Timmy84 said:

I'm mad that album's promotion stopped when it did. Then again I can understand what Michael was going through. I know he wanted to do his best with the album and for some reason due to label politics wasn't able to so he just said "fuck it".

Right! I think that is what upset the most about how this album's promotion was handled. It seemed like this was gonna be something promising, but it just ended up being a nightmare in the end. Michael had to do what he had to do though.

Timmy84 said:

I'm mad that album's promotion stopped when it did. Then again I can understand what Michael was going through. I know he wanted to do his best with the album and for some reason due to label politics wasn't able to so he just said "fuck it".

Yeah,Sony screwed up the promotion.There are at least five potential singles on the album.I would chosen these (not necesarily in this order):

"You Rock My World"

"Whatever Happens"

SoulAlive said:

Timmy84 said:

I'm mad that album's promotion stopped when it did. Then again I can understand what Michael was going through. I know he wanted to do his best with the album and for some reason due to label politics wasn't able to so he just said "fuck it".

Yeah,Sony screwed up the promotion.There are at least five potential singles on the album.I would chosen these (not necesarily in this order):

"You Rock My World"

"Unbreakable"

"Butterflies"

"Heaven Can Wait"

"Whatever Happens"

" Break Of Dawn"?

Man, I remember Invincible when it came out. From my childhood I remember how majorly promoted MJ's albums used to be. The only reason I knew Invincible was released was when my friend from school brought the album to school...we stayed in the back of the library all day listening to it. I personally loved it. I also remember it was topping (or close to the top of) the Canadian top 50 for a while too. I used to wait all day for MTV to play the "You Rock My World" music video. *sigh Good times... I really was excited about it. But I was wondering why it wasn't "hyped up" enough. And then I heard about what Sony was doing....and this was my reaction...----> Really, one of these days, Sony should get their come-uppin's and SOON!

behind the seances of thriller lmao

oops

[Edited 7/22/10 14:04pm]

.

[Edited 7/22/10 14:03pm]

Timmy84 said:

I'm mad that album's promotion stopped when it did. Then again I can understand what Michael was going through. I know he wanted to do his best with the album and for some reason due to label politics wasn't able to so he just said "fuck it".

When it happened and Michael spoke out against Sony, people were giving him the side eye for it, but after he passed away and people like Chris Rooney talked about it, you finally see what he meant. It wasn't just people wanting the catalog, but people who felt that Michael needed to do what they wanted him to do

I remember Toure' saying "Well, it was a garbage album and what label is going to promote a garbage album?"

Record labels do that all the time! and it was a Michael Jackson album, they were guaranteed to make some bank from it, but you barely knew the album was out here in the states. You Rock My World barely got any promotion, no physical singles released, Butterflies was a centimeter away from the #1 spot on R&B chart and a release of a CD single would've gotten it there

They released Cry, which was a HORRIBLE single choice overseas and it flopped hard. Michael didn't even bother showing up for the video

the promotion was a factor in the fate but the album itself shares some blame. Heartbreaker, 2000 Watts, Cry, The Lost Children, and Threatened needed to be taken off and replaced with Another Day and maybe Beautiful Girl

seeingvoices12 said:

SoulAlive said:

Yeah,Sony screwed up the promotion.There are at least five potential singles on the album.I would chosen these (not necesarily in this order):

"You Rock My World"

"Unbreakable"

"Butterflies"

"Heaven Can Wait"

"Whatever Happens"

" Break Of Dawn"?

It's a great song,but I think five singles would have been enough

bboy87 said:

Timmy84 said:

I'm mad that album's promotion stopped when it did. Then again I can understand what Michael was going through. I know he wanted to do his best with the album and for some reason due to label politics wasn't able to so he just said "fuck it".

When it happened and Michael spoke out against Sony, people were giving him the side eye for it, but after he passed away and people like Chris Rooney talked about it, you finally see what he meant. It wasn't just people wanting the catalog, but people who felt that Michael needed to do what they wanted him to do

I remember Toure' saying "Well, it was a garbage album and what label is going to promote a garbage album?"

