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PrintableCopycat said: Musical Influences Duffy admits she's influenced by a wide range of artists. She said: "I like a lot of obscure stuff. 
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SquirrelMeat said: Mong said: Jesus, there are some senseless fuckers commenting in this thread. How the fuck does Duffy sound like Dusty Springfield? She wishes... Dusty had a gorgeous easy natural rich tone...Duffy sounds like a nasal bleating sheep.
Estelle is no better. She's no singer, just a shitty cow who's been given a second chance, and one who can't judge "soul", owing to her poor voice. Big deal, she's black...but she can't sing. Well that's one stereotype she falls short of. Shame, as she could direct her point to the music industry, not the singers...of course the industry is racist...the lighter the skin, the more "sellable" they seem. That's bullshit. But she's better than Duffy. Fuck me, even Richard Simmons is a better singer than Duffy. Duffy is a stupid arrogant Welsh piece of shit. You brain is still living up you your name I see!  At least my ears work properly. Can you tell me how the hell you can compare her to Dusty Springfield? | |
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phunkdaddy said: Stymie said: I know soul music and it ain't Amy Winehouse. But I do agree Estelle has no soul either.
Amy Whinehouse sounds like a straight rip off of the Marvelettes to me. And before anyone says what i have against white artists? Nothing because i am a fan of average white band, the police, and hall & oates. | |
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murph said: thekidsgirl said: All I'm saying is that with quotes like this:
Estelle just sounds like she's directing her valid frustrations at the wrong people  Excerpt from Full original article (Might put homegirl's words in better context...): What angers Estelle most, though, is the way that in the UK, issues relating to race are swept under the carpet, especially in music. "Americans have their issues with skin colour, even within the black community, with light and dark skin, it's crazy - but no one's oblivious to it. Here everyone pretends it doesn't happen, it's all bullshit." She cites the way in which Ofcom banned the grime MC Bashy's single Black Boys from TV last year: "What about that song is racist? He says in that song, we're not all killers and murderers. It's racist because he says explicitly 'black boys' in the hook? Fuck off. Bullshit. He's telling the kids they can be more positive - you don't want the kids to be positive now? You want them to keep killing each other? You don't think you can use this song in an ad campaign like Trident [the Metropolitan police campaign against gun crime in London's black communities]? It really is that ignorant. It's 2008, but it feels like 19-fucking-80-something." WoW thats deep "Black Boys" is a great powerful and positive song. I heard it one time on youtube been looking for it to show to my young brothas. you'll have no idea how mad this Black Man is now after reading that. This world is SICK!! [Edited 4/18/08 9:53am] | |
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Aight, Duffy may not have to put black people in her videos but she damn well better learn to acknowledge where she's stealing her sound from. It ain't the fuckin' Rolling Stones. Rambling off in her interviews about the vague mysteries of her influences (except for the Stones, of course which sounds nothing like her) is insincere at the very least. Black folks are listening to her and then read that shit and go "Do you know we can HEAR YOU, b***ch?"
That's how you know a sound is manufactured; when the artist won't state their influences because they are a. too young to know them or b. deliberately trying not to point people in the direction of the source material. Her song is the embodiment of an era of music. If she sounded like a MLPS artist, y'all would be tearing her a new asshole right about now. She gets no support from me. I'm sure she'll still sell. Oh and she's not defending blue-eyed soul because not every "blue-eyed soul" artist is trying to pass themselves off as original by copying a style of an era in black music history. Teena never did that shit. Michael MacDonald never did that shit. Its only those who support the mindset of black music without black people who do shit like that. [Edited 4/20/08 8:59am] | |
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BlaqueKnight said: Aight, Duffy may not have to put black people in her videos but she damn well better learn to acknowledge where she's stealing her sound from. It ain't the fuckin' Rolling Stones. Rambling off in her interviews about the vague mysteries of her influences (except for the Stones, of course which sounds nothing like her) is insincere at the very least. Black folks are listening to her and then read that shit and go "Do you know we can HEAR YOU, b***ch?"
