All right I read the book ...and like popeye said "I stands alls I can stands and I can't stands no more" so here goes
Dear Mr. Hahn,
What's wrong with this book u wrote? Rise and fall, huh? I don't consider selling out major arenas across the country as a fall, if so I'd hate to see where he fell from. The last time I checked Musicology was a top ten album. Not bad for a "fallen popstar". I"m not a JW,but damn if TRC wasn't a brilliant album. As I recall most people thought SOTT was "experimental" at the time too. Now it's considered by many to be one of his best. Please do some research before publishing a book(ie. Kiss was on the Hits, The Edge is the guitarist for U2) I know most of this has probably been stated before I just needeed to get it off my chest!!

Thanks

thepurpleaxxe said:

i posted this before, and i'll repost. You "possessed" haters are so biased and so trapped in your prince world, you fail to realise his larger impact taken within the context of popular music as a whole. You love to talk out of both sides of your mouth saying "I don't consider selling out major arenas across the country a fall" but then easily dismiss the huge decline in record sales as irrelevent because the music was still great. You can't have it both ways!!! Here's what I said before:

Ok, I read possessed and actually really enjoyed it. I think a lot of orgers can't get past the title (The rise and fall of Prince) and Alex does seem to have a bias towards what Prince songs or eras are best. However, that being said, I think you truly get a lot of insight on the ever elusive purple one and really learn a lot about him as a person and his character and interactions with friends, girlfriends, bandmates, and business partners as well as his recording process and music.

So i picked up DMSR, which everyone says is "great and much better than that piece of shit possessed", and i must dissagree. I found DMSR very interesting from a historical perspective, it really documents his recording career and puts things in a great chronological perspective, but i really didin't learn much about prince and found it quite dry.

I'm a fan of both books, but I really believe possessed is the more interesting read and can't get over all the haters on this site. Prince fans are so loyal that it really kills them that Alex points out a fact, there was a decling in Princes career in terms of cultural impact, significance, and comercial success.

That being said, i truly enjoyed a lot of 90's prince, but realistically, he wasn't very successful outside of his loyal hardcore fan base and the music fell on deaf ears and undeniably, the 80's records were better both artistically and comercially

I do disagree with alex about the prince comeback, i actually love musicology!

Commercially speaking Prince did fall through the mid to late 90's, I dont see how anyone can argue with that.

bkw said:

...nobody can...

I personally think that the "Fall of Prince" in the title of the book implies more than a decline in record sales. It was probably just used to make the book seem more tantalizing or interesting.

All I know is I've watched enough Behind the Music to know that when I hear of someones "fall", I expect to hear about one of the cast of Different Strokes or somebody along those lines.

As far as artistic merit, that's truly subjective.

What's wrong with this book u wrote? Rise and fall, huh? I don't consider selling out major arenas across the country as a fall, if so I'd hate to see where he fell from.


uh, i dont know if you knwo this but the book came out abit ago, when basically prince was selling fuck all. i mean, i think it came out before NEWS, and we know how little that sold (obviously it wasnt meant to be a big seller but every album was selling to his fanbase and it was dwindling fast)

i know what you mean, but from a commercial point prince DID fall, he still produced great stuff in my opinion, but alex hahn himself said he'd love to write the follow up the rise of prince. so we'll see what happens there! poor sod wrote the book then within 6 months prince was huge again! maybe prince read the book and got pissed off!!!

The whole problem with Hahn is the fact that his book is written to smear Prince for the whole Uptown fiasco.The book has no "new" information for die hard fans.At times it appears that Hahn is reaching for information then makes it up.

On a scale of one to ten ,I'll give it a 5.

muleFunk said:

You know, i guess i'm not a die hard psycho prince fan, cause i found a lot of new info in possessed. I really enjoyed this book. I am so far from a newbie, hell, i saw P on the purple rain tour, then picked up 1999 and controversey, bought AWIAD, Parade right when they all came out, even got Crystal Ball as soon as it was released, and i really loved this book. For someone who had never read a book on P B4, and admitadely didn't follow him as closely in the 90's, i really enjoyed this. I guess if you have followed every aspect of his career for the past 25 years, you don't need to read it, but i found it a great first read for someone that went from being a childhood serious fan, to an adult serious fan

Biographies will always be controversial unless it's written by the celeb or authorised by them. I found the book to be insightful.

