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Printablesallysassalot said: was lionel a top 80's star? i thought tina turner would be on the list before lionel...
Tina was big for that Private Dancer album, but LR started crossing over with Commodores, then as a solo artist. he was mr. platinum for a minute...nobody really kinda patterns themselves after Tina except drag queens and Beyonce, pretty much you look better on your facebook page than you do in person  | |
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Not so sure about Lionel, either. He was huge, but he just didn't make much impact other than sales.
I would say Wham & George Michael, as mentioned before, but also Duran Duran for the early 80's. And for rock, maybe U2. Check this song out at:
http://www.soundclick.com...tmusic.htm | |
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VoicesCarry said: sallysassalot said: i think the erotica album and bedtime stories ar eboth comparable to britney's current style. i'm not saying britney's cds are on the same level...just that they are in the same category. Oh well, I disagree. To me, Britney's done four Like A Virgins in a row, the sum of which still do not equal the original Like A Virgin. Erotica and Bedtime Stories were both mature albums with superb production, lyrics and grooves. Britney has yet to make a "Secret", "Human Nature", "Rain", "Bedtime Story" or "Erotica" (that would require her to progress beyond the childish brand of sexuality she toys with). i don't really think erotica is terribly mature...i mean, besides in this life and secret garden. really...thief of hearts, fever, erotica, where life begins...these are not mature songs. though, i think on second thought, i agree with you on bedtime stories. | |
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meltwithu said: sallysassalot said: was lionel a top 80's star? i thought tina turner would be on the list before lionel...
Tina was big for that Private Dancer album, but LR started crossing over with Commodores, then as a solo artist. he was mr. platinum for a minute...nobody really kinda patterns themselves after Tina except drag queens and Beyonce, pretty much That's because not many people today can sing or perform like Tina. Beyonce is a poor man's drag queen imitation. | |
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sallysassalot said: VoicesCarry said: Oh well, I disagree. To me, Britney's done four Like A Virgins in a row, the sum of which still do not equal the original Like A Virgin. Erotica and Bedtime Stories were both mature albums with superb production, lyrics and grooves. Britney has yet to make a "Secret", "Human Nature", "Rain", "Bedtime Story" or "Erotica" (that would require her to progress beyond the childish brand of sexuality she toys with). i don't really think erotica is terribly mature...i mean, besides in this life and secret garden. really...thief of hearts, fever, erotica, where life begins...these are not mature songs. though, i think on second thought, i agree with you on bedtime stories. Erotica isn't mature? So Bad Girl (!), Deeper And Deeper (a song about coming out of the closet), Waiting, Words, etc. are immature songs? I disagree again, but I think you should reread the lyrics and ask yourself if you can envision Britney singing something like: It was so easy in the beginning When you didn't feel like running from your feelings like you are now What happened? What do I remind you of? Your past, your dreams Or some part of yourself that you just can't love? I wish I could believe you Or at least have the courage to leave you The title track is more intensely sexy than all of Britney's material. Even the cheeky tracks like Bye Bye Baby and Thief Of Hearts have a sarcastic sense of humour that makes for a great listen (Madonna saying "Stop, bitch....now sit your ass down." at the end of Thief Of Hearts is one of the album's highlights, at least for me). | |
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VoicesCarry said: meltwithu said: Tina was big for that Private Dancer album, but LR started crossing over with Commodores, then as a solo artist. he was mr. platinum for a minute...nobody really kinda patterns themselves after Tina except drag queens and Beyonce, pretty much That's because not many people today can sing or perform like Tina. Beyonce is a poor man's drag queen imitation. not too many women putting the rock flavor out there...except what's her name fubu dobson 
LR kinda made non-offensive r&b...songs you could hear on lite radio or r&B...endless love, truly, hello, all night long...kinda like boyz II men did in the 90's you look better on your facebook page than you do in person | |
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JANFAN4L said: meltwithu said: 3. Madonna--the standard by which all tarts (britany, Christina et al. are measured Actually, Britney gets the wealth of her influences from Janet (the large, drill team-esque sequences, her interchangable team of dancers, dancing with the chair in the "Stronger" video, etc.) The only Madonna influences are her slutiness and wearing an underwear and trenchcoat onstage. She gets that slutiness from her. Christina is more influenced vocally by Whitney Houston. To say Madonna is a slut, and Janet isn't is kinda dumb. Janet has three albums where she is nude and often exposes her nipple ring in photos. Meanwhile, madonna has ended that part of her life while janet continues to try too hard. | |
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On top of the BOTH Britney and Christina admitted Madonna as their biggest icon, might wanna do some research. | |
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Sorry, one more post.
