.

To answer someones question here:

Kylie is a fairly decent gaydisco-icon, nothing more, nothing less (but she dont touches me with her music)

Madonna is a mediocre singer, but has an ear for picking up 'trends' (NY disco, Vogue-dancing, French housemusic) and knows how to make slick, but smart mainstream-music from it. Next to that she can write great melodies in the pop-vein. I am not a fan of her, but i must say that especially Like a Prayer and Ray of light are great albums within their field.

But,that same person assuming i 'write down' Janet Jackson, because i might prefer Kylie or Madonna, is wrong. I mean: there are far more gifted female musicians i prefer above these three. To name a few: Björk, Bonnie Rait, Susan McKeown, Nathalie Merchant, June Tabor, Caroline Herring, Kate Rusby, Sandy Denny, Joni Mitchell, Mavis Staples, Carol van Dijk (Bettie Serveert).

Within the 'commercial field' i consider Madonna as a major force. But Janet has just been lucky to bump into Jam and Lewis, and they produced some great tracks for her (productionwise, not vocalwise), but when it comes to the quality of her vocals in general, her choices of songs, her creativity and soulfullness Janet Jackson is a hyped 'nobody'.

Janfriend said:

Tito ain't much of a dancer. Jermaine on the other hand isn't bad, even with his heavy bass you could tell he had natural rhythm.

Riverpoet31 said:

so does that mean every artist who dont produce their own songs are 'lucky' to have run into whoever their producers are, or just janet?

Nope, there are great artists who dont write or produce their own songs, but who actually CAN sing, and who can actually TOUCH the listener.

TotalAlisa said:

<-- the usual "totalalisa" reply in a jackson thread...
[Edited 11/11/07 17:42pm]

TotalAlisa said:

you may want to check your facts on that.
[Edited 11/11/07 16:31pm]

CHIC0 said:

it is a fact, she really dont have half as many hits as janet. just going by #1 songs alone kylie would have to have had at least 5 #1 pop singles ,which is half of janets. im not to familiar with her so if she does i stand corrected

Riverpoet31 said:

just because her music never touched you how do you know she never touched any of her fans, i mean common sense would tell me that for her to have fans who have stuck around over 20 years she must have done something positive for them.

Riverpoet31 said:

Janet's music has always touched me as a listener, and will continue to do so for the rest of my life. Thank you, Janet!

VoicesCarry said:

Aye, aye.

After I heard "What About" from "The Velvet Rope", I was very touched by Janet. I think Janet puts alot of herself into her music. I don't think she's just singing a song to sing it. After she insisted on performing "What About" at that VH1 fashion awards show some years ago, I refuse to call her talent-less ever. They didn't want her to perform that song and she told them it was either this song or nothing. It's a very powerful song and one that has always made Janet stand out to me as being just as talented as any of her brothers.

Believe me, I've had my share of bitching about Janet. I don't think she's been in "control" as much as she's let on throughout her career; I do think that JJ, TL, and Renee all had a part to play in her success. However, that isn't to say that she didn't have an amazing run of hit singles. And as much as I doubt that she was the driving force behind the music (or the lyrics), it does seem like a lot of it was extremely personal to the woman.

Nowadays, I get the impression that she's just not that interested in a music career, which is fine. She had longer on the top than most artists. I actually think that part of the reason I don't like 20 YO is that it just didn't feel like Janet really gave a damn about it. I did love Damita Jo, however, and I actually return to DJ much more than the rest of her catalog, which after years and years I finally burned out on.

Janet probably won't return to the list of my favorite artists, but that's alright, because she definitely was near the top for quite a while.

But I digress... Do I think that she's overrated by her hardcore fans (which artist isn't, though?) Yes. Definitely.

Do I think she's the "most overrated"? Certainly not. RN 1814, no matter who really wrote it and played the music on it, will go down as one of the greatest pop albums ever. Period.

Riverpoet31 said:

It's cool, Janet is none of those for you. But, she is that way to me.
Why does the org talking about her bother you so much? You could easily ignore the threads about her.
Because, if it's the fact that she actually has quite abit of fans on the org and you and maybe some others have a problem with that, tough!
The fact of the matter is, MICHAEL JACKSON, JANET JACKSON and PRINCE have allot of the same fans. You don't have to agree with it, but it is what it is. I'm one of the many that dig the three!

VoicesCarry said:

Tell em', VoicesCarry! I mean just because Janet might not touch some, it doesn't mean she doesn't touch others because she does!

xperience319 said:

thanks mister... you know what.. the jacksons well MJ and JJ are the most interesting to me

TotalAlisa said:

They're the most interesting to me as well.
Though, I love Prince too. Whenever I look at Prince or a photo of him, I think about his song PINK CASHMERE.