S7

I agree with what someone said earlier. The title "rise and fall" seems to suggest that something more dire happened to Prince. Like he became a crackhead or entered a mental institution or moved to the Sudan to wander the desert in a sack of cloth. Every human being who creates "sucessfull" popular music has a commercial peak. Hahn by his title seems to want to convey some horrible tragedy where none exists. Prince simlpy left the mainstream to follow his muse, no tragedy there. That some folks couldn't be bothered hunting down his work just says they weren't sufficiently engaged (for whatever reasons) to make the effort, again no tragedy there. Can anyone of u imagine someone putting out a book say the "rise and fall of Meryl Streep"? Now here is a exceptionally talented academy award winning actress whose career isn't nearly as "hot" as it was. However she keeps chugging along with good parts here and there. No one would have the audacity to term her "rise and fall" to sum up her career. Hahn had an axe to grind and it starts with the title. Anyone who can't see that just doesn't want too.

Hey Alex, here are a few suggestions for your next page-turner:


"The Rise and Fall of Santana"

"The Rise and Fall of Tina Turner"

"The Rise and Fall of Bonnie Raitt"

"The Rise and Fall of Aerosmith"


If anyone has the qualifications to write a "where are they now" about these lost icons, I know it's you.

Peace, David

roodboi said:

and more importantly...no one really cared. As Prince was 'Declining' so was musicianship on the charts. Ofcourse he fell in the 90's, by the time he was 'gone',lipsynching and producers whom couldn't tell the difference between the white keys and the black ones on a piano dominated. Also Rap started as a genre to dominate in a negative, degrading and offensive way. It was a sad time in general for music.

my 3 cents

thepurpleaxxe said:

When's YOUR book coming out ?

TheBluePrince said:

[This message was edited Fri May 21 7:50:02 2004 by freakyfeet]

livewire said:

And this is primarily the problem I have with Hahn. Why pick on Prince when even so-called superstars like Madonna and even MJ "fell" somewhat during the 1990's? The 1990's were not all that kind to the 80's Pop Icons, anyway. The emergence of gansta rap and grunge did create a backlash against 80's musicians. To point to Prince as an example might be warranted, but a little unfair when so many other artists actually DID fall. Now if he were to change the title to something like: "The Rise and Fall of the *Commercial* Prince," I would be more inclined to agree. On a purely commercial level, Prince DID "fall." His story is a bit more complex because you have the WB fiasco, which really did cause somewhat of a decline in artistic excellence, but I wish people would tell the whole story. Those were the "dark years," so to speak. When you feel trapped in a situation, do you really give it your all? I wouldn't think so...

thepurpleaxxe said:

Hey I second your post....I don't know how we are supposed belief all this fly on the wall info as facts when he can't get simple facts right. This guy obviously had an agenda. My point is this: I'm sure there alot of the negative stuff that is true in that book, but it gets tedious and tiresome when he misses on a lot of basic stuff. His credabilty is shit-with the Uptown fiasco (I love when he slips in that he was the lawyer representing them never expanding on how the book was made, I'm sure he was a Prince biographer/fan before that case<---SARCASM) and his knowledge of music was so short sighted an uneducated it was exhausting. I read it, and didn't buy it on principal.

Nero

TheBluePrince said:

I totally agree with you.

I also learned new things while reading "Possessed," and without sounding like I'm making some kind of attack, I think any smart reader can sort the wheat from the chaff and notice when an author is editorializing or reaching or sharing an opinion. The fact is, he involved people who really knew Prince when he wrote the book!

The true test is...are you so fickle that one book either enrages you because it's not all positive or -- even worse -- that you would give up on Prince because this book made him to look too negative for you to remain a fan? C'mon...

