said:

From KH library for research only - When the World Went to War
Many have expressed doubts as to the accuracy or even the existence of the Watchtower Society's letter to Hitler.
However you can read a section about the letter as well as a partial quote from the letter in the 1974 Yearbook of Jehovah's Witnesses, page 111.

WATCH TOWER
BIBLE AND TRACT SOCIETY
PUBLISHERS OF THE BIBLE STUDENTS ASSOCIATION

GENERAL OFFICES: 117 ADAMS TREET BROOKLYN NEW YORK, U.S.A.

GERMAN BRANCH:
WACHTTURMSTR.1 - 19
MAGDEBURG
POSTSCH.-K.: MAGDEBURG 4042

TELEPHONE, MAGDEBURG 405 56,405 57, 405 58
RADIO AND CABLE ADDRESS: WATCHTOWER MAGDEBURG

Most Honored Mr. Chancellor:

On June 25, 1933, a 5,000-delegate convention of German Bible Students (Jehovah's Witnesses), representing several million Germans who have been friends and followers of this movement for many years, was held in the Sporthalle Wilmersdorf in Berlin. The purpose of this meeting was to find ways and means of making known to you, Mr. Chancellor, and to other high government officials of the German Reich, as well as Länder [state] governments, the following:

In some parts of the country measures are being taken against an association of earnest Christian men and women which has positive Christianity as its foundation. Because of their origin, these measures can be regarded as nothing less than the persecution of one group of Christians by another, since the accusations which trigger them [the measures] are levelled from clerical, especially Catholic, quarters and are untrue.

Absolutely convinced of the full objectivity of the government departments and officials dealing with these matters, we nevertheless recognize that because of the volume of our literature on one hand and because of the heavy workload of the relevant case workers on the other, the content of our literature and the purpose of our movement are judged in large part incorrectly, specifically in accord with the views-which cause prejudice-that our religious opponents bring against us.

For this reason the matters discussed at the convention have been set down in the attached declaration of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society in order to convey to you, Mr. Chancellor, and to the senior departments of the governments of the German Reich and the Länder as documentation of the fact that German Bible Students intend only, as the sole objective of their work, to lead mankind back to God and to witness to and give honor to the name of Jehovah, the Almighty, the Father of our Lord and Redeemer, Jesus Christ, here on the earth. We are secure in the knowledge that you, Mr. Chancellor, will not let such activity be disturbed.

German Bible Student congregations are generally known as havens of true reverence for the Almighty and as ardent custodians of careful biblical research. Local police authorities must always affirm that Bible Students definitely have to be counted as among those elements of the country and people that love and support order. Their only mission is the recruitment of human hearts that love God. The Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society is the Bible Students' organizational mission center (for Germany: with head offices in Magdeburg).

The Brooklyn administration of the Watch Tower Society is and in the past has been outstandingly friendly to Germany. For this reason, the president of the Society and seven members of its Board of Directors in the United States were sentenced to 80 years imprisonment because the president refused to use two magazines published by him in the United States for war propaganda against Germany. These two magazines, "The Watch Tower" and "Bible Student" [The Bible Students Monthly] were the only magazines in the United States which refused [to publish] war propaganda against Germany and were, for this reason, outlawed and suppressed in the United States during the war.

In a similar manner, the administration of our Society not only refused to participate in the horror propaganda against Germany, but it took a position against it. This is emphasized by the attached Declaration which refers to the fact that the circles which led [in promoting] horror propaganda in the United States (commercialistic Jews and Catholics) are also the most eager persecutors of our Society's work and its administration. These and other statements in our Declaration are meant to serve as a rejection of the slanderous claim that the Bible Students are supported by Jews.

The representative convention of these five thousand delegates took notice with great satisfaction of the statement by the governing president of Magdeburg that the connection between Bible Students and Communists or Marxists, claimed by our clerical opponents, cannot be substantiated (and thus is slanderous as well). A relevant press report in the Magdeburg Daily News No. 104 of May 5, 1933 says:

A government declaration regarding the occupation of Bible Student House.-The government press center announces: "Police occupation of property owned by the Earnest Bible Students Association has been ended since no incriminating material regarding a claimed Communist activity was found."

Further: the Magdeburg Daily News No. 102 of May 3, 1933 [states]:

From the office of the Bible Students' Association we have receive word that the actions initiated by the police against the Watch Tower Society and the Bible Students' Association have been completely ended. All material was released because a careful search revealed that those societies are not guilty either in a political or criminal way and because it was further determined that both societies are absolutely apolitical and strictly religious [in nature].-Upon our questioning, the government confirmed the correctness of our report.

The representative convention of these five thousand delegate stressed that, following these circumstances, it would find it beneath its dignity to defend itself in future against the contemptible accusation of Marxist or Communist activity. The delegates refuted the accusations of our religious opponents, which are clearly a sign of religious competition.

They [the religious opponents] would prefer to throttle truthful herald of warning with slander rather than [use] the Word c God. Further, it was stated at the five-thousand-delegate convention-a expressed in the Declaration-that Bible Students are fighting for the same high, ethical goals and ideals that the National Government a the German Reich proclaimed regarding the relationship of man t God, namely: honesty of the created towards the Creator!