That's how you know a sound is manufactured; when the artist won't state their influences because they are a. too young to know them or b. deliberately trying not to point people in the direction of the source material. Her song is the embodiment of an era of music. If she sounded like a MLPS artist, y'all would be tearing her a new asshole right about now. She gets no support from me. I'm sure she'll still sell. Oh and she's not defending blue-eyed soul because not every "blue-eyed soul" artist is trying to pass themselves off as original by copying a style of an era in black music history. Teena never did that shit. Michael MacDonald never did that shit. Its only those who support the mindset of black music without black people who do shit like that. [Edited 4/20/08 8:59am] Its like Black Music = SHAQ and Duffy = Kobe. ShaQ says to Kobe "Im not saying you owe me, but act like you know me..." | |
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Duggs said:[quote
Its like Black Music = SHAQ and Duffy = Kobe. ShaQ says to Kobe "Im not saying you owe me, but act like you know me..."[/quote Exactly. Beautifully put! | |
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BlaqueKnight said: Aight, Duffy may not have to put black people in her videos but she damn well better learn to acknowledge where she's stealing her sound from. It ain't the fuckin' Rolling Stones. Rambling off in her interviews about the vague mysteries of her influences (except for the Stones, of course which sounds nothing like her) is insincere at the very least. Black folks are listening to her and then read that shit and go "Do you know we can HEAR YOU, b***ch?"
That's how you know a sound is manufactured; when the artist won't state their influences because they are a. too young to know them or b. deliberately trying not to point people in the direction of the source material. Her song is the embodiment of an era of music. If she sounded like a MLPS artist, y'all would be tearing her a new asshole right about now. She gets no support from me. I'm sure she'll still sell. Oh and she's not defending blue-eyed soul because not every "blue-eyed soul" artist is trying to pass themselves off as original by copying a style of an era in black music history. Teena never did that shit. Michael MacDonald never did that shit. Its only those who support the mindset of black music without black people who do shit like that. [Edited 4/20/08 8:59am] Great post... | |
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As Daryl Hall said the term "blue Eyed soul" was a borderline racist term and he always hated it from day one. The thing is if Hall and Oates came out today the same thing would be going on. There is just too much media, just sing your shit and move on, i dont give a shit who influenced you, if i wanna know, I'll ask. And i think stupid ass interviewers who write for Rolling Stone and Vibe etc.. need to get educated themselves, especially with how to interview people. Back in the day when someone came out new that was it, the music spoke, they didnt, this is why i think for years Prince always backed off the "Hendrix and influences" question and it really wasnt till later years that he actually talked influences much more openly. But nowadyas and artist puts out a single and we have to know who they listen too, who they grew up on, what they eat, what they look like when they pump gas etc.. who gives a flying fuck. "We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F | |
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If Daryll Hall said that, then Daryl Hall has no clue what racism is. Oh how badly the "white mane" has been oppressed in America! White people have had it so hard! I mean with the separate bathrooms, the police dog attacks and being sprayed by fire hoses for peaceful sit-ins. Having nooses hung on school trees. Being systematically omitted in terms of jobs and education while white women benefit the most from programs like affirmative action that are used as talking points to pretend as if equal opportunity exists and all is fair. Yeah...white men have it bad in America.
Secondly, I agree that interviewers SUCK these days. Still, if you are clueless about the origins of the music you are singing, you should refrain completely from comments on it. Better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. There is nothing wrong with having a song like this and saying "Well, we tapped into the old sounds of 60s R&B as an influence. We tried to recapture that old vibe and put a new twist on it and bring it to the youth of today." That's off the top of my head. Its simple, doesn't belittle the artist and pays homage to the source material all in one swoop. This song is OBVIOUSLY borrowing from a specific source. Not every song by every artist is, so that type of question would not be put to someone like Robin Thicke. The way she addressed it looks like someone selling ivory while trying to avoid talking about the big, black elephant standing in the middle of the room. [Edited 4/20/08 10:37am] | |
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BlaqueKnight said: If Daryll Hall said that, then Daryl Hall has no clue what racism is. Oh how badly the "white mane" has been oppressed in America! White people have had it so hard! I mean with the separate bathrooms, the police dog attacks and being sprayed by fire hoses for peaceful sit-ins. Having nooses hung on school trees. Being systematically omitted in terms of jobs and education while white women benefit the most from programs like affirmative action that are used as talking points to pretend as if equal opportunity exists and all is fair. Yeah...white men have it bad in America.