If Hahn's book was causing fans to turn away from Prince, that'd be another story. But I doubt that's the case.

And be honest...is there anyone here who, during the days in the 90s, didn't get frustrated with having to defend your boy to others or even, just once, think to yourself, "stop being so CRAZY, man"??? Most of us had one of those experiences, I'll bet...

Long story short, the book is what it is. As a major fan of Prince, I'm glad I read it. I don't think any less of Prince because of it, either.

Keith/Kacey

Here's an idea...

Let's not keep this piece of toilet paper alive, and flush it by killing this thread!

This guy clearly has a negative agenda, and anyone who calls 'The Rainbow Children' album "lite jazz", knows nothing about music, which is what Prince is all about.

Peace.

G.

Why do some fans take it so personal.

'The Rise & Fall of Prince' - He rose to fame and commercial success in the 80s and declined in the 90s - simple as - fact.

Deal with it, it doesn't impact on your love of the art, or does it?

muleFunk said:

I believe Hahn when he says he's a fan. Why? Because I've felt the same things about Prince for the last decade, at least, and I'm a fan. I don't care about how many albums he sells, but the artistic input has "fall"-en, no doubt, since Lovesexy. Of course, each album since has had its gems, but the level of artistic experimentation and daring hasn't been there in a while (still isn't there). It's been since Lovesexy that P came out with an album that was nothing like anything I'd heard before.
Of course, no one can be expected to maintain creativity like we saw from him in the 80's. It was sheer brilliance. But, give Hahn credit for making a valid point. Some "orgers" can't stand to hear any criticism.

Why pick on Prince when even so-called superstars like Madonna and even MJ "fell" somewhat during the 1990's? ...[/quote]


Maybe Hahn felt Prince had farther to fall than those two.

Giovanni777 said:

I know a little bit about music, and jazz in particular. The "jazz" parts of TRC struck me as lite jazz, too. The horn players he uses do not really solo in an interesting way. Prince isn't a jazz artist and he doesn't need to dabble in it just to prove some point about his protean abilities. I've followed Prince down most of the roads he's taken, and felt enriched by the experience. But, don't rip Hahn for making a sensible observation. He's not alone.

I believe Hahn when he says he is a fan as well, just as Uptown's crew were/are fans .

But when the lawsuit occured the attitude changed (rightfully so) and a different tone came from the magazine.You cannot have objectivity if you are that close to a lawsuit.


Everyone talks about Lovesexy but few Americans bought the album. The love show by fans now does not match the sales of the album.

jfs said:

No, it's not lite-jazz. That is obvious. Any self-respecting music listener would know that. Lite-jazz is a distinctly different genre of music to anything on TRC. Prince just does jazz-inflected music of varying styles- soul, gospel, blues, funk. If you don't think it's jazz there's no need to be negative - you're right. Does it sound like straight jazz (whatever that would mean) is what Prince is trying to achieve? No.

Just because there's no Coltrane-esque ferocious horn playing doesn't mean it's not worth listening to. I'm not sure why some keep saying "it's not jazz" as if that's a terrible thing, when it's bloody obvious it's not jazz and seems not to have been intended as such.

It is what it is, but it ain't lite jazz. Better to try not to define it I guess and just listen to it. Either u like it or u don't at the end of the day, that's all that really matters.

Anyways, why is the term 'jazz' brought up about TRC so often when it's probably more of a funk album than anything? It seems the album has been given the tag of 'the jazz album' by those who don't like it, when really it's just a diverse collection of songs like any Prince album.

The instrumentation on TRC is the best of any P album by the way. Closest album to real music for real musicians and all that nonsense.

Dear Alex,
Why did you write that book. I can't get to sleep at night anymore. Boo hoo..
Sincerely,
ThePurpleaxxe


Dear Purpleaxxe,
Please read my book next time instead of flipping through it in a rage at the bookstore.
Keep reading!
Love
Alex Hahn