Her music makes me go nah. Songs just aren't there.

2freaky4church1 said:

Grammys are meaningless trash and always have been but it's a really good album!

I personally was rooting for Lana.

Billie can't turn a phrase or stir up vivid imagery and a sense of nostalgia like Lana can.

But apparently the academy wasn't looking for that.

They awarded someone who's seventeen and depressed, who according to her own admission barely squeaked by to make it to see 2020.

Maybe these awards will save her.

Then I might look at it differently.

The album is sonically really interesting, as many have commented it's got this strange ASMR thing going on that is really quite original sounding. It's also based mostly on fairly straight forward melodic songwriting so it's not just experimental for lack of tunes . Obviously the lyrics mean little to people my age but that's ok, I don't need to be someone's biggest fan to appreciate an album.

It also stands out for being arguably the biggest album of the year (certainly in the top 5, i'd rather not have the argument) while also being entirely the work of her and her brother, side-stepping the usual style of bringing in the big guns like Jack Antonoff, Max Martin, Pharrell, Dr. Luke, etc. to polish and sculpt and make a "hit" album.

You don't have to love it (I'm not exactly playing it daily myself) but it's worth your time to give it a listen.

[Edited 1/27/20 10:21am]

I honestly have no idea who Billie Eilish is, I'm guess I'm just too old and too stuck in my old school ways.

Proof that the Grammys are a joke. One of the most annoying albums of all time, doing many things but doing them all wrong, sometimes in the same damn song (rap, electro, ballads, alternative rock, and trap, which is wrong in itself, TRAP IS TRASH) overrated by teenagers and hipsters seeking $$$$ (youtube reviews and magazines desperately trying to stay "trendy") and an even worse visual style (unwatchable videos and one of the worst front covers of all time). Dreadful and irritating. Shows how low we've come from Adele's 21 (easily the last great mainstream album of all time, so far). The music industry might not be dead (it just morphed into iTunes, legal downloads, youtube and spotify) but mainstream pop is DEAD for real. The 2010s have been AWFUL, eventually leading to Billie and Ed Fcking Sheeran.

By comparison, the Oscars are still a serious award (you don't see the likes of A:Endgame nominated for Best Picture, or Chloe Moretz for Best Actress).

[Edited 1/27/20 10:46am]

JoeTyler said:

By comparison, the Oscars are still a serious award (you don't see the likes of A:Endgame nominated for Best Picture, or Chloe Moretz for Best Actress).

I'm pretty sure Black Panther was.

Wow where to begin, this show is so poorly put together and the sound person needs to go, every year there is an issue, and can we stop with the cursing delays, either tell the artist to EDIT it or you cant perform. tired of this nonsense. I watched most of the show on MUTE because of sound issues and off key and weird things going on, like the double sound of DMC with Aerosmith WTF was going on was DMC using a record and rapping over their own stuff, i swear i heard like 10 voices. Camila Cabello like the girl, shes sweet, but this was so off key I felt bad for her, Demi Lovato always liked her super talented, but advice, heal in private stop doing these mega comebacks and tying it into a performance and single so you are bombarded with media which is what you said derailed you. As for the awards WTF? I honestly knew almost nothing, Billie Eilish I dont get it and I feel bad because all this at 18, what is going to come, downfall. Song of the year? What is it? John Legend? khaled I never heard this thing and what is special about it? Also who the hell won Rap album of the year? And better yet WTF are those nominees? Was anyone over 18 and not a social media fool. I swear the mainstream is totally fucking screwed, guys this is bad. And did they really give out the Comedy award on the air???? To The guy you know is never gonna show up? The grammy show is so F'd up, I am serious, what was the point of the comedy album on the air? I didnt even know half of those people and the other half I didnt know they had an album, also that cowboy thing, oh my god this is where we are. And Ariana Grande, I didnt know what that was, a medley? A pajama party, an orge waiting to happen? I think its time to stop all these music award shows. That Prince Tribute WHY? Sorry i saw no reason to have it outside of you have a Prince special on CBS that is gonna be a dumpster fire later this spring. I still dont get it, The grammy show avoided prince like the plague in the 90's and early 2000's now every year they pay him respects? don't get it. All in all, the show was as bad as i thought, I came away with not caring and not getting into anyone that i havent listened to before.

Yeah I agree the show was a glossy mess.

Alicia Keys was the MVP because of her intelligence and grace. I even loved her performance of her new song, an obvious deal for her to host the show again this year.

Camilla I just don't get. She's boring at best and whacksauce at worst. They would've been better off taking a chance with Normani.

Yeah the Nipsy tribute was kinda all over the place but I can listen to John Legend sing the phone book. I'm almost in love with him because of the way he sings.