Record labels do that all the time! and it was a Michael Jackson album, they were guaranteed to make some bank from it, but you barely knew the album was out here in the states. You Rock My World barely got any promotion, no physical singles released, Butterflies was a centimeter away from the #1 spot on R&B chart and a release of a CD single would've gotten it there

They released Cry, which was a HORRIBLE single choice overseas and it flopped hard. Michael didn't even bother showing up for the video

the promotion was a factor in the fate but the album itself shares some blame. Heartbreaker, 2000 Watts, Cry, The Lost Children, and Threatened needed to be taken off and replaced with Another Day and maybe Beautiful Girl

I know US top 40 was quite alternative then, but sony USA COMPLETELY cock'd up by not releasing "Earth song" in the states. Thats when it started to go wrong for Sony USA and Mike in the US. "Earth song" was a huge hit for him in europe and probably Asia aswell. Following up a record breaking no. 1 single with promo copies of "this time around" instead of a video and song like "Earth song", were they nuts? True "HIStory" was not shifting aswell as his earlier records (thought Sony and MJ made more money off the project then any other album apparantly, thanks to the 2 disc thing), but "Earth song", as a single at least, could of been huge in the states.

MTV in the US must of played the hell out of "Earth song", but still no single? That I feel squashed all momentum from future singles off "HIStory". "TDCAU" and "Stranger in Moscow" both flopped hard in America (particually the latter), they released them too late in the states. Thats when Sony US inparticular probably started thinking not to try so much to promote future releases of MJ's anymore.

I know you know BBoy how well the "HIStory" singles did in europe and in the UK, and how he kept his fanbase there. But I think after "You are not alone" and the bizarre omission of "Earth song", thats where it started to go wrong for Mike in the US. That and not touring there again of course LOL.

By contrast though "Invincible" did better in the US then the UK. It barely went platinum in the UK from what I remember? Terrible sales for him. It shipped 2x platinum in the states I think?

I think I found it Bboy! I think the clips were part of the other night MJ and his brothers did (not all it though). This user got alot of good stuff if, like me, you don't frequent MJ messageboards.

LOL, at that ole' corny skit at the beginning. Iam with Jermaine, I wanted "Lets get serious". Marlon should of improvised and suggested "Baby tonight", and then Michael could of said "What? I never heard of that one Marlon"

thesexofit said:

bboy87 said:

When it happened and Michael spoke out against Sony, people were giving him the side eye for it, but after he passed away and people like Chris Rooney talked about it, you finally see what he meant. It wasn't just people wanting the catalog, but people who felt that Michael needed to do what they wanted him to do

I remember Toure' saying "Well, it was a garbage album and what label is going to promote a garbage album?"

Record labels do that all the time! and it was a Michael Jackson album, they were guaranteed to make some bank from it, but you barely knew the album was out here in the states. You Rock My World barely got any promotion, no physical singles released, Butterflies was a centimeter away from the #1 spot on R&B chart and a release of a CD single would've gotten it there

They released Cry, which was a HORRIBLE single choice overseas and it flopped hard. Michael didn't even bother showing up for the video

the promotion was a factor in the fate but the album itself shares some blame. Heartbreaker, 2000 Watts, Cry, The Lost Children, and Threatened needed to be taken off and replaced with Another Day and maybe Beautiful Girl

I know US top 40 was quite alternative then, but sony USA COMPLETELY cock'd up by not releasing "Earth song" in the states. Thats when it started to go wrong for Sony USA and Mike in the US. "Earth song" was a huge hit for him in europe and probably Asia aswell. Following up a record breaking no. 1 single with promo copies of "this time around" instead of a video and song like "Earth song", were they nuts? True "HIStory" was not shifting aswell as his earlier records (thought Sony and MJ made more money off the project then any other album apparantly, thanks to the 2 disc thing), but "Earth song", as a single at least, could of been huge in the states.

MTV in the US must of played the hell out of "Earth song", but still no single? That I feel squashed all momentum from future singles off "HIStory". "TDCAU" and "Stranger in Moscow" both flopped hard in America (particually the latter), they released them too late in the states. Thats when Sony US inparticular probably started thinking not to try so much to promote future releases of MJ's anymore.

I know you know BBoy how well the "HIStory" singles did in europe and in the UK, and how he kept his fanbase there. But I think after "You are not alone" and the bizarre omission of "Earth song", thats where it started to go wrong for Mike in the US. That and not touring there again of course LOL.

