That album is still good.

Fab is still awfully handsome.

I agree that the criticism and backlash was way overblown.

MickyDolenz said:

119 said:

I agree most of the blame should go with the producers, but Fabrice and Rob did deserve some blame for going along with it. Sure, it was all about money and breaking into the business but they knew it was dishonest. Anyway it's nice to see Fabrice was able to move on with his life. He's still fine too after all these years I'll certainly be watching the documentary.

mimi2 said:

wow he do have a pretty good voice. was suprised.

Serious said:

119 said:

That album is still good.

Fab is still awfully handsome.

I agree that the criticism and backlash was way overblown.

IMO Fab looks way hotter than he did back then.

I agree that he looks better without the hair. But he's always had good bone structure and lovely skin. They were both some good looking men.

119 said:

Looking back on the clip about them, its amazing to me that these black men with long hair, dancing in tight and revealing outfits were as successful as they were. In my area everyone was in to them, and I don’t recall hearing more than a fleeting joke here or there about their aesthetic. The gender and masculinity norms in music are so rigid now, I can’t imagine such an act being able to make it, regardless of the lip synching issue. Frankly, I imagine now people would be more likely to accept the lipsynching than their aesthetic!

mimi2 said:

I agree most of the blame should go with the producers, but Fabrice and Rob did deserve some blame for going along with it. Sure, it was all about money and breaking into the business but they knew it was dishonest.

As I understand it, they signed the CONtract and accepted their advance$ BEFORE the entire plan was revealed to them. By the time they UNDERSTOOD the plan, the only way they could have gotten out of it would have been to have returned their advance (...which I'm sure had already been spent many times over). By this time, they were already being flown all around the world, and performing in front of hundreds of thousands of screaming fans. The producer continued dangling the carrot (more money) in front of their nose to keep it open, long enough for him to rake in the cash.

Personally, I really don't blame Rob or Fab for how things went down. In fact, my heart goes out to those [then] naive young men, for having been played by a smart producer and a slimy industry. Although that album is still one of my all time favorites, regardless of who actually sang on it. Every song on that album is very special to me.

My feeling always was that once they were exposed the Grammy should have gone to the actual singers. I had seen the news conference they held giving the Grammy back when it originally aired on the news, but I didn't notice until watching this YouTube clip now that Rob also recommended the same thing; that the Grammy be given to the actual singers. I think that's all Rob & Fab could have done.

I had heard Fab sing and play guitar before, and always knew he was talented. I look forward to supporting his upcoming projects. May Rob have found the peace in death that apparently eluded him in life.

119 said:

That album is still good.

Fab is still awfully handsome.

I agree that the criticism and backlash was way overblown.

119 said:

Looking back on the clip about them, its amazing to me that these black men with long hair, dancing in tight and revealing outfits were as successful as they were. In my area everyone was in to them, and I don’t recall hearing more than a fleeting joke here or there about their aesthetic. The gender and masculinity norms in music are so rigid now, I can’t imagine such an act being able to make it, regardless of the lip synching issue. Frankly, I imagine now people would be more likely to accept the lipsynching than their aesthetic!

Gangsta rap (and later grunge) killed the androgynous look of the 1980s (at least in the mainstream). But you can go back to the early 1960's with The Beatles "mop tops". For that time, they had long hair, and they caught on with some of the youth.

[Edited 4/15/11 15:17pm]

MickyDolenz said:

119 said:

Looking back on the clip about them, its amazing to me that these black men with long hair, dancing in tight and revealing outfits were as successful as they were. In my area everyone was in to them, and I don’t recall hearing more than a fleeting joke here or there about their aesthetic. The gender and masculinity norms in music are so rigid now, I can’t imagine such an act being able to make it, regardless of the lip synching issue. Frankly, I imagine now people would be more likely to accept the lipsynching than their aesthetic!

Gangsta rap (and later grunge) killed the androgynous look of the 1980s (at least in the mainstream). But you can go back to the early 1960's with The Beatles "mop tops". For that time, they had long hair, and they caught on with some of the youth.