Regarding Janet dancing with the chair and that influencing Britney, this may shock you but check Madonna's "open your heart" video from 1987. Madonna danced with a chair before Janet. | |
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sloopydrew4u said: Michael Jackson made no difference. 
He paved the way for black artists on MTV. And if you look at MTV and urban music's influence on American culture today?!? Saying he didn't make a difference is ridiculous. | |
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jayaredee said: On top of the BOTH Britney and Christina admitted Madonna as their biggest icon, might wanna do some research.
Actually, when Christina was still a virginal blonde thing (or at least when she was peddling that image ca. 1999/2000), she always named Mariah as her main influence. Of course, the slutty clothes might also have been inspired by Mariah, but you never know. | |
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Wouldn't it be more interesting to talk about other major 80's influences like:
The Smiths Dead Kennedys to name two | |
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prince- insturmental pop/r&b king
michael jackson - video and packaged pop king madonna - sells sex.... thats about it lionel richie - contemparary music king bottom line is.... w/o any of these and other big artists of the 80s music would be completely different. they all TOGETHER make up and influence the music of today. you cant say one is better than the other if they all influenced music in a different way or area.... the fact is there all great for different reasons... thats my 2 cents im goin to bed... | |
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sloopydrew4u said: meltwithu said: 1. Prince--music is sampled and emulated all over the map
2. Michael Jackson--laid the blueprint for Usher and Justin Timberlake 3. Madonna--the standard by which all tarts (britany, Christina et al. are measured 4. Bruce Springsteen--blue collar work ethic rock and roll 5. Lionel Ritchie--maudlin pop at it's best [Edited 9/16/04 21:07pm] Springsteen helped keep bue collar at the forefront. Too bad he charges $100.00 to see his show. Not many blue collar workers can afford that. Michael Jackson made no difference. I don't care if that pisses some of you off. Unless you think his contribution to crap N'SYNC songs means something, he was useless. Madonna. Hmm. Like a Prayer was a little above average. Otherwise, she really was nothing more than the inspiration for crappy fake singers like Britney Spears. Lionel Ritchie. Fuck him. He always sucked. He always will. You forgot to mention Prince. While I don't think he influenced many of the new corporate "pop" stars, I think he revived Rock and Roll. Prince meant something (and he still does). He was a HUGE influence on pop culture, if not a huge influence on pop music. Luv & Peace, Alex Did rock just die? Hang on Sloopy, Sloopy hang on!..... This post not for the wimp contingent. All whiny wusses avert your eyes. | |
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GottaLetitgo said: 3) Prince- His influence is undeniable on performers like Outkast, D' Angelo, and Alicia Keyes. And he's sampled a lot too. But Prince was such a chameleon in the 80's that it is hard to say his style influenced too many other performers. Quite frankly, most of the pop stars today do not have the balls to be as different and out there as P. One thing he greatly influenced...the Princebonics substitute of You (U) and To (to) in songs.
There just ain't no rational denial that Prince's imprint is all over the so-called Neo Soul movement, and then some. Whether they have the musical courage he displayed during his heyday doesn't make a difference really. And he's got people from way too many genres covering his music for people not to acknowledge it. I don't really see where Bruce or Lionel are influencing anybody these days.