By contrast though "Invincible" did better in the US then the UK. It barely went platinum in the UK from what I remember? Terrible sales for him. It shipped 2x platinum in the states I think?

That and not releasing This Time Around as an official single, HIStory slowly lost momentum here in the states. They Don't Care About Us was the last single that made a buzz here. Stranger In Moscow didn't make much buzz. This Time Around and Earth Song could've both been hits. I was about 9 when HIStory was out and as I look back and also at old reports, it didn't really have a chance after You Are Not Alone because alot of the songs weren't really US radio friendly. You guys got 6 singles and we barely got 4

the Earth Song video didn't get alot of play on MTV but BET and VH1 played it which surprised young bboy because he never saw the single at stores but always saw the video

They Don't Care About Us was released around the same it was released in the UK but Stranger In Moscow didn't get released until late 96-early 97 and we never got HIStory/Ghosts. Hell, we didn't get to see the Ghosts film until Invincible came out

and you can believe how pissed I was to see on TV that he was touring everywhere BUT the states but I sort of understand because there was alot of hate for him at the time

bboy87 said:

thesexofit said:

I know US top 40 was quite alternative then, but sony USA COMPLETELY cock'd up by not releasing "Earth song" in the states. Thats when it started to go wrong for Sony USA and Mike in the US. "Earth song" was a huge hit for him in europe and probably Asia aswell. Following up a record breaking no. 1 single with promo copies of "this time around" instead of a video and song like "Earth song", were they nuts? True "HIStory" was not shifting aswell as his earlier records (thought Sony and MJ made more money off the project then any other album apparantly, thanks to the 2 disc thing), but "Earth song", as a single at least, could of been huge in the states.

MTV in the US must of played the hell out of "Earth song", but still no single? That I feel squashed all momentum from future singles off "HIStory". "TDCAU" and "Stranger in Moscow" both flopped hard in America (particually the latter), they released them too late in the states. Thats when Sony US inparticular probably started thinking not to try so much to promote future releases of MJ's anymore.

I know you know BBoy how well the "HIStory" singles did in europe and in the UK, and how he kept his fanbase there. But I think after "You are not alone" and the bizarre omission of "Earth song", thats where it started to go wrong for Mike in the US. That and not touring there again of course LOL.

By contrast though "Invincible" did better in the US then the UK. It barely went platinum in the UK from what I remember? Terrible sales for him. It shipped 2x platinum in the states I think?

That and not releasing This Time Around as an official single, HIStory slowly lost momentum here in the states. They Don't Care About Us was the last single that made a buzz here. Stranger In Moscow didn't make much buzz. This Time Around and Earth Song could've both been hits. I was about 9 when HIStory was out and as I look back and also at old reports, it didn't really have a chance after You Are Not Alone because alot of the songs weren't really US radio friendly. You guys got 6 singles and we barely got 4

the Earth Song video didn't get alot of play on MTV but BET and VH1 played it which surprised young bboy because he never saw the single at stores but always saw the video

They Don't Care About Us was released around the same it was released in the UK but Stranger In Moscow didn't get released until late 96-early 97 and we never got HIStory/Ghosts. Hell, we didn't get to see the Ghosts film until Invincible came out

and you can believe how pissed I was to see on TV that he was touring everywhere BUT the states but I sort of understand because there was alot of hate for him at the time

Mikes "HIStory" tour made more money then any other didn't it? Had more dates then "Dangerous" I think aswell?

I just think Sony US just stopped caring as much as the sony companies overseas after "TDCAU" and "Stranger in Moscow" flopped. "Blood on the dancefloor", considering it was just a remix album of remixes already pretty much available (bar Tony Morans "History" and "2 bad") and 5 new tracks, did surprisenly well in the UK and Europe (despite Teddy Riley whinging about MJ releasing an old track with "Blood on the dancefloor" at the time)-I remember the article LOL). But I know sony US barely even acknowledged its existance LOL. I know the remixes were european in nature but they could of pushed it abit harder surely? So long before "Invincible" it seemed Mike was not top priority anymore.

We know that Mike apparantly wanted "Unbreakable" released first and how apparantly a sony exec leaked "YRMW" so that forced Mike to release it first. lots of conspiracies with that whole project LOL.

