when he released that...did u blast it in ur car?


now with sum more pro bl;ack movement stuff P has been doin...u guys arent offended r u?

In my opinion i like when he does that "preachin 2 speak da tooth" stuff.

do you have the lyrics handy?

Confusion say, when a man screams you must learn to whisper.

i wasn't offended as a white person. i love that version. i understand what he's talking about and he may be right. as were the Staple Singers when they recorded that. have you heard the original? it's more up-tempo and groove based.
mind you, that song was recorded in the 70s and the civil rights movement was still struggling then as well. not to say that things are perfect now, i'm not saying that at all. the subject of reparations is a thorny one and i'm sure the debate will go on forever. maybe another 400 years sadly.
as for Prince's pro black political stance, i think it's good. he never really used to get into politics too much in the past and i think it's good now that he is. i wonder if he was still a massive seller would he be involved in such a movement?
and i wonder, now that he is involved, what is he doing to further the cause? like the idea of "put up or shut up".

If it's a good song, it's a good song.
What's offensive about it?
History is history.

---

I wasn't personally offended, but when I hear Prince songs like that I kinda wish he would get over it. Every race at one time or another has done something terrible to another race, and the fact is that it's in the past, and it should remain there.

From my POV, I feel that since I have never been racist towards anyone else, why should I put up with the guilt of what my ansestors have done in the past? And vice-versa, why should I feel superior just because my ansestors did something good when I have done nothing myself? Anyway, I'm from Australia, so I can't really speak for anyone in the US.

"I don't want to know why those before us hated each other - I'd rather believe they never did"

toejam said:

that is such a misguided lyric if i ever heard one cuz they didhate each other. but i guess what he's getting at.

Can't we all just get along?

Remember that it's a song from the The Staple Singers, written back either in late 60's or early 70's?

The lyrical content THEN had a greater impact than Prince's version, though Prince's version has a desperation and anger to it, through the chord progression.

Not offended at all. I like the original better, though. My question is this...is this the same man who made "Race"?

My sentiment's are as follow's...

Being a black youth moving from the ghetto to the suburbs made me realize one thing. That racism exist's. I don't get how some white people don't see why black people sing or state that we are in an unfair race. Now, mind you, I was taunted every single day I went to high school. My teacher's held me back.. or persuaded me to take lower or lesser courses in my high school. My mother "after her divorce" had to raise 5 children on her own. Could not be there for us in reference to these issue's due to her working in a plant to keep us off of welfare.

Now today it is funny. Music is fickle. Now it is cool to "act black". All of those people who used to make fun of me now are acting black and digging hip-hop. You can say music is bringing us together, but I disagree to a degree. You see, white people can act black around black's but turn back around and live white. They will never understand a black man no matter how much they embrace hip hop. Hey I love a lot of white music... I hate to say that because I happen to think music is music. But my point is I can love the music but still embrace my race.

I don't think most white people understand the struggle. To say they were not envolved with slavery and bigotry is not accurate. Family's live off of family history. Trace my history in this country and you find slavery. What do you get when you trace your history? How much have you benefited from your ancestor's history throughout the years? See that is the question. You still reap what your ancestor's have sown. Commercially and in a capitalistic society you have many root's monetarily. We do not. Not saying that it is not better through the civil right's movement and what have you.. But the struggle still remain's. I could be wrong. So I am open for answer's to my delimma.

jojofran said:

This is not a one sided problem, jojofran. Not that you said it was. When I first moved to DC i was jumped by 5 black guys and they made a point to tell me why...I am white. I think we need to stop focusing on the skin color and start focusing on the problem. Ignorance.

CamillesKisses said:

This is such a tired, ignorant retort to the very sensible sentiments put forth by jojofran. So you were jumped by 5 brothas...are you saying that equates to what jojofran is very accurately stating? Do you know how many times I was called "nigger" or some other ignorant epithet growing up to be reminded that I was black? Or the things that go on today to remind me that I'm black? You're personalizing something that we have endured as a race for hundereds of years. If we're going to focus on what the real problem is, ignorance, as you put it, then you need to start by rethinking your stance as to why it's not "one-sided."
[This message was edited Thu Jun 12 23:39:48 PDT 2003 by BlackandRising]

NO

CamillesKisses said:

No what I am stating is what I posted. I just want to know why white people feel that we shouldn't focus on the past when we are still being held back by it. Racism is wrong period. But truth is truth. When I hear some white people say.. "hey, I didn't do nothing to you.." get's me heated. Maybe you didn't but your ancestor's did. And there is no equality. There isn't. I don't let myself be held back by it stating I can't get ahead.. but the struggle is very hard when you have to get approval for a loan by "white banks" who are not "so willing" to give it to you.