Might as well give Lionel Babyface... This post not for the wimp contingent. All whiny wusses avert your eyes. | |
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JANFAN4L said: Janet largely popularized the use of choreographers in videos. It can be seen in artists' videos ranging from Aaliyah, Brandy, Monica, Beyonce, Christina, Tamia, Ashanti, and any other one-named chick you can think of.
I think that credit goes to her big brother, whose name escapes me at the moment...but then, that's video. ` [Edited 9/18/04 0:12am] This post not for the wimp contingent. All whiny wusses avert your eyes. | |
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VoicesCarry said: jayaredee said: On top of the BOTH Britney and Christina admitted Madonna as their biggest icon, might wanna do some research.
Actually, when Christina was still a virginal blonde thing (or at least when she was peddling that image ca. 1999/2000), she always named Mariah as her main influence. Of course, the slutty clothes might also have been inspired by Mariah, but you never know. I know she said that but I'm just telling you what she said in her interview. I guess Christina's performance style (including dirty clothing) is influenced by madonna, and musical style goes to Mariah. Of course, Britney and Christina may have Madonna as their icon but they don't have a clue how to follow in her footsteps. | |
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Supernova said: JANFAN4L said: Janet largely popularized the use of choreographers in videos. It can be seen in artists' videos ranging from Aaliyah, Brandy, Monica, Beyonce, Christina, Tamia, Ashanti, and any other one-named chick you can think of.
I think that credit goes to her big brother, whose name escapes me at the moment...but then, that's video. ` [Edited 9/18/04 0:12am] You're right. Janet is really a subset of Michael. What a funny point to make that someone was an innovator in hiring someone else (in this case a choreographer) to create their art! Check this song out at:
http://www.soundclick.com...tmusic.htm | |
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jayaredee said: Sorry, one more post.
Regarding Janet dancing with the chair and that influencing Britney, this may shock you but check Madonna's "open your heart" video from 1987. Madonna danced with a chair before Janet. Madonna didn't dance with the chair in that video, she slithered on it and put her leg up on it. If you watch Britney's Stronger video, the chair routine was a complete rip off of Janet's Miss You Much "That's the End?" chair sequence. Britney was twirling the chair, doing all sorts of spins and sits on it just like Janet's MYM video. | |
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JANFAN4L said: jayaredee said: Sorry, one more post.
Regarding Janet dancing with the chair and that influencing Britney, this may shock you but check Madonna's "open your heart" video from 1987. Madonna danced with a chair before Janet. Madonna didn't dance with the chair in that video, she slithered on it and put her leg up on it. If you watch Britney's Stronger video, the chair routine was a complete rip off of Janet's Miss You Much "That's the End?" chair sequence. Britney was twirling the chair, doing all sorts of spins and sits on it just like Janet's MYM video. Okay, the truth is i never watched Britney's video. Remember at Janet's celebrtation when Pink did the whole chair rountine? THat was pretty good. | |
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jayaredee said: JANFAN4L said: Actually, Britney gets the wealth of her influences from Janet (the large, drill team-esque sequences, her interchangable team of dancers, dancing with the chair in the "Stronger" video, etc.) The only Madonna influences are her slutiness and wearing an underwear and trenchcoat onstage. She gets that slutiness from her. Christina is more influenced vocally by Whitney Houston. To say Madonna is a slut, and Janet isn't is kinda dumb. Janet has three albums where she is nude and often exposes her nipple ring in photos. Meanwhile, madonna has ended that part of her life while janet continues to try too hard. OK, let me speak my mind for a second... When people mainly reference to today's pop tarts and allude to Madonna they're refering to Maddy's sexiness. I never called Madonna a slut. Now, you, on the other hand, might've felt that sting of subconsciousness and you thought I called Madonna a slut. Now that's your demons! When people refer to todays tarts and they