I remember the constant delays of "Invincible". I remember the "Blood on the dancefloor" website LOL. Infomation trickled for literally years about a new album. Around the time of Tom Jones' UK comback album "Reloaded", there were rumours Sony wanted MJ to make an album of duets like Tom Jones had just done. Thank God that never happened LOL. So lots of idea's and concepts and aborted projects in the late 90's by the sound of it. Its amazing "Invincible" came out at all LOL.

thesexofit said:

bboy87 said:

That and not releasing This Time Around as an official single, HIStory slowly lost momentum here in the states. They Don't Care About Us was the last single that made a buzz here. Stranger In Moscow didn't make much buzz. This Time Around and Earth Song could've both been hits. I was about 9 when HIStory was out and as I look back and also at old reports, it didn't really have a chance after You Are Not Alone because alot of the songs weren't really US radio friendly. You guys got 6 singles and we barely got 4

the Earth Song video didn't get alot of play on MTV but BET and VH1 played it which surprised young bboy because he never saw the single at stores but always saw the video

They Don't Care About Us was released around the same it was released in the UK but Stranger In Moscow didn't get released until late 96-early 97 and we never got HIStory/Ghosts. Hell, we didn't get to see the Ghosts film until Invincible came out

and you can believe how pissed I was to see on TV that he was touring everywhere BUT the states but I sort of understand because there was alot of hate for him at the time

Mikes "HIStory" tour made more money then any other didn't it? Had more dates then "Dangerous" I think aswell?

I just think Sony US just stopped caring as much as the sony companies overseas after "TDCAU" and "Stranger in Moscow" flopped. "Blood on the dancefloor", considering it was just a remix album of remixes already pretty much available (bar Tony Morans "History" and "2 bad") and 5 new tracks, did surprisenly well in the UK and Europe (despite Teddy Riley whinging about MJ releasing an old track with "Blood on the dancefloor" at the time)-I remember the article LOL). But I know sony US barely even acknowledged its existance LOL. I know the remixes were european in nature but they could of pushed it abit harder surely? So long before "Invincible" it seemed Mike was not top priority anymore.

We know that Mike apparantly wanted "Unbreakable" released first and how apparantly a sony exec leaked "YRMW" so that forced Mike to release it first. lots of conspiracies with that whole project LOL.

I remember the constant delays of "Invincible". I remember the "Blood on the dancefloor" website LOL. Infomation trickled for literally years about a new album. Around the time of Tom Jones' UK comback album "Reloaded", there were rumours Sony wanted MJ to make an album of duets like Tom Jones had just done. Thank God that never happened LOL. So lots of idea's and concepts and aborted projects in the late 90's by the sound of it. Its amazing "Invincible" came out at all LOL.

I remember the delays. It was to be released in November 1999 but that day came and went and I thought it was coming because Michael did the TV Guide interview with a new look and the slight goatee he had at the time but we didn't get it until fall 2001

You're right, Blood On The Dancefloor recieved NO promotion here. I only found out about it because I was in a store and they had it on their "coming soon" list If I remember correctly, I bought it for $13.99

The video was only played a couple of times on BET and VH1 (MTV never showed it to my knowledge)

I really wish I was living in the UK between 1996-2003 because with my taste in music, I would've fit right in

I'm reading this and remembering my experiences of being an mj fan in the late 90's too with all this news, it's really taking me back, and I'm just shaking my head at how much time has passed by, and that he's no longer here It sucks!

I remember I would call Ticketmaster Canada almost everyday to ask if the HIStory tour was coming here but it didn't. I would also call muchmusic often to ask why Blood On the Dancefloor and Stranger in Moscow wasn't airing until they finally asked me if I'm the one calling everyday lmaoooo

Oh and I went to sites for mj news since 1996 and used to watch entertainment news shows which got calm toward him for sometime in comparison to now, so I didn't miss out on BOTDF or Invincible at all though I remember some of my classmates being surprised it was alreayd out when I was listening to it on headphones, and I even connected with a guy over it and we're still friends till this day.

[Edited 7/22/10 18:15pm]

bboy87 said:

thesexofit said:

Mikes "HIStory" tour made more money then any other didn't it? Had more dates then "Dangerous" I think aswell?