Secondly, I agree that interviewers SUCK these days. Still, if you are clueless about the origins of the music you are singing, you should refrain completely from comments on it. Better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. There is nothing wrong with having a song like this and saying "Well, we tapped into the old sounds of 60s R&B as an influence. We tried to recapture that old vibe and put a new twist on it and bring it to the youth of today." That's off the top of my head. Its simple, doesn't belittle the artist and pays homage to the source material all in one swoop. This song is OBVIOUSLY borrowing from a specific source. Not every song by every artist is, so that type of question would not be put to someone like Robin Thicke. The way she addressed it looks like someone selling ivory while trying to avoid talking about the big, black elephant standing in the middle of the room. [Edited 4/20/08 10:37am] I dont think Daryl was commenting on what racism is, but the term "blue eyed soul" is a yet another form of lumping all of one type of person with another, with at the end of the day, will give you that view. I doubt Daryl is saying he suffered in his journey as a "white" artist, though RB radio was the one that accepted them first because they had no "face" back than. Nowadays everyone has a face and anyway you slice it the world is more seperated than ever, whether it be by race, looks, weight or gender. As for artists, to me you dont get a pass because you know who Sly stone is, theres too much of that kind of thinking. This is why i give NO respect to people like Kanye or Justin or Timbaland etc..because they all talk a good game but back it up with shit. someone said Tim is an RB producer? On what planet is what he does RB? As for Justin and Kanye all they do is talk, they tell the listener who they are, and because most listeners are zombie like, they suck it all in. The listener is the judge, the artist needs to just let the work stand. I mean if you see a painting, you judge it, you dont have the painter telling you what you are seeing, why do we let artists tell us who they are like, who they listen too, what they grew up on. Its meaningless and no one gets a pass. "We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F | |
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BlaqueKnight said: Aight, Duffy may not have to put black people in her videos but she damn well better learn to acknowledge where she's stealing her sound from. It ain't the fuckin' Rolling Stones. Rambling off in her interviews about the vague mysteries of her influences (except for the Stones, of course which sounds nothing like her) is insincere at the very least. Black folks are listening to her and then read that shit and go "Do you know we can HEAR YOU, b***ch?"
That's how you know a sound is manufactured; when the artist won't state their influences because they are a. too young to know them or b. deliberately trying not to point people in the direction of the source material. Her song is the embodiment of an era of music. If she sounded like a MLPS artist, y'all would be tearing her a new asshole right about now. She gets no support from me. I'm sure she'll still sell. Oh and she's not defending blue-eyed soul because not every "blue-eyed soul" artist is trying to pass themselves off as original by copying a style of an era in black music history. Teena never did that shit. Michael MacDonald never did that shit. Its only those who support the mindset of black music without black people who do shit like that. [Edited 4/20/08 8:59am] It's not as if this is her first interview and that she has never revealed to have black artists as influences. Feel free to join in the Prince Album Poll 2018! Let'a celebrate his legacy by counting down the most beloved Prince albums, as decided by you! | |
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Blaque, speak your mind, goddammit  | |
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Moonbeam said: It's not as if this is her first interview and that she has never revealed to have black artists as influences.[/quote] I'm not a "Duffy" fan. This is the first thing I've read of hers, so for me its a first impression. I don't know her from the wall. I live in the States, not the UK. | |
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BlaqueKnight said: Bingo! Its the Elvis syndrome. The "mainstream" likes the music but if given a choice, many would rather see blonde hair and blue eyes or at least pale skin doing it. I resent the public for that but moreso its the fault of the labels. Its never the fault of the artist for doing what they do. Its just unfair that women like "Duffy" and Amy Winehouse get promoted to high hell when artists like Chrisette Michele, Angie Stone, and Conya Doss have to scrape and scrap to get on some liquor company sponsored tour with basically word-of-mouth promotion to rely on for ticket sales. The music industry is RACIST but people like to look away and pretend its something else.
 Your sentiments represent mine. Unfortunately people are too quick to dismiss Estelle's comments as picking on white artists, which is not what she was doing at all. I think she used those artists as examples to help illustrate and support her point, which is completely logical.