reference to Madonna they are talking about sex not art -- bottomline. Janet isn't a slut -- plain and simple. And as far as the Janet is "nude in all her albums and exposes herself" comment, that just shows you're grossly oblivious to her image, music and what she's all about, in general. She's a woman who expresses her sensuality and shares that in her LPs. As far as "trying too hard"... that's just your opinion. So, you're trying to tell me since Prince jumped on the stage in assless pants in the past he's a lesser artist? No. Of course not. There's a double standard with you when it comes to critiquing Janet. I know good and well you're not trying to sit up here and tell me Madonna "moved past" sex?! UMM, HELLO, WHERE WERE YOU JUST LAST YEAR WHEN THE CHICK WAS PULLING A LESBIAN SPIT-SWAP WITH BRITNEY AT THE VMAS?? Are we having amnesia or am I just imagining things? If that wasn't a slut move, what was it? You're telling me Janet can't talk about sex in three records?! For Pete's sake, the woman is only 38 years old. If she wants to exhibit sensuality and that's what's on her mind at the moment let her do that. SHE'S A GROWN A** WOMAN. Madonna's a grown a** woman, too, she can get all sultry and nasty. But don't try to go there and get all revisionist on me trying to make it like Madonna's just "sooo moved on" with all that sexiness... ooh, she's this refined, dignified artisté now --- please don't give me that. Let me add one more thing on Janet. All this "slut talk" post-Nipplegate is bullsh*t. Keep in mind Janet KEPT her clothes on for SIX RECORDS (Janet Jackson, Dream Street, Control, RN1814, janet. and TVR). Hello what the f**k was "Let's Wait Awhile" about? She didn't start getting sensual until '93's janet. and even then she didn't expose herself -- and there was an element of classiness with it. It wasn't until Velvet Rope that Janet started exploring the darker side of sex as far as piercings and bondage and even when she showed the piercings she had a bra on. You're acting like the woman was doin' it HUSTLER MAGAZINE style or some sh*t, sitting on a car with her coochie hanging out. All For You was a exercise in playfulness and of course the Super Bowl sh*t was a stunt that went terribly wrong. Now all of a sudden Janet is this MEGA-SLUT? Spare me the myopia, PLEASE. [Edited 9/19/04 4:27am] | |
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JANFAN4L said: jayaredee said: To say Madonna is a slut, and Janet isn't is kinda dumb. Janet has three albums where she is nude and often exposes her nipple ring in photos. Meanwhile, madonna has ended that part of her life while janet continues to try too hard. When people mainly reference to today's pop tarts and allude to Madonna they're refering to Maddy's slutiness. There's no artistry involved in critics' estimations of Britney or whoever when they compare them to Madonna -- it's all about sex appeal and slutiness, bottomline. Janet isn't a slut -- plain and simple. And as far as the Janet is "nude in all her albums and exposes herself" comment, that just shows you're grossly oblivious to her image, music and what she's all about, in general. The Velvet Rope was an introspective LP and in it lied a theme of pain -- the nipple ring was a part of Janet's self-expression process. All For You was a flashy, pop record -- she was a single woman for the first time in nine years and she wanted to be playful. Damita Jo was a sexy record -- she JUST found a new lover (in Jermaine Dupri) and she's in love, she's feeling sexy. She's a woman who expresses her sensuality and shares that in her LPs. As far as "trying too hard"... that's just your opinion. So, you're trying to tell me since Prince jumped on the stage in assless pants in the past he's a lesser artist? No. Of course not. There's a double standard with you when it comes to critiquing Janet. I know good and well you're not trying to sit up here and tell me Madonna "moved past" sex?! UMM, HELLO, WHERE WERE YOU JUST LAST YEAR WHEN THE CHICK WAS PULLING A LESBIAN SPIT-SWAP WITH BRITNEY AT THE VMAS?? Are we having amnesia or am I just imagining things? You gonna tell me that wasn't a slut move? You're telling me Janet can't talk about sex in three records?! For Pete's sake, the woman is only 38 years old. If she wants to exhibit sensuality and that's what's on her mind at the moment let her do that. SHE'S A GROWN A** WOMAN. She's not living to compete with Madonna, she really doesn't even give a sh*t about the woman. You must have been pretty drunk to