I just think Sony US just stopped caring as much as the sony companies overseas after "TDCAU" and "Stranger in Moscow" flopped. "Blood on the dancefloor", considering it was just a remix album of remixes already pretty much available (bar Tony Morans "History" and "2 bad") and 5 new tracks, did surprisenly well in the UK and Europe (despite Teddy Riley whinging about MJ releasing an old track with "Blood on the dancefloor" at the time)-I remember the article LOL). But I know sony US barely even acknowledged its existance LOL. I know the remixes were european in nature but they could of pushed it abit harder surely? So long before "Invincible" it seemed Mike was not top priority anymore.

We know that Mike apparantly wanted "Unbreakable" released first and how apparantly a sony exec leaked "YRMW" so that forced Mike to release it first. lots of conspiracies with that whole project LOL.

I remember the constant delays of "Invincible". I remember the "Blood on the dancefloor" website LOL. Infomation trickled for literally years about a new album. Around the time of Tom Jones' UK comback album "Reloaded", there were rumours Sony wanted MJ to make an album of duets like Tom Jones had just done. Thank God that never happened LOL. So lots of idea's and concepts and aborted projects in the late 90's by the sound of it. Its amazing "Invincible" came out at all LOL.

I remember the delays. It was to be released in November 1999 but that day came and went and I thought it was coming because Michael did the TV Guide interview with a new look and the slight goatee he had at the time but we didn't get it until fall 2001

You're right, Blood On The Dancefloor recieved NO promotion here. I only found out about it because I was in a store and they had it on their "coming soon" list If I remember correctly, I bought it for $13.99

The video was only played a couple of times on BET and VH1 (MTV never showed it to my knowledge)

I really wish I was living in the UK between 1996-2003 because with my taste in music, I would've fit right in

LOL, I remember you saying you liked all that drum and bass etc.. I remember people blasting that ish on the estates I grew up in. Craig David blew up and all the girls loved him and constantly sang "7 days" or whatever it was called. Ugh. Fun times. With brit pop and then our drum and bass scene going commercial etc..., the UK had some hald decent homegrown stuff going on in the top 40 around the mid 90's-late 90's.

Anyway, shame the websites don't exist anymore, but I swear the possible tracklistings that were rumoured for "Invincible" were somewhat different to what we actually got. I remember sony execs "walking on air" after hearing a certain future track called "Speechless", so thats older then 2001 at least. And his world music awards "You ain't seen nothing yet" LOL. I liked that montage they did with "Childhood" in the background.

Good call on the TV guide interview. I never read it, but MJ looked quite macho (for him) with that goatee LOL. I remember him talking about a few of his videos ("Thriller and "Black and White" spring to mind) on VH1/MTV with that get up.

thesexofit said:

bboy87 said:

I remember the delays. It was to be released in November 1999 but that day came and went and I thought it was coming because Michael did the TV Guide interview with a new look and the slight goatee he had at the time but we didn't get it until fall 2001

You're right, Blood On The Dancefloor recieved NO promotion here. I only found out about it because I was in a store and they had it on their "coming soon" list If I remember correctly, I bought it for $13.99

The video was only played a couple of times on BET and VH1 (MTV never showed it to my knowledge)

I really wish I was living in the UK between 1996-2003 because with my taste in music, I would've fit right in

LOL, I remember you saying you liked all that drum and bass etc.. I remember people blasting that ish on the estates I grew up in. Craig David blew up and all the girls loved him and constantly sang "7 days" or whatever it was called. Ugh. Fun times. With brit pop and then our drum and bass scene going commercial etc..., the UK had some hald decent homegrown stuff going on in the top 40 around the mid 90's-late 90's.

Anyway, shame the websites don't exist anymore, but I swear the possible tracklistings that were rumoured for "Invincible" were somewhat different to what we actually got. I remember sony execs "walking on air" after hearing a certain future track called "Speechless", so thats older then 2001 at least. And his world music awards "You ain't seen nothing yet" LOL. I liked that montage they did with "Childhood" in the background.

