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Musicology - You're fired... I've listened to Prince struggle with the concept of funk for well over a decade and someone close to him really needs to say, "Dude (or dudette) you need to give it up.
In his quest to create the "I wannabe James Brown" sound with those tight funk grooves which are Mr. Brown's trademark, he continually comes off as weak and ineffective, mainly because, in my opinion that doe-eyed, wet-lipped style of funk he constantly regurgitates will never have the balls to carry off what he hears in his head. Testosterone injections may be a start, but his estrogen levels are way too high to let the funk out. Plus the addition of Candy "which end of this thing do I blow into" Dulfer, lends zero credibility to the idea that he can even create a band that gives funk its due. If he wants to build a band, he needs to understand the concept of synergy - the idea that a creation is greater than the sum of its parts. Miles Davis understood this. As did George Clinton, Isaac Hayes and of course, James Brown to name a few. Prince excells at synth-pop and that's where he needs to put his energy. He should leave the funk to the masters "who knows what the funk's about, yall..." | |
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I think I'm the first person to respond to your post. Let me start of by saying that you are indeed entitled to your opinion but your opinion is WRONG. Funk isn't owned by one particular artist. Funk is whatever that artist wants his/her particular Funk to be. I could go into what a musical genius Prince is and how there's no one above him nor will there ever be another like him. But you obviously already know that otherwise you wouldn't have sought out his site. The cool thing about him is he is not trying to recreate the funk of James Brown, or Stevie he would probably tell you those artists are his inspiration and forefathers. Now, I'm not sure what end of the pipe you smoked out of b4 you posted that crap, but I can tell you which end to blow it out off. I'm gonna take a break from this reply and let you go listen to Musicology again, and you come back and talk to me if some things are still unclear. SO WHAT IF WE'RE CONTROLLING ALL THE OIL, IS IT WORTH THE CHILD DYING 4?
"Don't make my daughter sound like that Prince guy!" Joseph Jackson to Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis | |
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I totally agree with this post. Prince needs to shift gears already and find a formula that will work for his benefit. "You need people like me so you can point your fuckin' fingers and say, "That's the bad guy." "
Al Pacino- Scarface | |
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SpinDoctor said: I've listened to Prince struggle with the concept of funk for well over a decade and someone close to him really needs to say, "Dude (or dudette) you need to give it up.
In his quest to create the "I wannabe James Brown" sound with those tight funk grooves which are Mr. Brown's trademark, he continually comes off as weak and ineffective, mainly because, in my opinion that doe-eyed, wet-lipped style of funk he constantly regurgitates will never have the balls to carry off what he hears in his head. Testosterone injections may be a start, but his estrogen levels are way too high to let the funk out. Plus the addition of Candy "which end of this thing do I blow into" Dulfer, lends zero credibility to the idea that he can even create a band that gives funk its due. If he wants to build a band, he needs to understand the concept of synergy - the idea that a creation is greater than the sum of its parts. Miles Davis understood this. As did George Clinton, Isaac Hayes and of course, James Brown to name a few. Prince excells at synth-pop and that's where he needs to put his energy. He should leave the funk to the masters "who knows what the funk's about, yall..." Nice post. Very provocative. I got to say I think you’re way off base. “Estrogen” and “Testosterone”? Not sure exactly how these two words relate to funk. Sly was not exactly full of testosterone and neither, for that matter, was early Funkadelic or Stevie Wonder or Earth Wind and Fire. If anything JB is in an exception and not the rule. Now even on your own terms your wrong too. Listen to the “Black Album” and tell me that his “estrogen levels are way too high to let the funk out”?? Just not right man. Not only is the “Black Album” the funkiest record of the last twenty years (and that includes everybody, JB, GC, everybody) but it’s also pulsing with testosterone. ego tripping out | |
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tuffycat
how can u start off by saying that ure entitled to an opinion but then tell them that their opinion is wrong. Is that in your opinion? Fuck the funk - it's time to ditch the worn-out Vegas horns fills, pick up the geee-tar and finally ROCK THE MUTHA-FUCKER!! He hinted at this on Chaos, now it's time to step up and fully DELIVER!!