At the convention, it was stated that there are no opposing views in the relationship between German Bible Students and the National Government of the German Reich, but that, to the contrary, respecting the purely religious and apolitical goals and objectives of the Bible Students, it can be said that these are in complete harmony with the similar goals of the National Government of the German Reich.

Because of the supposedly harsh language of our literature, some of our books were banned. The five-thousand-delegate convention pointed out in this connection that the contents of our books that were objected to referred only to circumstances in the Anglo-American World Empire and that it-especially England-is to be held responsible for the League of Nations and the unjustified treaties and burdens placed on Germany. The things said in the above-mentioned spirit are therefore directed-whether in a financial, political, or Roman Catholic (ultramontane) sense-against the oppressors of the German people and country, not against the Germany struggling against these burdens. Thus the bans [on Bible Student literature] are made absolutely incomprehensible.

To those various German Länder in which there occurred bans on Bible Student religious services, prohibitions of prayer meetings, etc., those [Bible Students], who have waited for weeks for a just resolution of the situation which is stifling to their religious life, expressed the following:

We will continue to conform to the regulations of prohibition issued [against us] because we are confident that you, Mr. Chancellor, or the governments of the Länder, will lift these measures-by which tens of thousands of Christian men and women would fall victim to a martyrdom reminiscent of that of the original Christians-once the true state of affairs is known.

Finally, this five-thousand-delegate convention stated that the Bible Student-Watch Tower organization stands for the maintenance of order and the security of the state as well as for the enhancement of the above mentioned, religiously related high ideals of the National Government. In order to make this known above all to you, Mr. Chancellor, as the Leader of the German people, and to other high government officials of the Reich and the Länder, the sentiments expressed briefly above were set down in detail in the attached Declaration.

The attached Declaration was read [publicly] by the secretary of the five-thousand-delegate, Bible Student Convention, was approved unanimously [by Convention delegates], and was adopted with the instruction that a single copy of it and of the Convention Report be conveyed to the Chancellor of the Reich and to other high officials of the Reich and the Länder.

This is done with the most respectful plea that the request expressed in the Declaration be granted in a most positive manner: namely, to give a commission [drawn] from within our midst the opportunity of making a responsible exposition regarding the facts to you, Mr. Chancellor, or the Minister of the Interior, personally. Failing that, [we request] that a commission of men be appointed by you, Mr. Chancellor, who are not religiously prejudiced against us-that is of men who are themselves not by profession interested in religious matters but who would alone truly examine our concerns without prejudice and according to the just principles enunciated by the Chancellor of the Reich him self. By these principles we mean the statements in Section 24 of Platform of the National Socialist German Workers Party:

"We demand the freedom of all religious confessions in the state so long they do not endanger its existence or conflict with the ethical and moral beliefs of the German race. The Party, as such, represents the viewpoint of positive Christianity without associating itself with a specific confession. It opposes the Jewish-materialist spirit domestically and abroad and is convinced that a lasting recuperation our people can only happen from the inside out....''

We are firmly convinced that the National Government of German will find no reason to hinder our services or missionary activities if are judged, first, without religious prejudice and, second, according the Platform points quoted above.

With anticipation of an early, positive assent [to our requests] a with the assurance of our highest esteem, most honored Mr. Chancellor, we remain,

Most respectfully,

Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society Magdeburg
[This message was edited Thu Aug 5 18:12:06 2004 by CeeJay]

For research only on topic - When the World Went to War
Declaration of Facts dated - 25, 1933

WATCH TOWER
BIBLE AND TRACT SOCIETY
PUBLISHERS OF THE BIBLE STUDENTS ASSOCIATION

GENERAL OFFICES: 117 ADAMS TREET BROOKLYN NEW YORK, U.S.A.

GERMAN BRANCH:
WACHTTURMSTR.1 - 19
MAGDEBURG
POSTSCH.-K.: MAGDEBURG 4042


Declaration of Facts

This company of German people, who are peaceable and law-abiding citizens representing many others from every part of Germany, all of whom are earnestly laboring for the highest welfare of the people of this land, being now duly assembled at Berlin this 25th day of June, AD.. 1933, do joyfully declare our complete devotion to Jehovah, the Almighty God, and to his kingdom under Christ Jesus, whose shed blood bought the human race. We declare that the holy Scriptures set forth in the Bible constitute the Word of Jehovah God given to men for their guidance in righteousness, and that the Word of God is the truth, and that it is of greatest importance that man have a knowledge of his relationship to God. We ask to be judged by the standard of the Word of God.

Christ Jesus is Jehovah God's great Witness to the truth, and as his faithful and devoted followers we are, by His grace, witnesses to the truth. The purpose of this Declaration is that we may present a true and faithful witness before rulers and the people as to the name and purpose of Jehovah God and our relation thereto.