miss Janet's little "wardrobe mishap" at the superbow, in front of children where as Madonna isn't as stupid and pulls off her stunts at an award show, where parents have the choice of letting their kids watch it. On top of that have you seen her "all for you" show? She had some guy stattled and chained to some board where she practically had sex with him, im sorry that was slutty. As a madonna fan i can admit that madonna was a slut in the past, but she has found her spirituality and grown up a lot, despite the kiss which was hardly anything. However you being a hardcore janet fan, aren't gonna admit to janet's sluttiness so why bother an argument. Janet's 38 now? Madonna was grown up by 38 and learned to keep her clothes on. Janet is trying to compete with Britney and Christina with sex, while Madonna can sell out her tour with absolutely no sexuality involved. | |
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And i never said Janet is less of an artist, i think she's great at what she does but when you say Britney got all her sluttiness from Madonna but she is a big Janet worshipper as well, then i think she learned how to be proactive from both of them, not just Madonna. | |
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jayaredee said: JANFAN4L said: When people mainly reference to today's pop tarts and allude to Madonna they're refering to Maddy's slutiness. There's no artistry involved in critics' estimations of Britney or whoever when they compare them to Madonna -- it's all about sex appeal and slutiness, bottomline. Janet isn't a slut -- plain and simple. And as far as the Janet is "nude in all her albums and exposes herself" comment, that just shows you're grossly oblivious to her image, music and what she's all about, in general. The Velvet Rope was an introspective LP and in it lied a theme of pain -- the nipple ring was a part of Janet's self-expression process. All For You was a flashy, pop record -- she was a single woman for the first time in nine years and she wanted to be playful. Damita Jo was a sexy record -- she JUST found a new lover (in Jermaine Dupri) and she's in love, she's feeling sexy. She's a woman who expresses her sensuality and shares that in her LPs. As far as "trying too hard"... that's just your opinion. So, you're trying to tell me since Prince jumped on the stage in assless pants in the past he's a lesser artist? No. Of course not. There's a double standard with you when it comes to critiquing Janet. I know good and well you're not trying to sit up here and tell me Madonna "moved past" sex?! UMM, HELLO, WHERE WERE YOU JUST LAST YEAR WHEN THE CHICK WAS PULLING A LESBIAN SPIT-SWAP WITH BRITNEY AT THE VMAS?? Are we having amnesia or am I just imagining things? You gonna tell me that wasn't a slut move? You're telling me Janet can't talk about sex in three records?! For Pete's sake, the woman is only 38 years old. If she wants to exhibit sensuality and that's what's on her mind at the moment let her do that. SHE'S A GROWN A** WOMAN. She's not living to compete with Madonna, she really doesn't even give a sh*t about the woman. You must have been pretty drunk to miss Janet's little "wardrobe mishap" at the superbow, in front of children where as Madonna isn't as stupid and pulls off her stunts at an award show, where parents have the choice of letting their kids watch it. On top of that have you seen her "all for you" show? She had some guy stattled and chained to some board where she practically had sex with him, im sorry that was slutty. As a madonna fan i can admit that madonna was a slut in the past, but she has found her spirituality and grown up a lot, despite the kiss which was hardly anything. However you being a hardcore janet fan, aren't gonna admit to janet's sluttiness so why bother an argument. Janet's 38 now? Madonna was grown up by 38 and learned to keep her clothes on. Janet is trying to compete with Britney and Christina with sex, while Madonna can sell out her tour with absolutely no sexuality involved. I really hate to burst your bubble here, but the Super Bowl sh*t was a mistake that went wrong. Now, if you want to believe that Janet really wanted to flash a bare breast to millions: cool. What can I say to convince you otherwise? Nothing. The woman wanted to show her bra and ended up showing her tit. Which gave people like you the license FINALLY to write-off Janet as a "slut" and give you the long-craved ammunition to downplay Janet's legacy in popular music. Trust me, before the Super Bowl, there