KrystleEyes 22/03/05 | |
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spindoctor's info: Joined: May 16th 2004 Level: Member Posts: 1 so either spindoctor truly hates this CD enough to come here and join just to rip on it, or we have yet ANOTHER org-alter-ego tryina stir some stuff up. either way...whatevs... | |
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muirdo said: tuffycat
how can u start off by saying that ure entitled to an opinion but then tell them that their opinion is wrong. Is that in your opinion? Exactly, I'm like the ACLU, I may not like what you're saying, but I'll defend your right to say it to the end. SO WHAT IF WE'RE CONTROLLING ALL THE OIL, IS IT WORTH THE CHILD DYING 4?
"Don't make my daughter sound like that Prince guy!" Joseph Jackson to Jimmy Jam and Terry Lewis | |
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Let me start of by saying that you are indeed entitled to your opinion but your opinion is WRONG.
Impossible for an opinion to be wrong... Funk isn't owned by one particular artist. Funk is whatever that artist wants his/her particular Funk to be.
Absolutely true. I gave various examples of funk artist who are considered masters. I could go into what a musical genius Prince is and how there's no one above him nor will there ever be another like him.
Typically, anytime someone launches into this type of quasi-religious rethoric, I discount what they have to say by half...at least... But since we're on this topic, why don't you enlighten me into the greatness of Prince with some type of qualitative evidence. Let me clear something up here. I do not hate Prince. I've listened to Prince since I first bought the Soft and Wet album when it was first released, so I do know something of what he is capable of. Additionally, I've been a Jazz Pianist for about the last 15 years...therefore I do know something of music. I will say that I'm truly disappointed with the sham that Prince still foists onto the public, starting with the album "1-800-New Funk" (although it had some good moments, but probably only because he has the good judgement to enlist the help of Bootsy Collins, Mavis Staples et. al) and which has been ongoing. If he's still searching for a voice after all this time. I think he needs to concede the battle of trying to redefine funk on his own. The cool thing about him is he is not trying to recreate the funk of James Brown
Prince's funk is not guided by James Brown...it's an attempt at direct copy with a thin veneere of originality. And musically I think he's capable of much more. Now, I do realize this is a fan board and fans get excited when someone tends to not tow the party line. If this is the type of board that cannot abide a differing opinion, I will be happy to ignore it. However, if stimulating discussion is the norm here then I can appreciate that. Tuffycat is obviously a Prince zelot and I can also appreciate that. At least he, she, it has an opinion, even though (they) have problems with other peoples... And contrary to your posting, I did not come here to simply bow down at the idol of Prince, formerly known as The Artist. I came to find out what people thought of his music. Have your moderator do his worst. 17ways, you make a good point and maybe the hormonal comments were a bit over the top. However this reflects the way Prince's music of late affects me... I do admit the Black Album had some great moments, but it is far from the expected rule that I'd want from a musician of Prince's caliber. ----- [This message was edited Sat May 22 13:03:39 2004 by SpinDoctor] | |
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No an opinion cannot be wrong-just uninformed and hard to support-which is what the Spin Doctor's opinion is.
Most likely, James Brown, George Clinton, Miles Davis, and the others he mentioned, would be among the first to dispute most of his claims about Prince in this thread. In several instances (and interviews), since Prince came on the scene, James, Miles, and George have heralded and welcomed Prince as the new torchbearer for the funk (among other music genres.) People of their stature don't tend to throw around the term "genius" often but, when talking about Prince, they do. Yes, Spin Doctor, you are entitled to your opinion. But it is weak, mainly because your reasoning is drowning in the fact that you seem to think that funk can only be put out by "a real man". I thought this attitude about Prince, from intelligent music fans, died in the 80's. Furthermore the fact that you don't believe that Prince and his band(s) know about synergy, shows that you don't know a lot about Prince. Read a review from the latest tour and you'll see that your argument is highly debatable and severely flawed. [This message was edited Sat May 22 14:07:22 2004 by skywalker] [This message was edited Sat May 22 14:22:08 2004 by skywalker] "New Power slide...." |
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SpinDoctor said: Plus the addition of Candy "which end of this thing do I blow into" Dulfer, lends zero credibility to the idea that he can even create a band that gives funk its due. i hope you did see her perform because she IS funky. yes SIR! | |
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SpinDoctor said: I've listened to Prince since I first bought the Soft and Wet album when it was first released...
