It just appears the 'obvious' response here: Prince's transition from the artistic to the commercial when considering the Prince-inspired LOVESEXY epiphany, in comparison to the financially lucrative BATMAN era.

Do you sense he went into the studio with the emphasis on making a commercially sounding record to appeal the masses, and in the process, save himself from financial ruin?

I don't exactly hear it when I listen to the music, even though the association with the movie was clearly going to give the music the most accessible audience. To an 11 year old boy, BATDANCE sounded like nothing else out there, much like his other great records such as When Doves Cry and Sign 'O' The Times. Besides, the rest of the album was not anywhere near as deliberate in its pop sensitivities as tracks from earlier albums such as Rasberry Beret or Take Me With You or U Got The Look.

Why, then, does BATMAN receive the 'sell-out' tag? Disliking the music is one thing but thinking the BATMAN era signified the start of Prince becoming a fat cat is another matter entirely. Or are the two connected, perhaps incorrectly so?

Perhaps for most people, there will always be the attachment of the album to the movie. Understandably so. The only songs I really relate to the movie are "Batdance" and "Partyman" (well at the begining of it anyway)

"Electric Chair" and "Scandalous" (mainly) could've easily been from a non-movie related album. As well as the others I guess. I don't hink he sold out. I think he's one of the few artists who respect their music too much. And probably wouldn't have done it if he didn't feel it. Then again, I don't know Prince personally. I hardly ever associate the album with the movie when I listen to it. But now I wonder how successful the album would've been if it had not been related to the movie.










Redundant post edit!
[This message was edited Sun May 30 17:22:03 2004 by Chico319]

it wasn't a sell-out decision - it was a smart decision to make more money for his then-young paisley park label and for the films he was wanting to produce, not to mention the music he gave them was a little bit too "avant purple", for the most part, to be used in the movie. still, it worked out and the album was a hit. i think it was a perfect move. prince was a pop star at the time, and it was a winning combination. i'm very glad he made the decision - that soundtrack is one of my favorite prince albums.

Again, the overriding factor is where Prince felt he was at at the time. I don't believe he was necessarily making a "conscious decision" to push for a hit, being the intuitive character he has always been. P's involvement with the Batman soundtrack and its eventual success now looks like a fortuitous combination of factors.

Prince had been in the process of compiling tracks for tentative projects (i.e. Rave Unto The Joy Fantastic, which in turn evolved into Graffiti Bridge), when he was invited along for the ride over at Pinewood Studios, prompted by the enthusiasm of heavy hitters such as Jack Nicholson, a massive Prince fan who was intrigued by the idea of Prince getting a crack at the whip and who persuaded the big cheeses over at Warners to let Prince contribute to the movie's soundtrack, an idea they went for in a big way. Once Prince had arrived in England, he not just met film director Tim Burton (whom he got on with like a house on fire), but also his next paramour Kim Basinger, who must have provided dollops of inspiration - in and out of the studio. As it has been pointed out before, apart from a few lyrical references here and there, Prince never really went out of his way to create a special, tailor-made soundtrack that fitted the format of the Batman movie. Indeed, much of the material remained unchanged, retaining the spirit of what the original Rave project would have turned out to be (and, indeed, what Grafitti Bridge evolved into).

So, no. Hardly a question of a conscious bid on Prince's part to "sell out". Most likely, it was just a happy accident that the Batman project eventually proved to be the much needed financial shot in the arm Paisley Park needed at the time.

.

Anxiety said:

The single BATDANCE got me hooked, and the BATMAN album was the first I ever purchased by ANYONE.

Still somewhat intrigued as to what I was actually vibing off as an 11 year old?! I do remember thinking there was a lot going on in the album, and the album seemed like a movie in itself with all the characters. It was probably the Vicki Vales in the video, that was one hella cool move crawling underneath them.

Giotto said:

Do you think that taste of the financial shot afforded by the success of BATMAN, followed by the failure of the GB project to make any reasonable critical or financial impact, prompted a move towards the 'fat cat' years - D&P, VP of Warners, Symbol album etc - or again, just a happy accident?

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[This message was edited Mon May 31 4:42:41 2004 by Anji]

I agree with G on this one. The Batman albums's success was completely down to association.
From a musical standpoint, Prince wasn't conciously creating a 'mainstream' album or 'selling
out'. If the album had simply been a new Prince album, without any links to the Batman movie,
I'm sure it would 'only' have achieved similar sales (or less) to Lovesexy. It was really just very
convenient that the theme of duality (which runs through Batman) was merely an extension of
what Prince was already doing at the time (Lovesexy/Spooky Electric, Prince/Camille).

