I find it a bit odd that some expect Prince to be as raw as he was in 1980. I think half of the interesting thing about Prince is watching him evolve from year to year. The fact that he releases roughly an album a year provides amazing insight into where he is in his life. Most people I know in their 30's and 40's have told me that when you reach a certain age you start ask the big questions and start searching for "the Truth" so to speak. So why is it so astounding that Prince would do this rather than stay in a 20 something year old mind set?
Dirty Mind is the bomb, but don't get it wrong Prince is still sexy.

skywalker said:

well said. The irony is that if prince was coming out with songs about head and doing it all night now people would accuse him of being 'mutton dressed as Lamb' or a 'dirty old man'.

I can't speak for all members, but his days of being sexually explicit can be put behind him for all I care. But don't perform those songs at all, if you are going to change the lyrics.

He tells his fans all the time to "get out of the past," "I hope you didn't come to get your Purple Rain on..." etc. Why does he say these things to the fans, but then turns around and plays all his old stuff? Does he feel the need to "sell out" to a new generation? Why is it ok for him go back to the past and "clean-up" his songs? Just cause they're his songs, doesn't make it right to change words we're all accustomed to. He will feel the backlash eventually. For someone who is trying to stay in the game, doesn't seem like a wise move to me.

His "wisdom" doesn't seem to be very wise, when he is preaching against his fan base and their lifestyle or choice of beliefs. I think that is the hard time everyone is dealing with.

He is simply alienating his older fans with "wisdom" and "truth" that we don't agree with. Just my opinion, but that is what I am having a hard time dealing with.

LovesexyIsThe1 said:

I hear you. And that's where I separate the art from the artist. I don't have to sign off on all of his "truths of the day" to enjoy his work and his energy. I for one just tune out the JW influenced narration and jam out on TRC.

But I also agree with the original poster that Prince should be allowed to grow and yes it is cool that he's basically made an album a year so we all have a little record of where he's been. That's one of the things I love about him!

We have to accept that he will keep doing that even if he goes some places we don't like!!

krebsne said:

Prince needs to continue to not worry about alienating his fans. Did he worry asbout alienatiing his "I wanna b UR lover" teen audience by releasing "Dirty Mind"? Did he worry about alienating his "Purple Rain" masses with "Around the World in a Day"? Did he worry about alienating his fans with a black and white french film? Nude album cover? Changing his name to a symbol and performing only new material? No. He didn't.

Also, he is not trying to stay in the game. He IS in the game and in many ways above it. Look how effortlessly he dropped in to headline the Grammy's. I get the feeling that Prince can pretty much pick and choose when he gets media coverage after the last two months. It seems like just a matter of if he wants to go to LA or NYC or not.

skywalker said:[quote]

krebsne said:

TOO SEXY! u're right Skywalker! U get it!

I guess we wouldn't mind so much if the new music didn't suck as much dick as it does.

Great topic, and skywalker, you hit the nail on the head.Prince is not trying to get in the game, Prince is the game. Can you smell the funk?

skywalker said:

EXACTLY! The best Prince is fearless Prince. Afterall what are people asking him to do around here? Basically to be afraid. To be afraid of THEM. "If he doesn't do what he used to do we'll stop supporting him..." they cry. Well fine. STOP SUPPORTING HIM THEN. Its a free country.

Some of us actually enjoy the ride- bumps and all!!

I also like the poster who said Prince was in many ways "above" the game. Right on. Do what you wanna do Prince! That's your job as an ARTIST.

Evil- you crack me up!

EvilWhiteMale said:

But it doesn't in many people's opinion. If you want 1981 go listen to Controversy. I totally understand what you are saying and that's cool. However, hear this-I've been hearing people say his new stuff sucks ever since after Purple Rain. The only thing people have been saying about Prince for a longer time is "isn't he gay?"

LovesexyIsThe1 said:

That was for ONA. ONA had a purpose, and "Purple Rain" wasn't a part of it. Musicology has a different purpose.



That's exactly why he has every right. They're his songs.


I don't think he's preaching against his fan base so much as he's just stating his own beliefs. One's beliefs will almost always conflict with another's. It's called perspective.

krebsne said:

I try.

skywalker said:

But even a lot of fans hate his new stuff. I know quite a few Prince fans (outside of the org) who are disgusted by his material over the past years.

Change is hard to take..

And yes it is true, as you get wiser the old stuff doesn't seem to matter as much..

You never forget that it is what made you the person that you have become. Ones priorities change.

We all grow. It's life.

The only problem I have ever had with it is when he comes out against the strength of his youth. I'm 34 and certainly worlds away from who I was at 21. But I don't look back at the strength of that period in my life, discovering who I was and claiming it and turn around and bash it because I'm now older and in a different place.

I was happy to hear him say that he was following his spirit, when explaining some of the things he did in his youth (at the LA press conference). As long as he doesn't disparage the time in his life where he led and didn't follow, I have no problem with his personal growth.

It's not Hard at all cause I still love all his music. No, it's hard to fathom that I didn't get to go to bed with him when he still was fooling around with Girlies in such a Wild Way...But still I'd take him anyway he wants it. He owns me and he owns my Meow. A willing Slave ??? Hell yeah...Anytime anyplace for him.

OdysseyMiles said:

No offense, but it is obvious that some people on the org, are not artists.

When you create something, you will get in return what you give out. The need to create, is the need to be accepted. That's just a blatent fact that has been for all time... since the beginning of time.

