PatrickS77 said:

"Oh look...a dead horse!" "Let's beat it!"

vainandy said:

Well hell, when I heard "freak", I thought I was going to hear some good stuff like wild and kinky sexual stuff. This is just more of that dull Peter Pan side of him that has always turned me off. The only good dirt was him talking about Madonna but if she couldn't get him away from that Peter Pan shit, then he was hopeless. I do blame all of that shit on Joseph though. Michael was a better person than me though because if I was him, once I made all that money after "Thriller", I would have used my money and fame to make Joseph's life as miserable as he had made mine. I wouldn't have stopped until he was on the side of the road holding up a "Will Work For Food" sign.

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[Edited 12/29/20 6:31am]

Probably the best comments on this godforsaken thread.

Oh, and TrivialPursuit's comment was cool as well.

TrivialPursuit said:

onlyforaminute said:

RJOrion said:

50% of the people here enjoy being pissed on??... nah... not in my culture... that type of deviant sadistic behavior is limited to certain types of peoples. [Edited 12/30/20 8:29am]

RJOrion said:

50% of the people here enjoy being pissed on??... nah... not in my culture... that type of deviant sadistic behavior is limited to certain types of peoples

Then you're in the other 50%.

My point is that no one here really has the judgement call on who is a freak. We're all freaks to someone, musically, socially, sexually.

2freaky4church1 said:

He wanted to die young, he hated black women, used fame to be loved, sick dude:

https://www.youtube.com/w...YC87HPNWA0

He was troubled.

Eh, shut up. Greatest entertainer ever.

RJOrion said:

vainandy said:

Michael was a better person than me though because if I was him, once I made all that money after "Thriller", I would have used my money and fame to make Joseph's life as miserable as he had made mine. I wouldn't have stopped until he was on the side of the road holding up a "Will Work For Food" sign.

Every time he saw his father, Mike thought he was in trouble. Of course, he was "troubled". Tried to get the whole world to love him to replace Joseph's love or try to change Joe's mind.

Cinny said:

Every time he saw his father, Mike thought he was in trouble. Of course, he was "troubled". Tried to get the whole world to love him to replace Joseph's love or try to change Joe's mind.

word...the part that messed me up was he & Janet play-acting Joe's funeral... that was deep...and dark

RJOrion said:

Cinny said:

Every time he saw his father, Mike thought he was in trouble. Of course, he was "troubled". Tried to get the whole world to love him to replace Joseph's love or try to change Joe's mind.

That Joseph story can only go so far, though. One has to rise above their raising, be better than those who raised them. MJ had every opportunity to rise above it instead of using it as an excuse for his crutches in life.

RODSERLING said:

RODSERLING said:

MJ makes himself a martyr whenever his skin became an obvious problem, to distract from it. In fact MJ was the less beaten of the boys, because Joe always took him as a model : " Do as Michael". And according to his brothers, MJ was the most angry of the family and the only one who dared to face his father. .

Right. And you don't think that led to more beating? Resistance is the sure fire way to get more beatings. Besides, no one who wasn't there, should make a judgment on how their upbringing was or how they perceived it. Who are you to judge on how any of those kids should feel about what they were going through?

MotownSubdivision said:

Empress said:

RJOrion said:

50% of the people here enjoy being pissed on??... nah... not in my culture... that type of deviant sadistic behavior is limited to certain types of peoples. [Edited 12/30/20 8:29am]

You mean like evangelicals and politicians??

Joe Jackson irreparably damaged Michael and he never apologized, to my knowledge. This cannot be minimized.

Someone in a higher power will deal w/him.

Margot said:

Joe Jackson irreparably damaged Michael and he never apologized, to my knowledge. This cannot be minimized.

Someone in a higher power will deal w/him.

I remember just days after Michael's death, a reporter was asking Joe questions about Michael and he said.... "Yeah, yeah, yeah.....uh...look, I've got something important to say here. I'm working on this new group...".

vainandy said:

vainandy said:

Ottensen said:

Do Infind the tapes insightful? Yes. Do I find some of Michael's statement odd to the point of fringing on bizarre? Definitely. Do I believe he was a troubled individual with deep rooted psych issues who could have benefited from professional help to sort out his childhood trauma? Yes. But even though Michael clearly had issues, I can compatmrtmentalize that and still appreciate his artistic genius, and the impact of his legacy on modern music...and thankfully I can do so without attacking others who dare shine a light on the fact that like all humankind who walk this earth, he was no God, but a mere mortal with just as many flaws and warts as anyone else- flaws possibly intensified to a greater degree because of his background and celebrity. I know that hearing one's favorite hero lived life as a broken soul is difficult for many to accept or bear: heroes and heroines, after all, represent all that is shiny and perfect and without blemish in our greatest hopes and fantasies of what people and life could (or should) be. It's disappointing to be confronted with the fact that the images of people we hold as perfect, in reality, are mere illusions. [b]. With all that said, I do hope that as content like this is presented we can all agree not to attack each other over it. In all the years I've been on this site, one of the biggest lessons I've taken from our OG moderators is that in discussion, we should criticize ideas, not one another. If we find lies in the content, by all means, we should deconstruct it and tear it apart, but insulting other Orgers for simply presenting additional (though perhaps unpleasant) sides to a person's life story is very 2003. We can't ever capture the complete essence of anyone in their totality on this board, but it's completely fair (in my view) to explore different facets of their life, personality, and world view through their own words and the recollection of those who knew them intimately. I had to stop listening to the tapes because they were a bit much to start my morning of with, but I am intrigued enough to hear more later. For those who are offended by the tapes or consider them old news, please know that not everyone has heard them, and the reason some of us are fine with them being presented here is because they can prompt discussion not only about Michael's life and worldview, but set the stage for deep and meaningful discussion about different issues and life ideas not just unique to Michael's life situation, but heck, all of us. Btw, Happy 2021, y'all. I haven't been around for a while but threats of an extended lockdown might make me visit more often.

A lot of blablabla. A) why does it need to be discussed, especially be people who don't give a shit about MJ anyway?? B) having finally listened full to this edit, for anyone to have the take away of this being that he's a freak and sick and "hated black women" (WTF?), really tells much more about that person than about MJ. Wouldn't want to be around such a person, really and C) what makes you think that people taking issue with that take away think that he was perfect and not a mortal?? What a silly way to look at things.