sinisterpentatonic said:

I love you.

Vendetta1 said:

the way i see it....if you dont like the music, thats cool, everyone has different tastes right? I've got no problem with folks who just have different musical tastes than i do. thats kinda normal. thats why there's chocolate & vanilla right?

But, if your issue is with the fact that she sometimes plays with her back to you..?...well then let me repeat this part below...

"the Epileptic thing is serious...i've seen her literally collapse and pass out on stage due to flashes in the crowd. Its genuinely dangerous for her to perform when folks in the crowd are taking flash photos. I cant speak to every concert of course, but at least in some cases her performing with her back to the crowd/ eyes closed etc are situations where she's trying to make sure she doesnt fall risk to an epileptic incident caused by flash photography. Again, i cant speak for every show...because she definitely can be little firecracker for sure, for instance if the sound mix isnt right, she's absolutely not afraid to speak her mind. Her feelings will come across, good or bad happy or sad, no doubt about it."

and, even if the epileptic element wasn't in play, i guess i just have different expectations and different needs from live performances. I understand that many folks want a 'show' so to speak...they want an artist to 'perform for them'... that type of thing. thats fine and all i suppose, i guess i get that thats what some folks expect. But i actually prefer a concert where i feel like i'm just eavesdropping on a band as they are loosely jamming amongst themselves...exploring, creating things on the spot, trying things out and truly enjoying the musical interaction between each other in a somewhat spontaneous manner. THATS the stuff i live for in my live performances. the MUSIC thats created...period. hell, half the time im at a concert MY eyes are closed too, so that i can focus on what they're creating on stage and in my ears. i couldn't care less if the artist is looking at me, or talking to me...i didnt go there for that. I go there to hear them take some musical chances with each other and give it their all in that regard. period.

So yeah, if you go to concerts for something other than the raw music itself, then yup, i agree with you, Meshell shows are probably not for you, because really, thats all that she's about...the music...the raw unpredictable music.

.
[Edited 8/17/09 20:25pm]

justhemusic said:

I am/was a Meshell fan. I am very well aware of the epilepsy issue. There was no flashing going on at the show I was at. I think people dug her enough to respect that she did not want flash photography.

That aside, there should be a level of professionalism when people pay their money to see someone. I'm not at the stage where I'll just accept anything from anyone just because they are famous. When I go into work, I have to do my job no matter how shitty a night I had.

You're right, maybe it just isn't for me.

xlr8r said:

err...i kinda don't get it, are ya'll thinking i'm Matthew or something?
i hit his Meshell sites regularly (best Meshell sites on the web obviously) and I consider him a good friend of mine, but uh, I'm really not him. But again, he and his sites definitely DO deserve some props for being the main sources of Meshell info since like 1993 or something...

so while his sites deserve promotion, this actually isn't 'self promotion' at all.
[Edited 8/17/09 20:46pm]

Vendetta1 said:

again, i'm not going to speak for every show, because i know she definitely lets her true feelings show, good or bad. Like i said, she can be a firecracker

but again, for me its about expectations and what you consider 'part of her job' as a composer & musician...

•i don't consider friendly casual banter with a crowd a requirement of a composer/musical artists job

•i don't consider playing specific requests from the crowd a requirement of a composer/musical artists job

•i DO consider that playing music that is currently truly inspiring to the musician a requirement of a composer/musical artists job

I've been to many concerts where an artist is extremely friendly and talks to the crowd. thats cool. its just not something i require for my enjoyment. I'm there for the music. period. if the music is TRULY inspired i couldnt care less if you do or dont talk to me, look at me, see me or whatever. for me as a listener my question to the artist is are YOU truly inspired & excited by by what you're playing, or are you playing to a script? because i'll KNOW the truth if i'm truly listening to the music.

(fact is, in some cases that 'friendly casual banter' is so staged that i actually feel kinda cheap in a way, because i know they had the exact same 'casual banter' the night before at a previous gig with a crowd in a different town.

so again, that chatting with the crowd stuff is fine, but i can take it or leave it...

the thing i CANT take is 'live music by the numbers'. I dont get that from Meshell no matter what her mood is...in all the concerts I've been to she's always brought inspired unpredictable music to the table, and thats what i personally came to consume.

but hey its all good. like i said, chocolate & vanilla right?