You can't tell someone that you are going to take them to Disneyland, then once they're in the car, you take them to the zoo instead. Someone in that car is going to get pissed. Prince has basically pulled us in with his cool music, and now he's changing the tune, the soul of his craft. People will abandon him. He's on the road to washed out, 80's star whether anyone likes it or not.

Yes he has the right to believe differently, to change his lyrics, but as long as he his happy with the consequences he creates for himself, i.e. all alone with no fan base, then more power to him.

Get back to your artistic roots Prince. Create the art that will make positive and uniting statements, not create division amongst the ones who built Paisley Park. That is artistic suicide to me.

great thread. Thing is listen to Evilwhitemales point. If the songs were 'world class' in mould of what we know what he can do then swearing , explicit sex etc would not be an issue. I just , after 2 years of resisting, bought my 1st White Stripes cd [Elephant] and simply put there's nothing explicit, no swearing etc just raw grooves , great musicianship and some great lyrics. If Prince released a track like 'Ball and Biscuit' which is too cool to be true then we wouldn't give a shit about his new mature self.
Whilst I love the Jazz Funk phase from TRC onwards i am yearning for a Song / Album now that will consolidate all this new found popularity. What was unique about the 80's was his ability to put out singles that were totally different from anything else yet they still got airplay and appealed to the masses and he was seen as cool. But this time round with changing tastes and a lot safer radio programming he has to play the game and perhaps deliver another compromise CD like Rave with bits to keep us happy, bits to keep a label happy , bits to keep radio happy etc.
I hope that above else he is happy with who he is and he keeps putting out music. If nothing else its never boring!.

LovesexyIsThe1 said:

No offense taken, but you are somethin' else . I said what I said because I am an artist!! I've been an artist all my life. And as an artist, I discovered that you have to go your own way. Whether this person agrees with it, or that person does not.

Who said that? Freud?? That may be why some express themselves artistically, but such a broad generalization seems so unfair to me.
People who want commercial success may feel a need for acceptance, but a true artist will make their expression and be happy with it, whether the public likes it or not. Look at Marvin Gaye, Sade, Bjork, Kurt Cobain.

EvilWhiteMale said:

Digusted huh? Like I said-People have been saying new Prince music sucks since they heard "Around the World in a Day". Hell, it's not even limited to just Prince. How many times have you heard someone say about a band/musician/singer. "Yeah, I like their older stuff." People often have a hard time with change.

LovesexyIsThe1 said:

I think more than anything these past moths have gone to show that Prince is much farther away from being an 80's washed up has been than many people had thought. A vast majority of the articles on the Rock Hall of Fame stated that Prince was the only one inducted who is still vital and relevant.

Also, he is not trying to stay in the game. He IS in the game and in many ways above it. Look how effortlessly he dropped in to headline the Grammy's. I get the feeling that Prince can pretty much pick and choose when he gets media coverage after the last two months. It seems like just a matter of if he wants to go to LA or NYC or not.[/quote]

Right! He did say in the"Tavis" interview that the people in charge of the Grammys were "hounding him every year 2 do something".

skywalker said:

" can't understand all the things people say
Controversy
Am black or white? am straight or gay?
Controversy...

can't understand human curiousity
Controversy
Was it good 4 U? Is it what U wanted me 2 B?
Controversy"

There are two things going on with Prince recently, but it's easy to get them mixed up.

The first is that he has stopped playing his racier stuff and has censored a lot of songs to some degree.

The second thing going on is the JW-influenced songs and his preaching during live performances.

The latter seems to be the hardest for us to cope with, yet the latter has only been a temporary phase which has passed for now.

We need to separate these issues, because the fact is that Prince is playing some mighty fine music right now, and it isn't clouded by his cynical religious preaching. He is at a peak and we should be enjoying the ride.

EvilWhiteMale said:

ZZZ...Yawn...Typical...This is the kind of boring, crass, mindless generalization that we get from Bart and other perpetual "back-lookers", who seem to desperately want it to be 1984, and who have spent the last 20 years waiting and complaing.

Just what does "the new music" refer to? Is that just this year, five years ago, or ever since you decided everything sucked, which seems to be decades? "New music" is an easy out for critics...

This orignal thread post is so right... People are capable of responding to songs about sex, masturbation, and the like, and can easily deal with cursing and bathroom-wall poetry, but when it comes to dealing with spiritual issues, and seraching for more meaning in life, all the open minds start slamming shut.

Prince has grown as a person, and has shown an ability to change perspective, consider new answers, and to not act is if he is a teenager when he's not, while still being happy and funky in the process.

A pity many fans can't do the same...

jpav said:

CO MUTHAPHUKIN SIGN BABY!! The point of life is to evolve and mature, not perfect adolesence!!

What's this mean to you?

"Mind your own muthafucka, let a man be a man."

I assume that includes being able to change your own lyric to "mind your own brotha..."

Sywalker said:

I don't see anything wise about "putting women in their place." I could list many other examples of Prince's current beliefs that I find to be anything BUT wise, as a matta o' fact.

EvilWhiteMale said:

You really think it's as good as a blowjob?

"Wise" isn't exactly a word I'd use about Prince. He has yet to prove that he has any common business sense at all.

Still, I like that he recently seem to have been trying to patch up with his gay fanbase. I hope 2004 will be a good year to be a Prince fan, but mostly because I'm hoping for some new, good ol' Purple Rain era stuff in connection with it's anniversary.

Because like Prince (in Musicolgy), I sometimes do miss the feeling music gave me back in the day.