When it came to Diamonds And Pearls, Prince definitely DID have an eye for reclaiming some
chart action. But even then this desire for commercial success didn't overtly drive him to write
conciously commercial hits per se. It manifested itself more in the production values and 'icing'
on the songs rather than the songs themselves. The prime example being Gett Off, which was
originally only recorded and going to be released as a one off fun club track to celebrate his
birthday. It was only when DJ's and WB execs started raving about the track that Prince decided
he'd better make some room for it on his forthcoming album.

Hmmm, I guess creating a soundtrack, he may have had it in mind to create a commercially viable record - is this not what happened in 1984 with Purple Rain too.

I like the sound of Batman, it has a very clean, clear sound throughout - and I think it's synth-heavy sound, some people may see as making it a commercial / plastic sounding LP.

I think it is a natural progression of the Lovesexy sound though, if you listen to Escape, you can hear the connection between the Batman and Lovesexy sounds.

giotto said:

My stupid ass isn't familiar with the phrase "like a house on fire" - does that mean that they got along well? I remember being really disappointed when I read a quote years later from Tim Burton (one of my favs) saying that he wished he hadn't used Prince's music in the movie, because it "dated" it.

I think to an extent Prince did sell out during the Batman era. Perhaps to a large extent this was down to the repercussions of Lovesexy. Largely down to the cover art of Lovesexy, the album wasn't universally recieved particularly in the US where the album sold poorly by Prince's standards and only reaching No. 11 in the US album charts. Indeed, many media outlets reviewed the cover sleeve rather than the music! Prince said of Lovesexy, 'either you went with it and had a mind blowing experience or you didn't'. Thus, with mixed opinion on the album, one can speculate and suggest that Prince wanted to regain commercial success. Batman being the big budget movie that it was/is went someway to helping Prince achieve that.

It would be also fair to suggest that Prince sold out due to supposed financial difficulties at the time. Despite excellent revenue from Controversy Music a combination of falling record sales, the expense of the Lovesexy tour and the newly opened Paisley Park which at that point hadn't spawned any hits further strengthens the argument that Prince sold-out in that he would be rewarded handsomely for Batman.

Further still, a soundtrack album would be like meat and drink to a talented musical artist such as Prince. All he needed to do was read the script, view the film and write music based on what he wrote and saw. Easy in the sense that everyone knows what Batman is basically about! In this sense I think to a degree Batman suffers creatively because of this. Prince was creating music which wasn't entirely based on his own ideas. Added to this, he could of just as easily plucked several tracks from the Paisley Park vaults which would have worked in the film.

I guess the counter argument would be there were marked occasions where Prince appeared to sell-out prior to Batman. Purple Rain being a clear example. In this case, particularly Purple Rain the song. Dr. Fink once remarked in an interview that Prince was eager to achieve mass appeal where he was previously regarded as a black market singer. So what does he go and do, write an epic rock anthem. However, Prince of cause returned with Around the World in a Day in 1985 so instead of writing Purple Rain Mark II he was again challenging his listners. Very much in the same way Dirty Mind did after Prince.
[This message was edited Mon May 31 10:13:25 2004 by JDINTERACTIVE]

I have to agree that he did not sell out for Batman or even after. Actually, I have never considered him as sold out.

I do see a big change around the time of D&P. He decided not to be solo anymore. Dropped the purple sound and added a bunch of stuff to his music, that, quite frankly, wasn't necessary. Not selling out...more of second guessing what the audience wants. Instead of giving us unbridled albums...they felt much more restrained and calculated....IMO

theblueangel said:

Blue, that phrase means they got on very well. I find it surprising that he thinks the music dated the movie; it was barely noticeable from what I remember.

BorisFishpaw said:

In some ways, I kinda wish Prince would go back to a more arrogant approach in delivering his music. When something's good, there's no mistake when it hits the dancefloor. Sending a newly crafted song out to the clubs was, and still is, a GREAT idea. Get the execs to come to you...

Anji said:

Yeah,I was really pissed off at Tim Burton's comments regarding Prince's soundtrack.He made it seem as if Warners FORCED him to include Prince songs in the movie.In my opinion,the movie was shit and Prince's music actually enlivened it.

Hold up, David. That movie was BRILLIANT!

i love the batman album! it really is one of my favorites. if you listen to the songs outside of the context of the film, they still work by themselves. that's the brilliance of the record! prince was able to capture the spirit of the film and still have his own social issues in there. he still dealt with sex, religion, drugs, etc but in a different setting. i guess the music itself was a little more "convenient" but, let's face it, it was still incredibly prince-like. its not like he went in a totally different direction with his music simply to sell a record. na, i don't think it was a sell out move.

Prince is a big fan of Batman so it's not a sellout. The Cd for
the movie was just crap though.
In my opinion the worst CD Prince has ever done.

bigsexy said:

i loved this album ! , gentlemen lets broaden our minds !