.
[Edited 8/17/09 21:19pm]

Vendetta1 said:

did you go to the same show i went to?

i didn't bring a camera

i didn't yell out for a song to be played

i wasn't expecting anything but new material and still felt like i had did something wrong by showing up to her show.

sinisterpentatonic said:

If you were at the same show, I am gonna kick your ass.

I saw her at Kinetic one night and at Lincoln Park Zoo the next day.


And like you, I wasn't expecting anything. I don't follow her online and did not know what she was like. I don't need artists talking to me either but I don't like shitty attitudes. Some people think that shit is cute or badass and I don't.

Vendetta1 said:

who knows, maybe she did have a shitty attitude at the show you went to, i wasnt at that particular Chicago show.

i did go to her Chicago show at the Blue Note though (early last year or late the year before) and she and the band kicked ass and i didn't get any bad attitude vibes towards the crowd at all.

but like i said, maybe at the show you went to last year she just plain had a shitty attitude towards the crowd. Could be. If so, then no, thats not 'cute' or 'cool'. I have gone to a show where she got REAL pissed onstage because they told her she had to cut her set short just as she was getting into her groove (at the time she was opening for a big artist and the main artist wanted to start his show and told her to cut her set short.) So I KNOW she cant hide her emotions onstage good or bad.

but can you do me a favor and tell me two things:

can you be specific as to what she did that was shitty towards you (other than playing with her back to the crowd which we've already discussed?)

can you tell me how the music was?

.
[Edited 8/17/09 21:34pm]

justhemusic said:

The showing up late thing was huge for me. The early ending show. the fact that I didn't know it was some jam session and had no idea that the majority of the show would be played with her back to us.

She probably played bass about five minutes the whole show. I loved the band: Mark's bass playing was insane but I didn't go to see Mark play bass. There was nothing I felt like I benefited from being there, like I could have seen the whole thing online.

soo excited by this news...i am, have been and will continue to be one of meshell's biggest champions but let's not mence words here, here shows are totally hit and miss. this has nothing to do with her attitude nor her medical condition...i have seen her almost a dozen times (in the bay area and in LA) and she has blown me away one night and bored me to tears another. that is her nature...buy your tickets at your own risk but understand---if you win the lottery and see her flying on all cylinders...it's worth it.

peeps (and especially her die hard fans, heck, i consider myself one of them) need to stop fronting and be honest with the reality that is her nature.

sosgemini said:

interesting, maybe i've just been lucky and hit the lottery more often than most .

trust me i'm being very honest based on my own experiences.
Seriously, i've probably been to over dozen meshell shows as well and, while her vibe & interaction with the audience definitely has swung from one extreme to the other and is hit or miss (either she's chatty cathy or she's no-talk nancy, and i've said that from the start), i have never ever been bored by the music she's played. bored? really? wow, i've never heard bored before...'pissed', yeah heard that, 'offended', yup that too...but never 'bored' thats a new one for the books sosgemini!

there were two shows i've gone to where the sets were shorter than i wanted and i can understand and agree with a listener being upset about that.( i was miffed after that one too and said so in my review of the gig. the music she played was absolutely slamming, but i did want it to go on longer. Especially after attending many gigs where she played until the club owners had to practically force them off the stage because they wanted to keep playing )

So, yeah..for me i guess i must be the lucky lotto winner on the musical front, because the music has pretty much always been on point at the shows i've attended...go figure


or now that i think about it, perhaps it could be that i just have kinda weird taste. after all, my favorite most cherished live Prince recordings in my collection are NOT his live concerts or shows, but rather his REAHEARSAL recordings where he and the band are just privately jamming and grooving loosely playing around with different approaches. I think most people do tend to prefer the actual live shows and yeah, they would probably find the rehearsals less interesting (or even somewhat boring). my tastes run differently i guess, since i actually prefer the loose raw 'rehearsal' type music.
ah well...

again, just different stokes i guess

.
[Edited 8/17/09 23:00pm]

anyone think she smokes weed?

japanrocks said:

Sure seems like that live.

japanrocks said:

come on....

come smoke my herb

my voices tell me
be still
have faith
stay clear of the rat race
it’s alright
i’m simple like the flowers
and just love
and worry not
about tomorrow

be simple like the flowers
come smoke my herb
make your heart like the ocean
your mind like the clear blue sky
come smoke my herb
make your heart like the ocean
your mind like the clear blue sky
come smoke my herb

do you believe
creation desires your devotion
through murder and death
we squabble over
the pieces of the earth
the true beasts are
those who believe in creation
without mother, womb or birth
be simple like the flowers

come smoke my herb
make your heart like the ocean
your mind like the clear blue sky
come smoke my herb
make your heart like the ocean
your mind like the clear blue sky
come smoke my herb...

clear blue sky
clear blue sky
clear blue sky

come smoke my herb
make your heart like the ocean
your mind like the clear blue sky
clear blue sky
your mind like the clear blue sky.