You are disqualified. |
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TheBigBang said: SpinDoctor said: I've listened to Prince since I first bought the Soft and Wet album when it was first released...
You are disqualified. I've been listening to Prince since I bought the When Doves Cry album. [This message was edited Sat May 22 14:31:25 2004 by skywalker] "New Power slide...." |
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You all got points here, there's something apparent about Prince wanting to inherit the mantle of Funk and something which misses...
Hey don't diss on Candy though she can be funky, I'm more perturbed that from what people tell me Prince for all his "Musicology"rap aint making use of the real funk through Maceo, seems like there's some third alto player he has besides Candy and Maceo who is more smooth Jazz and more of the smooth than the jazz, ... never mind Greg Boyer who's worked with Parliament and Maceo... so much for musicology... and where is Eric Leeds ???? this is also an ongoing discussion on this site about what Funk is, however what Prince seems to be doing is greatest hits not funk, sadly... a couple of British papers were more dismissive of the album than the US seems to be, and one of the points made was that it aint all it could be that Prince didn't really make use of Maceo, which he did on Pretty Man... I am seeing Prince less and less as a Funk artist though and really more and more as Pop star... | |
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FelixtheCat said: You all got points here, there's something apparent about Prince wanting to inherit the mantle of Funk and something which misses...
Hey don't diss on Candy though she can be funky, I'm more perturbed that from what people tell me Prince for all his "Musicology"rap aint making use of the real funk through Maceo, seems like there's some third alto player he has besides Candy and Maceo who is more smooth Jazz and more of the smooth than the jazz, ... never mind Greg Boyer who's worked with Parliament and Maceo... so much for musicology... and where is Eric Leeds ???? this is also an ongoing discussion on this site about what Funk is, however what Prince seems to be doing is greatest hits not funk, sadly... a couple of British papers were more dismissive of the album than the US seems to be, and one of the points made was that it aint all it could be that Prince didn't really make use of Maceo, which he did on Pretty Man... I am seeing Prince less and less as a Funk artist though and really more and more as Pop star... wanting to inherit the mantle of funk???? He already did along time ago and has moved on.... "New Power slide...." |
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TheBigBang said: SpinDoctor said: I've listened to Prince since I first bought the Soft and Wet album when it was first released...
You are disqualified. Yeah, you're right, sorry... It's been a long time. "For you..." ----- [This message was edited Sat May 22 17:46:19 2004 by SpinDoctor] | |
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Prince is as close to funk as some can get...I think he has the right formula. He's doing well combining that with the pop scene & everything else, that's the way his music has always has been & he's a master at that. [This message was edited Sat May 22 17:50:18 2004 by Starmist7] | |
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Mutiny. Housquake. Lets work. You do as I say | |
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No matter what you think of Musicology, Candy is legit.  Check out The Mountains and the Sea, a Prince podcast by yours truly and my wife. More info at https://www.facebook.com/TMATSPodcast/ |
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To say that Prince doesn't understand funk is like saying the Pope doesn't understand the bible. | |
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SpinDoctor said: I've listened to Prince struggle with the concept of funk for well over a decade and someone close to him really needs to say, "Dude (or dudette) you need to give it up.