was nothing you could say foul about Janet's image that Madonna hasn't done about 50 to a 1,000 times over. Yep, Feb. 1 done incalculable amounts of damage to Janet's image and I'm aware of that. The woman is far from "just some slut" -- to even assume just that is straight up ignorant. Yes, I have seen "All For You" world tour. I was there. I went to the tour in person and I watched it countless times. The "Would You Mind" routine was sensual, extravagant and frank, but it was all in fun. When I was at the shows, people were screaming and laughing in joy, they weren't like "ewww this sh*t is gross." They didn't walk away like, "OMG, Janet is such a f**king slut, I'm steamrolling her albums." Plus, there were parents and kids in the audience. The segment only lasted for about 7 minutes out of a 2 1/2 hour show. You're talking as if the All For You tour was akin to The Girlie Show -- far from it. As far as Madonna all of a sudden turning over a new leaf and "growing up"... I reiterate what I said in my previous post: UMM, HELLO, WHERE WERE YOU JUST LAST YEAR WHEN THE CHICK WAS PULLING A LESBIAN SPIT-SWAP WITH BRITNEY AT THE VMAS?? Let's not try to get all revisionist and make it like Madonna's just "sooo moved on" with all that sexiness... ooh, she's this refined, dignified artisté now --- please don't give me that. For the "selling out tours with no sexuality involved" comment: Janet began her career WITHOUT using sex as the primary means to push her music. The Rhythm Nation World Tour remains the largest grossing debut world tour for any solo artist (to this day) and she had no coned-bras, didn't roll around on stage, nor did she simulate masterbation scenes on a bed in lingerie. Madonna's career is primarily ladened in sex while Janet transitioned into sensuality later into her career -- there is a difference. And I'm not even going to entertain the notion that Janet, an icon, would even dare compete with any of these new chicks. Spare me. ... [Edited 9/19/04 5:04am] | |
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JANFAN4L said: I really hate to burst your bubble here, but the Super Bowl sh*t was a mistake that went wrong. Now, if you want to believe that Janet really wanted to flash a bare breast to millions: cool. What can I say to convince you otherwise? Nothing. The woman wanted to show her bra and ended up showing her tit. [Edited 9/19/04 5:04am] But there was no bra. Just red frilly material stuck to the top of the "cup". | |
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WildStyle said: JANFAN4L said: I really hate to burst your bubble here, but the Super Bowl sh*t was a mistake that went wrong. Now, if you want to believe that Janet really wanted to flash a bare breast to millions: cool. What can I say to convince you otherwise? Nothing. The woman wanted to show her bra and ended up showing her tit. [Edited 9/19/04 5:04am] But there was no bra. Just red frilly material stuck to the top of the "cup". Thank YOU! Only the die hard janet fans defend that stupid stunt she pulled off, otherwise she was doing it deliberately. She realized what Madonna did with Britney so she conveniently took Britney's ex and made a stunt with him, totally unoriginal. | |
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JANFAN4L said: jayaredee said: You must have been pretty drunk to miss Janet's little "wardrobe mishap" at the superbow, in front of children where as Madonna isn't as stupid and pulls off her stunts at an award show, where parents have the choice of letting their kids watch it. On top of that have you seen her "all for you" show? She had some guy stattled and chained to some board where she practically had sex with him, im sorry that was slutty. As a madonna fan i can admit that madonna was a slut in the past, but she has found her spirituality and grown up a lot, despite the kiss which was hardly anything. However you being a hardcore janet fan, aren't gonna admit to janet's sluttiness so why bother an argument. Janet's 38 now? Madonna was grown up by 38 and learned to keep her clothes on. Janet is trying to compete with Britney and Christina with sex, while Madonna can sell out her tour with absolutely no sexuality involved. I really hate to burst your bubble here, but the Super Bowl sh*t was a mistake that went wrong. Now, if you want to believe that Janet really wanted to flash a bare breast to millions: cool. What can I say to convince you otherwise? Nothing. The woman wanted to show her bra and ended up showing her tit. Which