[Edited 4/15/11 15:17pm]

Yeah... As for another brother with long hair and tight clothes, does anyone else remember Corey Glover from Living Colour and his Body Glove outfits? It's from the same period. I thought it was an awesome look for the time period...but, fell out of fashion once the 90's hit.

Interesting about Fab and Rob... I remember Rob getting most of the attention--light skinned, pretty boy...lots of women loved that in the 80's. In recent years, I've seen many people reference Fab as good looking and handsome, perhaps due to an overall change in tastes or social changes..etc.

gemari77 said:

MickyDolenz said:

Gangsta rap (and later grunge) killed the androgynous look of the 1980s (at least in the mainstream). But you can go back to the early 1960's with The Beatles "mop tops". For that time, they had long hair, and they caught on with some of the youth.

[Edited 4/15/11 15:17pm]

Yeah... As for another brother with long hair and tight clothes, does anyone else remember Corey Glover from Living Colour and his Body Glove outfits? It's from the same period. I thought it was an awesome look for the time period...but, fell out of fashion once the 90's hit.

But their audience were mainly white (and so were Milli Vanilli's), and a lot of the "hair rock" groups already wore spandex which is similar to the Body Glove clothes. You didn't see many black male acts that had a primarily black audience wearing spandex. Maybe Word Up era Cameo and some other funk groups did, but not hip hop acts, nor the R&B singers of the period like Luther Vandross, James Ingram, Jeffrey Osborne, or Alexander O'Neal, who all tended to wear suits.

MickyDolenz said:

gemari77 said:

Yeah... As for another brother with long hair and tight clothes, does anyone else remember Corey Glover from Living Colour and his Body Glove outfits? It's from the same period. I thought it was an awesome look for the time period...but, fell out of fashion once the 90's hit.

But their audience were mainly white (and so were Milli Vanilli's), and a lot of the "hair rock" groups already wore spandex which is similar to the Body Glove clothes. You didn't see many black male acts that had a primarily black audience wearing spandex. Maybe Word Up era Cameo and some other funk groups did, but not hip hop acts, nor the R&B singers of the period like Luther Vandross, James Ingram, Jeffrey Osborne, or Alexander O'Neal, who all tended to wear suits.

Interesting. Where I lived black people (including men) were unapologetically listening to Milli Vanilli.

119 said:

MickyDolenz said:

But their audience were mainly white (and so were Milli Vanilli's), and a lot of the "hair rock" groups already wore spandex which is similar to the Body Glove clothes. You didn't see many black male acts that had a primarily black audience wearing spandex. Maybe Word Up era Cameo and some other funk groups did, but not hip hop acts, nor the R&B singers of the period like Luther Vandross, James Ingram, Jeffrey Osborne, or Alexander O'Neal, who all tended to wear suits.

Interesting. Where I lived black people (including men) were unapologetically listening to Milli Vanilli.

Milli Vanilli wasn't played on R&B radio where I lived (which at the time mostly played stuff like EPMD & Geto Boys and New Jack groups like Today), only the pop stations. I didn't say that black people didn't listen to them at all, but their main audience was white. Like I said in another thread, back then, it depended on what area of the US you lived as to what was played. It wasn't all Clear Channel with identical playlists like today.

MickyDolenz said:

119 said:

Interesting. Where I lived black people (including men) were unapologetically listening to Milli Vanilli.

Milli Vanilli wasn't played on R&B radio where I lived (which at the time mostly played stuff like EPMD & Geto Boys and New Jack groups like Today), only the pop stations. I didn't say that black people didn't listen to them at all, but their main audience was white. Like I said in another thread, back then, it depended on what area of the US you lived as to what was played. It wasn't all Clear Channel with identical playlists like today.

Man, I really miss radio from back in the day. Particularly FM stations late at night, when they had features like "Album Hour", when the DJ would play entire albums by a particular artist... COMMERCIAL FREE. That was our cue to break out our portable cassette recorders and hold them up to the speakers (...prehistoric file sharing, lol). Of course, back then artists made albums where the entire thing was worth listening to, lol. Sometimes the DJ would even bring records from his personal collection at home to play on the air, and you could even hear the crackle & pop from REAL VINYL spinning on the turntable.

