phunkdaddy said:

TonyVanDam said:

You know what's funny Cinnie? The very last new song I've heard that had a (simple) bassline in it was a freaking track by The Spice Girls!

[Edited 8/4/10 21:52pm]

[Edited 8/4/10 21:53pm]

Sad but true Phunkdaddy. I had to rely on some Spice Hoes (as RebirthOfCool calls them! ) the give me something to shake my ass to. These shit-hop/rhythmless bullshit artists can NOT get the job done musically because they don't play any basslines at all, not even simple basslines.

vainandy said:

BlaqueKnight said:

[img:$uid]http://www.unity.i8i.co.uk/forum/images/smiley_ROFLMAO.gif[/img:$uid]

Andy, that was too funny! You got me spilling my tea over here! I wouldn't even try to argue with the truth.

The second statement is sad but also true. My fear is the only way funk can come back to mainstream now is if white people do it. Its already that way a little bit now. Bands like Maroon 5 or Chromeo can be as "funk-ish" as they wanna be but if Van Hunt or somebody dropped a funk CD - I mean a REAL funk CD - they would probably get dropped from whatever label they are on. What's worse is there's such a generational disrespect in the current R&B and hip-hop culture with kids embracing and rationalizing being musically illerate that its not likely that many of them seem willing to take it to the next lvel. If you're over 25, its like Logan's Run in the music business - you better run because if you try to put out music, the first thing that gets said is "you're too old to be doing this" - which is some new dumb shit that goes way beyond logic. NOBODY is too old to do music; especially good music.

One of the Barkays said recently that his biggest fear is that one day some white kid is going to tell black people "Come here and let me show you how to play some funk and they're going to take credit for something that we started because there is a whole generation of blacks that don't play music at all". Well, it's already happening because everything that I've heard that even resembles funk at all has been by white groups like Jamiroquai and Chromeo. And if you play it for younger blacks, they call it "white folks music". They just don't know it but they are the ones listening to "white folks music"....a bunch of shit hop that's slower and duller than classical music. Hell, Lawrence Welk and Slim Whitman had more rhythm than these motherfuckers today.

When a band like Maroon 5 is more interesting than Prince, then you know the problem might be too late to fix.

[Edited 8/5/10 10:04am]

Boo-hoo Bar Kays, then stop sucking mainstream R&B's dick and GO BACK TO THE FUNK. :rolleyes:

I'm getting tired of their excuses. If white folks KNOW what funk is and black folks FORGOT, it ain't white folks' fault that they KNOW what's funky.

It's just seem black folks who are between 18 and 30 done FORGOT about it (except those who are on this board including yours truly) and honestly with hip-hop, they don't CARE to.

TonyVanDam said:

namepeace said:

Why dig into the crates when Dre, Easy Mo Bee and RZA already did it for you, right?

And don't forget about Warren G, Johnny J (rest in peace), & Daz.

Timmy84 said:

Boo-hoo Bar Kays, then stop sucking mainstream R&B's dick and GO BACK TO THE FUNK. :rolleyes:

I'm getting tired of their excuses. If white folks KNOW what funk is and black folks FORGOT, it ain't white folks' fault that they KNOW what's funky.

It's just seem black folks who are between 18 and 30 done FORGOT about it (except those who are on this board including yours truly) and honestly with hip-hop, they don't CARE to.

It was actually one of the ex members of the BarKays who made the statement Harvey

Henderson. He actually had a point. The problem with current members James and Larry

are they are trying to be relevant across too many genres in R&B circles. The BarKays

haven't released an album full of funk since 1994's 48 hours album. I did like 2003's

the Real Thing mainly because they tried their hand at blues with collaborations with

J.Blackfoot, Shirley Brown, and Archie Love all with Stax connections. The album had

a few funk tracks on it but it was all over the place again with another Slide song as

they had already done on 48 hours but much funkier and blues and hip hop to an extent.