We are wrongfully charged before the ruling powers of this government and before the people of this nation; and in order that the name of Jehovah God may be exalted in the minds of the people, and that his benevolent purposes be better understood and our position fairly placed before the government, we do respectfully ask the rulers of the nation and the people to give a fair and impartial consideration to the statement of facts here made.

The Scriptures plainly state that the chief opposer of Jehovah God and the greatest enemy of mankind is Satan the Devil whose name is also that of Serpent and Dragon. It is written in the Scriptures that Satan, who has long been the invisible ruler of this world, deceives and blinds the people to the truth in order that the light of and concerning Jehovah God and Christ Jesus may not shine into the minds of men. (2 Corinthians 4: 3,4)

Frequently by fraud, subtility [sic]] and deception Satan has induced honest persons to war with each other, in order that he might turn them all away from God and destroy them. Above all things, the people need to know Jehovah God and his gracious provision for their general welfare.

By the term 'clergy', as used in our literature, reference is made to the class of professed religious teachers, priests and Jesuits who employ improper political means to accomplish their ends and pin forces even with those who deny God and the Lord Jesus Christ. That is the same class to whom Jesus referred as his persecutors. We have no criticism of any honest religious teacher.

When Jesus went to the Jews to tell them of the truth, it was the Jewish clergy, that is to say, the Pharisees and priests, that violently opposed him and persecuted him and caused him to be charged with all manner of crimes and offenses. They refused to hear the truth, and addressing them Jesus said: "Why do ye not understand my speech? even because ye cannot hear my word. Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it. And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.' (John 8: 43-45) Although the Pharisees and priests then claimed to represent Jehovah God Jesus told them that they were in fact the representatives of Satan the Devil.

"We have no fight with any persons or religious teachers, but we must call attention to the fact that it is generally those who claim to represent God and Christ Jesus who are in fact our persecutors and who misrepresent us before the governments and nations. As true followers of Christ Jesus we are to expect such opposition, and we mention it here in explanation of why we have been misrepresented before the rulers of this nation. To his faithful followers Jesus said: 'Remember the word I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they [the false religious teachers] have persecuted me, they will also persecute you; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.' (John 15: 20) Furthermore, Jesus said that this same class of men would cause his true followers to be wrongfully charged before the ruling powers, his language being: 'But take heed to yourselves: for they [false religious teachers] shall deliver you up to councils [police power]; and in the synagogues ye shall be beaten; and ye shall be brought before rulers and kings for my sake, for a testimony against them.' (Mark 13: 9) This explains why Jehovah God now permits his faithful witnesses to be misrepresented and persecuted, namely, that those of a wrong spirit may identify themselves as opponents of God and thus bear witness against themselves. The same materialistic spirit that caused the persecution of Jesus Christ now exists and is back of the persecution of us his faithful followers.

It is falsely charged by our enemies that we have received financial support for our work from the Jews. Nothing is farther from the truth. Up to this hour there never has been the slightest bit of money contributed to our work by Jews. We are the faithful followers of Christ Jesus and believe upon Him as the Savior of the world, whereas the Jews entirely reject Jesus Christ and emphatically deny that he is the Savior of the world sent of God for man's good. This of itself should be sufficient proof to show that we receive no support from Jews and that therefore the charges against us are maliciously false and could proceed only from Satan, our great enemy.

The greatest and most oppressive empire on earth is the Anglo-American empire. By that is meant the British Empire, of which the United States of America forms a part. It has been the commercial Jews of the British-American empire that have built up and carried on Big Business as a means of exploiting and oppressing the peoples of many nations. This fact particularly applies to the cities of London and New York, the stronghold of Big Business. This fact is so manifest in America that there is a proverb concerning the city of New York which says: 'The Jews own it, the Irish Catholics rule it, and the Americans pay the bills.' We have no fight with any of these persons mentioned, but, as the witnesses for Jehovah and in obedience to his commandment set forth in the Scriptures, we are compelled to call attention to the truth concerning the same in order that the people may be enlightened concerning God and his purpose.

Our Literature

It is said that our books and like literature, when circulated amongst the people, constitute a danger to the peace and safety of the nation. We are certain that this conclusion is due to the fact that our books and other literature have not been carefully examined by the rulers and hence are not properly understood. We respectfully call attention to the fact that these books and other literature were written originally in America and the language therein used has been adapted to the American style of plainness of speech and, when translated into German, the same appears to be harsh. We admit that the same truths might be stated in a less blunt and more pleasing phrase, and yet the language of these books follows closely the language of the Bible.

It should be borne in mind that in the British Empire and in America the common people have suffered and are now suffering greatly because of the misrule of Big Business and conscienceless politicians, which misrule has been and is supported by political religionists, and hence the writers of our books or literature have endeavored to employ plain language to convey to the people the proper thought or understanding. The language used, however, is not as strong or emphatic as that used by Jesus Christ in denouncing the oppressors and false teachers of his time. "The present government of Germany has declared emphatically against Big Business oppressors and in opposition to the wrongful religious influence in the political affairs of the nation. Such is exactly our position; and we further state in our literature the reason for the existence of oppressive Big Business and the wrongful political religious influence, because the Holy Scriptures plainly declare that these oppressive instruments proceed from the Devil, and that the complete relief therefrom is God's kingdom under Christ. It is therefore impossible for our literature or our work to in any wise be a danger or a menace to the peace and safety of the state.

