MickyDolenz said:

mj looks like he doesn't want to be next to her

Madonna didn't do alot of touring in the 90s.There was the Blonde Ambition tour in 1990 but the next tour (Girlie Show,1994) didn't even play alot of American dates.In the 90s,she was busy focusing on things like Evita and motherhood.

She made up for it in the last ten years,though.Since 2001,she has done a whopping four world tours and the most recent one is the most successful tour ever by a female artist (grossing over $400 million).

HonestMan13 said:

Two entirely different genres and audiences back then. They were never even postioned in the media to be rivals. They both existed free of comparison to the other and still do to this day. They'll both go down in music history as leaders in what they've accomplished.

Very true.In fact,this site is the only place that I ever see them being compared

I never got the comparison other then the fact that they both create dance music. Personally, I think Madonna won this "battle" already. There's really no denying that she's the blueprint for female Pop stars and the most successful of all female artists.

smoothcriminal12 said:

I wasn't around, so I wouldn't know, but in my opinion Madonna has NOTHING on Janet.

kenny88 said:

I never got the comparison other then the fact that they both create dance music. Personally, I think Madonna won this "battle" already. There's really no denying that she's the blueprint for female Pop stars and the most successful of all female artists.

I think Madonna has gone as far as any female artist is likely to go.She's in the Rock N'Roll Hall of Fame and even in the Guiness Book of World Records.

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[Edited 5/21/22 18:26pm]

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[Edited 5/21/22 18:26pm]

TotalAlisa said:

kenny88 said:

I never got the comparison other then the fact that they both create dance music. Personally, I think Madonna won this "battle" already. There's really no denying that she's the blueprint for female Pop stars and the most successful of all female artists.

we can thank madonna for her blueprint of no talented, non-singing, barely can dance or perform singers who use gimmicks and sexuality to maintain popularity.

janet's blueprint is different, she was an awesome performer, used iconic choreographed dances in her videos and performance and didn't rely on gimmicks.

so there was no battle that madonna won.

amen to this

SoulAlive said:

kenny88 said:

I never got the comparison other then the fact that they both create dance music. Personally, I think Madonna won this "battle" already. There's really no denying that she's the blueprint for female Pop stars and the most successful of all female artists.

I think Madonna has gone as far as any female artist is likely to go.She's in the Rock N'Roll Hall of Fame and even in the Guiness Book of World Records.

She's also the only Pop female artist in the top 40 of Rolling Stone's Greatest Artists Of All Time list.

TotalAlisa said:

kenny88 said:

I never got the comparison other then the fact that they both create dance music. Personally, I think Madonna won this "battle" already. There's really no denying that she's the blueprint for female Pop stars and the most successful of all female artists.

we can thank madonna for her blueprint of no talented, non-singing, barely can dance or perform singers who use gimmicks and sexuality to maintain popularity.

janet's blueprint is different, she was an awesome performer, used iconic choreographed dances in her videos and performance and didn't rely on gimmicks.

so there was no battle that madonna won.

They're both in the same vein when it comes to their approach as performers - meek voices; elaborate tours with good back-up dancers.

I don't think Janet did a good job being as consistent as Madonna have over the years. Madonna is still talked about today even without an album. Her name is always attached to any upcoming Pop artist's performance or album.

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[Edited 5/21/22 18:27pm]

TotalAlisa said:

kenny88 said:

They're both in the same vein when it comes to their approach as performers - meek voices; elaborate tours with good back-up dancers.

I don't think Janet did a good job being as consistent as Madonna have over the years. Madonna is still talked about today even without an album. Her name is always attached to any upcoming Pop artist's performance or album.

you just proved what i said, madonna is all about popularity. thats all you base madonnas merits on. Janet is a better performer/dancer and singer. Thats a fact. Her videos had several iconic choreographic dances. No it was not the same approach. if janet's talents were on the same level as madonna, she wouldn't even make it as far. She is a jackson so more was expected of her and it was almost standard for her.

madonna is only talked about by certain people. Janet is in Guiness book of world records too so is mariah carey.

show me a madonna without gimmicks and lets see if the career would have lasted long.

Madonna is a POP artists. So like every POP artist, she's about POPularity. Madonna's merits are also based on critical acclaim and she gets much more acclaim than Janet ever did in her prime. Sorry, but that's a fact.

Show me a Pop artist that doesn't use gimmicks... didn't Janet's career fall apart because of a gimmick she pulled?

TotalAlisa said:

you just proved what i said, madonna is all about popularity. thats all you base madonnas merits on. Janet is a better performer/dancer and singer. Thats a fact. Her videos had several iconic choreographic dances. No it was not the same approach. if janet's talents were on the same level as madonna, she wouldn't even make it as far. She is a jackson so more was expected of her and it was almost standard for her.

madonna is only talked about by certain people. Janet is in Guiness book of world records too so is mariah carey.

show me a madonna without gimmicks and lets see if the career would have lasted long.

no,that's not a "fact"...it's just your opinion Know the difference.

Um...Janet has been selling sex (and flip flopping before/after weight loss) for the past 20 years. How is that not a "gimmick?" All that toy soldier soldier choreography is another gimmick.