The only thing that I will add is that it cuts across media platforms into film and television as well. Basically, it is the entire entertainment industry, which is nothing more than a microcosm of life. The entertainment industry - worldwide - is not immune to the illnesses that plague the world in which it exists. So, in 2008 we still have a LONG way to go where equal opportunity is concerned. perfection is a fallacy of the imagination... | |
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bellanoche said: BlaqueKnight said: Bingo! Its the Elvis syndrome. The "mainstream" likes the music but if given a choice, many would rather see blonde hair and blue eyes or at least pale skin doing it. I resent the public for that but moreso its the fault of the labels. Its never the fault of the artist for doing what they do. Its just unfair that women like "Duffy" and Amy Winehouse get promoted to high hell when artists like Chrisette Michele, Angie Stone, and Conya Doss have to scrape and scrap to get on some liquor company sponsored tour with basically word-of-mouth promotion to rely on for ticket sales. The music industry is RACIST but people like to look away and pretend its something else.
Your sentiments represent mine. Unfortunately people are too quick to dismiss Estelle's comments as picking on white artists, which is not what she was doing at all. I think she used those artists as examples to help illustrate and support her point, which is completely logical.
The only thing that I will add is that it cuts across media platforms into film and television as well. Basically, it is the entire entertainment industry, which is nothing more than a microcosm of life. The entertainment industry - worldwide - is not immune to the illnesses that plague the world in which it exists. So, in 2008 we still have a LONG way to go where equal opportunity is concerned. Very true but we have to also look at things like artists, filmmakers, actors that further these issues by doing exactly what "sells" and not what is against the "grain" of the Mainstream. There is too much focus on that word MAINSTREAM, as Dr. Cornell West said "It is possible to be mainstream without being main-streamed". There are too many people that are afraid of being un-popular and just want to go along with the stream. And dont get me started on the so-called filmmakers and video directors that do nothing but further the issues of this "stream" "We went where our music was appreciated, and that was everywhere but the USA, we knew we had fans, but there is only so much of the world you can play at once" Magne F | |
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lastdecember said: bellanoche said: Your sentiments represent mine. Unfortunately people are too quick to dismiss Estelle's comments as picking on white artists, which is not what she was doing at all. I think she used those artists as examples to help illustrate and support her point, which is completely logical.
The only thing that I will add is that it cuts across media platforms into film and television as well. Basically, it is the entire entertainment industry, which is nothing more than a microcosm of life. The entertainment industry - worldwide - is not immune to the illnesses that plague the world in which it exists. So, in 2008 we still have a LONG way to go where equal opportunity is concerned. Very true but we have to also look at things like artists, filmmakers, actors that further these issues by doing exactly what "sells" and not what is against the "grain" of the Mainstream. There is too much focus on that word MAINSTREAM, as Dr. Cornell West said "It is possible to be mainstream without being main-streamed". There are too many people that are afraid of being un-popular and just want to go along with the stream. And dont get me started on the so-called filmmakers and video directors that do nothing but further the issues of this "stream" I completely agree with you. I am very familiar with Dr. West's comments on this topic too. I had a discussion with someone last week about how today people are so concerned with endorsement deals and what sells that they are afraid to say or do anything outside of the mainstream because it's all about achieving/maintaining fame/status/bling, i.e. making money. It is sad because as someone who LOVES the arts, I am watching a slow, painful death of art for art's sake on a large scale. The integrity has waned big time. We still have artists who reside in obscurity attempting to create authentic, organic expressions. However, the mainstream has definitely been "main-streamed" into a bastion of banality. perfection is a fallacy of the imagination... | |
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BlaqueKnight said: Moonbeam said: It's not as if this is her first interview and that she has never revealed to have black artists as influences. I'm not a "Duffy" fan. This is the first thing I've read of hers, so for me its a first impression. I don't know her from the wall. I live in the States, not the UK.[/quote] I'm not from the UK either. It's not as if I've read a ton of material on the chick, to be honest, but I have heard her mention Motown in particular before. Perhaps she is naive on the state of the UK music industry- I wouldn't know, as I've never been there. However, I do agree with her quote, "If the talent and the desire is there, I don't really think it matters what colour you are." And I don't think Estelle needed to slight other acts to make her point. Feel free to join in the Prince Album Poll 2018! Let'a celebrate his legacy by counting down the most beloved Prince albums, as decided by you! | |
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abierman said: phunkdaddy said: Amy Whinehouse sounds like a straight rip off of the Marvelettes to me. And before anyone says what i have against white artists? Nothing because i am a fan of average white band, the police, and hall & oates.