Good call on the TV guide interview. I never read it, but MJ looked quite macho (for him) with that goatee LOL. I remember him talking about a few of his videos ("Thriller and "Black and White" spring to mind) on VH1/MTV with that get up.

you guys have some great talent over there. I was listening to the BBC 1Xtra Homegrown podcast and I liked what I heard. I found out about UK Garage through Craig's music then I discovered MJ Cole, Wookie, So Solid Crew, The Streets, Ms Dynamite, through that, I really got an appreciation for dance music. Everybody I knew was heavy into people like Eminem, Linkin Park, 50 Cent, and I was into UKG, House, and R&B

I VIVIDLY remember the websites. MJIFC, Planet Jackson, MJWeb, MJJForum, MJNO, KOP. The tracklistings, from what I remember (which isn't quite well) is different. I remember the tidbit about Dr. Dre turning down working with Michael and I'm glad it never happened I also remember the original tracklistings to the 2001 special editions

thesexofit said:

bboy87 said:

I remember the delays. It was to be released in November 1999 but that day came and went and I thought it was coming because Michael did the TV Guide interview with a new look and the slight goatee he had at the time but we didn't get it until fall 2001

You're right, Blood On The Dancefloor recieved NO promotion here. I only found out about it because I was in a store and they had it on their "coming soon" list If I remember correctly, I bought it for $13.99

The video was only played a couple of times on BET and VH1 (MTV never showed it to my knowledge)

I really wish I was living in the UK between 1996-2003 because with my taste in music, I would've fit right in

LOL, I remember you saying you liked all that drum and bass etc.. I remember people blasting that ish on the estates I grew up in. Craig David blew up and all the girls loved him and constantly sang "7 days" or whatever it was called. Ugh. Fun times. With brit pop and then our drum and bass scene going commercial etc..., the UK had some hald decent homegrown stuff going on in the top 40 around the mid 90's-late 90's.

Anyway, shame the websites don't exist anymore, but I swear the possible tracklistings that were rumoured for "Invincible" were somewhat different to what we actually got. I remember sony execs "walking on air" after hearing a certain future track called "Speechless", so thats older then 2001 at least. And his world music awards "You ain't seen nothing yet" LOL. I liked that montage they did with "Childhood" in the background.

Good call on the TV guide interview. I never read it, but MJ looked quite macho (for him) with that goatee LOL. I remember him talking about a few of his videos ("Thriller and "Black and White" spring to mind) on VH1/MTV with that get up.

you're totally taking me back! I was so excited when he got that WMA and they kept saying his name before commericals breaks, when I watched the BET awards after his death, it hit me that it's never going to happen again and there were so many little things like that we lost along with him physically

And I remember bits of that mtv interview too when they did the countdown and taping it, at one part he went "Hi, I'm Michael Jackson" and I remember cringing cause he was acting like no one knew him when of course they did!!! Seriously, he was like an embarassing parent at times but I loved him soooooo much so it was ok, and I loved his hairstyle and outfit there and how he was talking about the Thriller dance moves.

silverchild said:

I swear this should've been the first single from Invincible (2001). Not knocking "You Rock My World," but this is far more superior to me. Mike and Santana goes off in the deep end near the end of this one! Absolutely love this...

The fact that Whatever Happens wasn't a single shows how much Sony/MJ/Management (tick the applicable) dropped the ball.

When non-fans hear this song they usual ask - wow how come i've never heard that?

Swa

Wasn't Cry rush released as a single as it got a lot of air play in the days of post 9/11 so Sony the video was rushed through as well.

Also to this day I still feel that YRMW video was the video we would have gotten if Dangerous was released.

And in an online chat at the time I recall MJ saying he had some short film plans for either Unbreakable or Invincible that he had started working on.

For me - the fact they didn't release Butterflies as a physical CD single with the Eve Remixes stopped it from charting higher.

If memory serves me correctly it got top 10 in the Billboard 100 without any video.

Swa

Swa said:

Wasn't Cry rush released as a single as it got a lot of air play in the days of post 9/11 so Sony the video was rushed through as well.

Also to this day I still feel that YRMW video was the video we would have gotten if Dangerous was released.

And in an online chat at the time I recall MJ saying he had some short film plans for either Unbreakable or Invincible that he had started working on.

For me - the fact they didn't release Butterflies as a physical CD single with the Eve Remixes stopped it from charting higher.

If memory serves me correctly it got top 10 in the Billboard 100 without any video.