Madonna is a R&R Hall of Famer, despite the fact that her debut album came out a year after Janet's. Guinness and Billboard Magazine lists Madonna - not Janet - as the most successful female recording artist of all time.

Madonna has been scaling down on "gimmicks" since the early/mid 90s, while Janet has steadily increased on them.

Oh, and IMO Madonna is the better singer. I'd like to hear Janet pull off "Papa Don't Preach," and the type of music Madonna did during her I'm Breathless, Evita or even Ray of Light periods. Madonna's voice has *much* more clarity. Half the time Janet sounds like she's mumbling, and I can't understand what she's singing. Her diction is awful.

Aren't opinions great?!

[Edited 8/10/11 15:21pm]

SoulAlive said:

TotalAlisa said:

you just proved what i said, madonna is all about popularity. thats all you base madonnas merits on. Janet is a better performer/dancer and singer. Thats a fact. Her videos had several iconic choreographic dances. No it was not the same approach. if janet's talents were on the same level as madonna, she wouldn't even make it as far. She is a jackson so more was expected of her and it was almost standard for her.

madonna is only talked about by certain people. Janet is in Guiness book of world records too so is mariah carey.

show me a madonna without gimmicks and lets see if the career would have lasted long.

no,that's not a "fact"...it's just your opinion Know the difference.

seriously...give it up TotalAlisa. i love me some janet, i love em about equally, and while i may agree Janet is a TECHNICALLY MORE TALENTED PERFORMER - she is missing something that Madonna has. and beauty/appreciation of music is in the eye of the beholder...no matter how you spin it, Janet will never be as 'big' as Madonna in the history of the world.

"SORRY"

HonestMan13 said:

Two entirely different genres and audiences back then. They were never even postioned in the media to be rivals. They both existed free of comparison to the other and still do to this day. They'll both go down in music history as leaders in what they've accomplished.

Exactly, back then critics kept writing Madonna off as a flash in the pan, as she was a considered a relatively new force in pop music. It took a few years for them to get that she was a force to be reckoned with.

Also, people forget Janet was a showbiz veteran by the time the Control album was released, even though she was only on the verge of turning 20. She already established herself as an actress on Good Times, Diff'rent Strokes and Fame, and recorded a couple albums.

To call the two rivals in the 80s would be a big stretch. 90s, yeah maybe.

[Edited 8/10/11 15:47pm]

smoothcriminal12 said:

I wasn't around, so I wouldn't know, but in my opinion Madonna has NOTHING on Janet.

Thanks for making me feel like an old geezer,

Nobody said anything about Janet being a bigger star than Madonna. But as far as Madonna being the only Blueprint for Pop female artist is a HUGE Negative AND Laugh. Everyone from NSYNC to Lady Gaga from Usher to TLC and from Rihanna to Mary J Blidge has credited Janet as an infleunce.

HonestMan13 said:

Two entirely different genres and audiences back then. They were never even postioned in the media to be rivals. They both existed free of comparison to the other and still do to this day. They'll both go down in music history as leaders in what they've accomplished.

I dont know why we just cant leave it as that

[Edited 8/10/11 16:12pm]

afro75 said:

smoothcriminal12 said:

I wasn't around, so I wouldn't know, but in my opinion Madonna has NOTHING on Janet.

Thanks for making me feel like an old geezer,

Young whipper-snapper! :shakes cane:

I agree wholeheartedly with TotalAlisa, Janet is superior to Madonna in EVERY way. Madonna is nothing more than an attention hungry whore who had a few cute songs and videos in her day. I hate how just because somebody is insanely popular that everybody has to believe that the person is actually talented and worthy. No ma'am.

I'm not even a big Janet fan, I think she fell off after Doesn't Really Matter and should have stopped making albums YEARS ago.

Madonna is not cute, you're only fooling yourself if that's all you think there is to her. Looks and cuteness don't get you that far for 30 years if you have nothing relevant to say or offer to the world and express it in your music and art.

PlayboyOriginal said:

I agree wholeheartedly with TotalAlisa, Janet is superior to Madonna in EVERY way. Madonna is nothing more than an attention hungry whore who had a few cute songs and videos in her day. I hate how just because somebody is insanely popular that everybody has to believe that the person is actually talented and worthy. No ma'am.

I'm not even a big Janet fan, I think she fell off after Doesn't Really Matter and should have stopped making albums YEARS ago.

im glad someone can admit the truth. You don't have to even be a janet fan to see madonna is not as talented. This is no way to discredit madonna. She had some really decent pop classic songs of the 80s. She was the it girl during the 80s but apart from that, it was all gimmicks to stay relavent. Janet's tours were out selling Madonnas during the 90s, in from what I heard people say janet was a more popular artist during the 90s than madonna. Although madonna was more popular during the 80s.

the bold is how i feel about lady gaga. I think she has some decent songs, which im basically terrified to listen to.

Someone pointed out earlier that Madonna barely toured in the 90's and that she was acting and raising her children. I prefer Janet in concert over Madonna too, but to write Madonna off as an 80's act is unfair without really knowing her 90's or 00's work, the way people do it to MJ writing him off as an 80's artist or being Mr. Thriller. I'm all for friendly debates about the two artists, but I would go listen to some Madonna music of the 90's and 00's first, especially off Erotica, Ray of Light and American Life.