Hall & Oates, the legit white soul-duo! (not because YOU like 'em!  )They are far more pop than soul. Look up their chart success. They just happen to be pop singers with soul overtones. Musically they weren't jacking other artists sounds like some of these so called pop acts now. Don't laugh at my funk
This funk is a serious joint | |
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Mong said: SquirrelMeat said: You brain is still living up you your name I see! At least my ears work properly. Can you tell me how the hell you can compare her to Dusty Springfield? Your eyes must be playing you up then. I never said she sounded like Dusty, I said shes going for the dusty sound. By that I mean the package, the vibe, the market, the approach. The "white soul" thing. Just look at Dusty and Jimi. http://www.youtube.com/wa...re=related or Dusty on her own http://www.youtube.com/wa...tBwruLPhl4 I think Duffy's market is the exact same modern day equivelent. . |
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Moonbeam said: I'm not from the UK either. It's not as if I've read a ton of material on the chick, to be honest, but I have heard her mention Motown in particular before. Perhaps she is naive on the state of the UK music industry- I wouldn't know, as I've never been there. However, I do agree with her quote, "If the talent and the desire is there, I don't really think it matters what colour you are." And I don't think Estelle needed to slight other acts to make her point. Yeah...I used to believe that, too. In truth, it DOESN'T matter what color you are but in today's video age, people are spoiled. They want their musical artists customized like everything else. Its funny how it seems like people want to hear a voice like Chaka or Angie Stone or Erykah Badu or even Patti LaBelle but they want to hear it coming from an 18 year old scantily-clad blonde with big boobs. Then, there's the crowd that's been weened on American Idol and crap like that. The karaoke show goer. They want to see people playing on stage but they don't want to see people kicking their ass; they want to see them as someone they feel they can "compete with" - if he/she can do it then so can I therefore that could be me on that stage. There's way too much catering to the American ego in our society. Its that narcissism that makes the "mainstream" prefer people like Justin Timberlake and Christina A. over other artists more rooted in the genre. Nicole Sherzinger, Fugglie, Amy Winehouse and Joss Stone fit a more "video-friendly" mold for Pop R&B. There are a lot of factors involved and too much to explain but it comes down to peoples' preferences dominating their lives. Its no fault of the artists for wanting to do whatever style of music they are drawn to but it becomes the artist's responsibility when they accept being "whitefaced" in order to sell records. | |
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BlaqueKnight said: Moonbeam said: I'm not from the UK either. It's not as if I've read a ton of material on the chick, to be honest, but I have heard her mention Motown in particular before. Perhaps she is naive on the state of the UK music industry- I wouldn't know, as I've never been there. However, I do agree with her quote, "If the talent and the desire is there, I don't really think it matters what colour you are." And I don't think Estelle needed to slight other acts to make her point. Yeah...I used to believe that, too. In truth, it DOESN'T matter what color you are but in today's video age, people are spoiled. They want their musical artists customized like everything else. Its funny how it seems like people want to hear a voice like Chaka or Angie Stone or Erykah Badu or even Patti LaBelle but they want to hear it coming from an 18 year old scantily-clad blonde with big boobs. Then, there's the crowd that's been weened on American Idol and crap like that. The karaoke show goer. They want to see people playing on stage but they don't want to see people kicking their ass; they want to see them as someone they feel they can "compete with" - if he/she can do it then so can I therefore that could be me on that stage. There's way too much catering to the American ego in our society. Its that narcissism that makes the "mainstream" prefer people like Justin Timberlake and Christina A. over other artists more rooted in the genre. Nicole Sherzinger, Fugglie, Amy Winehouse and Joss Stone fit a more "video-friendly" mold for Pop R&B. There are a lot of factors involved and too much to explain but it comes down to peoples' preferences dominating their lives. Its no fault of the artists for wanting to do whatever style of music they are drawn to but it becomes the artist's responsibility when they accept being "whitefaced" in order to sell records. I agree with most of what you said...People really do like it when its an image that they fill more comfortable with (and that's usually on the racial tip...great point...)...But there are a few acts that you mentioned that have shown their talent and respect for their influences beyond the hype and image...I'll take Christina A. and even Amy Winehouse (beyond her problems, she's never tried to take all the credit for her success...And she's always shown reverence for her influences...) over Fergie and Joss Stone anyday... [Edited 4/20/08 18:20pm] | |