MICHAEL JACKSON, I think about ROCK WITH YOU

JANET JACKSON, I think about COME BACK TO ME

VoicesCarry said:

I second that. Why do you think we are fans? For our health? Everyone is entitled to their opinions but don't make generalisations based solely on your opinion

Considering the number of threads, I would say that she and her brother Michael both are. Hell, if they fart, someone is going to make a thread about it.

Janfriend said:

Tito maybe, but don't tell me you've never seen the Dynamite video

lowkey said:

That's a bit of a rubbish argument because you'e only speaking for one country. FLip it over in the UK and Janet has had ZERO #1s and Kylie has had 8.

Ellie said:

Yes but plently of hit albums and singles. Kylie's only had 2 successful singles in the USA but ZERO #1 : LOCOMOTION AND CGUOOMH.
[Edited 11/12/07 3:07am]

That's more to do with the USA's attitude towards Dance/Pop music in certain years as well as reluctance to play/embrace foreign acts. There are a few exceptions, most of which were either one hit wonders or already well established acts from the 70s to early 80s.

Funny how Janet didn't get a single Top 10 hit in the UK from Rhythm Nation despite a tour, HEAVY airplay and promotion. Can't say the same for Kylie as half her stuff was barely even released in America.

Ellie said:

Well that is a reflection of the UK's bad taste as the time: Compare "i should be so lucky" to "miss you much". No comparison at all. The tour however was sucessful as was the album in the UK. Maybe Janet was considered an album artist. If you look at Amy's "Back to Black" she has only had one top ten hit for the album despite 4 singles being released yet the album is by far the biggest seller of the year.

Are you sure the singles and album were heavily promoted? I don't recall much publicity from it, there are hardly interviews in the UK from that period.

Hey, I was like 8 years old and saw Janet videos on The Chart Show every week. Didn't she even do lots of kids TV interviews? I remember being surprised cos I never knew Michael Jackson even had a sister back then

And as for Kylie's US releases, I'm not talking about her first two albums. Things like Confide In Me (totally ripped off by The Velvet Rope 4 years later), Put Yourself In My Place, even Better The Devil You Know, Shocked... forget Impossible Princess since that flopped everywhere unfortunately, even though it's considered one of her best. Was the Light Years album ever released or given any attention in the US? Don't think so.

It's like comparing Janet's 20 Y.O. to Kylie's entire 90s output. Janet didn't even bother coming over to do an interview anywhere or say to Europe "hey, I have an album out". She was even IN France for some Paris Fashion week but never even tried to promote her album while she was there. Likewise, Kylie and her record company never bothered with the US.

So they're both local superstars really that can't be compared to Madonna internationally in any way.

Ellie said:

Common you can't say Janet copied Kylie, that’s laughable. In fact this whole comparison is too. If you want to talk about people copying each other why don't you listen to "body language" and compare it to the "janet" album.

This trend of discrediting Janet for all her achievements is really starting to piss me off!

btw: i compared Kylie's 1st two efforts to RN1814 because i was trying to compare musical tastes in that period.

So, yeah. I repeat...

RipHer2Shreds said:

OK, if you need Kylie's output during the RN1814 peiod then go with the Rhythm of Love album, not her first two.

I didn't say Janet "copied" Kylie, just that the title track to The Velvet Rope was very reminscent of Confide In Me, yet some of her fans at the time loved to hail Janet as some sort of saviour of originality... hell, I remember getting kicked off a Janet board once in '98 for suggesting that Madonna's Ray of Light was in any way decent. It's like some weird disease of the Jacksons - the fanatics are unbearable and contribute to negative vibes towards the artists themselves.

JJ fanatics are the worst I've found though cos they start outright lying about the smallest of things re: her success and then they start to believe them. Twas well weird when some twat started arguing me once that All For You had sold 12 million copies, with a straight face. Even if it had, why should that effect my opinion on the album?

Ellie said:

I agree - why does it always come down to chart and sales statistics?

The UK has never liked Janet, for whatever reason I'll never fathom. If all of the naff, boring shit Kylie released early in her career (and there was a lot of it, as brilliant as she has become since that period) could go Top 5 while Janet was releasing amazing single after amazing single off Rhythm Nation to no avail, that tells me a lot about the futility of equating success with artistic value. Same goes for all the fabulous Kylie singles that were ever ignored or not released in the US.
[Edited 11/12/07 7:13am]