In his quest to create the "I wannabe James Brown" sound with those tight funk grooves which are Mr. Brown's trademark, he continually comes off as weak and ineffective, mainly because, in my opinion that doe-eyed, wet-lipped style of funk he constantly regurgitates will never have the balls to carry off what he hears in his head. Testosterone injections may be a start, but his estrogen levels are way too high to let the funk out. Plus the addition of Candy "which end of this thing do I blow into" Dulfer, lends zero credibility to the idea that he can even create a band that gives funk its due. If he wants to build a band, he needs to understand the concept of synergy - the idea that a creation is greater than the sum of its parts. Miles Davis understood this. As did George Clinton, Isaac Hayes and of course, James Brown to name a few. Prince excells at synth-pop and that's where he needs to put his energy. He should leave the funk to the masters "who knows what the funk's about, yall..." That's just silly. He is certainly capable of producing high quality funk. I think what you detect is in fact a genre shift in the continuing evolution of an artist whose greatest strength, and fundamental genius, is not found in the synth-pop you describe but his ability to blend styles. To paraphrase Joni Mitchell, his hybrid nature is responsible for his brilliance. I don't believe he could have achieved what he has without being a girly-man, a nut, and an egomaniac, among other things. Conversely, I would posit that this is also his greatest weakness and responsible in part for his particularly erratic and deeply unfocused work of the recent past. Musicology is not his greatest work, but is his most solid in an age. To judge it as a coherent body of "funk", (despite the references in the title track), does not make sense because that is not what it is. | |
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SpinDoctor said: Plus the addition of Candy "which end of this thing do I blow into" Dulfer, lends zero credibility to the idea that he can even create a band that gives funk its due. DON'T YOU DARE SLAM Candy!  Check it out ...Shiny Toy Guns R gonna blowup VERY soon and bring melody back to music..you heard it here 1st! http://www.myspacecomment...theone.mp3 | |
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 [This message was edited Sun May 23 4:14:50 2004 by mellowDEEkOOL]  
get yo house in order! | |
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Mazerati said: SpinDoctor said: Plus the addition of Candy "which end of this thing do I blow into" Dulfer, lends zero credibility to the idea that he can even create a band that gives funk its due. DON'T YOU DARE SLAM Candy! 
get yo house in order! | |
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Are you saying women can't be funky becuz there testosterone levels are not high enough?
Anyway to say what Prince does best is synthpop I believe is wrong. Synthpop could be used to categorize his work pre-Purple Rain, but Kiss, Housequake, 1+1+1=3,and even I,C,P&C don't strike me as synthpop. They are all straight funk. Prince may not be a master of all musical genres but I think funk is one he has covered. Furthermore, I think Musicology just shows that Prince can still make a hit album in his sleep. Is it his greatest work...probably not. But what it is is a damn good album thats enjoyable to listen to. I don't think its a an album that challenges the listener ala TRC, but it is a fun album and I know I enjoy it. when the melting pot stirs how we gonna take it?
when u can't tell him from her how u gonna fake it? | |
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SpinDoctor said: Prince excells at synth-pop and that's where he needs to put his energy.
I'm sorry mate, but you obviously know squat about synthpop. "Synthpop" is a subgenre of gothic / industrial music and Prince sure as hell isn't a goth.  | |
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Prince is rarely true funk. Come on. His funk is like funk light. He has very few actual funk songs. He has no bottom in there. Musicology is not even close to funk. | |
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EvilWhiteMale said: I totally agree with this post. Prince needs to shift gears already and find a formula that will work for his benefit.
----- You still think people on this board care about your opinion. You and this guy need to get off of the crack. | |
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DiamondGirl said: Prince is rarely true funk. Come on. His funk is like funk light. He has very few actual funk songs. He has no bottom in there. Musicology is not even close to funk.
----- Okay none of the stuff he wrote for The Time was funky, None of the Madhouse stuff is funky. Nothing on Controversy on 1999 is funky. I guess the Come cd was not a tribute to funk. Please tell us what type of drugs you have been using. | |
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laurarichardson said: EvilWhiteMale said: I totally agree with this post. Prince needs to shift gears already and find a formula that will work for his benefit.
----- You still think people on this board care about your opinion. You and this guy need to get off of the crack. If you don't care about my opinion, don't respond to it. Can you resist, or are you so in love with me? "You need people like me so you can point your fuckin' fingers and say, "That's the bad guy." "
Al Pacino- Scarface | |
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