©2003 Revolutionary Jazz Giant Music, BMI

Written by Meshell Suhaila Bashir Shakur
Drums: Chris Dave
Vox Box: Allen Cato
Everything else: Meshell

Produced by Allen Dariest Cato for 3000 E. Zion & Meshell Ndegeocello for Humility Profits

Nice.....can't wait.
I hope Chris Dave is on this joint.

Thanks for all of the thoughts on the live shows. I'll pass on seeing her and keep an eye out for the album.

justhemusic said:

yeah, maybe that's what it is...i saw a show at bimbos that had long stretches of "jams" within each song (and she looked mighty blunted). well, I do appreciate a good jam but these jams were loooonnggggg....and the musicians were soo into their sound that the audience was non-existent to them....well, the crowd was a young, wanna be hip, good looking crowd that night and she lost them...folks just started pouring into the bar. the friends that i went with were so bored they asked to leave, so we did. i think that was my worst experience at a meshell show. this was for her pocketbook tour.

now, the last time i saw her was for Meshell Presents..... at Yoshi's and there were no vocals and all jams and it worked...the venue and the bands vibe were a perfect fit.

sosgemini said:

its all good. like i said just depends on what you're into. I've been to other artists 'official' concerts (i wont mention names unless asked) where I was extremely bored because i felt the concerts were SO musically 'scripted' that they felt devoid of true inspiration and 'life' to me. they felt cold and kinda 'phony'...like they were going through the perfectly planned out motions. Executed to a "T" mind you, but for me it didn't feel 'real'. However other folks seemed to enjoy the shows...the same shows that I found completely forgettable for one reason or another, they, for different reasons, dug. so again, it really may be more about what each of us looks-for/listens-for in a concert that will be key to whether or not we feel satisfied at the end ya know?

so far, for me and what i like most, meshells pretty much hit it outta the park everytime i've seen her


btw...here's more tidbits of info on the new "Devils Halo" record...

http://www.vintageguitar....ewsID=2056

http://www.downtownmusic....degeocello

(thanks to m & akhi from over at freemyheart for the scoop)


.
[Edited 8/23/09 18:44pm]

Album Cover....


http://www.speakeasy.org/...aloha.html

and click the 'please do' link...in the part that says
"41 days: If you haven't already, please do "

will be available on vinyl too for you wax heads...
[Edited 8/27/09 20:27pm]

..."like a dog in heat"?

Vendetta1 said:

That is such a shame. What happened to her? She was one of the few artists who I went to see every time she was in Chicago. I used to love her shows. They had so much energy and she interacted with the audience. Then something changed.

She seemed to get "bitter" to quote one of her albums. The last time I saw her was a few years back in Chicago at the ParkWest. It was around the time that Jam Master Jay was killed. The energy of that show was off. It was like you said, it seemed like we weren't even there. It was a Friday night and people were ready to party and have a good time, but she just played a bunch of mellow and/or melancholy songs. Many people were disappointed that night. I could tell from the last couple of times that I had seen her that something was changing, but that night was it. Sadly, I just can't bring myself to see her live based on what I am hearing now.

It sucks because I had purchased all of her albums through Cookie and she was one of my favorite artists, but I have been disappointed with her as of late.

i'll never pay to see her live again!

lover her music but i'm ok with the cds.

her opening act played for 90mins, people were booing them and they kept playing. she took the stage only did songs from Comfort Woman though the cd was still 3 months away. it was billed as promotion for Cookie. Mumbled through 45 mins did Fool of Me, Free My Heart and was gone.

NEVER AGAIN!

yeah.....she is a night owl too but i guess if you catch her on a good night when she is high and has smoked some good herb - the show can be incredible

did not know about the epilepsy thing

but there seem to always be random drunk people that show up and start yelling out song titles, etc.

guess that happens everywhere

japanrocks said:

i'd rather not spend money on someone who is hit or miss.