As for the white folks black folks comment regarding funk i kind of agree with Harvey to

an extent. I don't hear some of these so called overseas modern funk groups like

Osaku Monaurail trying to imitate funk and actually sounding like a bad karaoke garage

band. Average White Band were far better than Osaku can ever wish to be in AWB's heyday.

In a nutshell black folks haven't forgotten funk but there just isn't a market for it

across the board in the states particularly among the 18 to 30 crowd you talked about.

phunkdaddy said:

Timmy84 said:

Boo-hoo Bar Kays, then stop sucking mainstream R&B's dick and GO BACK TO THE FUNK. :rolleyes:

I'm getting tired of their excuses. If white folks KNOW what funk is and black folks FORGOT, it ain't white folks' fault that they KNOW what's funky.

It's just seem black folks who are between 18 and 30 done FORGOT about it (except those who are on this board including yours truly) and honestly with hip-hop, they don't CARE to.

It was actually one of the ex members of the BarKays who made the statement Harvey

Henderson. He actually had a point. The problem with current members James and Larry

are they are trying to be relevant across too many genres in R&B circles. The BarKays

haven't released an album full of funk since 1994's 48 hours album. I did like 2003's

the Real Thing mainly because they tried their hand at blues with collaborations with

J.Blackfoot, Shirley Brown, and Archie Love all with Stax connections. The album had

a few funk tracks on it but it was all over the place again with another Slide song as

they had already done on 48 hours but much funkier and blues and hip hop to an extent.

As for the white folks black folks comment regarding funk i kind of agree with Harvey to

an extent. I don't hear some of these so called overseas modern funk groups like

Osaku Monaurail trying to imitate funk and actually sounding like a bad karaoke garage

band. Average White Band were far better than Osaku can ever wish to be in AWB's heyday.

In a nutshell black folks haven't forgotten funk but there just isn't a market for it

across the board in the states particularly among the 18 to 30 crowd you talked about.

Oh lol

But still I think even some of the funk legends have forgotten there are ways to get it out. It may not go into the mainstream market then again I wouldn't want them to. Just present it on YouTube or on their site or just sell it online or whatever.

In a way I can KINDA see what he's talking about, but I rather people stop talking and just DO, you know?

I don't think it will.

Pop (read: watered down) music has been taking over radio stations and music videos for the past few decades, and what folks consider "hip-hop" these days is basically Pop music with people rapping instead of singing on the track. No true artistry. Artistry and Musicianship are near extinction, and without them there will be no chance of genres like funk to return to prominence.

I guess everything that could have been done to keep funk alive has been done .

We're too far in the cycle of crap music that I just see it continuing to go downhill from here. We're in a digital age, and that just leaves dance and pop music for the masses to gobble up.

Prince is a true-funk soldier and has definitely helped give it a household name. Even some of his "heirs" (Van Hunt, Erykah, etc) are putting a new twist to funk in their own ways, so for me that will just have to suffice as far as prominence/mainstream goes.

I know where to look for local or underground funk when I need to.

vainandy said:

BlaqueKnight said:

[img:$uid]http://www.unity.i8i.co.uk/forum/images/smiley_ROFLMAO.gif[/img:$uid]

Andy, that was too funny! You got me spilling my tea over here! I wouldn't even try to argue with the truth.

The second statement is sad but also true. My fear is the only way funk can come back to mainstream now is if white people do it. Its already that way a little bit now. Bands like Maroon 5 or Chromeo can be as "funk-ish" as they wanna be but if Van Hunt or somebody dropped a funk CD - I mean a REAL funk CD - they would probably get dropped from whatever label they are on. What's worse is there's such a generational disrespect in the current R&B and hip-hop culture with kids embracing and rationalizing being musically illerate that its not likely that many of them seem willing to take it to the next lvel. If you're over 25, its like Logan's Run in the music business - you better run because if you try to put out music, the first thing that gets said is "you're too old to be doing this" - which is some new dumb shit that goes way beyond logic. NOBODY is too old to do music; especially good music.