Ahh, memories...

Thanks for posting. I never knew the whole story. That Producer really did them in.

The fact that they signed a contract AND a confidentialailty agreement really sealed their fate.

He called ALL the shots and when they were no longer useful... (or too much trouble) he could pull the rug. After all, he had nothing to lose. HE really did produce the music... so technically he did not deceive anyone.

PDogz said:

jaybendy said:

BEST BEHIND THE MUSIC EVER! I wish they'd show this one more I love it. I mean I feel bad that dude felt he wanted to end his life tho. That's kinda sad.

If ever there was a reason to commit suicide (and I don't believe there ever is), poor Rob had a damned good one. All within about a 2 year period: You go from a completely unknown, happy-go-lucky party boy, to SUPERSTAR OF THE WORLD, then quickly shot down to less than zero - a mockery... the laughing stock. The one NOBODY wants to be around. That must have screwed with his head something terrible! And the thing is; he didn't set out to deceive anybody, and always had the aspiration to sing with his own voice.

But all drama aside, it was the MUSIC that got me with Milli Vanilli. I heard them on the radio much more often than I ever saw them on music television. And in 1989, the radio was playing them... A WHOLE LOT! So even if you didn't own the album, everybody knew... "Blame It On The Rain", and "Girl I'm Gonna Miss You" and so on. They were just nice songs.

Poor Rob, man. I hope he found peace.

Honestly, when I saw the video for this song and saw it was Rob that was singing it... I KNEW that was not his voice. I just knew. I didn't know all of what really went on. I guess I just figured it was Fab who really sang it but they let Rob pretend to sing the vocals on the video because to share the lime light equally... but I knew that pretty boy with the light eyes had that deep almost gravelly voice.

Soft and sexy... yeah I buy that. FalsetAto... okay. Deep and gravelly like Eddie Levert... sorry in my opinion... you will LOOK like Eddie Levert too. And seeing the real singer.. I wasn't far off.

Just like CC music factory... "everybody dance now" The girl in the video was cute like Beyonce... sorry if you look like Beyonce... 9/10 you will sound like Beyonce... not Aretha, or Patti, or Jennifer Holliday.

PDogz said:

MickyDolenz said:

Milli Vanilli wasn't played on R&B radio where I lived (which at the time mostly played stuff like EPMD & Geto Boys and New Jack groups like Today), only the pop stations. I didn't say that black people didn't listen to them at all, but their main audience was white. Like I said in another thread, back then, it depended on what area of the US you lived as to what was played. It wasn't all Clear Channel with identical playlists like today.

Man, I really miss radio from back in the day. Particularly FM stations late at night, when they had features like "Album Hour", when the DJ would play entire albums by a particular artist... COMMERCIAL FREE. That was our cue to break out our portable cassette recorders and hold them up to the speakers (...prehistoric file sharing, lol). Of course, back then artists made albums where the entire thing was worth listening to, lol. Sometimes the DJ would even bring records from his personal collection at home to play on the air, and you could even hear the crackle & pop from REAL VINYL spinning on the turntable.

Ahh, memories...

There was a station on AM (which still exists today) that played soul and R&B oldies and sometimes blues. One day a week they would play zydeco music. Every once in awhile, they had a record that was scratched and usually they would fade the song out and put on another. They still play records today and is not computerized at all. The title of the song that is playing does not show up on those new style radios.

prodigalfan said:

Just like CC music factory... "everybody dance now" The girl in the video was cute like Beyonce... sorry if you look like Beyonce... 9/10 you will sound like Beyonce... not Aretha, or Patti, or Jennifer Holliday.