gave people like you the license FINALLY to write-off Janet as a "slut" and give you the long-craved ammunition to downplay Janet's legacy in popular music. Trust me, before the Super Bowl, there was nothing you could say foul about Janet's image that Madonna hasn't done about 50 to a 1,000 times over. Yep, Feb. 1 done incalculable amounts of damage to Janet's image and I'm aware of that. The woman is far from "just some slut" -- to even assume just that is straight up ignorant. Yes, I have seen "All For You" world tour. I was there. I went to the tour in person and I watched it countless times. The "Would You Mind" routine was sensual, extravagant and frank, but it was all in fun. When I was at the shows, people were screaming and laughing in joy, they weren't like "ewww this sh*t is gross." They didn't walk away like, "OMG, Janet is such a f**king slut, I'm steamrolling her albums." Plus, there were parents and kids in the audience. The segment only lasted for about 7 minutes out of a 2 1/2 hour show. You're talking as if the All For You tour was akin to The Girlie Show -- far from it. As far as Madonna all of a sudden turning over a new leaf and "growing up"... I reiterate what I said in my previous post: UMM, HELLO, WHERE WERE YOU JUST LAST YEAR WHEN THE CHICK WAS PULLING A LESBIAN SPIT-SWAP WITH BRITNEY AT THE VMAS?? Let's not try to get all revisionist and make it like Madonna's just "sooo moved on" with all that sexiness... ooh, she's this refined, dignified artisté now --- please don't give me that. For the "selling out tours with no sexuality involved" comment: Janet began her career WITHOUT using sex as the primary means to push her music. The Rhythm Nation World Tour remains the largest grossing debut world tour for any solo artist (to this day) and she had no coned-bras, didn't roll around on stage, nor did she simulate masterbation scenes on a bed in lingerie. Madonna's career is primarily ladened in sex while Janet transitioned into sensuality later into her career -- there is a difference. And I'm not even going to entertain the notion that Janet, an icon, would even dare compete with any of these new chicks. Spare me. ... [Edited 9/19/04 5:04am] Madonna never used sexuality in her tours until her 3rd tour my dear. And what's wrong with coned bras? And i realized Madonna pulled off a stunt, and i agree it was immature and unnecessary considering she had a standing ovation anyways. BUT Janet pulled off a stunt too, and im not gonna believe it was a wardrobe error.... it just doesn't work that way. The Super Bowl stunt wasn't what convinced me of Janet's slutism, it started in 93 when she released her Janet album (which i like by the way) with her boyfriends hands on her tits. And at Madonna's Girlie Show, there were kids there and they were laughing when they seen a topless dancer hanging from the bar at the top, does that make it any less risque? Was it all in good fun? Don't pull that on me, Janet is using sex to sell just like all pop female artists. And Janet is in competition with Britney whether you like it or not, i never said Britney was better than Janet. If Janet wants to stay current she has to compete with the young pop whores. | |
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jayaredee said: JANFAN4L said: I really hate to burst your bubble here, but the Super Bowl sh*t was a mistake that went wrong. Now, if you want to believe that Janet really wanted to flash a bare breast to millions: cool. What can I say to convince you otherwise? Nothing. The woman wanted to show her bra and ended up showing her tit. Which gave people like you the license FINALLY to write-off Janet as a "slut" and give you the long-craved ammunition to downplay Janet's legacy in popular music. Trust me, before the Super Bowl, there was nothing you could say foul about Janet's image that Madonna hasn't done about 50 to a 1,000 times over. Yep, Feb. 1 done incalculable amounts of damage to Janet's image and I'm aware of that. The woman is far from "just some slut" -- to even assume just that is straight up ignorant. Yes, I have seen "All For You" world tour. I was there. I went to the tour in person and I watched it countless times. The "Would You Mind" routine was sensual, extravagant and frank, but it was all in fun. When I was at the shows, people were screaming and laughing in joy, they weren't like "ewww this sh*t is gross." They didn't walk away like, "OMG, Janet is such a f**king slut, I'm steamrolling her albums." Plus, there were parents and kids