Swa

Yeah it was Unbreakable he mentioned, I forgot about that chat though I remember reading it.

I have the Butterflies single, but it's on vinyl format and I found it a year after it came out. It reached #14 on the Billboard Hot 100 in January and February 2002. I don't care what people say, it did not flop the way the media wants you to think. For a flop, it did well.

[Edited 7/22/10 20:44pm]

Swa said:

silverchild said:

I swear this should've been the first single from Invincible (2001). Not knocking "You Rock My World," but this is far more superior to me. Mike and Santana goes off in the deep end near the end of this one! Absolutely love this...

The fact that Whatever Happens wasn't a single shows how much Sony/MJ/Management (tick the applicable) dropped the ball.

When non-fans hear this song they usual ask - wow how come i've never heard that?

Swa

I remember actually picking this album up in October of 2001 the first week it came out. Spent my whole allowance on it (which was $20 dollars) and being anxious of what I was gonna hear when I popped in the album. My initial response at that time was that I couldn't fathom the uptempo cuts, but the mid-tempo and slow ballads were the selling points of the record. Whatever Happens completely sold me to this album and I can honestly say that this was one of the best songs he had done in his later years. Listened to this album 5 years later to now and of course my perception has brought me to the conclusion that this was a overall great album that was overlooked by many with hate and scrunity; with Whatever Happens being one of the most infectious song MJ had done since...(i can't choose a song, there's so many!) Loved it then, adore it now. That's what pisses me off about how this album was handled and what it was viewed as by many. Whatever Happens should've brought MJ back to the masses stronger than ever. Feelings of sadness and joy occur everytime I listen to this song because it was the gem of the album that everybody should've paid more attention to as it was one of his stronger vocal performances in a long time with a great production to boot.

[Edited 7/22/10 21:16pm]

I remember buying it with my allowance too and running out of money a week before the release date, frantically selling some older CD's at a used store to get a few more dollars hheheh I refused to listen to any leaked samples or songs online though everyone was gushing about Butterflies. Upon my first listen to the album, I loved about half of it, and Whatever Happens was the one that made me tear up right away cause I loved it that much. It got better upon each listen and I had the album on heavy rotation for the next year since then.

[Edited 7/22/10 21:19pm]

what ever hapens seems to be a favorite , its a shame the album doenst get half a chance.

a friend of mine calls it a flop , but he never listened to all the songs. i bet he can only name 4 being the title song , 2 singles and speechless.

[Edited 7/22/10 21:58pm]

[Edited 7/22/10 21:59pm]

It makes me sick to think of what Sony did to Invincincle. I absolutely love the album and still listen to it more than any other MJ album. You can tell that Michael was ready to promote this album like no other. When I saw him appear at Tower Recores and at MTV coutdown., I knew that he was really ready to promote. Sony fucked up and then leaked things to the media in an effort to destroy the album so that they could gain control of MJ's stake in the catalogue. It was so obvious that Sony sabotaged Invincible and that the entire industry and media were in on this shit. Even with basically no promotion at all, the album did better than basically any other album released by other aritists. I know people who had stopped being a fan and became a fan AGAIN after Invincible was released. R&B fans really loved it and bought it because R&B radio played "Butterflies", "Break of Dawn", "Heaven Can Wait" and "You Rock My World" to death. For the first time in many years, the DJ's were raving about Michael's songs. It seems as if the MF'ers at Sony are still trying to diminish Invincible. You never see it in stores; yet, you see every other album. If Sony had released "Whatever Happens" that song alone would have guaranteed another 2-5 million sales in the US alone. The songs on Invincible still stand the test of time and sound just as fresh today as they sounded when the album was released. What amazes me is that some fans even fell for the shit that Sony and the media were perpetuating. Calling this album a flop when if any other artist had sold the same amount, it would have been deemed a major success. I can't even imagine what Michael had to endure, watching Sony sabotage him. I love the fact that he called Sony and Tommy Mottola out. I don't know any other artist of Michael's calibre who had the courage to do that. Sadly, people doubted his reasoning for the public calling out of Mottola and Sony. I never doubled Michael for a moment. It was obvious that what he was saying was true. It took his death and people like Corey Rooney to confirm that he was telling the truth about Mottola's sabotage.