Our organization is not political in any sense. We only insist on teaching the Word of Jehovah God to the people, and that without hindrance. We do not object or try to hinder anyone's teaching or believing what he desires, but we only ask the freedom to believe and teach what we conceive the bible to teach, and then let the people decide which they wish to believe. "To know Jehovah God and his gracious provision for mankind is of most vital importance to all persons, because God has declared in His Word that where there is no vision or understanding of his Word the people perish. (Proverbs 29: 18) We have devoted our lives and our material substance to the work of enabling the people to gain a vision or understanding of God's Word, and therefore it is impossible for our literature and our work to be a menace to the peace and safety of the nation. Instead of being against the principles advocated by the government of Germany, we stand squarely for such principles, and point out that Jehovah God through Christ Jesus will bring about the full realization of these principles and will give to the people peace and prosperity and the greatest desire of every honest heart.

Our organization seeks neither money nor members, but we are a company or organized body of Christian people engaged solely in the benevolent work of teaching the Word of God to the people at the least possible cost to them. Our organization was originally incorporated in the United States of America in 1884 under the name of the WATCH TOWER BIBLE TRACT SOCIETY, and in 1914 incorporated under the laws of Great Britain by the name of the INTERNATIONAL BIBLE STUDENTS ASSOCIATION. These are merely the corporate names of our organization for legally carrying forward its work. The Scriptural name by which we are known is 'Jehovah's witnesses'. We are engaged solely in a benevolent work. The purpose of our organization is to aid the people to understand the Bible, which discloses the only possible way for the complete relief and blessing for mankind. Our organization has extended its work throughout the earth. The education, culture and upbuilding of the people must and will come through the agency of God's kingdom concerning which we teach as set forth in the Bible. The salvation of the people depends upon the true knowledge of and obedience to Jehovah God and his righteous ways.

The people are in great distress and in need of help to understand the reason for their unhappy condition and what is the means of relief. The Scriptures, when understood, make this matter clear. Instead of collecting money from the people and using the same to erect great buildings and to support men in luxury, we print the gospel message of God's kingdom and carry it to the homes of the people that they may, at the least inconvenience to themselves, gain a knowledge of God's purposes concerning them.

A careful examination of our books and literature will disclose the fact that the very high ideals held and promulgated by the present national government are set forth in and endorsed and strongly emphasized in our publications, and show that Jehovah God will see to it that these high ideals in due time will be attained by all persons who love righteousness and who obey the Most High. Instead, therefore, of our literature and our work's being a menace to the principles of the present government we are the strongest supporters of such high ideals. For this reason Satan, the enemy of all men who desire righteousness, has sought to misrepresent our work and prevent us from carrying it on in this land.

For many years our organization has put forth an unselfish and persistent effort to do good to the people. Our American brethren have greatly assisted in the work in Germany, and with money freely contributed, and that at a time when all Germany was in dire distress. Now because it appears that Germany may soon be free from oppression and that the people may be lifted up, Satan, the great enemy, puts forth his endeavours to destroy that benevolent work in this land.

League of Nations

The language in our books or literature concerning the League of Nations has been seized upon as a reason for prohibiting our work and the distribution of our books. Let us remind the government and the people of Germany that it was the League of Nations compact that laid upon the shoulders of the German people the great unjust and unbearable burdens. That League of Nations compact was not brought forth by the friends of Germany. In America at one time the public press announced that 140,000 clergymen had set aside a certain period of time in which a concerted movement was to be made, and which was made, to induce the American people to fully endorse the League of Nations. It was the Federation of Churches in America that issued a manifesto stating that the 'League of Nations is the political expression of God's kingdom on earth', and which by them was substituted in the place and stead of God's kingdom under Christ. It was in America that our organization under the visible leadership of its president pointed out emphatically that the League of Nations is not an institution of Jehovah God, because it is oppressive and unfair. It was that condition, existing at the time, which called forth language that appears in our books concerning the League of Nations and also calling attention to the fact that such League of Nations compact can never bring about the relief and blessing of the people, because such relief and blessing can come by adhering strictly to the principles laid down in God's Word and in the manner which Jehovah has pointed out.

For almost half a century our strictly Christian organization has carried on its work in various parts of the earth. Its books are published in more than 50 languages, and upward of 140 million of these books are in the hands of the people. For more than thirty years our books and literature have been distributed throughout Germany, and millions of these are now in the hands of the German people and are read by the people, all of whom will bear testimony to the fact that these books, based strictly on the Bible, are of great help to them and upbuild them and give them hope for a realization of the blessings which Jehovah God long ago promised. In all these years of our work, and in the wide distribution of our books and literature, not one instance can be truthfully cited wherein our work or literature has been a menace to the government or has in any wise endangered the peace and safety of the nations.