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BlaqueKnight said: Moonbeam said: I'm not from the UK either. It's not as if I've read a ton of material on the chick, to be honest, but I have heard her mention Motown in particular before. Perhaps she is naive on the state of the UK music industry- I wouldn't know, as I've never been there. However, I do agree with her quote, "If the talent and the desire is there, I don't really think it matters what colour you are." And I don't think Estelle needed to slight other acts to make her point. Yeah...I used to believe that, too. In truth, it DOESN'T matter what color you are but in today's video age, people are spoiled. They want their musical artists customized like everything else. Its funny how it seems like people want to hear a voice like Chaka or Angie Stone or Erykah Badu or even Patti LaBelle but they want to hear it coming from an 18 year old scantily-clad blonde with big boobs. Then, there's the crowd that's been weened on American Idol and crap like that. The karaoke show goer. They want to see people playing on stage but they don't want to see people kicking their ass; they want to see them as someone they feel they can "compete with" - if he/she can do it then so can I therefore that could be me on that stage. There's way too much catering to the American ego in our society. Its that narcissism that makes the "mainstream" prefer people like Justin Timberlake and Christina A. over other artists more rooted in the genre. Nicole Sherzinger, Fugglie, Amy Winehouse and Joss Stone fit a more "video-friendly" mold for Pop R&B. There are a lot of factors involved and too much to explain but it comes down to peoples' preferences dominating their lives. Its no fault of the artists for wanting to do whatever style of music they are drawn to but it becomes the artist's responsibility when they accept being "whitefaced" in order to sell records. That is spot on. As much as I can enjoy music videos, they literally changed the face of the game. Fashion trends (and body image trends) become essential for music acts to follow in their videos, or they run the risk of losing their audience. Today it, female pop stars have to be "hot" and sing primarily about sex, while male pop stars have to be arrogant players. Bands have to focus on their image as much as their music if they want to be successful. And don't get me started on American Idol- that show promotes the lowest common denominator and results in an industry where all personalities and natural quirks are diluted and processed. Has anyone really cared what Kelly Clarkson or Clay Aiken had to say? Does anyone believe that anyone who was succeeded from an Idol franchise has ever really been interesting and brought something new, unique, or even naturally passionate to the table? Feel free to join in the Prince Album Poll 2018! Let'a celebrate his legacy by counting down the most beloved Prince albums, as decided by you! | |
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SquirrelMeat said: I would hardly call Duffy "soul" anyway. She's soul influenced. Her sound is as much Marianne Faithfull as it is Aretha Franklin.
I think shes more like a new Dusty Springfield than a Diana Ross. Here's a link to here first single "Rockferry". Much better than "Mercy". http://www.youtube.com/wa...lcRRnbqS8Y I wasn't talking about the way she looked. Wasn't that obvious? You were too ambiguous, as you can surely see above. | |
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murph said: I agree with most of what you said...People really do like it when its an image that they fill more comfortable with (and that's usually on the racial tip...great point...)...But there are a few acts that you mentioned that have shown their talent and respect for their influences beyond the hype and image...I'll take Christina A. and even Amy Winehouse (beyond her problems, she's never tried to take all the credit for her success...And she's always shown reverence for her influences...) over Fergie and Joss Stone anyday... [Edited 4/20/08 18:20pm] That's why I used a variety of examples. Its not about the artists themselves but rather the machines driving them. ANY artist of any color will take whatever press/attention/exposure they can get. Its the corporations that exploit them. Some are just better at interviews and are more sincere than others. | |
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