The thing with that, is the girl (Zelma Davis) really did sing on many of the songs on that album, just not that particular one. On the 2nd album both Martha Wash and Zelma sang lead on Do You Wanna Get Funky. Now Black Box (also Martha Wash vocals) hired a model to do the videos and concert performances. On the 1st Technotronic video, they also had a model (Felly) in the video. The real female rapper (there was also a male rapper MC Eric) whose name was Ya Kid K, complained and was in the rest of the videos. Ya Kid K wasn't bad looking, just tomboyish. To me, she was better looking than Felly.

prodigalfan said:

PDogz said:

If ever there was a reason to commit suicide (and I don't believe there ever is), poor Rob had a damned good one. All within about a 2 year period: You go from a completely unknown, happy-go-lucky party boy, to SUPERSTAR OF THE WORLD, then quickly shot down to less than zero - a mockery... the laughing stock. The one NOBODY wants to be around. That must have screwed with his head something terrible! And the thing is; he didn't set out to deceive anybody, and always had the aspiration to sing with his own voice.

But all drama aside, it was the MUSIC that got me with Milli Vanilli. I heard them on the radio much more often than I ever saw them on music television. And in 1989, the radio was playing them... A WHOLE LOT! So even if you didn't own the album, everybody knew... "Blame It On The Rain", and "Girl I'm Gonna Miss You" and so on. They were just nice songs.

Poor Rob, man. I hope he found peace.

Honestly, when I saw the video for this song and saw it was Rob that was singing it... I KNEW that was not his voice. I just knew.

I very rarely ever saw the videos to any of those songs back in the day, maybe once or twice. Mostly, I heard the songs on the radio, and then shortly after the album dropped, I purchased it. So when I'd hear Milli Vanilli, it was usually at home on my stereo, on in my car on casssette. So while I knew what Rob & Fab looked like, I never really associated them with, or envisioned them singing, the songs. I just knew I liked the music. Although I began hearing rumors within the industry just a few months before the story actually broke. So by the time that incident happened on stage where the vocal track skipped, I was already aware that they weren't the actual singers.

prodigalfan said:

Just like CC music factory... "everybody dance now" The girl in the video was cute like Beyonce... sorry if you look like Beyonce... 9/10 you will sound like Beyonce... not Aretha, or Patti, or Jennifer Holliday.

I remember seeing C+C Music Factory on some television program, and for whatever reason; all the musical acts were performing LIVE. So when it came to the "Everybody Dance Now!" part, that skinny girl that was in the video (Zelma Davis?) TRIED to sing that part... and she was awful! She had NO POWER in her voice whatsoever. That's when I knew something was up, lol. Soon after, we learned it was Martha Wash, lol. I hope Martha got paid, because she MADE that song!

gemari77 said:

MickyDolenz said:

Gangsta rap (and later grunge) killed the androgynous look of the 1980s (at least in the mainstream). But you can go back to the early 1960's with The Beatles "mop tops". For that time, they had long hair, and they caught on with some of the youth.

[Edited 4/15/11 15:17pm]

Yeah... As for another brother with long hair and tight clothes, does anyone else remember Corey Glover from Living Colour and his Body Glove outfits? It's from the same period. I thought it was an awesome look for the time period...but, fell out of fashion once the 90's hit.

Interesting about Fab and Rob... I remember Rob getting most of the attention--light skinned, pretty boy...lots of women loved that in the 80's. In recent years, I've seen many people reference Fab as good looking and handsome, perhaps due to an overall change n tastes or social changes..etc.

I always preferred Fab, back then and now. He was fine as wine... Rob was "pretty boy".

Looked like he might break down in tears if you hit him.

PDogz said:

I remember seeing C+C Music Factory on some television program, and for whatever reason; all the musical acts were performing LIVE. So when it came to the "Everybody Dance Now!" part, that skinny girl that was in the video (Zelma Davis?) TRIED to sing that part... and she was awful! She had NO POWER in her voice whatsoever. That's when I knew something was up, lol. Soon after, we learned it was Martha Wash, lol. I hope Martha got paid, because she MADE that song!

Trivia: Zelma Davis is one of the background singers in the video for Michael Jackson's Will You Be There. If you look closely, you can see her when the angel is landing on the stage at the end.