One of the Barkays said recently that his biggest fear is that one day some white kid is going to tell black people "Come here and let me show you how to play some funk and they're going to take credit for something that we started because there is a whole generation of blacks that don't play music at all". Well, it's already happening because everything that I've heard that even resembles funk at all has been by white groups like Jamiroquai and Chromeo. And if you play it for younger blacks, they call it "white folks music". They just don't know it but they are the ones listening to "white folks music"....a bunch of shit hop that's slower and duller than classical music. Hell, Lawrence Welk and Slim Whitman had more rhythm than these motherfuckers today.

I ain't trying to hear either much like Osaka Monaurail. Chromeo sounds wack all the way

around. Jamiroquai is way overrated imo. Listen to Average White Band's sound compared

to these acts and i don't think it would be hard to see which act really sounds like funk.

GTFO with that "people aren't writing songs with basslines" shit!

Militant said:

GTFO with that "people aren't writing songs with basslines" shit!

Nice bassline in that song.

Militant said:

GTFO with that "people aren't writing songs with basslines" shit!

I stand corrected.

Timmy84 said:

phunkdaddy said:

It was actually one of the ex members of the BarKays who made the statement Harvey

Henderson. He actually had a point. The problem with current members James and Larry

are they are trying to be relevant across too many genres in R&B circles. The BarKays

haven't released an album full of funk since 1994's 48 hours album. I did like 2003's

the Real Thing mainly because they tried their hand at blues with collaborations with

J.Blackfoot, Shirley Brown, and Archie Love all with Stax connections. The album had

a few funk tracks on it but it was all over the place again with another Slide song as

they had already done on 48 hours but much funkier and blues and hip hop to an extent.

As for the white folks black folks comment regarding funk i kind of agree with Harvey to

an extent. I don't hear some of these so called overseas modern funk groups like

Osaku Monaurail trying to imitate funk and actually sounding like a bad karaoke garage

band. Average White Band were far better than Osaku can ever wish to be in AWB's heyday.

In a nutshell black folks haven't forgotten funk but there just isn't a market for it

across the board in the states particularly among the 18 to 30 crowd you talked about.

Oh lol

But still I think even some of the funk legends have forgotten there are ways to get it out. It may not go into the mainstream market then again I wouldn't want them to. Just present it on YouTube or on their site or just sell it online or whatever.

In a way I can KINDA see what he's talking about, but I rather people stop talking and just DO, you know?

sorry, i meant FUNK basslines

TonyVanDam said:

Reel said:

I agree with the house music scenerio. House music morphed into Techno...and that sucked the big time. Techno is Ecstasy and trance music. Once someone uses the word sh*t-hop...I kinda lose interest in what is being said, so I really cant comment on your rap analysis because I skipped over that part.

Wrong.

Techno was funky at first when the gerne was founded in Detroit by Juan Aikens (AKA Cypotron, Model 500), Kevin Saunderson (one-half of Inner City), & Derreck May (AKA Rhythim is Rhythim). They weren't think about disco (like Chicago House) as much as they were think about future-sounding music (Kraftwerk, P-Funk's Flashlight & Atomic Dog). As a mstter of fact, Juan Alkens' earlier work sounded exactly like the genre Electro/Synth-Funk!

The moment too many Canadians got involved in the music production catering to the fans on acid & MDMA, that's when the ideas of Trance was forming.

[Edited 8/5/10 8:17am]

The techno over the past 10-15 years has been Esctasy and Trance music. You just added more detail to my original point.

Timmy84 said:

Militant said:

GTFO with that "people aren't writing songs with basslines" shit!

Nice bassline in that song.

More so in this song than the Spice Girls example. The Spice Girls example

sounds more like Madonna house music in the 90's.

phunkdaddy said:

vainandy said:

One of the Barkays said recently that his biggest fear is that one day some white kid is going to tell black people "Come here and let me show you how to play some funk and they're going to take credit for something that we started because there is a whole generation of blacks that don't play music at all". Well, it's already happening because everything that I've heard that even resembles funk at all has been by white groups like Jamiroquai and Chromeo. And if you play it for younger blacks, they call it "white folks music". They just don't know it but they are the ones listening to "white folks music"....a bunch of shit hop that's slower and duller than classical music. Hell, Lawrence Welk and Slim Whitman had more rhythm than these motherfuckers today.