The endeavors of our organization being exclusively confined to bearing testimony to the name and Word of Jehovah God, it would be entirely inconsistent for us to attempt to exert any political influence in the governments of this world or to do anything that would endanger the peace and safety of the nation. We have no desire nor inclination to do anything except to carry out our divinely given commission to proclaim the Word of Jehovah God.

In America, Canada and other parts of the British Empire the political clergy, priests and Jesuits have persistently persecuted and continue to persecute those of our organization, and without just cause or excuse; and we have every reason to believe that a like influence has been subtilly [sic] employed by the great enemy Satan to misrepresent us and our work in Germany. We remind you that in the years past the political clergymen have brought more sorrow upon the German people than probably any other class of men. We have no desire to fight with the clergymen, but we do ask that the ruling powers of the nation judge us not by the misrepresentation of such men, but that we be judged according to the Word of God and the work we are doing consistent therewith. Jehovah God persecutes no one, but permits each one to choose his own course, holding him responsible for his acts according to knowledge. Jehovah God has emphatically expressed his anger against those who do persecute others who are trying to serve him; and this proves that those who persecute us do not represent God, but that they are incited so to do by the enemy of God and man.-Psalm 72:4

Great Truths

The Holy Scriptures, viewed in the light of present-day events which are in fulfilment of divine prophecy, disclose that: The time has arrived when Jehovah will make his name known to all creation and vindicate his name and clear it from the defamation which Satan has placed against that holy name. (Psalm 83: 18) When Jesus Christ, the Vindicator, ascended into heaven Jehovah commanded him to wait until his due time to put the enemy down. That period of waiting has now come to an end and God has sent forth his beloved Son to oust the enemy and rule in righteousness. (Psalm 110: 14; Hebrews 10: 12,13) The world, or uninterrupted rule, of Satan has ended, and this began to be evidenced by the World War in 1914, and since then until now is the time when the gospel of the Kingdom must be told to the people. (Matthew 24: 3,14) Satan has now been cast out of heaven and down to the earth and now confines his operations to the earth in an endeavor to blind the people to the truth and destroy them, and that is the reason for the present-day sufferings of humanity. The prophetic words of Jesus now apply: 'Woe to the inhabiters [the rulers] of the earth, and of the sea [the people in general]! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.'-Revelation 12: 12.

The people of Germany have suffered great misery since 1914 and have been the victims of much injustice practiced upon them by others. The nationalists have declared themselves against all such unrighteousness and announced that 'Our relationship to God is high and holy'. Since our organization fully endorses these righteous principles and is engaged solely in carrying forth the work of enlightening the people concerning the Word of Jehovah God, Satan by subtilty [sic] endeavors to set the government against our work and destroy it because we magnify the importance of knowing and serving God. Instead of our organization's being a menace to the peace and safety of the government, it is the one organization standing for the peace and safety of this land. We beg to remind all that the great crisis is upon the world because the transition period from bad to good is at hand, and the hope of the world is God's kingdom under Christ, for which Jesus taught his followers to constantly pray: 'Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth, as it is done in heaven.'

The power of Jehovah God is supreme and there is no power that can successfully resist him. His time to exercise his power in the interest of humanity and to the vindication of his great name is here. In this connection we respectfully call attention to the admonition and warning of Jehovah God, both to the rulers and to the people, which applies to this very hour, wherein he says: "Yet have I set my king upon my holy hill of Zion.... Be wise now, therefor, O ye kings; be instructed, ye judges of the earth. Serve the LORD with fear, and rejoice with trembling. Kiss the Son, lest he be angry, and ye perish from the way, when his wrath is kindled but a little. Blessed are all they that put their trust in him.'-Psalm 2: 6, 10-12.

The present government having declared adherence to the aforementioned high ideals, we are persuaded that the rulers do not desire to knowingly resist the progressive witness work to the name of Jehovah God and his kingdom which we are now carrying forward. If our work is merely that of men, it will fall of its own weight. If it is of Jehovah God and being carried forward in obedience to his commandment, then to resist it means to fight against God.-Acts 5: 39.

We therefore appeal to the high sense of justice of the government and nation and respectfully ask that the order of prohibition against our work and our literature be set aside, and the opportunity be given us to have a fair hearing before we are judged. We respectfully ask that the government appoint a committee of impartial men to hold conference with a committee of our organization and that a fair and impartial examination of our literature and our work be made, to the end that all misunderstanding may be removed and that we may without hindrance obey Jehovah God's commandment now applying to us, to wit: 'Go through, go through the gates; prepare ye the way of the people; cast up the highway; gather out the stones; lift up a standard for the people.'-Isaiah 62: 10.

The peoples of Germany are a God-fearing people and should not be deprived of an opportunity to learn of Jehovah God and of his gracious provision to bring lasting peace, prosperity, liberty and everlasting life on earth to all those who know and obey him. Let all who love God work together to the honor and vindication of his name. All who take a contrary course must take responsibility before God; but as for us we will serve Jehovah forever.