Recently, I went for a debt consolidation loan so I can further myself in my production's. Turned down. I work in line's of credit, collections, loans, etc.. While I was working on a customer's debt.. I noticed that she was indebted much more then I was and made less but was approved w/o co-signer for her consolidation loan. Now call it co-incidence but we as black people alway's are left wondering.. was it due to my color? That is what I question to white people and state that you never have to worry about a possiblity of racism when your ancestor's own virtually all of the banks.

BlackandRising said:

OK, listen up. Everybody this nation other than those who come from a wealthy ancestry, have been abused and mistreated in one way or another. Native Americans have been far more mistreated than Black Americans. Black Americans are no worse off in this day and age than their white (or any other color for that matter) counterparts. If you are a wealthy Black American you get a better deal than the poor Black American. The same goes for every other race. I'm sick to death of this race card being pushed at every chance. Yes, 30 years ago it was a shit situation. Times have changed. And don't tell me that because I'm not black i can't understand. My parents are divorced and my father was married to a black woman with two daughters of her own. I lived with them and went to school with them and went to church with them and saw everything they saw. I understand sticking out in a crowd. Im not saying racism doesn't exist. Of course it does. But it exists on all levels in each race. Why is it no big deal that I was beat up for racial issues but if I were black and it happened you would say how awful it is. I think we need to recognize that our system, the American system, is at work here. No other nation takes this much issue with race. It is a ploy that many people fall prey to. You see, if you are too busy worrying about race issues, you're too busy to see that it keeps us occupied and out of the way. Maybe that is a bit too conspiratorial for you but that's how I feel. To get back to your comments...do you know hw many times i was called cracker during my upbringing? Do you know how much I didn't "fit in" growing up white in a black neighborhood? Don't you dare act like you know me or my situation. It doesn;t make it less hurtful because I'm white. People need to stop being ignorant fools for the system and wake the fuck up!

jojofran said:

I'm sorry jojofran but check your history books. My ancestral descent is Italian and Ukranian. My ancestors did not come to this country until about 50 years ago. They had nothing to do with slavery. But chances are, your ancestors had a lot to do with slavery because over 25% of slaves were sold from their African leaders (who were black). Even if my ancestors had something to do with it...why do I need to answer for them? That is bullshit! I am responisible for MYSELF and MYSELF ALONE. Check a history book first, then come talk to me.

CamillesKisses said:

You do not get it by your comments. You feel what it is like to be pre-judged. But what I am saying is that you have a overabundance of wealth in you family history in this country. This country! Indian's had it worse? Indian's were not slave's are owned or told they were less than a man. The worst thing you could have gotten was some people "stating" to you this or that. We were "treated" that way for year's. Firehoses sprayed on us. Police brutality. Hanged. On and on. You can look back at your history and see brilliant things because this society is built "around your history".

Our history in this country is the "slave trade". Civil rights movement's.. etc. The mental affect's are far more worse on me than a black man calling you cracker. That is not right either mind you. But until you walk as a black man you have no right whatsoever to say this is a ploy. This is truth. Now I do not think anyone is superior.. But in this society the one who hold's the upper hand is a white man in the sense of advancement. Not every black person or white person will agree with me. I at time's do not agree with myself, I tell myself that this cannot be true all the time. But something reminds me of the latter every day.

CamillesKisses said:

All the more reason why you are not repeatedly prejudged. Your history has no root's in slavery. This is not an argument. I just beg to differ. Of course we all are responsible for ourselve's.. I just say the scale's are unbalanced, and there is no way to not see it. Or you do see it but don't want to. And African's did not view slavery as white's did. Read "your" history. But I am not even going back to Africa or "your" roots.. I am talking about today! I don't include all white's when I say white's. There are ignorant blacks and whites. I do not agree with bigotry towards any race. I believe in equality. And for you to say the scale's are balanced, well, I violently disagree. But that is just my opinion.
[This message was edited Thu Jun 12 21:08:51 PDT 2003 by jojofran]

jojofran said:

Excuse me, by the way, but I don't come from a wealthy family. Nobody in my bloodline owns a bank! That is rude and ignorant of you to lump all white people into a group. If I were to do that with black people I would be a racist. I can't begin to fathom what being black in America is like but the sam goes for you in regards to white people. I have to struggle to get food in my fridge because i have a shit paying job and school loans to worry about with no help from any family. Like many other black AND white people in this country, i live below the poverty level. I struggleto make ends meet and get denied loans just like you. Maybe it doesn't have anything to do with race at all. But if that is your answer for everything, in order for you to feel better about yourself, than I'm sorry. There will be no pity party for you. I'm too busy throwing my own.

I'm white, and no I wasn't offended. Slavery was wrong, and what kind of country is it that to this day there has never been any type of offical apology? Making cash payments may not be the best way, but what if the "payment" is more of a spiritual healing this country needs to go through? Maybe something akin to the truth and injustice trials that South Africa had. There hasn't even been a national debate on this issue, and at some point it needs to happen. So if a song like this can be put out there, and it happens to be a good song, too, more power to everyone involved.