I ain't trying to hear either much like Osaka Monaurail. Chromeo sounds wack all the way

around. Jamiroquai is way overrated imo. Listen to Average White Band's sound compared

to these acts and i don't think it would be hard to see which act really sounds like funk.

Well of course. Any funk from the 1970s or 1980s is going to sound better than those acts. I was referring to the current times. I don't see Jamiroquai as being overrated at all considering that no one else is even attempting to throwdown these days, which is a damn shame. Even if they only made one jam, that's one jam more than what everyone else is doing so I definately give credit where I feel credit is due. Even the old funk acts sellout when they make an old album. Prince is the only one left that still puts jams on his album and even he sells out on particular tracks.

Michael Jackson was selling out later on too, but something tells me he would have had new jams in store.

Militant said:

GTFO with that "people aren't writing songs with basslines" shit!

I can't see the video but I be damned if I'm going to listen to Britney Spears even if it does have a bassline.

Militant said:

GTFO with that "people aren't writing songs with basslines" shit!

That drum break is giving me "A Love Bizarre" lite.

Being a "funk" musician myself, it's my belief that the only way funk can return to prominence is if young black musicians start playing in bands again. Like in the 70's all of the teens older than me played in bands. After watching them, that's what I wanted to do. Just like rap in the 80's, the youth followed that movement.

I don't believe it will ever get to the way it was. Just like in the 60's, it would have to be an underground thing that's bubbling below the surface. The industry doesn't want to support black bands anymore. There will always be groups and some bands that are funky or are inspired by funk. We'll never see a time where there's a mass movement and wide acceptance of funk bands again.

I hope I'm wrong

Although your arguments can be very true, I dislike reading music analysis in racial terms... to the question now... funk won't make a comeback because it is considered retro. There were revivals of old sounds the past decade or so but all of them were very short. It also demands talent and that's in short supply today (I am talking about popular music).

PS all the discussion about hip-hop is besides the point because hip-hop is dying... Unfortunately what seems to take its place (the David Guetta-type of dance music) is about 50 times worse. What is gonna happen hopefully is that in a few years time hip-hop music will become so commercially unattractive that all the sh*t acts which destroyed it will move to dance music (It is already happening with Usher, Flo Rida, Black Eyed Peas etc) and that will leave the room clear for the ones really liking R&B/hip-hop/funk/reggae and the like and not just the cash and money it brings to finally develop it further underground so it can make a commercial comeback in a decade's time. It won't be funk and it won't be hip-hop but it would be definitely something funky because the problem with R&B/Hip-hop the last decade was that it overstayed its time not growing and not becoming less prominent. Now that it is dying as a commercial powerhouse, it can finally move on.

jiorjios said:

Although your arguments can be very true, I dislike reading music analysis in racial terms... to the question now... funk won't make a comeback because it is considered retro. There were revivals of old sounds the past decade or so but all of them were very short. It also demands talent and that's in short supply today (I am talking about popular music).

PS all the discussion about hip-hop is besides the point because hip-hop is dying... Unfortunately what seems to take its place (the David Guetta-type of dance music) is about 50 times worse. What is gonna happen hopefully is that in a few years time hip-hop music will become so commercially unattractive that all the sh*t acts which destroyed it will move to dance music (It is already happening with Usher, Flo Rida, Black Eyed Peas etc) and that will leave the room clear for the ones really liking R&B/hip-hop/funk/reggae and the like and not just the cash and money it brings to finally develop it further underground so it can make a commercial comeback in a decade's time. It won't be funk and it won't be hip-hop but it would be definitely something funky because the problem with R&B/Hip-hop the last decade was that it overstayed its time not growing and not becoming less prominent. Now that it is dying as a commercial powerhouse, it can finally move on.