Billie Eilish is a nice singer who does good without all the bells and whistles (her sit down performance was strong) but she is oh so trendy. I'm surprised and not surprised that they awarded her so heavily. We'll see what happens. Adele was awarded heavily and then came back with another diamond cert (whatever that means in the 2010s) so stranger things have happened. If success screwed her up so much I'd hate to see what failure does.

On a side note the sappy, nostalgic side of me was satieted by the performance of "I Feel The Body Electric", and was elated that they brought out original cast members the perform, especially Lee Curreri who played Bruno Martelli.

Bruno Martelli was my inner keyboardist inspiration when I was young and first saw the movie. I was so excited to see him. Now if they would've gotten Irene Cara I'd be dead now. Cyndi was a perfect stand-in though.

CynicKill said:

Yeah I agree the show was a glossy mess.

Alicia Keys was the MVP because of her intelligence and grace. I even loved her performance of her new song, an obvious deal for her to host the show again this year.

Camilla I just don't get. She's boring at best and whacksauce at worst. They would've been better off taking a chance with Normani.

Yeah the Nipsy tribute was kinda all over the place but I can listen to John Legend sing the phone book. I'm almost in love with him because of the way he sings.

Billie Eilish is a nice singer who does good without all the bells and whistles (her sit down performance was strong) but she is oh so trendy. I'm surprised and not surprised that they awarded her so heavily. We'll see what happens. Adele was awarded heavily and then came back with another diamond cert (whatever that means in the 2010s) so stranger things have happened. If success screwed her up so much I'd hate to see what failure does.

On a side note the sappy, nostalgic side of me was satieted by the performance of "I Feel The Body Electric", and was elated that they brought out original cast members the perform, especially Lee Curreri who played Bruno Martelli.

Bruno Martelli was my inner keyboardist inspiration when I was young and first saw the movie. I was so excited to see him. Now if they would've gotten Irene Cara I'd be dead now. Cyndi was a perfect stand-in though.

The problem with Camila is the same that I have with most of the female younger artists in her genre, the vocals and the production are all the same the style of singing, the gymnastics in the voices, If i was blind Ariana and Camila and hell even Demi they all seemed to be in the same school of learning. Billie Eilish again its a trend and at 18 how does she react to that? She is not Norah Jones who played clubs won a million awards but still knew it was all a fluke and maintained herself and never cared about sales slipping etc...I worry more about the youth, though Norah was 22 at the time she had a stronger upbringing and was a musician at heart not a trend that caught fire, social media stars are really dangerous now.

lastdecember said:

The problem with Camila is the same that I have with most of the female younger artists in her genre, the vocals and the production are all the same the style of singing, the gymnastics in the voices, If i was blind Ariana and Camila and hell even Demi they all seemed to be in the same school of learning.

Aren't mainstream acts in general influenced by the acts that came right before them? Elvis did with blues, gospel, country, & R&B. The Beatles did with R&B, Indian music, and showtunes. Michael Jackson with James Brown & Fred Astaire. So who was popular before the current female singers that they might have heard? It was Whitney Houston, Mariah Carey, R. Kelly, Christina Aguilera, Jodeci, Dru Hill, etc. Which is the style a lot of people do on popular TV shows like American Idol and Star Search before it. Remember Sam Harris? That vocal style comes from gospel singing. Patti Labelle is well known for that. In the same way it was Michael & Janet Jackson, Madonna, Paula Abdul and others who popularized big dance routines that are still done with newer pop acts. The choreography before the the MTV era was more smooth & simple like The Temptations & The Pips, not aerobics with 10 other dancers behind them. That's how those older acts could sing and dance at the same time without lip syncing in concert or being out of breath. They weren't trying to duplicate a music video.

[Edited 1/27/20 13:44pm]

CynicKill said:

I personally was rooting for Lana.

Billie can't turn a phrase or stir up vivid imagery and a sense of nostalgia like Lana can.

But apparently the academy wasn't looking for that.

They awarded someone who's seventeen and depressed, who according to her own admission barely squeaked by to make it to see 2020.

Maybe these awards will save her.

Then I might look at it differently.

i thought for sure Norman Fcking Rockwell was going to win a few awards

i kinda like billie eilish although i've only listened to her album maybe twice,
whereas i've listened to lana's new album about a hundred times and played
some of the individual songs a gazillian times over.

MotownSubdivision said:

The main issue with this it seems is that there were bigger, more prominent and maybe even better choices for the 4 majors yet Billie sweet them all. Lizzo and Lil Nas X were everywhere last year; they were almost inescapable. Even if you avoided their music, you still heard their names and what they stood for. I don't recall ANYBODY even mentioning this girl's name in my day to day life last year despite her success yet she's the one winning Best New Artist, Record of the Year, Song of the Year AND Album of the Year? GTFOH. [Edited 1/27/20 14:43pm]

I probably would've thrown Best New Artist at Lizzo.

Given Record of the year to L'il Nas X.

And given my girl Lana Album and Song.