Additional perspectives on Meshells music and the Devils Halo Project...
(compiled from other threads that are out there in webland & the org)...


"Any disaffected Prince fan is doing themselves a disservice by not checking her out."

•

"Found a short synopsis.

Devil’s Halo, Meshell’s 8th album, harkens back to the way records used to be made:
no click, live band energy, and phenomenal musicianship. Influenced by a breadth of sounds, from The Human League to Wu Tang to Yes, Devil’s Halo displays Meshell’s own diversity of formidable gifts. Always the uncompromising artist and bass player,this record brings a broad range of musical and lyrical voices and selves: the searcher,the skeptic, the dissenter, and the lover. True to form, Meshell offers compositions with raging climaxes alongside moments of terrifying tenderness and honesty. Genre-defiant as ever, Devil’s Halo asks for the real fans of exploration to please stand up.

Me'Shell has given up with the politics of explaining herself. After 20 years in an industry that has called her everything from avant garde to a dying breed, what unquestionably remains is the fearsome bassist, prolific songwriter and the creativity and curiosity of an authentic musical force. With that,
she has earned critical acclaim, the unfailing respect of fellow players, songwriters and composers, and the dedication of her diverse, unclassifiable fans."


•


"I met Deantoni parks last sunday and he told me that Devil's Halo is a bit like bitter meets elvis' sunset record days."


•


"...Meshell feels that Devil’s Halo represents a return to a place that she truly appreciates, music that is created and performed by people’s hands. Produced by Meshell and guitarist Chris Bruce, and influenced by a wide breadth of sounds – from The Human League to Wu Tang to Yes – Devil’s Halo displays Meshell’s vocals and diversity throughout.

Meshell says of Devil’s Halo, “I guess I’ve ended up believing in the gray area, the dichotomies and the unknowable. This record is all about contrast – then and now, raw and polished, beats and harmonies, Devil’s Halo, good in evil in all things. I know some people want more of what they’ve heard and I know other people want the envelope pushed every time and I feel like this record makes peace with all of them”. She adds, “I love heavy bass and dub and beats, but I also sit and play the piano and write a song inspired by a pub in Dublin. I’m not representing anymore – I’m a musician, that’s all I can offer. Each record is just meant to say: here’s where that’s led me today.”

•

As i'm writing this I actually happen to be listening to a recording of one of the live meshell concerts that i've been lucky enough to come across and add to my collection over the years...

On the real, point blank, seriously, with all other peripheral elements aside...its just some of the best damn MUSIC i own...period.
Obviously Org rules prevent me from sharing here of course (and i definitely dont wanna be banned for uploading samples or anything like that ) but i'd love for folks to hear on their own samples of 'Mehsell live' through the years...stuff from as far back as 1994 all the way through as recently as this year, and let the MUSIC itself speak for itself. You'd be able to hear and judge for yourself the wide breadth of music styles she's deeply explored, ingested and created over the years and hear how her music has been pretty much in a constant exploratory, evolving and seemingly 'seeking/learning/melding' state...while at the same time keeping a few specific threads of consistency throughout: a consistent commitment to that particular moment alone regardless of environment or expectations, a commitment to that particular raw naked honest musical expression at that particular time...and consistency to the respect to and quality of the craft of creating the music itself. those things have always been there in her music, so you can count on that part for sure. Other than that though, pretty much all other bets are off!

Again, that type of thing isn't for everyone...it just isnt. i'm definitely aware of that. (I have good friends who just aren't into that amount of unpredictability with their music. they dig some of it, and other parts not so much... so i understand that it's not something that everyone is looking for in their music. no problem from me on that at all, (because as mentioned before, there is also a lot of stuff that my friends listen to that I don't like so much either, because it just doesn't feel 'alive' to me.) So, we are all 'into' whatever we're 'into', right? Its cool. Chocolate / vanilla / strawberry baby...

BUT, for those of you that DO look for that kind of raw naked 'no expectations' musical approach...then yeah, live Meshell music can be some of the most satisfying stuff on many many levels that you'll listen to...sometimes Chocolate, sometimes Vanilla, sometimes Strawberry...and hell, with meshell you never know, you just may get Grape, Pineapple, Banana and Cocoanut thrown in the mix too...

.
[Edited 8/29/09 10:18am]

justhemusic said:

and sometimes you can find a dead fly in your bowl of fruit.