CamillesKisses said:

Pity party? I am talking about the majority the white people in this country. I am not stating that your folks own a bank. That is not what I mean. I mean the majority of businesses in this country are owned by whom? Now there are many variety's of white.. I am not talking about "you". I am talking about the country as a whole. But most importantly I am talking about the mental abuse. The stereotypical black role's on tv. The media manipulation.

I don't want noone's pity! I want people, as gnation's put it to just realize what they have done and stop stating that we are hyping up the past. I want white people to stop stating black folk are using the past as a "pity party". I think that there is a certain type of musical understanding that white's and black's are seeing... So let's take it further and have black partner's in major businesses! Schooling for black's need help.. Many black's like myself were raised in the ghetto.. We got out of the "ghetto" moved in with white's and were ridiculed. We were not allowed to fit in.

Black's in my humble opinion are often forgiving. That is why you see white people merging w/hip hop. I will also state that black people have a lot of issues with our own race because of the stereotyping that is the matrix of this country. Advertisement and tv as I stated before shape your mental. Tv show's more affluent white programming. Or a stereotypical black male "positioning". I am just stating what I see.. I know that there are a lot of side's to this coin. I could see why a white person would get sick of hearing black people say the thing's I state. But hey.. it's whatever.

I agree with the merging. The only way that will be successful is if the hard feelings and mistrusts are put aside. Jojofran, of course the majority of businesses are white owned...the majority of the country is white. however, if you go to areas largely populated by black Americans, there are many black businesses. Maybe not in Iowa but there are lots and lots on the east and west coasts. I am not in favor of segregation or separation. I wish the past wasn't what it was. But it is. We need to stop reminding each other of the terrible things we've all done to one another and start building a nation. One Nation. Not a black nation and a white nation and so forth and so on.

it takes a hell of alot more than a song to piss me off.

No, not offended, something else, bored.As a white european, i'm well aware of the terrible shit that happened and my sympathy rests with those slaves of the day, it really does.

Key word: 'rests'. Time to move on, and fight current prejudice and injustice, you can't undo history simply by re-telling those stories over and over.Help change the present instead cause shit is still happening in places.

Slavery is still rife.(see IceNines thread in the General Discussion forum)

daym every1 is arguing. I didnt mean it like that.

I ment it in a good way or just a question..but i shouldve known it was gonna get blown up.

Even tho im a gay black male i must say that if i have a white boyfriend who is bigger and stronger than me, i will feel like a slave..cant help but 2 feel like that..lol.


I want 2 hear the original version of the song though..gotta hav it!

paisleypark4 said:

Why would white people be offended by it? I certainly wasn't, I think it's one of Prince's better tracks from that era, and I was glad that he followed the artistic and musical path from the War, to WWWBP to TRC.

Sounds like you want white people to be offended by it though.

In my opinion there's nothing to be paid, it's a full of shit argument offered by whining self-pitying past-dwellers.

the lyrics for Rumpofsteelskin:

When will we be paid for the work we've done
When will we be paid for the work we've done

Fought in your wars, in every land
To keep this country free, y'all
For women, children, and men
But anytime we ask for pay or a loan
That's when everything seems to turn out wrong

We've been beat up, called name, shot down, and stoned
Every time we do right, somebody say we're wrong

Tell me
When will we be paid for the work we've done
When will we be paid for the work we've done

Listen..
We worked this country (Say it!)
From shore to shore (Well)
Our women cooked all your food (Food)
And washed all your clothes
We picked cotton and laid the railroad steel
(Said we laid it)
Worked our hands down to the bone at your lumber mill
(At your lumber mill)

Tell me
When will we be paid for the work we've done
When will we be paid for the work we've done

Will we ever be proud
Of "My country, tis of thee"
Will we ever sing out loud
Sweet land of Liberty

When will we be paid (Tell us)
For the work we've done (Well?)

I wanna know
I wanna know
I wanna, I wanna, I wanna know
(When, when, when, when)

When will we be paid for the work we've done
(Why can't we be paid?)
When will we be paid for the work we've done
When will we be paid for the work we've done
When will we be paid for the work we've done

Oh, oh when, when will we be paid?
We've given up our sweat, now
And all of our tears
Stumbled through this life
For more than 300 years
I, I wanna know, the work we've done
When will be paid for the work we've done

Romance1600 said:

no i played it about 3 or 4 times in a row one day, and this guy asked me can he use that for background music for his speech about racism between him and other colleagues in our college.

Just wanted 2 know what did u guys thought...i have 2 b honest it means more 2 black people than anything else of course.

the truth shouldn`t hurt nobody