But the only one I was adamant about was Album, which I feel Lana truly deserved.

Good to see see some Lana love here if not at the Grammy's. Agree that Lana's album was album of the year.

As far as Billie Eilish, I think she is talented and I appreciate her in limited doses. However, If i listen to her entire album I start feeling depressed, in part because I realize she is so popular because so many young people relate to the depression and ennui portrayed in her music I absolutely love her song that captures her reaction to her success this year, Everything I Wanted. This and most of her other singles are so different from mainstream radio that it is amazing that they play them. I worry for her that her extreme success and inevitable backlash will be hard to handle for such a young and seemingly vulnerable person. My heart roots for her to survive and thrive!

MickyDolenz said:

lastdecember said:

The problem with Camila is the same that I have with most of the female younger artists in her genre, the vocals and the production are all the same the style of singing, the gymnastics in the voices, If i was blind Ariana and Camila and hell even Demi they all seemed to be in the same school of learning.

Aren't mainstream acts in general influenced by the acts that came right before them? Elvis did with blues, gospel, country, & R&B. The Beatles did with R&B, Indian music, and showtunes. Michael Jackson with James Brown & Fred Astaire. So who was popular before the current female singers that they might have heard? It was Whitney Houston, Mariah Carey, R. Kelly, Christina Aguilera, Jodeci, Dru Hill, etc. Which is the style a lot of people do on popular TV shows like American Idol and Star Search before it. Remember Sam Harris? That vocal style comes from gospel singing. Patti Labelle is well known for that. In the same way it was Michael & Janet Jackson, Madonna, Paula Abdul and others who popularized big dance routines that are still done with newer pop acts. The choreography before the the MTV era was more smooth & simple like The Temptations & The Pips, not aerobics with 10 other dancers behind them. That's how those older acts could sing and dance at the same time without lip syncing in concert or being out of breath. They weren't trying to duplicate a music video.

[Edited 1/27/20 13:44pm]

yes but that doesn't mean it's good, Christina Aguilera has a great voice but is a horrible singer a lot of the times, the acrobats like with a Beyoncé and others yes came from Mariah sort of but also from the teachers they had in their singing classes and schools. There are so many people today taking musical theatre and many stink at their style and technique. So grande and Cabello and lovato have good voices but horrible techniques.

lastdecember said:

yes but that doesn't mean it's good, Christina Aguilera has a great voice but is a horrible singer a lot of the times, the acrobats like with a Beyoncé and others yes came from Mariah sort of but also from the teachers they had in their singing classes and schools. There are so many people today taking musical theatre and many stink at their style and technique. So grande and Cabello and lovato have good voices but horrible techniques.

Melisma has long been a part of gospel music and gospel was the foundation of R&B and early rock n roll. It wasn't just invented with Mariah Carey. Mariah (and Shanice Wilson) got the high notes from Minnie Riperton who was doing that in the 1960s in the band Rotary Connection.. Some early R&B was literally gospel songs with the lyrics changed to secular subjects. You can even hear it in the preaching style of some black Baptist pastors. Many older R&B and soul singers started out in church or in gospel groups like Aretha Franklin, Sam Cooke, James Brown, Little Richard, Charlie Wilson, etc. Aretha's biggest selling album is gospel. Eddie Levert from The O'Jays said one of his influences was opera singer Mario Lanza and opera is also known for melisma. You can hear it in doo wop songs too.

MotownSubdivision said:

The main issue with this it seems is that there were bigger, more prominent and maybe even better choices for the 4 majors yet Billie sweet them all. Lizzo and Lil Nas X were everywhere last year; they were almost inescapable. Even if you avoided their music, you still heard their names and what they stood for. I don't recall ANYBODY even mentioning this girl's name in my day to day life last year despite her success yet she's the one winning Best New Artist, Record of the Year, Song of the Year AND Album of the Year? GTFOH. [Edited 1/27/20 14:43pm]

You could try paying attention to what people are liking and not falling for one-hit wonders like Lil Nas X perhaps? Also Lizzo won three grammys so give it a rest. I'm sorry if you're off the ball with knowing what's big but that's on you, Billie Eilish album has gone double platinum, Lizzo's has not.

[Edited 1/28/20 1:15am]

MickyDolenz said:

JoeTyler said:

By comparison, the Oscars are still a serious award (you don't see the likes of A:Endgame nominated for Best Picture, or Chloe Moretz for Best Actress).

I'm pretty sure Black Panther was.

And Black Panther deserved it, unlike Endgame which is a fun time but not awardworthy as best picture.

Black Panther's story was overall grounded and the film's impact was important to prove once and for all that an international audience will pay money to see a diverse cast. That's the kind of thing that should be acknowledged by the Academy.

I'll give her a try.

This is the first year I didn't bother to even glance at the winner's list. Looking at the nominees a few weeks ago, I felt really disconnected from it all.