"RESOLVED, That copies of this Declaration be respectfully delivered to high officials of the government and that the same be given wide publication to the people, that the name of Jehovah may be further known."
[This message was edited Thu Aug 5 18:19:48 2004 by CeeJay]

In the "Declaration of Facts", Dated June 25, 1933 accompanied letter see above letter to Hitler:

Research tells me that The Watchtower Society tried to distance themselves from the Jews and to curry favor and establish common cause with Hitler.

The the Watchtower Society wrote:
"It is falsely charged by our enemies that we have received financial support for our work from the Jews. Nothing is farther from the truth. Up to this hour there never has been the slightest bit of money contributed to our work by Jews."

The watchtower society did not receive funding from the Jews, they made their statement and that should have been sufficient.

The "Declaration" continues:
"We are the faithful followers of Christ Jesus and believe upon Him as the Savior of the world, whereas the Jews entirely reject Jesus Christ and emphatically deny that he is the Savior of the world sent of God for man's good.This of itself should be sufficient proof to show that we receive no support from Jews and that therefore the charges against us are maliciously false and could proceed only from Satan, our great enemy."

Was that really necessary? The next paragraph goes even further.

"The greatest and most oppressive empire on earth is the Anglo-American empire. By that is meant the British Empire, of which the United States of America forms a part. It has been the commercial Jews of the British-American empire that have built up and carried on Big Business as a means of exploiting and oppressing the peoples of many nations. This fact particularly applies to the cities of London and New York, the stronghold of Big Business. This fact is so manifest in America that there is a proverb concerning the city of New York which says: 'The Jews own it, the Irish Catholics rule it, and the Americans pay the bills.' We have no fight with any of these persons mentioned, but, as the witnesses for Jehovah and in obedience to his commandment set forth in the Scriptures, we are compelled to call attention to the truth concerning the same in order that the people may be enlightened concerning God and his purpose."

It seems to me that the previous statements regarding the Jews are there in order to establish common cause with Hitler. Later in the "Declaration".

The letter goes on even further to do that:

"The people of Germany have suffered great misery since 1914 and have been the victims of much injustice practiced upon them by others. The nationalists have declared themselves against all such unrighteousness and announced that 'Our relationship to God is high and holy'. Since our organization fully endorses these righteous principles and is engaged solely in carrying forth the work of enlightening the people concerning the Word of Jehovah God, Satan by subtilty endeavors to set the government against our work and destroy it because we magnify the importance of knowing and serving God. Instead of our organization's being a menace to the peace and safety of the government, it is the one organization standing for the peace and safety of this land.

In the letter to Hitler that accompanied the "Declaration", the society continues this theme:

The Brooklyn administration of the Watch Tower Society is and in the past has been outstandingly friendly to Germany. For this reason, the president of the Society and seven members of its Board of Directors in the United States were sentenced to 80 years imprisonment because the president refused to use two magazines published by him in the United States for war propaganda against Germany. These two magazines, 'The Watch Tower' and 'Bible Student' [The Bible Students Monthly] were the only magazines in the United States which refused [to publish] war propaganda against Germany and were, for this reason, outlawed and suppressed in the United States during the war."

In my opinion the Watchtower Society resorts to an out and out lie in order to cozy up to Hitler.
Rutherford and the rest of the board of Directors were not imprisoned for refusing to use their magazines for propaganda against Hitler. I have never seen any mention of this outside this letter. If anyone has evidence to the contrary, I would love to see it.

The letter continues:

"In a similar manner, the administration of our Society not only refused to participate in the horror propaganda against Germany, but it took a position against it. This is emphasized by the attached Declaration which refers to the fact that the circles which led [in promoting] horror propaganda in the United States (commercialistic Jews and Catholics) are also the most eager persecutors of our Society's work and its administration. These and other statements in our Declaration are meant to serve as a rejection of the slanderous claim that the Bible Students are supported by Jews."

The Watchtower is obviously trying to establish common cause with Hitler.

Many Jehovah's Witnesses have expressed doubts as to the accuracy or even the existence of the Watchtower Society's letter to Hitler. However you can read a section about the letter as well as a partial quote from the letter in your own copy of the 1974 Yearbook of Jehovah's Witnesses, page 111

The conventioners returned home tired and disappointed. They took 2,100,000 copies of the "declaration" home with them, and made fast work of distributing them and sending them to numerous persons in positions of responsibility.

The copy sent to Hitler was accompanied by a letter that, in part said:

"The Brooklyn presidency of the Watch Tower Society is and always has been exceedingly friendly to Germany. In 1918 the president of the Society and seven members of the Board of Directors in America were sentenced to 80 years' imprisonment for the reason that the president refused to let two magazines in America, which he edited, be used in war propaganda against Germany."

Obviously the letter existed and the quote that I posted is accurate.
What is inaccurate is what Rutherford told Hitler about the length of and reason for their prison sentence.

First of all:
The length of their sentences - from the book "Jehovah's Witnesses - Proclaimers of God's Kingdom" (Proclaimers) - page 69

On June 21, 1918, J. F. Rutherford and several of his close associates were sentenced to 20 years' imprisonment, having been falsely convicted of conspiracy.

On page 211:
Shortly after this, members of the Society's administrative staff were arrested, and on June 21, 1918, they were sentenced to 20-year prison terms.

