Those who are offended or annoyed by these lyrics are simply showing their intolerance and ingnorance. One does not have to be a divisive, intolerant, bigoted, or racist by pointing out the truth that is otherwise ignored. If the truth was told of advance cultures Moores and other African civilizations of the time in comparison to those of Europe then there would be no need to write such songs. It is a matter of history and it's only relevance today is to give those of African descent a sense of pride which has been systematically stripped from them through a process of disenfranchisement of which one of it's many methods included dis-information of the African and non-African masses. It is no different from making a movie about Germany in the 1930's nad 1940's. We don't hold the German citizens of today accountable for the actions of a large number of their descendents.

At the same time we do not hold you ... those of European descent ... accountable for things that happen 1000 and 2000 years ago.

But the truth is the truth ... you are the descendents of the 'Barbarians' ... the Goths, the VisiGoths, the Vandals, and the Vikings. The so-called 'Renaissance' was just a period of learning and ingestion of the information that was learned and 'acquired' during the many 'crusades' against people of African and Asian descent.

It shouldn't matter to you what happen back then because look at where you are now.

But to us it matters because we have been told through your history and media that we ain't nothin but 'jungle bunnies'. I applaud, praise, and exhault Prince more now than I ever have before. I always regarded him as a the most brilliant musical artist ever but with this added sense of consciousness he has come full circle and my only regret is that all of my people don't know and understand the depth of this man.

The bottom line is that if you are offended by these lyrics than you are not truly a fan of his music. He was not offending you ... he was trying to uplift me.

coldbloodedque said:

It's just a 1 perspective point of view.
There is no use in claiming or blaiming.
By doing that you keep things the same or make'm even worse

lulirom said:

Co-sign.

too.

coldbloodedque said:

So to be a true fan, one should believe exactly what Prince believes, and agree with every half-assed opinion he chooses to express? Gosh, in that case, I'll think I'm quite content not to call myself a "true fan".

As has been discussed in other threads, there is absolutely nothing wrong with Prince trying to promote a sense of pride in the great achievements of African civilisation. What irks people here though - and this is something that you have no right to tell people not to be offended by - is the manner in which Prince chooses to say that, in expressing such dismissive, contemptuous, and incorrect opinions about other civilisations and therefore other people's ancestors and heritage.

So I'll thank you not to brand people as "ignorant" or "intolerant" on this website thank you very much - everyone reserves the right to be offended (or otherwise) by whatever they like.

ian said:

co-sign. This guy (whoever he is) has a lot of nerve trying to tell me what to think and calling me ignorant because I don't agree with him.

lovemachine said:

Not to mention, this 'opinion' of Prince's is NOT fully historically accurate.
By spouting this HALF-TRUTH (which is exactly what it is) he's alienating a lot of people. It's sad, really.

in my opinion, people who react negatively to the lyrics aren't peeved because prince is promoting the African/Moorish culture, but because he does so by kind of putting other cultures down.

and i think prince's 'real' fans are people who give him honest feedback about how his work affects them.

If the defintion of being racist is to put down another race or culture in favor of your "own" then Prince is a racist. However as if that is not bad enough, the biggest problem I have with Prince's one-sided, divisive, arrogant, revisionist HALF "truth" is that there are so many knuckleheads, like this one here, who gladly swallow Prince''s stinking crap as "the truth" and continue with hatefull language against the "white man" (whoever the fuck they are pointing at with that discriminating description).

What I see now in the Prince "community" is a divide between a bunch of people calling themselves "black", and attacking "white people" for being offended at Prince's revisionist shit. Speaking in terms of "we" and "they" and leaving all what Prince used to be about in the past. Ain't it funny then that all they can bitch on about themsleves IS the past. It is crying shame and I have no doubt in my mind that Prince knows damn well what he is doing.

lulirom said:

For real.

I read the lyrics, thought "OK", and moved on, they didn't offend me.

Although that have provoked some interesting discussion.

what do prince and the bubble boy on seinfeld have in common?they think it was the moors .i believe george costanza IT WAS THE MOOPS

VelvetSplash said:

I was bored by this thread.

coldbloodedque said:

Coldbloodedque-

First of all, brother... let me say with the utmost love and respect for you as a powerful Nubian Prince, etc. etc...