in the audience. The segment only lasted for about 7 minutes out of a 2 1/2 hour show. You're talking as if the All For You tour was akin to The Girlie Show -- far from it. As far as Madonna all of a sudden turning over a new leaf and "growing up"... I reiterate what I said in my previous post: UMM, HELLO, WHERE WERE YOU JUST LAST YEAR WHEN THE CHICK WAS PULLING A LESBIAN SPIT-SWAP WITH BRITNEY AT THE VMAS?? Let's not try to get all revisionist and make it like Madonna's just "sooo moved on" with all that sexiness... ooh, she's this refined, dignified artisté now --- please don't give me that. For the "selling out tours with no sexuality involved" comment: Janet began her career WITHOUT using sex as the primary means to push her music. The Rhythm Nation World Tour remains the largest grossing debut world tour for any solo artist (to this day) and she had no coned-bras, didn't roll around on stage, nor did she simulate masterbation scenes on a bed in lingerie. Madonna's career is primarily ladened in sex while Janet transitioned into sensuality later into her career -- there is a difference. And I'm not even going to entertain the notion that Janet, an icon, would even dare compete with any of these new chicks. Spare me. ... [Edited 9/19/04 5:04am] Madonna never used sexuality in her tours until her 3rd tour my dear. And what's wrong with coned bras? And i realized Madonna pulled off a stunt, and i agree it was immature and unnecessary considering she had a standing ovation anyways. BUT Janet pulled off a stunt too, and im not gonna believe it was a wardrobe error.... it just doesn't work that way. The Super Bowl stunt wasn't what convinced me of Janet's slutism, it started in 93 when she released her Janet album (which i like by the way) with her boyfriends hands on her tits. And at Madonna's Girlie Show, there were kids there and they were laughing when they seen a topless dancer hanging from the bar at the top, does that make it any less risque? Was it all in good fun? Don't pull that on me, Janet is using sex to sell just like all pop female artists. And Janet is in competition with Britney whether you like it or not, i never said Britney was better than Janet. If Janet wants to stay current she has to compete with the young pop whores. No, she doesn't. If she wants to do shitty electro pop, then, yes, she'll have to compete with the young pop whores. | |
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The Pixies.. one of the pioneers of grunge
source of inspiration for Nirvana. | |
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Madonna never used sexuality in her tours until her 3rd tour my dear. And what's wrong with coned bras? And i realized Madonna pulled off a stunt, and i agree it was immature and unnecessary considering she had a standing ovation anyways. BUT Janet pulled off a stunt too, and im not gonna believe it was a wardrobe error.... it just doesn't work that way. The Super Bowl stunt wasn't what convinced me of Janet's slutism, it started in 93 when she released her Janet album (which i like by the way) with her boyfriends hands on her tits. And at Madonna's Girlie Show, there were kids there and they were laughing when they seen a topless dancer hanging from the bar at the top, does that make it any less risque? Was it all in good fun? Don't pull that on me, Janet is using sex to sell just like all pop female artists. And Janet is in competition with Britney whether you like it or not, i never said Britney was better than Janet. If Janet wants to stay current she has to compete with the young pop whores.[/quote] Ok The Girlie Show and it's orgy... Let's look at it shall we? Express Yourself and Deeper and Deeper are done in 70's drag in party that turns into an orgy with everyone fuckin each other. The orgy turns into Why Is It So Hard... a song about minorites and women have to stuggle to be accpeted in society. As the song progesses the dancers, guitar player, bass player, and Donna and Niki walk into a Bright Light and dissapear. This secition concludes with a Speech about HIV/AIDS and her tribute to Martin Burgoyne and Christopher Flynn her best friend and Dance instructor who died of AIDS. Yes Madonna uses sex but she uses it to make people think. I love Janet but have yet to see her get beyond just using Sex You CANNOT use the name of God, or religion, to justify acts of violence, to hurt, to hate, to discriminate- Madonna
authentic power is service- Pope Francis | |
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