In business you must fall a few times until you learn how to walk. Nobodys perfect so I'm not asking if he's a perfect businessman just if he is or has been a good business man.

Is prince a good business man?

no. honestly. he's got the potential to be one, but somethin ain't clickin with the brotha.

if he is a good businessperson i am the high priest of sri-lanka

well, i say he is a good artist, and to be a good artist sometimes you have to have complete control of the business aspect of it. i think he does okay as a business man. he makes plenty of money on that awful website of his, his ugly apparal that he sells, etc. he must be doing something right.

also, by owning his publishing rights, he probably makes more money now then he did when he was selling more albums.

When referring to Prince's art, I've heard a lot of obsessive fans use the phrase; 'Let the baker bake the bread'.

I use the same phrase when it comes to running businesses. Let the businessmen run the businesses. Prince is a musical genius whom no-one can touch. However, when it comes to running a business, it's becoming more and more apparent that he's got no idea.

NO!

DOPEE said:

Does the Pope shit in the woods?

Musician...the best to ever pick up an instrument.

Business man...oh HELL no!!!

He likely has more money than most of us put together so he's doing something right. But what he has probably can be exploited a lot better. Maybe he feels too much business kills the music...who knows. Maybe he has nobody that he fully trusts to run his business affairs? I dunno...

Prince and good business sense are like parallel lines - destined never to meet.

A great musician..

a crap of a business man.. he sucks and blows donkey nuts that have been laying in dirt for 4 months with crusty saliva stuck to the rim.

Sdldawn said:

That might be taking it a bit far, besides he's got more money than all of you broke muhfuckas! He must be doing something right or kinda right

sinisterpentatonic said:

Give it time my naive friend...

Is a good businessman someone who signs a contract in good faith, and then writes "Slave" on his face because he no longer wishes to honor that contract??? I think you have much of the answer to your question right there.

But Prince is not primarily a "businessman" of course...he's an artist/performer who makes his money that way

He doesn't seem to earn much money with his other "business ventures". When he tried to own a record company with Paisley Park, it failed financially, which is in a "business" sense, which is what we are discussing.

He also tried the business of owning clubs and that failed, financially. He also opened the NPG Retail stores and they failed too.

But he doesn't have to be a good businessman to make lots of money. In fact, he has succeeded despite his poor business dealings because he is so talented that it overpowers and makes up for his "unique" style of doing business.

I'd rather him spend time writing songs than figuring out the business world, so I'm glad he focuses more on that aspect of things, and that he can afford to screw up his business dealings from time to time.

"What the fuck wrong with you, Kid??...This is a BIDNESS and you ain't too far gone to see that yet!" - Billy



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[This message was edited Mon Dec 22 23:24:40 PST 2003 by TonyC]

I would say he's both, early in his career he knew what to do to get attention, I think he does understand the business very well, I think he just doesn't care enough to try to do better. He's never been a slave to money. His ego is another factor, him and Michael are not pop musicians in terms of sales anymore, neither can accept this, like many other older artists. They still think they are bigger than they really are. To some people they are but no longer to that key demographic that puts records into the multi-platinums. Competition is another, when he did Paisley Park, I'm sure he never wanted to create another Time to deal with and personally think he intentionally sabotaged every artist after the time got so great. He once said it was like creating a monster.

I understand our friend more & more everyday.

Today, I got hit "below the belt". Even the "friendliest" music business folks remember and have a nice kiss my @$$ way of reminding you they're not there to be your friend. They exist to make $$$ off of the artist.

Oh, and... I forgot, they cut you a little check too. OOPS!
If you miss the smallest detail on agreements, you've been had. An error or typo from their end, they find some loophole to blame you.

It's a wonder Prince didn't go crazy (no pun intended) let alone stay in the game all these years. I don't know how he does it.

Prince was & is the best businessman he knows how to be. When everything is self-contained (writing, production, arranging, etc.), somehow it's very easy falling right into handling your own business. Not everyone sees your vision.


Concerning "other business ventures".. Forget the clubs, the record company and whatever else may have failed (in the public eye). What about the business we DON'T see. Perhaps he has some real estate? Perhaps he's a silent partner somewhere else. Our friend makes money in his sleep. He's not even thinking about us.

Btw, how ironic the same year Paisley Park got the axe, up & coming Maverick Records got the green light? Who/where do you think the Warner Bros.$$$ went to?



Uncanny.

This business isn't about music.. it's about who can get over on who if you not looking and still roll over and smile at you in the morning, while you try to remember what you had to drink that night, meanwhile back at the ranch.. both of you had to ride in the same vehicle to the same job that same afternoon.



Ya feel me?

Prince was pivotal in changing the music industry as we know it. The Nelly's, The JayZ's, The Ani DiFranco's wouldn't be putting out their OWN records keeping their OWN publishing & masters if Prince didn't go through the incident (SLAVE on the cheek and all!! ) in public. More frightening, he was completely alone the whole time. Other artist were too afraid to stand by him because of what it could do to their careers.

So what makes a good businessman?

After 20 years, anyone who still has a fan "meet & greet", charge everyone $1000 for a handshake & a smile... and walk away with your money with a clear conscience & a lollipop.

Prince is probably the worst business man in all of music. I'd say that's his biggest downfall actually.

The fact that anyone still cares about him is just a testament to how untouchable he was/is as an artist.

I really wish he'd let someone with more business sense run his operations, because his decisions have systematically done everything possible to kill his overall image and public profile.

Only a musical genius can get away with some of the illogical moves he's made, and it's hurt him enough as it is.

Maybe Prince just can't admit to himself that great music without the proper business model in place simply isn't enough.
[This message was edited Tue Dec 23 7:43:25 PST 2003 by PurpleKnight]

PurpleKnight said:

Amen, I agree with everything you've said. He's tried to sabotage his career with the "Slave" on the face, and the name change, etc, but his talent always won out in the end. When you see him perform live, you are still a fan even after the Crystal Ball fiasco and all the other broken promises, etc. Actually, he did such wonderful work in the 80s that he made a lot of fans for life, despite what dumb shit he does afterwards.

He certainly has done lots to hurt his career, but you've got to give him credit for building his career in the first place. Doing the Purple Rain movie was a gutsy move, but it paid off. I'm still not sure that how he markets himself as a musician reflects whether or not he is a good "businessman". I'd say the failed ancillary ventures are more telling

I think if Prince would pull his head out of his ass long enough to wipe the shit out of his eyes he could be a good business man.

of course he's a good businessman, he's rich!

There was a massive article in a Minneapolis Newspaper with the headline Purple Drain. It's in a box somewhere which if anyone is interested I can dig it out. But it was pages and pages of stories of how local contractors weren't getting paid, some even went out of business because of it. Interview with past PP employees, collaborators etc. Fascinating story even if only 1% of it was the truth.

I remember one part about rehearsing for a tour and how he said I want a bed/car/something ( I can't remember what) over here on the stage and I want it to rise up and fly across the people and come back down over here on this side of the stage. Someone said it can't be done so he fired him on the spot, another then said it can be done but not within budget, so he was fired on the spot.

familygroove said:

What's the definition of being a "good businessman"?

As far as I'm concerned it hasn't got to do a lot with being rich. What truly matters is how succesfull your business ventures are. In the case of Prince all his business ventures have turned out to be complete turds.

Well I think he has become one..since 1996! He learn the biz from past mistakes & now he is doing very well!!

I mean he gets MOST of..

* CD/DVD Sales..
* Concert Ticket Sales..
* MERCH!
* Record Albums pretty close to free!
* NPGMC $100 per (Gravy)

Since 1996 He has bought Houses in Hawaii,Canada & Spain

Not Including everything he had from 20 years of working with/for Warner Bros.

locoarts said:

What a load of crap. Shows that you care a lot about money.

It's not about how much money he personally makes, it is about how succesfull his business ventures are. They are not succesfull, not the least.

- The bigger percentage of the CD/DVD sales don't mean a thing when his sales have dropped massively and there are no advances.

- The concert ticket sales is not hard to make money from considering he doubled his prices. Then again the venues he plays have dropped in size massively as well. That's not being a good businessman, that's desperately trying to make the same as you used to by letting your fans bleed..

- Merch? Please... that's not even worth mentioning. Only the hardcore fools buy his tacky merch. He probaly loses money on i, because it cost him too much to produce it.

- "Record albums"??? "close to free"??? What are you talking about?

- NPGMC 100$. Yeah we all know about the scam the NPGMC is. Just ask the Better Business Bureau. they can tell you all about what a GOOD businessman is and what isn't. Obviously Princes fall into the latter category.

Oh yeah right, so he bought three houses and has sold them again. "Great" considering it was probably partly financed by running the poorest business ventures I ever encountered. He still isn't happy.

Fact #1: Michael Jackson owns all the Beatles' songs (and has currently signed them over to Sony to raise $$$).

Fact #2: Paul McCartney is by most accounts a billionaire.

Fact #3: Many sources say that Paul McCartney's overbearing attitude with respect to music and business did as much to break up the Beatles as John's infatuation with Yoko.

Fact #4: Paul McCartney continues to write, play and perform music, and is thought to be an all-around good guy.

Is Paul McCartney a good businessman?

I guess how you measure something depends on your criteria.

A good businessman knows how to manage his financial resources to create revenue and good will in the market.



Prince is exactly the opposite. He has never once passed up an opportunity to piss away money or the good faith of his audience.

DOPEE said:

Could he be better? Absolutely.
Does it seem to matter to him? No.
Is he doing what he wants for a living? Obviously.
Is he well-off. Yes.

Do the whiners keep supporting him? Damn straight.

He's got his MOJO working, and it's working on all of...

Supernova said:

that lichtenstein is pretty bad...wtf's up with that wrist?