"Negro, please!"

Don't equate someone's admiration with art to whether or not they are offended by it.

Their argument is valid. They are looking for themselves in this art and are not finding it. I love Avalanche, but not the way I love CREAM. Cream is something that I use to uplift myself. Cream, while its somewhat person specific (U gotta have a guitar, right), its still got a theme that's relatable to many. I've written down the words to Cream for friends and said 'Read this in the mirror.' Works everytime.

I don't go to Prince for a history lesson. He's allowed and if that's how he wants to do his art and communicate himselef, GOD bless him. I think the Rainbow Children is a great album. But people who are REALLY offended by Moors (assuming they were listening) would have probably been even MORE offended by The Rainbow Children. And yet many, WHITE AND BLACK, claim that Family Name is they're jam!

He can balance the two. Probably reading those words and not hearing the lick behind it is what gets ya. ALWAYS READ YOUR LYRICS FIRST, PEOPLE. Prince has been saying ALOT of what he's saying now before, ya wuz just 2 mezmerized by the groove. He's always had an opinion. On race, GOD, etc. - and has NEVER been afraid to share it. Even if he's had to hide it in metaphors and funk. I think he gets it from Jesus.

As for this implication that folk are just 'resistant to the Truth?" I got no problem with anyone's resistance to the Truth (as Prince knows it). And as far as Prince is concerned, that's what he BELIEVES he is communicating.

I don't think he believes he's promoting any particular race, etc. I think he believes he is telling the Truth. He's done his research and this is what he's reporting.
I think I read a book by a guy named Alex Hahn who thinks he's doing the same thing. Interesting.

As an artist, he's achieving a goal, obviously, because people (like you) are taking time out of their lives to discuss it. And at the basis of this, that's the goal of any artist, right? To start a discussion (outrospection) or reflection (introspection).

The question, however is... is he communicating the so-called Truth in a way where we can ALL take responsibility for the promotion of the LIE? And thus return ourSelves to the Truth?

It's like Black people who LOVE to talk about slavery, but dont like to talk about the fact that were it NOT for slavery, all of those "slaves" would have been killed. They were prisoners of battle. And they would have either been killed (as was allowed in those days) or they would have been sold. Would you rather be dead or be sold? "sold to the one now who can now make a displaced bloodline.. " (nice tune, aint it? but it even opens more discussion on Muse 2 The Pharoah, huh bruh?)

Please! If the man, who at one time told me

"Race? In space - I mark 'human'"

- all of a sudden needs to give me a history lesson on races of people? Cool. Its his own way of working out his life. Not mine. He'll wanted all those people who mark "human" to spend $100 on a membership and take pictures of the beautiful racial harmony at his concerts.

Truth, as a word, is good thing, I guess. Only problem is - as a word, it starts with a T. Which means it follows M. Which means people usually put MONEY before Truth. Get it?


Crimes against humanity are committed by HUMANS! As humans we should look back at the Holocaust. Look back at the signs in restaurants that said "Whites Only" and COLLECTIVELY be ashamed for our behavior. So that we can COLLECTIVELY do something about it.

History will be told. It will be agreed. It will be argued and it will be concealed. But if it produces no fruit today, then it is useless and should be thrown into the fire with the rest of the trash.

Before you become history, my brother - what fruit are you producing?

"Watch that the forklift that uplifts doesn't elevate you beyond the reach of One who could hand you a spoon...

and feed your starving hunger"

My solution: Stop giving Prince your money.

lulirom said:

Me too, that was my point, but also saying I didn't think the lyrics were that worth bothering over - although it has created some interested discussion.

Why is it that these people who hardly ever post here always keep this garbage up?

coldbloodedque said:

Bottom line is that if you are only provided with the lyrics (unfinished) - but you don't actually get the music, it's arrogant and stupid to claim you are a true fan of his music because you weren't offended by half the unfinished work.

ian said:


It's amazing to me when someone can't find something wrong with the statement itself and decide to have a problem with the "manner" in which he stated it.