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[Edited 5/21/22 18:27pm]

TotalAlisa said:

alphastreet said:

Madonna is not cute, you're only fooling yourself if that's all you think there is to her. Looks and cuteness don't get you that far for 30 years if you have nothing relevant to say or offer to the world and express it in your music and art.

madonna was only relevant for her gimmicks and shocking people. That has nothing to do with music. its about staying in public interest. If it was all about great music that kept the public interested in you thats a whole different story.

Michael played the media too when it beneffited him, but for different purposes. It's showbiz. And she has released great music outside of her 80's radio friendly hits as mentioned in an earlier post.

alphastreet said:

Madonna is not cute, you're only fooling yourself if that's all you think there is to her. Looks and cuteness don't get you that far for 30 years if you have nothing relevant to say or offer to the world and express it in your music and art.

I've listened to her music and it bored me endlessly. I don't see what you see when it comes to her. She contributed to pop culture greatly but I don't give a damn about pop culture. I love music for the art of it. Madonna is nothing more than an older Britney or younger than Marilyn. Society always takes a no talent hoe and makes them seem more than what they are. I don't buy into it.

alphastreet said:

TotalAlisa said:

madonna was only relevant for her gimmicks and shocking people. That has nothing to do with music. its about staying in public interest. If it was all about great music that kept the public interested in you thats a whole different story.

Michael played the media too when it beneffited him, but for different purposes. It's showbiz. And she has released great music outside of her 80's radio friendly hits as mentioned in an earlier post.

yeah but he had actual talent like dancing/performing and great music to back up whatever things he did. So that was just a bonus. I wish janet would have done the same, but she is so low-key and shy.

badujunkie said:

SoulAlive said:

no,that's not a "fact"...it's just your opinion Know the difference.

seriously...give it up TotalAlisa. i love me some janet, i love em about equally, and while i may agree Janet is a TECHNICALLY MORE TALENTED PERFORMER - she is missing something that Madonna has. and beauty/appreciation of music is in the eye of the beholder...no matter how you spin it, Janet will never be as 'big' as Madonna in the history of the world.

"SORRY"

janet has appreciation for music too. She has touched almost all genres of music. Not to mention she grew up in a musically talented family. So to insinuate janet doesn't have appreciation is far fetched.

You are right about the eye of the beholder, music is basically someone's tastes.

janet will not be as big as madonna but that is no knock to janet. Because we all know madonnaused gimmicks and shock tactics to get this big time house hold name. It wasn't based on actual talent. Someone being more popular does not make them a better artist. It is what it is.

[Edited 8/10/11 19:44pm]

TotalAlisa said:

mjscarousal said:

I am both fans of Whitney and Janet and in BOTH threads I have said they aint no such thing as the BIG four.. no its just Michael, Prince and Madonna.

I made that comment because it seems to be a bitter feud between the fan bases of JJ and Madonna.

madonna is not on the same lines as Prince and MJ, she just isn't that talented and her fans will even say that. People always say she stayed in the public eyes because she was controversial not that she was talented. If we are going strictly or talent janet is closer to them then her. but if its all based on popularity and bigger star power then madonna. But she is not a better artists.

(not directed at you MJcarousal)

my only issue with people concerning this issue is, they will like janet jackson more than madonna. Will even say janet can dance, sing and perform better, like her music more, yet say madonna is the better artist. If you think madonna is better why don't you think she can sing/perform/dance better than jj, and why don't you like her music more than jj. so is the degree of talent of an artist based on popularity, or do you just like any artist based on popularity.

Hey boo you get to caught up with the talentless Madonna when ever she gets compared to Michael and Prince...

I personally wouldnt even compare even Janet to Prince and Michael because she is NO WHERE to be found on a Prince and MJ talent. She is a great performer, kick ass dancer and some of her best work is pre-velvet Rope that was cultivated by mostly Jimmy and Terry not knocking J but her "talent" doesnt compare with them which mostly is just being a good dancer .. sorry love her but no..

Likewise with Madonna, I wasnt catagorizing Mike, Prince and her together as far as talent goes just as big stars of the 80's.

The discussion is on popularity not on who has the more talent.

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[Edited 5/21/22 18:27pm]

alphastreet said:

Someone pointed out earlier that Madonna barely toured in the 90's and that she was acting and raising her children. I prefer Janet in concert over Madonna too, but to write Madonna off as an 80's act is unfair without really knowing her 90's or 00's work, the way people do it to MJ writing him off as an 80's artist or being Mr. Thriller. I'm all for friendly debates about the two artists, but I would go listen to some Madonna music of the 90's and 00's first, especially off Erotica, Ray of Light and American Life.

You can't change how some people feel about certain artists. Prince is written off as an 80's act and so is Whitney etc and its supposed to be ok. So I feel that Michael and Madonna are overrated then thats my perogative. Michael was an amazing performer but he wasn't the greatest. Madonna is the Queen of Pop Culture and Controversy but she's average at best. You just have to DEAL!!