On page 652 the Proclaimer's book offers a more complete explanation of their sentences:

Regardless of all of this, on June 20, 1918, the jury returned a verdict finding each of the defendants guilty on each count of the indictment. The next day, seven of them were sentenced to four terms of 20 years each, to be served concurrently. On July 10, the eighth was sentenced to four concurrent terms of 10 years.

In an effort to make their sentences look as bad as possible to Hitler, the society mentioned 80 years without mentioning that they were, in fact, four twenty year concurrent sentences.

The reason they were convicted and sentenced:
The Proclaimer's book, on pages 650 and 651 says the following:

The previous day, in Brooklyn, New York, two indictments had been filed against Brother Rutherford and his associates. If the desired results did not come from one case, the other indictment could have been pursued.

The first indictment: laid charges against the greater number of individuals, included four counts: Two charged them with conspiring to violate the Espionage Act of June 15, 1917; and two counts charged them with attempting to carry out their illegal plans or actually doing so. It was alleged that they were conspiring to cause insubordination and refusal of duty in the armed forces of the United States and that they were conspiring to obstruct the recruiting and enlisting of men for such service when the nation was at war, also that they had attempted to do or had actually done both of these things.

The indictment made particular mention of publication and distribution of the book The Finished Mystery.

The second indictment construed the sending of a check to Europe (which was to be used in the work of Bible education in Germany) to be inimical to the interests of the United States. When the defendants were taken to court, it was the first indictment, the one with four counts, that was pursued.

Another indictment of C. J. Woodworth and J. F. Rutherford under the Espionage Act was at that time pending in Scranton, Pennsylvania.

According to a letter from John Lord O'Brian dated May 20, 1918: members of the Department of Justice feared that U.S. District Judge Witmer, before whom the case would be tried, would not agree with their use of the Espionage Act to suppress the activity of men who, because of sincere religious convictions, said things that others might construe as antiwar propaganda.

There is nothing there, or in any other history of the Watchtower Society that I could find, about them being asked and then refusing to allow the Watchtower Society's magazines to be used for anti-German propaganda.

So, in a further effort to curry favor with Hitler, Rutherford lied about why he and his fellow board members were convicted and imprisoned in 1918.

Why?

CeeJay-

i appreciate your earnestness and eagerness in helping people see the truth, but those were some long stinkin' posts!!! think you could shorten it up a bit next time?

thanks!

fantasyislander said:

1

fantasyislander said:

sosgemini said:

"We ain't gon' study war no more...ain't gon' study war no mo...ain't gon studieeeee war no more."

So...how's everybody doing?

thedoorkeeper said:

CeeJay said:

Taken from the original thread: JOHN 15:19 one reason true christians are no part of the world

OdysseyMiles said:

Taken from the original thread: JOHN 15:19 one reason true christians are no part of the world

Ekalb101 said:

333 said:

ekalb101 said: mzflash said:

After reading most of this thread, I'm left with the impression that Satan has taken over some righteous minds.

For anyone to say that God does not love a soldier who is willing to sacrifice his life for the freedom of his brother, I say that they do not know God.

Why would He favor those sitting at home drinking beer and criticizing others more than one who loves his neighbor as himself and is willing to stand up for what they have been taught is right?

I'm not saying war is right. I'm saying that some of those who follow what Jesus taught, that we should love our neighbors as ourselves, might have been steered in the wrong direction. Surely God is all of His wisdom sees this and loves the intent in the soldiers heart.

God sees and knows all. We do not.




Did someone say God did not love soldiers? Hmmm?I don't see that written anywhere. God doesn't love war....and BTW I think it is a tremendously brave and commendable thing that someone believes in something so much that they are willing to lose their life over it, I think God love's even the suicide bombers..as they were lead to do what they did by men, and really believed they would go straight to heaven after they killed all the people and themselves. You are right only God knows what is in someone's heart, we don't. Did I understand you when you said love your neighbor as yourself? Does this only apply when there is no war going on? A neighbor would not kill a neighbor (even if it is all the way in Iraq )if he loved him as himself. Please you must agree (or not) that there are alot of soldiers that have really gone too far to receive glory for themselves...like the female shown in newsweek magazine, laying across a stack of dead bodies with her thumb up as in right on! Look what we killed!! That is absolutely disgusting. I personally don't think God was proud of her, but again back to the heart, we don't know it only God does. Who are you implying that sits home and drinks beer and critisizes people?

Ekalb101 I have not defended the soldiers who participated in the activity that you mention above. I'm talking about a youth growing up, being lead in the wrong direction.

For example, another of God's Commandments is that We Honor Our Father and Mother. Some are brought up believing that he/she is doing the honorable thing by offering to serve their country. If they've tried to honor and respect their parents understanding and guidance they are doing what they believe is right. Once within the military system it is very hard to earn your freedom other than doing your time. New recruits are seduced to sign up for years of service before they really figure out what they are up against. I doubt if many are signing up to kill anyone. It's my guess, many would walk away if they could once the reality sets in. But trying to be true to their commitments and understanding of what God intended for them they give their life and liberty for others freedom.