I can understand that it may be uncomfortable for you and others to read music being analyzed in racial terms. However one would have to be an ostrich with his / her head in the sand to not see that race plays a significant role in what gets played, and the longevity of the music genre being played. As well as it's distribution to the masses. There have been artist who have had their careers die a suffocating death because they lacked "cross over" appeal and was only played on "black stations". In order to get a more mainstream audience many artists felt the need to water their music down so that it could have more of a crossover appeal.

In addition there have been SOME non-black artist who have made feeble attempts at recreating the sound of certain genre's such as Funk and they perhaps unknowingly contributed to the music swirling away from it's authentic sound.

vainandy said:

Militant said:

GTFO with that "people aren't writing songs with basslines" shit!

I can't see the video but I be damned if I'm going to listen to Britney Spears even if it does have a bassline.

Don't knock it until you've tried it Andy! When I first heard this song, I was like "Damn that bass is funky!" and now it's pretty much the only tune from the album that gets regular rotation from me.

It makes me wonder if artists of the past actually enjoyed the music they made.

They seemed to give up on the music as quickly as the record label without putting up a fight.

The 90s hit and people didn't even bother trying anymore.

I don't understand Y it failed 2 make a lasting impression on aspiring artists.

U can always find someone who has a guitar and likes playing rock music and U can usually find someone who likes to rap.

Reel said:

TonyVanDam said:

Wrong.

Techno was funky at first when the gerne was founded in Detroit by Juan Aikens (AKA Cypotron, Model 500), Kevin Saunderson (one-half of Inner City), & Derreck May (AKA Rhythim is Rhythim). They weren't think about disco (like Chicago House) as much as they were think about future-sounding music (Kraftwerk, P-Funk's Flashlight & Atomic Dog). As a mstter of fact, Juan Alkens' earlier work sounded exactly like the genre Electro/Synth-Funk!

The moment too many Canadians got involved in the music production catering to the fans on acid & MDMA, that's when the ideas of Trance was forming.

[Edited 8/5/10 8:17am]

The techno over the past 10-15 years has been Esctasy and Trance music. You just added more detail to my original point.

I had to for good reason.

Detriot Techno (which sounds like Electro's twin sibling) is THE real Techno. After 1995, Techno was dead musically because Trance replaced it!

I know Trance when I hear it. It's sounds like classical-wannabe. Synths are used for string parts, with the Roland TR-909 drum machine beats at the tempo of 140-145 BPM, and a grand piano playing notes that were stoles from New Age. This gerne isn't techno at all, believe me.

Militant said:

vainandy said:

I can't see the video but I be damned if I'm going to listen to Britney Spears even if it does have a bassline.

Don't knock it until you've tried it Andy! When I first heard this song, I was like "Damn that bass is funky!" and now it's pretty much the only tune from the album that gets regular rotation from me.

If I was buying songs from iTunes, I would have brought only THAT song and say the hell with the rest of the album.

With Britney, some of her music (especially Baby One More Time & Slave 4 U) are better buys than the whole albums. That's why I concern her as a singles-only artist.

phunkdaddy said:

Timmy84 said:

Nice bassline in that song.

More so in this song than the Spice Girls example. The Spice Girls example

sounds more like Madonna house music in the 90's.

I was thinking more like Madonna's dance-pop/house music from the 80's like Where's The Party & Spotlight.

[Edited 8/5/10 19:31pm]

Chromeo rules! They're among my favorite artists of the past 10 years, and they heavily dabble in some synth funk deliciousness. I'm eagerly awaiting their next album.

Unfortunately, though, I don't think funk (even synth funk) can come back as a prominent mainstream force. I would love it to be true, but I think the mainstream can only tolerate funk in bits and pieces.

Militant said:

GTFO with that "people aren't writing songs with basslines" shit!

Not bad (and I'm being sincere), but no gold star.

On a side note, Britney gets some good tracks (she needs em).

[Edited 8/5/10 18:58pm]