Yeah I got mad when people were saying after awhile that he's over and his last album didn't sell and he's broke and stuff like that. I remember people online at that time saying his stuff was getting airplay on the r&b station too. The jay z mixes of you rock my world and butterflies would play at clubs for well over a year too. It didn't make a big impact, it was minimal but could have been much more with Sony's push. I really felt that some of the songs would have sounded good back to back with current radio songs though Michael's stood on their own.

alphastreet said:

Yeah I got mad when people were saying after awhile that he's over and his last album didn't sell and he's broke and stuff like that. I remember people online at that time saying his stuff was getting airplay on the r&b station too. The jay z mixes of you rock my world and butterflies would play at clubs for well over a year too. It didn't make a big impact, it was minimal but could have been much more with Sony's push. I really felt that some of the songs would have sounded good back to back with current radio songs though Michael's stood on their own.

I think that's one of the utmost saddest aspects of Michael's career in which critics and the media have always concluded that each release after the blockbuster success of Thriller was a downright failure/disappointment and that his career was going to be in the ruins. I mean read any review on every album post-Thriller and one would find some pretty hardcore and ugly stuff that many of these worthless, over-pretentious and bias music magazines pointed out. Things got even worser as the years went by with the public and Michael because of the bizarre scandals and such and alot of people just lost faith in his music and made more money off of a distorted image they wanted to put on Michael. When Invincible came out, I was so excited to hear that he was finally getting this long-awaited album off of the ground and sure the You Rock My World and Butterflies singles and his 30th Anniversary Special made me believe that even though his prime was way past him, MJ could still pump out some worthwhile and genuine music during the 5th decade of his career. True, Michael thought that he could top the sales of Thriller with every subsequent release and it backlashed, but come on, people in this industry today can't even put their hand on what Michael has achieved commercially. Invincible's figures are still phenomenal to me. Just an unfair thing and something I call: career poison.

silverchild said:

alphastreet said:

Yeah I got mad when people were saying after awhile that he's over and his last album didn't sell and he's broke and stuff like that. I remember people online at that time saying his stuff was getting airplay on the r&b station too. The jay z mixes of you rock my world and butterflies would play at clubs for well over a year too. It didn't make a big impact, it was minimal but could have been much more with Sony's push. I really felt that some of the songs would have sounded good back to back with current radio songs though Michael's stood on their own.

I think that's one of the utmost saddest aspects of Michael's career in which critics and the media have always concluded that each release after the blockbuster success of Thriller was a downright failure/disappointment and that his career was going to be in the ruins. I mean read any review on every album post-Thriller and one would find some pretty hardcore and ugly stuff that many of these worthless, over-pretentious and bias music magazines pointed out. Things got even worser as the years went by with the public and Michael because of the bizarre scandals and such and alot of people just lost faith in his music and made more money off of a distorted image they wanted to put on Michael. When Invincible came out, I was so excited to hear that he was finally getting this long-awaited album off of the ground and sure the You Rock My World and Butterflies singles and his 30th Anniversary Special made me believe that even though his prime was way past him, MJ could still pump out some worthwhile and genuine music during the 5th decade of his career. True, Michael thought that he could top the sales of Thriller with every subsequent release and it backlashed, but come on, people in this industry today can't even put their hand on what Michael has achieved commercially. Invincible's figures are still phenomenal to me. Just an unfair thing and something I call: career poison.

I agree with everything you said; except it wasn't Michael who was always trying to top Thriller. It was the media always comparing everything to Thriller. In fact, Michael has stated many times in interviews that he wasn't trying to top Thriller. It was Frank Dileo who claimed that MJ taped a note to his mirror saying that Bad would sell 100 million. I truly don't think that Michael worried about topping Thriller. Again, it was the media and the music industry who always acted as if everything had to live up to Thriller. The media did a good job brainwashing people into thinking Invncible was a flop when it really wasn't.

I don't think people gave up on his music, the media were just being assholes. Bad and Dangerous were huge hits, even the tours. I was a really young kid during those eras and didn't know much about them while they were happening, but I knew they were going on and many people played his music or performed it or something. I even remember ET saying something about Bad not living up to numbers and cringed but then they added it's the second best seller(at the time) ever so that made up for it.

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[Edited 7/27/10 17:41pm]