I agree with coldbloodedque. Prince isn't putting down any race in particular where he is telling the truth. Europeans have a very long and bloody history. Because someone tells the truth about, which is often omitted, isn't devisive. It is your history.

I just recently learned that in the south, of the United States of America, in this very year of 2003, history is taught that slaves were actually treated well. If europeans are proud of their achievements, they need to claim their atrocities too. There are too many people still alive who have lived thru these indignities for europeans to go around with amnesia and revisitionist history.

And maybe you guys need to brush up on your history before you say that what Prince says is "half assed". I mean really, I don't think too many of you people on this forum are fans. I think a lot of you are miserable, trying to make others miserable and this is the latest board that you try to spread your misery.

wyld1 said:

Hmmm...another person who barely posts here telling us that there aren't too many Prince fans on this site... Europeans are not the only ones that need to claim their atrocities.

2 serve the meatloaf...or 2 not serve the meatloaf...been a while since i served some, y'know...

Handclapsfingasnapz said:

SERVE IT PLEASE!!!

endorphin74 said:

guess what's back...

Handclapsfingasnapz said:

you had to save it for a special occasion such as this...

on that note...i'm off to bed!!!

nitey nite!!!

endorphin74 said:

nite, kitty!!!

Why argue? It's all a fallacy.

And when I say "all" I mean everything we've been taught.
[This message was edited Fri May 30 21:44:08 PDT 2003 by whodknee]

stymie said:

CDHTUNE said:[quote]

coldbloodedque said:

---
In fact, they were often tipped off by other Africans who were paid for information on where to find their brothers and sisters or some Africans actually performed the capture and sold their captives to slave traders.
---

I agreed with everything you commented on CTune. Very well stated. Just want to clarify that one line where you said "find their brothers and sisters". Africa has more diverse languages and cultures than any other continent. Sadly to this day most Africans see themselves as part of a family/nation/tribe and other Africans as "others". This made it really easy for Europeans to "Divide and Conquer".
Another poster said that in the southern states of the USA if is thought that Slavery was not so bad. While I live in the USA , I honestly do not know if its true that slavery is whitewashed to this day in the southern states. But I do know that when "Roots" first aired on TV in the US in the 1970's many whites and blacks alike were shocked to see how brutal a period in history this was. Why were they shocked, because the truth was not thought.
Prince went to high school in the 1970's in Minnesota. I spent my senior year in Minnesota and I know for a fact that very little of the horrors of history was in the school curriculm. Not just an ommition of slavery but ommission of the truth about treatment of Native Americans,etc. Ironically while there I had a conversation with an exchange student from Spain who once said to me "People in this country are though to desparage Africa. If I (the exchange student) was African I would be very proud." Those were his words not mine. He then went on to tell me that a lot of the technology that made Spanish and Portuguese Empires possible(shipbuilding, navigation tools) were as a direct result of the learnings they got as a result of contact with the then technologically superior moors. After researching his words, I realised everything he said is true.
Prince is just discovering his history which has long be denied either by lies or outright ommission. It is not divisive. People who find it divisive do not want there world-view questioned.
Prince it seems to me is on a quest to find the truth. For a man to embrace a bible-based, strict religion like the Jehovah's Witnesses takes the heart and mind of a truth-seeker. Whether the Jehovah's Witnesses represent the truth is debatable, but anyone who embrasses the faith does so because they think it holds truth..."The' Truth. I think he wants to know the truth too about history.

wyld1 said:

I wanted to respond to these posts but I could not do it better than you have. Thank you.

HalluRain said:[quote]

CDHTUNE said:

Yo ... I was not going to comment on the ignorance of this CDHTUNE because I did not want to call the brother out but you hit it on the head. His assessment of the global market of trading of people from the continent of Africa as slaves [Never refer to us as being slaves because we were never slaves ... we were enslaved people ... KRSONE] as a favorable option to death is absurd. The fact that the ENTIRE middle passage is plastered with bones of 100 million Africans is a testament to that. If it were not for coastal African tribes who fell for the power of the guns that the Europeans provided them there would have been no slave trade.

But I am going to leave that alone because I can go on ...

Brother ... CDHTUNE ... check out the comment from DONRANTS and see how inappropriate your response truly was