They need our support and prayers that they will return soon. It's difficult for me to understand those who refuse to even pray for their safety, and that's what I'm talking about. I've received the impression that since JW's do not believe in war they shun the thought of caring for those who are serving our country. in order to secure our freedom. Surely JW's enjoy the freedom that our forefathers shed their blood for.

I thought we were here because God has a Plan for us. Things we go thru here on earth are designed to bring us closer to Him. So whatever situation we find ourselves in, we can be sure that God's design includes us ALL. I don't feel that a select group of people can nominate themselves as the only true believers who will be saved. God made and loves us ALL and has a way for each one of us to return to Him. And that includes everyone. Even those who have chosen to go the in the opposite direction of just sitting back and indulging in alcohol or drugs while doing nothing more than criticizing what they don't understand.

And yes I do try to love my neighbor as myself. It takes work but if we do not see eye to eye, we can still try to embrace each others lives in the spirit of God's love.
If God didn't want us to work to realize we want to live with Him, He would have made it so. We need to respect and love ALL of God's people and the plan He has for them.
[This message was edited Fri Aug 6 6:06:18 2004 by mzflash]

mzflash said:

333 said:

Matt. 26:52: “Jesus said to him: ‘Return your sword to its place, for all those who take the sword will perish by the sword.’”

Isa. 2:2-4: “It must occur in the final part of the days that the mountain of the house of Jehovah will become firmly established above the top of the mountains . . . And he will certainly render judgment among the nations and set matters straight respecting many peoples. And they will have to beat their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning shears. Nation will not lift up sword against nation, neither will they learn war anymore.” (Individuals out of all nations must personally decide what course they will pursue. Those who have heeded Jehovah’s judgment give evidence that he is their God.)

2 Cor. 10:3, 4: “Though we walk in the flesh, we do not wage warfare according to what we are in the flesh. For the weapons of our warfare are not fleshly, but powerful by God for overturning strongly entrenched things.”

Luke 6:27, 28: “I [Jesus Christ] say to you who are listening, Continue to love your enemies, to do good to those hating you, to bless those cursing you, to pray for those who are insulting you.”

Is it not true that Jehovah allowed ancient Israel to engage in warfare?

Jehovah directed ancient Israel to use warfare to take possession of the land that he himself designated as their inheritance and to execute people whose depraved practices and defiance of the true God caused Jehovah to view them as being no longer fit to live. (Deut. 7:1, 2, 5; 9:5; Lev. 18:24, 25) Nevertheless, mercy was shown to Rahab and to the Gibeonites because they demonstrated faith in Jehovah. (Josh. 2:9-13; 9:24-27) In the Law covenant God laid down rules for warfare that he would approve, stipulating exemptions and the manner in which this warfare was to be carried out. Such were truly holy wars of Jehovah. That is not true of the carnal warfare of any nation today.

With the establishing of the Christian congregation, a new situation came into existence. Christians are not under the Mosaic Law. Christ’s followers were to make disciples of people of all nations; so worshipers of the true God would in time be found in all those nations. However, what is the motive of those nations when they go to war? Is it to carry out the will of the Creator of all the earth or is it to further some nationalistic interest? If true Christians in one nation were to go to war against another nation, they would be fighting against fellow believers, against people who prayed for help to the same God that they did. Appropriately, Christ directed his followers to lay down the sword. (Matt. 26:52) He himself, glorified in the heavens, would henceforth carry out the execution of those who showed defiance of the true God and His will.—2 Thess. 1:6-8; Rev. 19:11-21.

As to serving in the armed forces, what does secular history disclose about the attitude of early Christians?

“A careful review of all the information available goes to show that, until the time of Marcus Aurelius [Roman emperor from 161 to 180 C.E.], no Christian became a soldier; and no soldier, after becoming a Christian, remained in military service.”—The Rise of Christianity (London, 1947), E. W. Barnes, p. 333.

“We who were filled with war, and mutual slaughter, and every wickedness, have each through the whole earth changed our warlike weapons,—our swords into ploughshares, and our spears into implements of tillage,—and we cultivate piety, righteousness, philanthropy, faith, and hope, which we have from the Father Himself through Him who was crucified.”—Justin Martyr in “Dialogue With Trypho, a Jew” (2nd century C.E.), The Ante-Nicene Fathers (Grand Rapids, Mich.; reprint of 1885 Edinburgh edition), edited by A. Roberts and J. Donaldson, Vol. I, p. 254.

“They refused to take any active part in the civil administration or the military defence of the empire. . . . it was impossible that the Christians, without renouncing a more sacred duty, could assume the character of soldiers, of magistrates, or of princes.”—History of Christianity (New York, 1891), Edward Gibbon, pp. 162, 163.

NotDeaf said:

333 said:

sosgemini said:

OdysseyMiles said:

Ekelb101:

333 said:

333 said:

333 said:

ekalb101 said:

ekalb101 said:

I said:

ekalb101 said:

333 said:[quote]

ekalb101 said: