I've been a huge fan of Prince's Music since age 7, he has influenced an entire generation of ppl, and continues, perhaps not at the speed he once did, but slowly and surely he's influencing new artist(s) and fans of all ages across the globe.

Prince hasn't been a mainstream artist these past several years, simply because he chose to step away from the industry way of manipulating the music and its artist(s).

Time Warner owned Prince and he didn't feel that an artist who writes, produces, plays every single instrument and sings every vocal, should credit someone else for his own art!
Which makes perfect sense...and with that comes a price!
The Industry is the devil when it comes to artist having complete control and freedom, as well as owning the work you've created without their help!

Ok so Time Warner made Prince who is he today, only because they had the funds to promote and market this musical messiah, that the world became familiar with after having impact radio with songs like '1999, When Doves Cry, Lets go Crazy, Kiss, Rasberry Beret, Batdance, I wanna be ur lover, Cream, Controversy' and many others...

Prince is known for his creative ways of putting together the ultimate pop songs for himself and artist(s) alike.

Prince's last mega splash in the Industry would be 'The Most Beautiful Girl' and made some impact with 'Emancipation'...but hasn't had the Industry Monster to back him to the fullest lately...this is only due to the fact that Prince VOICED HIS OPINIONS ON HOW THE MUSIC BUSINESS TREATS ARTIST(S) AND HOW THEY STEAL FROM THE ARTIST(S). This wouldn't be because he's a hasbeen or washed up!
In Reference to a post made by someone who feels he's over and the only way he can pack a stadium is by playing the hits!

Prince's One Night Alone was a smaller venue tour, but still brought 3-6000 fans to each show, which by the way sold out across the board for his spring/usa and fall/european shows...

The ONA shows were an indication of Prince's fanbase accepting the now and welcoming what Prince had for us at that point, we all love change, and its good at times especially from an artist we loved for so many years and couldn't waite for a new album and video.

Prince is a trend setter and a genius...his musical journey will continue to change for the best!
These Hits he's playing for the New Tour, Is to give the fans what they want...who didn't have the opportunity to see him play the oldies...I think its a great Idea...PRINCE playing the songs that made him who he is today!

Of course some were upset that nothing from the newer albums were performed, but I'd pay again to see the Hits!

Simply because I think it'd be great to see Prince- let ppl know who he is of old and introduce some new stuff to the old fans and those whose never seen him play live before.

The Last tour -he demanded all new material with a few obscure non-hit Prince trax, now he's demanding one more time for the hits.

From all the reviews PRINCE is on top with the Oz and Hong Kong shows...pleasing fans whom havent seen a Prince Concert in 11 years...so why the big fuss!

They deserve a HITS SHOW!
Its so hard for artist like PRINCE, because he can never satisfy anyone...old or new!
I attended the ONA shows and their were ppl who were enjoying the music, but wanted 'Purple Rain and Kiss'!

I've attended Jam Of the Year Shows and seen ppl yell out "Emancipation, Sleep Around, Joint 2 Joint, and Somebody's Somebody'..but didnt get it!

So its a win/lose situation...so as for those who feel Prince is over, just stop logging into PRINCE.ORG or NpgMc, and just allow those who still loves PRINCE for PRINCE to enjoy his fourthcomings of new directions in music and whatever else he has planned for us.

Because whether you dig him or not...Guess what he'll still have tons more money and fame than any of you!
He'll still have all those hit records to his credit...and I think he has an amazing body of work from 1980-1995...he also gave us...'Emancipation, Rave, The Rainbow Children, ONA-Piano and Live...and NEWS...which all have gotten GREAT REVIEWS from publications who dissed every record after 'Sign O'Times'...

So whose on the org -being a hater, and whose selling out arenas and singing 'Purple Rain'? and planning on releasing a new video and album with his new found glory.
Can't nobody beat 'John Blackwell, Rhonda S., Renato Neto, Maceo, Greg Boyer and RAD!

Remember nothing can stop PRINCE AND THE NEWPOWERGENERATION!

GO PRINCE!!!

For the record most of the shows on the US/Canada ONA tour did not sell out. The shows in the bigger cities sold out but in some venues it was no more then 2/3 to 1/2 full.


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[This message was edited Sun Oct 26 9:48:34 PST 2003 by lovemachine]

NPD313 said:

Now thats not very fair now is it? I mean come on...just becasue someone doesn't like his output etc. doesn't mean they can't participate.

NPD313 said:

That's incorrect, WB did not own Prince - (Like any of us do) he exchanged his work for payment, as outlined in his contracts - both parties agreed to the terms. However we view the terms, they WERE agreed to, in 1978, and again in 1992.

NPD313 said:

For some reason there is a whole clump of Prince fans who are under the impression that WB are bad guys.

WB were VERY good to Prince, and have been renound in the past as being one of the more artist friendly labels.

Now where we are at now, most labels (the handful that remain) have left us with a popular music industry that is crumbling under it's own greed and vacuousness - but if the artists didn't sign, they wouldn't have records to sell - That is to say, it takes two to tango, no one side is all to blame.

NPD313 said:

That's somewhat true to say that Prince's decline in sales has been because he has not had the record company big wheels turning behind him.

But why would they want to deal with someone who was a) notoriously difficult and uncommunicative to start with, and b) bad mouthing their livelyhood and career at every given opportunity for years on end?

A second point to this is, a decline in sales/popularity amongst casual listeners is expected the longer an artist is releasing music, when they first burst onto the scene, they're new, fresh and exciting, part of the zeitgeist of that generation.

Thankfully popular music is kept fresh by the next generation coming in and gravitating towards something different from what has come before, so it's a given that Prince's, or anyone else's, popularity will decline.

This decline in casual listeners and the general public has also been mirrored by a decline in the core fan-base, and that is due to a decline in the quality of the music.

Now, we can blah, blah, blah for days about what is quality, you like this, I like that, you love NEWS, I hate it - yadda, yadda, yadda - but there is a large percentage of the Prince fan base who agree that during the latter half of the 1990's Prince's music took a nose-dive in terms of quality - I think his battles with WB and his insistence on handling business affairs himself, rather than having a management team did affect him music in a detrimental way.

Personally since TRC, I'm pleased to say that I think that has began to improve, but there are still plenty of fans who consider his work since the early-mid 90's to be of sub-par standard considering what Prince has released on record in the past.

To get back to the thread title, to most of the general music buying public, he IS a has-been, in as much that they don't see his videos on MTV, don't hear him on the Top40 radio countdown, and don't see his face on billboards, or in magazines.

Now personally, I think this time for Prince has passed he had it, it was great, it's gone.

I'm not really that bothered about the charts, I can't really think of much music in the Top 40 that is worth listening to right now, so I see it as a positive that the people who think the Top 40 is quality music don't buy Prince records.

Warner has been nice to Prince ... Since when ...


Those jerks have stopped selling Prince material for years. I go to the record store and am lucky to find 2 or 3 CDs by Prince. Cant find any off his old stuff and the numereous VHS tapes of have of Prince cant find any released on DVD.

They are not only ripping off Prince and the money he would make off these sales but the fans who cant buy any older material. My 1983 live VHS tape is almost ruined and the best live stuff he did. Cant buy it anymore because of Warner.

Warner can kiss my backside

Freeze said:

Dude you don't really have a clue.

Well here is a link so you can buy your the tape that Warners does not want you to have. Brand new for $12.98.


http://www.amazon.com/exe...o&n=507846

Trust me if they could make money be releasing it on DVD they would.

The reason there are not more then 2 or 3 Prince cd's in your store is because his old stuff isn't selling anymore. It's funny because you are mad at WB for the exact opposite reasons that all the other Prince fans are. Everyone else gets mad because Warners is trying to make money by re-selling his old stuff

Actually, to a certain degree... Warner DID own "Prince".

Some didn't really understand why he changed his name to
. Warner had his name register trademarked, thus years later... if you look on some of his latter albums (Emanicipation being one), he clearly states "such and such" are registered and owned by PRN Enterprises.

Personally, I thought having people call him "The Artist formerly Known As.." & "The Artist" was sarcastic, ingenious, & hilarious.

This same battle was fought publicly between NSYNC & Lou Pearlman. Although, the group's mothers came up with the name, Lou contractually owned the handle.

Prince had been "prophecying" about/to the industry for years before anyone was listening. *Including myself*

Go back to the Rave un2 the Year 2000 DVD. Read the Freedom News info. Intense. Most of what he was conveying hadn't yet taken place and has now come to pass.

Howbeit, he'd been speaking on Warner issues (before it's historic merger). Years later, the same company files bankruptcy. Intense.


All that to say...

It's because of such insight, talent, and wisdom... our friend will NEVER be considered a hasbeen, a was or any other derogatory name that would delete his contributions to music. He will forever transcend.

That's the reason after all these years,


We're still talking about him.




ps.- I've really enjoyed reading everyone's thoughts and opinions. Mad love & respect.

Time warner did own PRINCE, The Artist states this info on BET TONIGHT!

WB wasn't very nice to PRINCE since 1982...Prince States this in a Rolling Stone Interview!
Plus Madonna was given more than PRINCE as an artist at the label...her label is still standing with only one or two good acts and only one that sells good at all or atleast used to! -Alanis !

Prince's record sells declined because he and Time Warner had a fallen out...his sells were good as long as he didnt say nothing!
Hints the Symbol Record or The Gold Experience...how they didnt Promote TGE which was one of his best 90 releases!

WB has screwed PRINCE to many times!

Prince's ONA Tour was a success...and how do you know that all of his shows were less than full???

When the 3 in Chicago sold out 3 times, Detroit was sold out, NYC was sold out and most of the shows he played were sold out!

Prince's tour overseas are still doing very well! and were talking 12,000 seaters!

Whatever the case is, if he didnt make money or sell a concert tour, they wouldn't allow him to play these arenas!

PRINCE IS THE MAN!
If he had the Big Boys behind him, he'd still be selling 6-10million albums, for an indie act now of 10 years, he's doing well with record sells, concerts, and making news where ever he goes!

Ask Ani...did anyone ask why she hasn't signed! LOL

Romance1600 said:

However, if the artists are just getting their start and DON'T sign with the music industries, they are essentially screwed. So, it's either selling their souls to Satan and allowing the companies to take most of their income away or else not seeing their music reach the masses. It's a no-win scenario because the music companies don't give a damn about what kind of music is released or who gets hurt as long as they screw the artists for any money they can get out of them. The irony is that they bitch and complain about losing money on the file sharers while they themselves get away with the rape of artists' hard earned income.

he is far from over!! Infact i think hes hardly begun

Ok gotta add my in here:

I love Prince and always will. Been there since 1983 and buy everything. Sometimes I am disappointed (basically NEWS is not MY cup of tea) but he never stays in the same groove for long so the next album (Musicology?) could be totally different and restore my interest.

However, Prince is extremely unlikely to ever be as big as he was. He *may* make a bit of a comeback (commercially) in 2004 if a lot of the rumours are true (Purple Rain re-release, remastered CDs, nw album, world tour etc) but even with a Major label behind him (such as Universal) he will not capture the current music buying generation's heart the way he captured ours in the 80s.

Someone has already said this higher up - each generation has it's own music to identify with. Even the Beatles would have seen their popularity and sales tail off if they had stayed together during the 70s.

Prince's influence is unquestioned. He was one of the three biggest artists of the 80s (with MJ and Madonna).

As for the blame for his drop from popularity - the truth has gotta be that both parties (WB and Prince) are to blame. They both sabotaged his career (though I have to say I expect WB would have loved to make more money from the guy if it was possible).

A large number of "fans" who switched off with the name change and slave thing - that was Prince.

Basically I think it was a shame that WB and Prince couldn't have been more grown up and found a solution to suit both parties. Certainly believe that had TGE been released in 94 on the back of the smash success of TMBGITW it would have been his 2nd or 3rd biggest album. Oh well!

P.S. The other thing ignored by this thread so far is Prince hooking up with Arista in 1999. A major with proven formula to revive an artist (Santana) that all went horribly wrong. A lot of the blame was again Prince's - he wouldn't shoot a video for Greatest Romance and then went around playing Baby Knows on TV shows when that wasn't the single AND did not bother to tour to promote the album! Oh I know execs at Arista buried RUTJF because of Clive Davis departure etc - as I said, two sides to every story

NPD313 said:

You're living in a dream world.

lovemachine said:

I believe that I read most of the online press from every stop on that tour. Aside from the one show outside PP during Celebration, I hadn't heard that any of the shows were not sell-outs, and especially only 1/2 full. Please document your sources.

At the end of the day the relationship is now severed so it doesnt really matter. However its ridiculous to suggest Prince's demise is all WB's doing. In 1992 he signed an extremely lucrative deal with warners and just because Prince was the talent behind the contract doesn't mean he was any less obliged to honour this agreement as Warners were.

Warners WASTED a lot of money on Prince. Investment in his vanity projects cost the company big, but such was their respect for him as a creative talent, he was given more freedom than most artists. Madonna got a lot of investment from warners because nearly all her albums sold 10m plus and she was their most bankable asset, but she would never have been afforded such creative freedom as Prince. Failed movie projects, and side projects that were binned at the last minute all cost money. Paisley Park spent a lot of money but made very little return.

I personally think that what Prince was standing up for was correct in its most basic notions, however I think the way he went about it was childish, petulant, and ultimately self destructive. He has only made 2 worthwhile albums that rival his Warners output (The Rainbow Children and The Truth), and regardless of what you say, this can surely be attributed somewhat to the lack of record company pressure on the man to perform. IMO his reaction to Warner Bros. was another example of how the man can be a little arrogant about his own god given talents. If he wanted to work in the music BUSINESS, he should have acted a bit more professionally when it came to compromising with his record company.


I think its taken Prince 5 years to sort himself out in terms of his music club, and deciding which direction he wants to take with his career. After warners he wanted to be a big commercial success, and when this failed, he rejected the notion completely. Now he's called Prince again and is producing music for the simple reason that he wants to. He makes good money, has creative freedom, and has a core fan base that he knows worship almost all he does. I've loved his output over the last couple of years and hope he continues in the same vein in the next few years.