MickyDolenz said:

lastdecember said:

yes but that doesn't mean it's good, Christina Aguilera has a great voice but is a horrible singer a lot of the times, the acrobats like with a Beyoncé and others yes came from Mariah sort of but also from the teachers they had in their singing classes and schools. There are so many people today taking musical theatre and many stink at their style and technique. So grande and Cabello and lovato have good voices but horrible techniques.

Melisma has long been a part of gospel music and gospel was the foundation of R&B and early rock n roll. It wasn't just invented with Mariah Carey. Mariah (and Shanice Wilson) got the high notes from Minnie Riperton who was doing that in the 1960s in the band Rotary Connection.. Some early R&B was literally gospel songs with the lyrics changed to secular subjects. You can even hear it in the preaching style of some black Baptist pastors. Many older R&B and soul singers started out in church or in gospel groups like Aretha Franklin, Sam Cooke, James Brown, Little Richard, Charlie Wilson, etc. Aretha's biggest selling album is gospel. Eddie Levert from The O'Jays said one of his influences was opera singer Mario Lanza and opera is also known for melisma. You can hear it in doo wop songs too.

But again that Type of singer like a Mariah since she sold everyone then proceeded to try to be like her. Christina's vocal styling is all over the place so whether she was tapping into Mariah who was tapping into Minnie sort of, they are not identical singers, Im saying what they are doing and how its transferred now makes every singer sound the same. Alessa Cara sounds 100% like Camila Cabello, its like they are twins, and that is exactly what I hear from tons of female singers coming up now, its a style, like an assembly line to fit the songs the way they are written for them.

jaawwnn said:

Please check again. Billie is NOT manufactured pop at all, it is homegrown, self written music, Prince style made in the own bedroom-studio only by herself and her brother.

And Billie is not positioned as the next big thing. She is already the biggest star on the scene. She won most of the end-of-year-charts for 2019 in Europe, and I guess also in the US.

And no, she also doesn't make music aimed at 14 year olds. I'm 47, and the two CDs she has out seldom leave the player. She's as fresh as 1999 was in 1982.

You definitely miss out a lot if You don't follow her closely.

EmmaMcG said:

Just been checking out some more of Billie Eilish's music. Like I said before, not my cup of tea at all but she's definitely being positioned as the next big thing. I mean, we all know that the Grammy's are bought and paid for. The "main" awards are anyway. That's not really a secret at this stage. So not only does she "win" several Grammy's but she's also given the new Bond theme. Well, now that Bond is being distributed by Universal Pictures and Billie Eilish is signed to a division of Universal Music, it makes sense. It's actually great promotion. Similar to how Columbia gave Skyfall to Adele when it was their movie studio in charge of Bond. I don't like most manufactured pop and Billie Eilish is no different but she's very young and I wish her well. Hopefully she is given more protection than a lot of other young girls are given in the music industry.

Now Tyler, the Creator, he is the shit.

kindofblue said:

Please check again. Billie is NOT manufactured pop at all, it is homegrown, self written music, Prince style made in the own bedroom-studio only by herself and her brother.

And Billie is not positioned as the next big thing. She is already the biggest star on the scene. She won most of the end-of-year-charts for 2019 in Europe, and I guess also in the US.

And no, she also doesn't make music aimed at 14 year olds. I'm 47, and the two CDs she has out seldom leave the player. She's as fresh as 1999 was in 1982.

You definitely miss out a lot if You don't follow her closely.

EmmaMcG said:

Just been checking out some more of Billie Eilish's music. Like I said before, not my cup of tea at all but she's definitely being positioned as the next big thing. I mean, we all know that the Grammy's are bought and paid for. The "main" awards are anyway. That's not really a secret at this stage. So not only does she "win" several Grammy's but she's also given the new Bond theme. Well, now that Bond is being distributed by Universal Pictures and Billie Eilish is signed to a division of Universal Music, it makes sense. It's actually great promotion. Similar to how Columbia gave Skyfall to Adele when it was their movie studio in charge of Bond. I don't like most manufactured pop and Billie Eilish is no different but she's very young and I wish her well. Hopefully she is given more protection than a lot of other young girls are given in the music industry.

But there in is the issue, its not manufactured but the label and all the push is because as Prince would say when there is stagnation you can pop something in there. But do understand this is how the industry still works, despite the eroding sales in all forms even streaming is down across the board, labels and people having very short attention spans rarely latch on to artists, because there is something coming right behind them. She is only 18 and that is really young even in this industry to be given the accolades, because every artist has that "honeymoon" period as Elton John called it, he had it for half a decade but those times were different, there was musical competition and he was doing two albums a year most of the time or at least one and a double album too. Things are not set that way so she will have to either adapt or somehow shake the jinxes of the industry where everyone expects when you win something that you always have to win something.